I love "Historians": the young ATGs vs older generation/s ATGs H2H debate

T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
Full list of H2H between older and younger ATGs (only fully placed in the Open era), irrespective of the number of matches played between them and age difference:

Connors (born 1952) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 14-20
Connors (born 1952) vs Lendl (born 1960) 13-22
Connors (born 1952) vs Borg (born 1956) 8-15
Borg (born 1956) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 7-7
Borg (born 1956) vs Lendl (born 1960) 6-2
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Lendl (born 1960) 15-21
Lendl (born 1960) vs Wilander (born 1964) 15-7
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Wilander (born 1964) 7-6
Borg (born 1956) vs Wilander (born 1964) 1-0
Connors (born 1952) vs Wilander (born 1964) 0-5
Connors (born 1952) vs Becker (born 1967) 0-6
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Becker (born 1967) 2-8
Lendl (born 1960) vs Becker (born 1967) 11-10
Wilander (born 1964) vs Becker (born 1967) 3-7
Wilander (born 1964) vs Edberg (born 1966) 11-9
Connors (born 1952) vs Edberg (born 1966) 6-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Becker (born 1967) 10-25
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Edberg (born 1966) 7-6
Lendl (born 1960) vs Edberg (born 1966) 13-14
Connors (born 1952) vs Sampras (born 1971) 0-2
Connors (born 1952) vs Agassi (born 1970) 0-2
Edberg (born 1966) vs Agassi (born 1970) 3-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Sampras (born 1971) 6-8
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Sampras (born 1971) 0-3
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-2
Lendl (born 1960) vs Agassi (born 1970) 6-2
Lendl (born 1960) vs Sampras (born 1971) 3-5
Wilander (born 1964) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-5
Wilander (born 1964) vs Sampras (born 1971) 1-2
Becker (born 1967) vs Sampras (born 1971) 7-12
Becker (born 1967) vs Agassi (born 1970) 4-10
Sampras (born 1971) vs Federer (born 1981) 0-1
Agassi (born 1970) vs Federer (born 1981) 3-8
Agassi (born 1970) vs Nadal (born 1986) 0-2
Nadal (born 1986) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 25-28
Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25

In bold the H2Hs, where the older ATG is leading the H2H.

8 out of 37 H2Hs were in favour of the older ATG.

Full list of H2H between older and younger ATGs (only fully placed in the Open era), with more than 5 matches played between them and age difference of less than 10 years and more than 4 years:


Connors (born 1952) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 14-20
Connors (born 1952) vs Lendl (born 1960) 13-22
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Wilander (born 1964) 7-6
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Becker (born 1967) 2-8
Lendl (born 1960) vs Becker (born 1967) 11-10
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Edberg (born 1966) 7-6
Lendl (born 1960) vs Edberg (born 1966) 13-14
Edberg (born 1966) vs Agassi (born 1970) 3-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Sampras (born 1971) 6-8
Wilander (born 1964) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-5
Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25

3 out of 12 H2Hs are led by the older ATG.

Out of those Becker leads Lendl 5-1 in GS matches.
Wilander McEnroe 3-2 in GS matches.
In the other Edberg has won his last 5 matches against McEnroe.

Context: the discussions about the current 3 ATGs and their H2Hs.

:cool:
 
Last edited:
A

ABCD

Hall of Fame
Tennis_Hands said:
Full list of H2H between older and younger ATGs (only fully placed in the Open era), irrespective of the number of matches played between them and age difference:

Connors (born 1952) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 14-20
Connors (born 1952) vs Lendl (born 1960) 13-22
Connors (born 1952) vs Borg (born 1956) 8-15
Borg (born 1956) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 7-7
Borg (born 1956) vs Lendl (born 1960) 6-2
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Lendl (born 1960) 15-21
Lendl (born 1960) vs Wilander (born 1964) 15-7
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Wilander (born 1964) 6-7
Borg (born 1956) vs Wilander (born 1964) 1-0
Connors (born 1952) vs Wilander (born 1964) 0-5
Connors (born 1952) vs Becker (born 1967) 0-6
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Becker (born 1967) 2-8
Lendl (born 1960) vs Becker (born 1967) 11-10
Wilander (born 1964) vs Becker (born 1967) 3-7
Wilander (born 1964) vs Edberg (born 1966) 11-9
Connors (born 1952) vs Edberg (born 1966) 6-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Becker (born 1967) 10-25
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Edberg (born 1966) 7-6
Lendl (born 1960) vs Edberg (born 1966) 13-14
Connors (born 1952) vs Sampras (born 1971) 0-2
Connors (born 1952) vs Agassi (born 1970) 0-2
Edberg (born 1966) vs Agassi (born 1970) 3-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Sampras (born 1971) 6-8
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Sampras (born 1971) 0-3
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-2
Lendl (born 1960) vs Agassi (born 1970) 6-2
Lendl (born 1960) vs Sampras (born 1971) 3-5
Wilander (born 1964) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-5
Wilander (born 1964) vs Sampras (born 1971) 1-2
Becker (born 1967) vs Sampras (born 1971) 7-12
Becker (born 1967) vs Agassi (born 1970) 4-10
Sampras (born 1971) vs Federer (born 1981) 0-1
Agassi (born 1970) vs Federer (born 1981) 3-8
Agassi (born 1970) vs Nadal (born 1986) 0-2
Nadal (born 1986) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 25-28
Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25

In bold the H2Hs, where the older ATG is leading the H2H.

7 out of 37 H2Hs were in favour of the older ATG.

Full list of H2H between older and younger ATGs (only fully placed in the Open era), with more than 5 matches played between them and age difference of less than 10 years and more than 4 years:


Connors (born 1952) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 14-20
Connors (born 1952) vs Lendl (born 1960) 13-22
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Wilander (born 1964) 6-7
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Becker (born 1967) 2-8
Lendl (born 1960) vs Becker (born 1967) 11-10
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Edberg (born 1966) 7-6
Lendl (born 1960) vs Edberg (born 1966) 13-14
Edberg (born 1966) vs Agassi (born 1970) 3-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Sampras (born 1971) 6-8
Wilander (born 1964) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-5
Becker (born 1967) vs Sampras (born 1971) 7-12
Becker (born 1967) vs Agassi (born 1970) 4-10
Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25

2 out of 14 H2Hs are led by the older ATG.

Out of those two Becker leads Lendl 5-1 in GS matches.
In the other Edberg has won his last 5 matches against McEnroe.

Context: the discussions about the current 3 ATGs and their H2Hs.

:cool:
Click to expand...

Good effort. If you are interested in truth you should try to test 2 possible hypothesis here. Is less favorable H2H for older players a consequence of 1) Age-associated decline of a player's performance or 2) Increase in average quality of younger players (use of accumulated knowledge, improvements in coaching methods, improvements of methodology/technology etc.) or combination of 1 and 2. Think what you should measure to being able to distinguish between options 1 and 2.
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
ABCD said:
Good effort. If you are interested in truth you should try to test 2 possible hypothesis here. Is less favorable H2H for older players a consequence of 1) Age-associated decline of a player's performance or 2) Increase in average quality of younger players (use of accumulated knowledge, improvements in coaching methods, improvements of methodology/technology etc.) or combination of 1 and 2. Think what you should measure to being able to distinguish between options 1 and 2.
Click to expand...

I get your point, but are "Top-10 wins" and criteria such as these relevant then? I mean, you don't get to choose who you play for instance. If you dig deep (not only here but in Lew's stats as well) you may end with adopting a different view. The beauty of stats, you can show whatever you want.
 
E

EasyGoing

Professional
Lew II said:
Younger players tended to be more talented than the older as tennis became popular. Now it has quite reached its peak of popularity.
Click to expand...

Just stick to the numbers, buddy. At least you can cherry pick them to provide the wrong interpretation while in this case everything rests on you - not a pretty sight.

ABCD said:
Good effort. If you are interested in truth you should try to test 2 possible hypothesis here. Is less favorable H2H for older players a consequence of 1) Age-associated decline of a player's performance or 2) Increase in average quality of younger players (use of accumulated knowledge, improvements in coaching methods, improvements of methodology/technology etc.) or combination of 1 and 2. Think what you should measure to being able to distinguish between options 1 and 2.
Click to expand...

Since you are a professor with over 100 scientific articles on “Ageing” and statistics surely you could put forward your own theory! :)
 
A

ABCD

Hall of Fame
Eren said:
I get your point, but are "Top-10 wins" and criteria such as these relevant then? I mean, you don't get to choose who you play for instance. If you dig deep (not only here but in Lew's stats as well) you may end with adopting a different view. The beauty of stats, you can show whatever you want.
Click to expand...

Lew II statistics is highly relevant as this one is. Good thing is that Tennis_Hands described phenomenon. Now he needs to find out what what additional data he should analyse to interpret this phenomenon.
 
Lew II

Lew II

G.O.A.T.
Federer only played 1 slam final/semi against ATGs other than Djokovic and Nadal (and Murray).

This affects his greatness much more than his h2h against Djokovic and Nadal. They're younger, they're better. This is the norm.

But where were ATGs of his age or a bit older to give him a hard time in 2003-07?
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
ABCD said:
Lew II statistics is highly relevant as this one is. Good thing is that Tennis_Hands described phenomenon. Now he needs to find out what what additional data he should analyse to interpret this phenomenon.
Click to expand...

He did not describe anything, he showed us stats of older vs younger ATGs. I never have seen you ask Lew II additional data he should analyse. Since you're supposed to be an amazing professor, I thought that was strange. But whatever.
 
Nadal_Django

Nadal_Django

Legend
Comparing 80s to the modern era regarding the professional sport. Never a good idea.;)

Lendl the father of modern day professional tennis, as the pioneer with all his fitness, training, and food regimes, holds the majority of the older guy positive H2H. Why I'm not suprised!:D
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
ABCD said:
Lew II statistics is highly relevant as this one is. Good thing is that Tennis_Hands described phenomenon. Now he needs to find out what what additional data he should analyse to interpret this phenomenon.
Click to expand...

Hypothesis and data for it are most welcome. Feel free to present such.

:cool:
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
Lew II said:
Federer only played 1 slam final/semi against ATGs other than Djokovic and Nadal (and Murray).

This affects his greatness much more than his h2h against Djokovic and Nadal. They're younger, they're better. This is the norm.

But where were ATGs of his age or a bit older to give him a hard time in 2003-07?
Click to expand...

He only had Agassi, and smashed him everytime (more or less) they met. Sampras went AWOL, but he did beat him the only time they met. It's a shame really for Sampras to retire so early.

Older ATGs vs Federer

Agassi: 3-8
Sampras: 0-1
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
Lew II said:
This place is becoming more and more fun as Djokovic wins and Federer gets closer to retirement LOL
Click to expand...

Djokovic may end up in his 2017 form lol, enjoy it for now. Who knows what will happen in a not so distant future. Tennis is weird. No one in 2010 thought Djokovic would happen but it did. That left poor Nadal with no era of his own and sandwhiched between a weak era inflater and a choker.
 
Lew II

Lew II

G.O.A.T.
Eren said:
Djokovic may end up in his 2017 form lol, enjoy it for now. Who knows what will happen in a not so distant future. Tennis is weird. No one in 2010 thought Djokovic would happen but it did. That left poor Nadal with no era of his own and sandwhiched between a weak era inflater and a choker.
Click to expand...
Federer with his retirement will certainly free us from a lot of rude posters, like the one I was addressing.

Then we'll see what Djokovic will do.
 
S

Sputnik Bulgorov

Professional
Lew II said:
Federer only played 1 slam final/semi against ATGs other than Djokovic and Nadal (and Murray).

This affects his greatness much more than his h2h against Djokovic and Nadal. They're younger, they're better. This is the norm.

But where were ATGs of his age or a bit older to give him a hard time in 2003-07?
Click to expand...

I don't quite get your point. Federer did face Agassi to win the 2004 and 2005 USO, beat Sampras in 2001 Wimbledon. He faced Djokovic, Nadal and Murray a whopping 33 times in Slams. Even if nobody his age became an ATG, he had his work cut out for him, especially as he grew older.
 
Lew II

Lew II

G.O.A.T.
Sputnik Bulgorov said:
I don't quite get your point. Federer did face Agassi to win the 2004 and 2005 USO, beat Sampras in 2001 Wimbledon. He faced Djokovic, Nadal and Murray a whopping 33 times in Slams. Even if nobody his age became an ATG, he had his work cut out for him, especially as he grew older.
Click to expand...
Federer is the only ATG born between Sampras and Nadal (15 years).

I won't say Fed had it easier than other ATGs, since he then had to deal with the Big4, but he had it easier than his two main competitors in the GOAT race.
 
Eren

Eren

Professional
Lew II said:
Federer with his retirement will certainly free us from a lot of rude posters, like the one I was addressing.

Then we'll see what Djokovic will do.
Click to expand...

About rude posters, you like comments of other rude posters that put words into one's mouths or talk complete crap out of their ass.

So not sure why you're so agitated if someone else behaves like those posters?

I mean, there was a comment in another thread today something as: "Federer would win zero Wimbledons vs. peak Nadal and peak Djokovic"

I proposed stats of Federer having a 6-4 H2H against good grass courters (>=2 Wimbledons) while Djokovic has a 4-5 record. Explained that Peak Nadal on grass is 06-11 (2 titles and 3 finals) while 12-present Nadal has 0 finals lol.

Some people are beyond delusional and take delusions over actual results. Yet, you like those posters. Why? Because they have the same views as you do.
 
A

ABCD

Hall of Fame
Tennis_Hands said:
Hypothesis and data for it are most welcome. Feel free to present such.

:cool:
Click to expand...

Do H2H between ATG and his peers (+-2 years) in 3 age categories 20-24, 25-29, 30-34. Do the same with H2H ATG and 4-7 years older players (older players categories 25-29 and 30-34) and the same for H2H ATG and 4-7 years younger players (20-24 and 25-29 categories).
 
S

Sputnik Bulgorov

Professional
This reinforces what I always thought about Federer's struggles vs Djokovic and Nadal. His less than stellar records against them are understandable in the context that the younger player historically has an advantage over the older player, especially if the older player doesn't retire early. He wasn't good enough to overcome the odds stacked against him, but that doesn't make him an inferior player. Thanks @Tennis_Hands for providing these stats.
 
NatF

NatF

Bionic Poster
Lew II said:
Federer is the only ATG born between Sampras and Nadal (15 years).

I won't say Fed had it easier than other ATGs, since he then had to deal with the Big4, but he had it easier than his two main competitors in the GOAT race.
Click to expand...

- Agassi was relevant until 2005
- Nadal broke out in 2005

Your comments are meaningless in the context of what actually happened.
 
K

KINGROGER

G.O.A.T.
Lew II said:
Federer is the only ATG born between Sampras and Nadal (15 years).

I won't say Fed had it easier than other ATGs, since he then had to deal with the Big4, but he had it easier than his two main competitors in the GOAT race.
Click to expand...
Djokovic won half his slams vs lesser players. Old Fed, Murray, Delpo, Anderson, washed up Nadal.

His competition vanished following 2014 RG.
 
Raining hopes

Raining hopes

Hall of Fame
ABCD said:
Good effort. If you are interested in truth you should try to test 2 possible hypothesis here. Is less favorable H2H for older players a consequence of 1) Age-associated decline of a player's performance or 2) Increase in average quality of younger players (use of accumulated knowledge, improvements in coaching methods, improvements of methodology/technology etc.) or combination of 1 and 2. Think what you should measure to being able to distinguish between options 1 and 2.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I have no care for this GOAT Debate. But I pity you. And I pity those Who try to one up you even after seeing through your pathetic shameless agendas.
 
D

Deleted member 758560

Guest
KINGROGER said:
Djokovic won half his slams vs lesser players. Old Fed, Murray, Delpo, Anderson, washed up Nadal.
Click to expand...
fed won more than a half vs lesser players... old agassi better than old fed?, roddick better than murray?, baghdatis better than delpo?, hewitt better than nadal?
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
Nadal_Django said:
Comparing 80s to the modern era regarding the professional sport. Never a good idea.;)

Lendl the father of modern day professional tennis, as the pioneer with all his fitness, training, and food regimes, holds the majority of the older guy positive H2H. Why I'm not suprised!:D
Click to expand...

What do you consider "Modern era"?

State an year that you think that era started and why precisely that year.

:cool:
 
beard

beard

Legend
Tennis_Hands said:
Full list of H2H between older and younger ATGs (only fully placed in the Open era), irrespective of the number of matches played between them and age difference:

Connors (born 1952) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 14-20
Connors (born 1952) vs Lendl (born 1960) 13-22
Connors (born 1952) vs Borg (born 1956) 8-15
Borg (born 1956) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 7-7
Borg (born 1956) vs Lendl (born 1960) 6-2
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Lendl (born 1960) 15-21
Lendl (born 1960) vs Wilander (born 1964) 15-7
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Wilander (born 1964) 6-7
Borg (born 1956) vs Wilander (born 1964) 1-0
Connors (born 1952) vs Wilander (born 1964) 0-5
Connors (born 1952) vs Becker (born 1967) 0-6
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Becker (born 1967) 2-8
Lendl (born 1960) vs Becker (born 1967) 11-10
Wilander (born 1964) vs Becker (born 1967) 3-7
Wilander (born 1964) vs Edberg (born 1966) 11-9
Connors (born 1952) vs Edberg (born 1966) 6-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Becker (born 1967) 10-25
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Edberg (born 1966) 7-6
Lendl (born 1960) vs Edberg (born 1966) 13-14
Connors (born 1952) vs Sampras (born 1971) 0-2
Connors (born 1952) vs Agassi (born 1970) 0-2
Edberg (born 1966) vs Agassi (born 1970) 3-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Sampras (born 1971) 6-8
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Sampras (born 1971) 0-3
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-2
Lendl (born 1960) vs Agassi (born 1970) 6-2
Lendl (born 1960) vs Sampras (born 1971) 3-5
Wilander (born 1964) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-5
Wilander (born 1964) vs Sampras (born 1971) 1-2
Becker (born 1967) vs Sampras (born 1971) 7-12
Becker (born 1967) vs Agassi (born 1970) 4-10
Sampras (born 1971) vs Federer (born 1981) 0-1
Agassi (born 1970) vs Federer (born 1981) 3-8
Agassi (born 1970) vs Nadal (born 1986) 0-2
Nadal (born 1986) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 25-28
Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25

In bold the H2Hs, where the older ATG is leading the H2H.

7 out of 37 H2Hs were in favour of the older ATG.

Full list of H2H between older and younger ATGs (only fully placed in the Open era), with more than 5 matches played between them and age difference of less than 10 years and more than 4 years:


Connors (born 1952) vs McEnroe (born 1959) 14-20
Connors (born 1952) vs Lendl (born 1960) 13-22
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Wilander (born 1964) 6-7
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Becker (born 1967) 2-8
Lendl (born 1960) vs Becker (born 1967) 11-10
McEnroe (born 1959) vs Edberg (born 1966) 7-6
Lendl (born 1960) vs Edberg (born 1966) 13-14
Edberg (born 1966) vs Agassi (born 1970) 3-6
Edberg (born 1966) vs Sampras (born 1971) 6-8
Wilander (born 1964) vs Agassi (born 1970) 2-5
Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25
Click to expand...

2 out of 12 H2Hs are led by the older ATG.

Out of those two Becker leads Lendl 5-1 in GS matches.
In the other Edberg has won his last 5 matches against McEnroe.

Context: the discussions about the current 3 ATGs and their H2Hs.

:cool:
Click to expand...
Nice stats Tennis Hands :)

Now, lets see....
I will use list with more than 5 matches played between, its better, most will agree (1-0, 3-2 H2H are meaningless).
2 out of 12 H2Hs are led by the older ATG.
Click to expand...
So, 2 of 12 gran paps were better than youngsters, that is 17% success!

Federer (born 1981) vs Nadal (born 1986) 15-23
Federer (born 1981) vs Djokovic (born 1987) 22-25
Click to expand...
So, Federer score is 0 of 2, that is 0% success!
Obviously, its possible to beat younger player in h2h, but suppose that was impossible for GOAT, although he had most chances (38/47 matches)

Without Federer, about whom we are talking, and who is obviously spoiling gran paps stats ( :mad: ), its 2/10, or 20% success! Shame on you GOAT!
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
beard said:
Nice stats Tennis Hands :)

Now, lets see....
I will use list with more than 5 matches played between, its better, most will agree (1-0, 3-2 H2H are meaningless).

So, 2 of 12 gran paps were better than youngsters, that is 17% success!


So, Federer score is 0 of 2, that is 0% success!
Obviously, its possible to beat younger player in h2h, but suppose that was impossible for GOAT, although he had most chances (38/47 matches)

Without Federer, about whom we are talking, and who is obviously spoiling gran paps stats ( :mad: ), its 2/10, or 20% success! Shame on you GOAT!
Click to expand...

:)
 
K

KINGROGER

G.O.A.T.
jm1980 said:
Roddick
Hewitt
Gonzalez
Baghdatis
Philippoussis
Old Agassi
Soderling
Click to expand...
Washed up mentally fragile Nadal
Old servebot junkballer Fed with 4.0 ground strokes
Broken back Mauresmo Murray
Journeyman Wawrinka

Vs

Peak claydal
Fearsome ball striker old Agassi
Big FH/serve young Roddick
Young aggressive big FH Djokovic
Talented clean hitters Davydenko/Nalbandian
 
E

EasyGoing

Professional
beard said:
Nice stats Tennis Hands :)

Now, lets see....
I will use list with more than 5 matches played between, its better, most will agree (1-0, 3-2 H2H are meaningless).

So, 2 of 12 gran paps were better than youngsters, that is 17% success!


So, Federer score is 0 of 2, that is 0% success!
Obviously, its possible to beat younger player in h2h, but suppose that was impossible for GOAT, although he had most chances (38/47 matches)

Without Federer, about whom we are talking, and who is obviously spoiling gran paps stats ( :mad: ), its 2/10, or 20% success! Shame on you GOAT!
Click to expand...

Now I know you think you just proved something, but actually you just put forward a very strong argument why little kids shouldn’t try to school smarter and more experienced posters. I’ll let you mull over it for a day or two, maybe you spot where it all went wrong for you.
 
TennisPinkBabe

TennisPinkBabe

Rookie
There's a big revelation in this list. Nadal and Djokovic have no 5 years younger ATGs pushing them. This is why their slam stats are over inflated.
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
beard said:
I know you will, in day or two, please don't forget to do so :cry:
Click to expand...

c3oOOey.gif


:cool:
 
beard

beard

Legend
TennisPinkBabe said:
There's a big revelation in this list. Nadal and Djokovic have no 5 years younger ATGs pushing them. This is why their slam stats are over inflated.
Click to expand...
Federer had no older GOAT to push him back ;), Nadal and Novak had, but broke him soon...
It works both ways, you know?
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
beard said:
o_O Are you f....ng kidding me.
Old Agassi is same as prime Federer?
We are so done talking :mad:
Click to expand...

Federer stopped Nadal plus Djokovic from getting directly a grand total of 3 Majors in their formative years.

They also stopped him from getting 3 at an old age effectively removing his effect on their careers from the equation.

I hate to break it for you, but...... there is a new and interesting thread coming.

:D
 
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