I noticed I stopped unit turning during a match...(3.5 and under only)

[TimeToPlaySets]

Played a stronger player, and I instantly dropped the unit turn.
Just gone.

I just took back my racket and let my other arm dangle.
Nipples to the net.

I also didn't turn for return of serve.
I just hop, then I keep doing 5 more mini-hops, all while facing nipples to the net.
I just take back my racket and let my other arm dangle.
Nipples to the net.

Also didn't turn for many approach shots.
Just ran to net, Nipples to the net.

The unit turn is the hardest motion in tennis to remember.

Clearly, 2 months of daily drill is not enough to make unit turn automatic.
Maybe it takes 6 months or 2 years. Who knows?

When you don't turn, you tend to bunt the ball back, since timing is royally ****ed.
To address this, I played some weaker players and decided the ONLY thing I would think about the entire match was to say to myself "turn" on every ball.
That worked out well, I was turning early, and I found my heavy strokes again.

Since I have now discovered that turning simply WILL NOT HAPPEN if you don't actively think about it,
I will now say "Turn!" in my mind as soon as opponent hits the ball for the rest of my life.

The problem is that just because I typed that, doesn't mean I will remember.
I need to write it down on my racket, and tape "Turn!" to the throat to remind me to remind myself.

The other thing I will do is have my coach watch me play the same stronger player.
The problem with live matches is that you can't get any feedback.
If I am not unit turning, he can inform me.
Right now, the only way is to watch video the next day.

 

[mad dog1]

@TimeToPlaySets

The unit turn is the hardest motion in tennis to remember for you!

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Most people under 4.0 don't even know what it is, so I feel Ok.
There is a reason every 3.0 and most 3.5 basically plays nipples to the net.

 

[Slicerman]

Most people under 4.0 don't even know what it is, so I feel Ok.
There is a reason every 3.0 and most 3.5 basically plays nipples to the net.

I think it might be more helpful for you game by keeping your eyes on the ball rather than on your opponent's nipples.

 

[mad dog1]

There is a reason every 3.0 and most 3.5 basically plays nipples to the net.

Yeah, the reason is apparently to distract you!

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

No, that is actually terrible advice.
Watching the ball IS THE ROOT OF THE PROBLEM.

If you are watching the ball coming at you,
you are distracted and FORGET to unit turn.
Science has proven you can only focus on one thing at a time.

The entire key is to NOT watch the ball.

1) Watch ball only long enough to know which side to turn.
2) TURN (Divert attention away from ball and onto unit turn)
3) Resume watching ball.

If you watch the ball, you will just stare at the ball, and not turn.

The whole reason I am not unit turning is because I am watching the ball
instead of actually doing something.

 

[Wesley J]

You should always watch the ball. A unit turn shouldn't cause you to divert your attention elsewhere. You turn your torso, not your head/neck.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Semantics.
You can't FOCUS on the ball.
If you do, you'll just stand there focusing on the ball.
You need to break free of the ball trance, and remember to turn.

DO NOT FOCUS ON THE BALL
or you will never focus on doing the unit turn !!

 

[Wesley J]

You're thinking of it as separate actions performed sequentially...watch ball, stop watching ball and turn, watch ball again...but they are performed at the same time. Don't make it more complex than it needs to be.

 

[jaxadam]

10/10 would turn again

 

[Slicerman]

Semantics.
You can't FOCUS on the ball.
If you do, you'll just stand there focusing on the ball.
You need to break free of the ball trance, and remember to turn.

DO NOT FOCUS ON THE BALL
or you will never focus on doing the unit turn !!

When you're driving a car and you're performing a turn, do you have your eyes on the road? or do you have your eyes on the steering wheel?

 

[Limpinhitter]

"The entire key is to NOT watch the ball." -- TimeToPlaySets

WHAT? What the heck has Federer been been doing all of this time, watching the ball all the way to contact and staring at the contact point after the ball has gone? How did he pick up such bad habits? Imagine what he could have done with his career if he had only known NOT to watch the ball.

 

[dennis]

^(credit to toptennistraining)

It might be caused by not having time to do the unit turn against faster incoming shots so you resort to just using your arm, see if you can recognise the incoming shot and start your move as soon as possible, eg before the ball crosses the net. Saying 'turn' to yourself and playing against different levels of players until it becomes a habit like you say sounds like a plan.

 

[time_fly]

Maybe you were playing a heavy hitter and were rushing / skipping steps? Remember prepare the racquet first. When the ball is still on the other side of the net there isn't too much to focus on yet and you can get your grip and racquet prep for forehand or backhand done early.

 

[Raul_SJ]

Played a stronger player, and I instantly dropped the unit turn.
Just gone.

This is very common when playing a higher level player. Your form will totally break down. For now, just focus on doing it with lower level opponents.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

No, that is actually terrible advice.
Watching the ball IS THE ROOT OF THE PROBLEM.

Watching the ball is not the root of the problem but watching the ball to the exclusion of all else can be.

If you are watching the ball coming at you,
you are distracted and FORGET to unit turn.

You were able to execute your unit turn when playing against a slower ball. Therefore, you've proven the above statement is false.

One can watch the ball and do other things if one has trained long enough to do so. You simply haven't trained enough at that level. But it will come.

Science has proven you can only focus on one thing at a time.

Then why is it you were able to unit turn and watch the ball simultaneously agaianst slower shots?

The entire key is to NOT watch the ball.

1) Watch ball only long enough to know which side to turn.
2) TURN (Divert attention away from ball and onto unit turn)
3) Resume watching ball.

If you watch the ball, you will just stare at the ball, and not turn.

The whole reason I am not unit turning is because I am watching the ball
instead of actually doing something.

No: the reason you are not unit turning is because the ball is coming in faster than you're accustomed to so your training goes out the window. As you acclimate to higher speeds, you'll be able to watch the ball and unit turn simultaneously.

Your suggestion above would lead you to lose track of the ball as you turned to focus your attention on the unit turn. Then you'd lose precious tenths of a second re-acquiring the ball in flight. Bad idea, IMO.

What does your coach say?

 

[mad dog1]

Watching the ball is not the root of the problem but watching the ball to the exclusion of all else can be.



You were able to execute your unit turn when playing against a slower ball. Therefore, you've proven the above statement is false.

One can watch the ball and do other things if one has trained long enough to do so. You simply haven't trained enough at that level. But it will come.



Then why is it you were able to unit turn and watch the ball simultaneously agaianst slower shots?



No: the reason you are not unit turning is because the ball is coming in faster than you're accustomed to so your training goes out the window. As you acclimate to higher speeds, you'll be able to watch the ball and unit turn simultaneously.

Your suggestion above would lead you to lose track of the ball as you turned to focus your attention on the unit turn. Then you'd lose precious tenths of a second re-acquiring the ball in flight. Bad idea, IMO.

What does your coach say?

Uh. Haven't you learned yet? Logic doesn't work on this guy. Have you been taking lessons for the last 24 days straight and getting better everyday? If not, you're just like all the other idiot 3.5 spazzs on this forum who know zero about real tennis.

 

[SinjinCooper]

I focus on respiration, and win every match as my opponents foolishly focus on tennis stuff and suffocate.

 

[Wander]

Funny that in Salzenstein's latest video he's talking about many recreational players turning too much before hitting their forehands:

 

[SinjinCooper]

Funny that in Salzenstein's latest video he's talking about many recreational players turning too much before hitting their forehands:

The gist: unit turn with the torso and hips if you have to move to the ball. Unit turn with the torso only for balls closer to you, to save time and preserve footwork options.

But always unit turn.

Bit of a clickbait title, but Jeff's a great instructor.

 

[samarai]

thats the problem with playing better players. they put u in uncompromising positions so u are usually late to shots. What is the answer? To play these types of matches more often. Instead of spending all of your time taking lessons, spend some more time playing matches. Good opponents wont hand feed u to groove your strokes.

 

[Fxanimator1]

I noticed I stopped unit turning during a match...(10 and under only)
I fixed the thread title for you.

You're welcome!

 

[Notirouswithag]

grab a mate next time your in the gym and get a medicine ball, have your mate throw the medicine ball at your (starting out slowly &n increasing the speed) and focus on open/square unit turns and reaction to catching/throwing the ball back

 

[ARKustom93]

Semantics.
You can't FOCUS on the ball.
If you do, you'll just stand there focusing on the ball.
You need to break free of the ball trance, and remember to turn.

DO NOT FOCUS ON THE BALL
or you will never focus on doing the unit turn !!

Recommended read: "The inner game"(Timothy Gallwey) ...

 

[PittsburghDad]

This isn't complicated. You haven't put the work in to have a decent swing in match conditions. Chatting with people on this board can help you. But it's not a substitute for honest work. Neither is making it rain on coaches when you can't unit turn against a decent hittet. Tape whatever word you want on the handle. Doesn't matter. More training. Less message board. (And 4.0's don't normally struggle with a unit turn this deeply.)

 

[ChaelAZ]

Reps on a ball machine with mechanics focus will start to make it a habit.

 

[PittsburghDad]

I noticed I stopped unit turning during a match...(10 and under only)
I fixed the thread title for you.

You're welcome!

I heart this post.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

This isn't complicated. You haven't put the work in to have a decent swing in match conditions. Chatting with people on this board can help you. But it's not a substitute for honest work.

I've practiced 6 days a week for the last 2 months.
It takes a bit longer to build a 4.0 tennis player.

 

[Traffic]

So I think OP is going through good progression. Practice a basic skill. Then see how you perform during a match when the pressure is on. Then take note of how it went. Then work on it some more. Pressure makes it hard to execute what's not your own. But only practicing the technique in a controlled environment makes it not practical in real life match either. So you need both.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

"The entire key is to NOT watch the ball." -- TimeToPlaySets

WHAT? What the heck has Federer been been doing all of this time, watching the ball all the way to contact and staring at the contact point after the ball has gone? How did he pick up such bad habits? Imagine what he could have done with his career if he had only known NOT to watch the ball.

No, you can not focus on the ball while it's coming to you.
You need to disconnect your mind for a split second while you unit turn.
Then you focus on the ball again.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

It might be caused by not having time to do the unit turn against faster incoming shots so you resort to just using your arm, see if you can recognise the incoming shot and start your move as soon as possible, eg before the ball crosses the net. Saying 'turn' to yourself and playing against different levels of players until it becomes a habit like you say sounds like a plan.

It's not about having less time (That is like 20% of the issue)

Somehow, the unit turn is just not in my brain yet.
My body can do it, but my brain does not tell the body to do it.
Why? Because it's totally unnatural and expends valuable energy.
The human instinct is to move as little as possible.
So, I simply do not do it if I am not thinking about it.
Instead, I stand there and watch the ball and waste time.
It will take a very long time to get it ingrained.


I can play a 3.0 and still not turn, since it's so unnatural and technically unnecessary to hit a ball.
Human brain is not wired to waste energy, it is wired to conserve energy, and do as little as possible.
Same reason why every coach in every sport must repeatedly tell students to bend their knees.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

No, you can not focus on the ball while it's coming to you.
You need to disconnect your mind for a split second while you unit turn.
Then you focus on the ball again.

Have you not mastered breathing, walking and chewing gum all at the same time yet?

 

[PittsburghDad]

No, you can not focus on the ball while it's coming to you.
You need to disconnect your mind for a split second while you unit turn.
Then you focus on the ball again.

Sweet. The guy who can't do a unit turn is giving advice....on doing a UNIT TURN. Helpful.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Funny that in Salzenstein's latest video he's talking about many recreational players turning too much before hitting their forehands:

Salzenstien lives on a different planet.
What do you think he charges for lessons in his little ivory club? I bet it's $250/hr.
Guess who pays $250/hr for lessons? SERIOUS tennis players (That is a 6 figure investment)
So, it makes sense that the non-random sample Salz. is exposed to are prone to hyper-technique.
People who take lessons from an ATP pro have already taken YEARS of club lessons.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Have you not mastered breathing, walking and chewing gum all at the same time yet?

Actually, breathing deserves a new thread. Most people do it wrong. Stay tuned.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

Actually, breathing deserves a new thread. Most people do it wrong. Stay tuned.

Don't bother. Only 5.0 players and higher have been able to master breathing. Now that my game has dropped below 5.0, I've forgotten how to exhale.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

thats the problem with playing better players. they put u in uncompromising positions so u are usually late to shots. What is the answer? To play these types of matches more often. Instead of spending all of your time taking lessons, spend some more time playing matches. Good opponents wont hand feed u to groove your strokes.

I played the same guy again today.
My entire focus was on turning and I played much better.
Totally different strokes.
My entire focus for August will be the unit turn.

I started to say "turn", but then I forgot to keep doing it.
Next match, I SWEAR I will say "turn" every single shot he hits.

 

[Limpinhitter]

No, you can not focus on the ball while it's coming to you.
You need to disconnect your mind for a split second while you unit turn.
Then you focus on the ball again.

Completely wrong! Focusing on the ball is the single most important fundamental of tennis. If you are a beginner, you have to learn the remaining aspects of technique one at a time. When you have a well developed game, focusing on the incoming ball triggers automatic execution of the other aspects of shot preparation and set-up. But, in all cases you should focus on the ball to the best of your ability.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Salzenstien lives on a different planet.
What do you think he charges for lessons in his little ivory club? I bet it's $250/hr.
Guess who pays $250/hr for lessons? SERIOUS tennis players (That is a 6 figure investment)
So, it makes sense that the non-random sample Salz. is exposed to are prone to hyper-technique.
People who take lessons from an ATP pro have already taken YEARS of club lessons.

I don't follow your line of thinking. You're saying because he's a former pro and charges $250/hr he lives on a different planet?

I would judge his planetary residence based on what he teaches and how.

For one, he's offering this information for free, not $250/hr. Granted, it's not the same level of personalization but everyone can make their own determination whether it's useful. I notice you didn't mention anything about whether you thought the information was helpful.

For another, since he's making it available on the internet, his audience is very broad, not just those who are "prone to hyper-technique".

 

[dennis]

So, it makes sense that the non-random sample Salz. is exposed to are prone to hyper-technique

Watch his videos and you'll see the things his lessons cover happening at local $$ private clubs and public courts.

Also, 'hyper technique'?! Not heard that one. I remember the derogatory term 'coached' being used by kids (someone whose strokes look nice but you'd beat by giving them the kind of shots a coach wouldn't feed).

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I don't follow your line of thinking. You're saying because he's a former pro and charges $250/hr he lives on a different planet?

I would judge his planetary residence based on what he teaches and how.

For one, he's offering this information for free, not $250/hr. Granted, it's not the same level of personalization but everyone can make their own determination whether it's useful. I notice you didn't mention anything about whether you thought the information was helpful.

For another, since he's making it available on the internet, his audience is very broad, not just those who are "prone to hyper-technique".

The dude has not coached anyone under 5.0 in his entire life.
That is what I am saying. So, yea, he's never met the 80% of players who do not unit turn.
He does not see the viewers of his videos, obviously.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I remember the derogatory term 'coached' being used by kids (someone whose strokes look nice but you'd beat by giving them the kind of shots a coach wouldn't feed).

You know what coached kids to do to beat street kids who never took lessons?
Hit the ball to them.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

The dude has not coached anyone under 5.0 in his entire life.
That is what I am saying. So, yea, he's never met the 80% of players who do not unit turn.
He does not see the viewers of his videos, obviously.

I'm under 5.0 and I find his instruction very helpful. His serve and RoS videos I think are great. And others on this forum have also mentioned him favorably. And the viewers of his videos leave comments that are favorable.

if you think he's not basic enough, fine; I'm sure there are other resources out there that you'll feel comfortable with. Or, bypass them altogether and rely solely on your coach.

I don't think that means he's on another planet.

 

[fundrazer]

I'm starting to picture ttps as this crazy guy from Silent Hill. You don't actually see him in the 2nd game, but it's assumed he's a wackjob. At some point you find wrote "tern the numbers" in blood on one of the walls, in reference to some combination lock you have to unlock for puzzle.

So I'm starting to picture some straight jacket weirdo saying "tern tern tern." lol

 

[Bender]

Don't bother. Only 5.0 players and higher have been able to master breathing. Now that my game has dropped below 5.0, I've forgotten how to exhale.

5.0 players leave me breathless; what can I say.

One time I watched Daniela Hantuchova play and I had to be rushed to the hospital when I was found on my apartment floor, apparently not breathing.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I'm starting to picture ttps as this crazy guy from Silent Hill. You don't actually see him in the 2nd game, but it's assumed he's a wackjob. At some point you find wrote "tern the numbers" in blood on one of the walls, in reference to some combination lock you have to unlock for puzzle.

So I'm starting to picture some straight jacket weirdo saying "tern tern tern." lol