I really hope Nadal never plays this "tournament" again

I hope this helps people

2019 R. Nadal (the true champion)

2018 A. Zverev

2017 G. Dimitrov

2016 A. Murray

2015 N. Djokovic

2014 N. Djokovic

2013 N. Djokovic

2012 N. Djokovic

2011 R. Federer

2010 R. Federer

2009 N. Davydenko

2008 N. Djokovic

2007 R. Federer

2006 R. Federer

2005 D. Nalbandian

2004 R. Federer

2003 R. Federer

2002 L. Hewitt

2001 L. Hewitt

2000 G. Kuerten

1999 P. Sampras

1998 A. Corretja

1997 P. Sampras

1996 P. Sampras

1995 B. Becker

1994 P. Sampras

1993 M. Stich

1992 B. Becker

1991 P. Sampras

1990 A. Agassi

1989 S. Edberg

1988 B. Becker

1987 I. Lendl

1986 I. Lendl

1985 I. Lendl

1984 J. McEnroe

1983 J. McEnroe

1982 I. Lendl

1981 I. Lendl

1980 B. Borg

1979 B. Borg

1978 J. McEnroe

1977 J. Connors

1976 M. Orantes

1975 I. Nastase

1974 G. Vilas

1973 I. Nastase

1972 I. Nastase

1971 I. Nastase

1970 S. Smith
Huge mistake.

It's the moral champion.
 
Djokovic's results in WTF 2011:
Win over Berdych 3-6 6-3 7-6(7-3)
Loss against Ferrer 3-6 1-6
Loss against Tipsarevic 6-3 3-6 3-6

And with these results he was extremely close to reaching the semifinals. Worse than Nadal's results this year, no? The only thing that stopped him from reaching the semifinals is that Berdych managed to come back and beat Ferrer. And make no mistake, Djokovic would have probably won the title if he got out of the group. So as you can see @mike danny too much things depend on luck in this tournament. Nadal this year had clearly better results than Djokovic in 2011.
 

Yugram

Hall of Fame
I corrected my error.
Wait for it, there’s still opportunity for Federer to grab his 6th Big Moral Title this season if he goes 2-6 against Thiem or 2-5 (What a disgrace for so called GOAT, omg) against Zverev on Sunday.
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
Saving a matchpoint, coming back from 5-1 down, spending 3 hours against Tsitsipas to get another win and all that was WASTED TIME AND ENERGY. There is only one tournament where such a pathetic scenario is possible. Just to think Djokovic could keep fighting after saving matchpoints and winning back to back 3 setters in Rome. He could fight for the title until the last point.

Nadal should never play this "tournament" again. It doesn't deserve him. Even if he wins 3 matches in his group they will find a reason why he shouldn't play in the semifinals.

Congratulations to Nadal on YE#1 and now it's time to prepare for 2020, to play at tournaments where the conditions are fair for all players, where you can't lose a match and go out while another player loses a match and wins the title.
agree. it's an exhibition and nothing else. allowing a player who is already eliminated to play a player who has to win to get in and knock out another player is dumb.
 

Rafa24

Hall of Fame
Yeah, if it was like every other tournament he'd have been dumped out in straight sets in the first round, and never got to show his awesome fighting qualities at all.
if it was like a real slam it would have been bo5 and zverev would have lost.
 

Surion

Hall of Fame
Saving a matchpoint, coming back from 5-1 down, spending 3 hours against Tsitsipas to get another win and all that was WASTED TIME AND ENERGY. There is only one tournament where such a pathetic scenario is possible. Just to think Djokovic could keep fighting after saving matchpoints and winning back to back 3 setters in Rome. He could fight for the title until the last point.

Nadal should never play this "tournament" again. It doesn't deserve him. Even if he wins 3 matches in his group they will find a reason why he shouldn't play in the semifinals.

Congratulations to Nadal on YE#1 and now it's time to prepare for 2020, to play at tournaments where the conditions are fair for all players, where you can't lose a match and go out while another player loses a match and wins the title.
Just win all matches and it's easy. His own fault.
 

Keizer

Professional
if it was like a real slam it would have been bo5 and zverev would have lost.
If WTF was a real slam and Rafa had to face the prospect of playing BO5 on indoor hards at the end of a season every season, he'd have withdrawn like 12 times instead of 6.
 

40L0VE

Rookie
Djokovic's results in WTF 2011:
Win over Berdych 3-6 6-3 7-6(7-3)
Loss against Ferrer 3-6 1-6
Loss against Tipsarevic 6-3 3-6 3-6

And with these results he was extremely close to reaching the semifinals. Worse than Nadal's results this year, no? The only thing that stopped him from reaching the semifinals is that Berdych managed to come back and beat Ferrer. And make no mistake, Djokovic would have probably won the title if he got out of the group. So as you can see @mike danny too much things depend on luck in this tournament. Nadal this year had clearly better results than Djokovic in 2011.
Nadal plays in a strong era so what did you expect? Easy opponents.
 
What a bias and unfair list. The ONLY one you got right is 2019. Hint: the same guy was the moral champion at all the other iterations of this event, too.

I hope this helps people

2019 R. Nadal (the Moral champion)

2018 A. Zverev

2017 G. Dimitrov

2016 A. Murray

2015 N. Djokovic

2014 N. Djokovic

2013 N. Djokovic

2012 N. Djokovic

2011 R. Federer

2010 R. Federer

2009 N. Davydenko

2008 N. Djokovic

2007 R. Federer

2006 R. Federer

2005 D. Nalbandian

2004 R. Federer

2003 R. Federer

2002 L. Hewitt

2001 L. Hewitt

2000 G. Kuerten

1999 P. Sampras

1998 A. Corretja

1997 P. Sampras

1996 P. Sampras

1995 B. Becker

1994 P. Sampras

1993 M. Stich

1992 B. Becker

1991 P. Sampras

1990 A. Agassi

1989 S. Edberg

1988 B. Becker

1987 I. Lendl

1986 I. Lendl

1985 I. Lendl

1984 J. McEnroe

1983 J. McEnroe

1982 I. Lendl

1981 I. Lendl

1980 B. Borg

1979 B. Borg

1978 J. McEnroe

1977 J. Connors

1976 M. Orantes

1975 I. Nastase

1974 G. Vilas

1973 I. Nastase

1972 I. Nastase

1971 I. Nastase

1970 S. Smith
 

mightyjeditribble

Hall of Fame
Because I actually remember Djokovic almost reaching the semifinals in 2011 with 1 win. (1 very close win, and in one of his losses he was totally destroyed). But when it comes to Nadal he never gets out of the group unless he has 3 wins, and even then they try to find reasons to keep him out.
This is pretty good comedy material, keep it coming!

Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
 

mightyjeditribble

Hall of Fame
Federer was in the same situation. But lucky to him Thiem beat Djokovic and secured the first place in the group, so all Federer had to do is win his last 2 matches. On the other hand Zverev was trash against Tsitsipas, and because of that things got complicated, and Nadal had no chances left.
That's right, all Federer had to do was to beat Djokovic. Piece of cake compared to beating Zverev, Tsitsipas and Medvedev I grant you.

Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
 

mika1979

Professional
Saving a matchpoint, coming back from 5-1 down, spending 3 hours against Tsitsipas to get another win and all that was WASTED TIME AND ENERGY. There is only one tournament where such a pathetic scenario is possible. Just to think Djokovic could keep fighting after saving matchpoints and winning back to back 3 setters in Rome. He could fight for the title until the last point.

Nadal should never play this "tournament" again. It doesn't deserve him. Even if he wins 3 matches in his group they will find a reason why he shouldn't play in the semifinals.

Congratulations to Nadal on YE#1 and now it's time to prepare for 2020, to play at tournaments where the conditions are fair for all players, where you can't lose a match and go out while another player loses a match and wins the title.
He got the year end number 1 what else do you want? he didnt deserve to make sf on what he did out there
 

mightyjeditribble

Hall of Fame
Yawn. You can dislike the RR format in tennis of course - in fact they were trying to bring it in for other tournaments done years ago, and I disliked that immensely.

I think it sort of works for the WTF because you have the eight best players in the world, and it's a different event anyway. But even if you don't like it, stop acting as if it is somehow unfair. The same rules go for all the players. And if Nadal had won his remaining two matches in straight sets, be would have likely still progressed to the semis. He didn't, so he didn't. C'est la vie.

Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
 

ghostofMecir

Hall of Fame
Saving a matchpoint, coming back from 5-1 down, spending 3 hours against Tsitsipas to get another win and all that was WASTED TIME AND ENERGY. There is only one tournament where such a pathetic scenario is possible. Just to think Djokovic could keep fighting after saving matchpoints and winning back to back 3 setters in Rome. He could fight for the title until the last point.

Nadal should never play this "tournament" again. It doesn't deserve him. Even if he wins 3 matches in his group they will find a reason why he shouldn't play in the semifinals.

Congratulations to Nadal on YE#1 and now it's time to prepare for 2020, to play at tournaments where the conditions are fair for all players, where you can't lose a match and go out while another player loses a match and wins the title.
If he didn’t get ripped apart by Zverev, things would be different. He’s lucky Medvedev choked hard. He’s had how many tries at winning this thing? The real issue is that he can’t get cushy draws and has to actually play more than one good player to win a title.
 

40L0VE

Rookie
If he didn’t get ripped apart by Zverev, things would be different. He’s lucky Medvedev choked hard. He’s had how many tries at winning this thing? The real issue is that he can’t get cushy draws and has to actually play more than one good player to win a title.
Actually he did have a cushy draw (h2hs before event started)

Leading 4-1 h2h against Tsitsipas.
Leading 5-0 h2h against Zverev.
Leading 2-0 h2h against Medvedev.


Nadal is 11-1 h2h against all 3 of them. H2H is the most important indicator of ability to Nadal fans so chump draw all the way.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Yawn. You can dislike the RR format in tennis of course - in fact they were trying to bring it in for other tournaments done years ago, and I disliked that immensely.

I think it sort of works for the WTF because you have the eight best players in the world, and it's a different event anyway. But even if you don't like it, stop acting as if it is somehow unfair. The same rules go for all the players. And if Nadal had won his remaining two matches in straight sets, be would have likely still progressed to the semis. He didn't, so he didn't. C'est la vie.

Sent from my moto g(7) plus using Tapatalk
If Nadal had won a set against Zverev and won his other matches in straight sets, he would have topped the group.

Not depending on him my behind.
 
If Nadal had won a set against Zverev and won his other matches in straight sets, he would have topped the group.

Not depending on him my behind.
Looks like we are going over and over again, in a circle. Bottom line, I get the rules and I just think they are stupid. Djokovic destroyed the field last year and then lost a final to Zverev who was totally destroyed by him earlier in the tournament. Not that I'm complaining about that result, but that's not what should happen in a normal tournament.
 

Meles

Bionic Poster
Saving a matchpoint, coming back from 5-1 down, spending 3 hours against Tsitsipas to get another win and all that was WASTED TIME AND ENERGY. There is only one tournament where such a pathetic scenario is possible. Just to think Djokovic could keep fighting after saving matchpoints and winning back to back 3 setters in Rome. He could fight for the title until the last point.

Nadal should never play this "tournament" again. It doesn't deserve him. Even if he wins 3 matches in his group they will find a reason why he shouldn't play in the semifinals.

Congratulations to Nadal on YE#1 and now it's time to prepare for 2020, to play at tournaments where the conditions are fair for all players, where you can't lose a match and go out while another player loses a match and wins the title.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Looks like we are going over and over again, in a circle. Bottom line, I get the rules and I just think they are stupid. Djokovic destroyed the field last year and then lost a final to Zverev who was totally destroyed by him earlier in the tournament. Not that I'm complaining about that result, but that's not what should happen in a normal tournament.
In a normal tournament, Nadal would have been out 4 days ago. So I don't get the complaining.
 

ghostofMecir

Hall of Fame
Looks like we are going over and over again, in a circle. Bottom line, I get the rules and I just think they are stupid. Djokovic destroyed the field last year and then lost a final to Zverev who was totally destroyed by him earlier in the tournament. Not that I'm complaining about that result, but that's not what should happen in a normal tournament.
Actually, this tournament has fairer rules than any other tournament. Winning a close match vs. a top 8 player isn’t rewards he same as winning convincingly, something Zverev and Federer did. If you win all three matches then even that doesn’t matter.

Also, no ******** USO 2010,2013,2017 draws here.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Looks like we are going over and over again, in a circle. Bottom line, I get the rules and I just think they are stupid. Djokovic destroyed the field last year and then lost a final to Zverev who was totally destroyed by him earlier in the tournament. Not that I'm complaining about that result, but that's not what should happen in a normal tournament.
The rules are very delicate.

Look at 2009 WTF. Federer, Delpo and Murray were neck and neck in their group. All 3 had a 2-1 record and a 5-4 sets win-loss percentage. The final tiebreaker was the games win-loss percentage and Murray ended up last here and thus went out.

It is what it is. When 3 guys have an equal chance of qualifying, a tiebreaker has to exist. Not everybody can win.
 
Actually, this tournament has fairer rules than any other tournament. Winning a close match vs. a top 8 player isn’t rewards he same as winning convincingly, something Zverev and Federer did. If you win all three matches then even that doesn’t matter.

Also, no ******** USO 2010,2013,2017 draws here.
If Djokovic in a slam final is an easy draw then why is Federer 4-1 down against him in slam finals? :unsure:
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
The annoying part is that he spent so much time and energy on court against Medvedev and Tsitsipas for NOTHING. The only chance for him to ever get out of a group is by winning all 3 matches. He should have withdrawn after losing to Zverev.
Yes. He should have withdrawn instead of winning more points that will help him next year. And he should have just tanked today, figuring there was a 50/50 chance he wouldn't make the finals. It was all a waste, continuing to improve his serve and overall game on HC, indoors, right? Because that could not possibly pay dividends in the coming 2020 AO. Right?

And tanking, or just withdrawing would have looked great, right? I mean it's not like every Nadal hater would have attacked him for not giving his best? Right? Acting like a total spoiled brat, just like YOU are doing over and very again here, would have gained him a lot more fans right?

Sure, Nadal should act just like you. You are presenting yourself here as a whiny little brat. If you are over the age of 15, you should be ashamed of yourself. There are other loyal, sane fans who are disappointed. I'M DISAPPOINTED. I wanted another Fedal match. And I think Nadal fought like a champion in the last two matches.

So why don't you just do us ALL a favor and SHUT UP.
 

RaulRamirez

Hall of Fame
SR, Your incessant whining about the format doesn't do you, Rafa or his fans (of which I am one) any favors. In some cases, it also brings out the salty, sarcastic (and obvious) remarks of his detractors.

For what it's worth, Rafa showed his usual talent and heart in beating Med, and winning versus Tsit, who really did battle...unlike Thiem and Med today, who weren't really into it.

I started a thread with suggestions of things I'd like to change about this tourney, but the rules are known to all players beforehand. To be honest, not winning this tourney should not at all disqualify Rafa from mythical GOAThood.
Despite all his injuries, his resume already compares well with any OE player.
 

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
SR, Your incessant whining about the format doesn't do you, Rafa or his fans (of which I am one) any favors. In some cases, it also brings out the salty, sarcastic (and obvious) remarks of his detractors.

For what it's worth, Rafa showed his usual talent and heart in beating Med, and winning versus Tsit, who really did battle...unlike Thiem and Med today, who weren't really into it.

I started a thread with suggestions of things I'd like to change about this tourney, but the rules are known to all players beforehand. To be honest, not winning this tourney should not at all disqualify Rafa from mythical GOAThood.
Despite all his injuries, his resume already compares well with any OE player.
Yup to all of it. He's right in the race for best of the Big 3, and at this point every point counts. I didn't follow points, but I heard he earned 400, so he got 400 points for three matches after losing the 1st.

To me everything points to improvement on HC. He stepped in closer a few times, great net play, a few impressive aces. I think the oldest #1 in the history of open tennis. He could do very well at AO. The only thing that stops him at this point is his body betraying him. His return stats are holding up as well or better than the other Big 3, so with his improving serve that's a great sign.

I want young players to break through, so I'm not seriously backing him for a run in 2020, but to be honest he actually looks pretty good - an understatement.

SR is just inviting irrational, unfair attacks from people who hate Nadal. His whole stance is just stupid and should be an embarrassment for any sane fan of Rafa.
 
SR, Your incessant whining about the format doesn't do you, Rafa or his fans (of which I am one) any favors. In some cases, it also brings out the salty, sarcastic (and obvious) remarks of his detractors.

For what it's worth, Rafa showed his usual talent and heart in beating Med, and winning versus Tsit, who really did battle...unlike Thiem and Med today, who weren't really into it.

I started a thread with suggestions of things I'd like to change about this tourney, but the rules are known to all players beforehand. To be honest, not winning this tourney should not at all disqualify Rafa from mythical GOAThood.
Despite all his injuries, his resume already compares well with any OE player.
Nadal won 2 matches in this tournament, and he got treated EXACTLY like Medvedev who went 0-3. Yes, this is annoying. IMO it's one big joke when Federer or Djokovic fans compare this "tournament" to slams. Nadal shouldn't be bashed for not winning it. Actually, he should never play it again. (and I think he will not play it. He plays it once in a few years anyway)
 

RaulRamirez

Hall of Fame
Agreed .. the cry baby b1tching and moaning from his pathetic fan base is almost intolerable.
He doesn't represent Nadal, or me, and I don't represent Rafa, Novak or anyone - just my own opinions. It sounds vain, but I wish everyone posted in this spirit, regardless of whether they share the same rooting interests or opinions.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
This is such a joke. The only tournament that might forgive you for losing one of early matches is the WTF, everywhere else you are packing your bags immediately. Looks like even that opportunity isn't enough for Nadal to win just once over all these years, or his fans who are denying the fact that he was never good enough in indoor conditions against very best opponents to win this tournament by discrediting its status among the biggest events in the world.
Don’t think any Rafa fan goes around saying indoor HC is Rafas best surface.
he is unlucky WTF isnt on any other surface. Even grass is better for him than this.
 

Rogfan

Semi-Pro
Poor Nadal, tournaments always find a way to disadvantage him. Outrageous. I remember when he lost the 2nd seed in Wimbledon, Wimbledon made up the rule just the night before to favour Federer and disadvantage Nadal. Now they did it again! Making up the rule that we look at sets win-loss after match win-loss to determine ranking in the group only after Nadal won his last match. Such injustice!
 

JaoSousa

Rookie
I wonder how Nadal can win a title in WTF if:
1. He almost never plays it. He skipped it 5 times in this decade
2. Even when he does play they do everything to keep him out of the tournament. They would find a reason to get him out even if he had 3 wins in his group.
How? Explain it to me.
 

Rogfan

Semi-Pro
Looks like we are going over and over again, in a circle. Bottom line, I get the rules and I just think they are stupid. Djokovic destroyed the field last year and then lost a final to Zverev who was totally destroyed by him earlier in the tournament. Not that I'm complaining about that result, but that's not what should happen in a normal tournament.
I’m sure if somehow Meddy took a set off Zeverv or won today, therefore Nadal qualified, the rule wouldn’t be stupid according to you anymore
 
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