If Alcaraz were to win, it would completely redeem the RG loss as a one-off due to nerves

weakera

Talk Tennis Guru
Please note, I do fully expect Djokovic to win, but if Alcaraz were to win on grass after having lost on clay, we can safely assume Alcaraz should have won both matches but for the unfortunate bout of nerves and cramps. So the 2023 RG would become something of an asterisked tournament.
 

StrongRule

Talk Tennis Guru
Please note, I do fully expect Djokovic to win, but if Alcaraz were to win on grass after having lost on clay, we can safely assume Alcaraz should have won both matches but for the unfortunate bout of nerves and cramps. So the 2023 RG would become something of an asterisked tournament.
It already is. One of the weakest slams ever, even by the standards of this era.
 

weakera

Talk Tennis Guru
Not really. Each match is different. There’s no “redeeming” a loss. You just lost.

Don't worry. Djokovic will win. I'm just saying Alcaraz is essentially playing to win two matches tomorrow, not one.
 

GabeT

G.O.A.T.
Don't worry. Djokovic will win. I'm just saying Alcaraz is essentially playing to win two matches tomorrow, not one.
That’s a lot of pressure on Carlos. I like him and although I hope you are right about who will win it wouldn’t bother if he wins. Ok, maybe a little :whistle:
 
Don't worry. Djokovic will win. I'm just saying Alcaraz is essentially playing to win two matches tomorrow, not one.
It would strengthen alcaraz case that peak for peak he’s better than Novak.

As it could be argued that the French match may have ended differently if he didn’t cramp. We will see.
 

weakera

Talk Tennis Guru
It would strengthen alcaraz case that peak for peak he’s better than Novak.

As it could be argued that the French match may have ended differently if he didn’t cramp. We will see.

The only chance it could strengthen that case for Alcaraz is if Djokovic invented a time machine that he plans on using
 
As a Djokovic fan it's in your interest to say and believe this, with all due respect.
Yeah that’s true. I can understand that. However, nothing should be taken away from alcaraz.

He’s playing a 4 time defending champion and 7 time winner at Wimbledon who’s also won last 2 slams. If alcaraz wins he deserves all the plaudits, praise, hype, etc.
 
He’s in great shape and all. But this isn’t peak Novak. And in any case one single win at the tail end of Novak’s career can’t be considered proof of anything.
To be fair for grass though it’s hard to find a year he’s looked better. I’d say probably 2015 he maybe did. All the other years though I’m not sure. Even in 2011 when we first won it I didn’t feel Djokovic was as complete on a grass court compared to now.
 

paolo2143

Hall of Fame
Please note, I do fully expect Djokovic to win, but if Alcaraz were to win on grass after having lost on clay, we can safely assume Alcaraz should have won both matches but for the unfortunate bout of nerves and cramps. So the 2023 RG would become something of an asterisked tournament.
No we cannot safetly assume any such thing. This is a completely different match at a different time and on a different surface under different circumstances.

It is not Novak' s fault that Carlos broke down mentally and physically at RG if anything that just tells me if he got in winning position he would have choked it. He couldn't handle pressure of being favourite.

Now same thing might happen to Novak this time as all pressure on him this time. However even if he loses i think you will not get Novak losing due to cramping with nerves.
.
 

paolo2143

Hall of Fame
Please note, I do fully expect Djokovic to win, but if Alcaraz were to win on grass after having lost on clay, we can safely assume Alcaraz should have won both matches but for the unfortunate bout of nerves and cramps. So the 2023 RG would become something of an asterisked tournament.
No we cannot safetly assume any such thing. This is a completely different match at a different time and on a different surface under different circumstances.

It is not Novak' s fault that Carlos broke down mentally and physically at RG if anything that just tells me if he got in winning position he would have choked it. He couldn't handle pressure of being favourite.

Now same thing might happen to Novak this time as all pressure on him this time. However even if he loses i think you will not get Novak losing due to cramping with nerves
Don't worry. Djokovic will win. I'm just saying Alcaraz is essentially playing to win two matches tomorrow, not one.
No he is not and if he thinks like that he will probably lose again. He needs to focus on this match solely as he lost fair and square at RG as being mentally and physically able to hamdle the pressure has always been huge part of tennis.
.
 

daggerman

Hall of Fame
We've already established years ago that Djokovic should lose every match he plays (but ends up winning them because the opponent choked, opponent cramped, match was played indoors, conditions were too slow, ball bounce wasn't high enough, opponent was too old, opponent was too young, Djokovic faked an injury to throw his opponent off, opponent was just coming back from injury and hadn't worked on his defensive tennis in the offseason, opponent was tired, match was at night, weather delay disrupted opponent's rhythm, line judge missed a crucial call, opponent got injured, draw leading up to the match was easy, opponent was simply rubbish (always determined after the fact), etc. etc.),

So I'm not sure what an Alcaraz win tomorrow would clarify.
 

Lleytonstation

Talk Tennis Guru
Please note, I do fully expect Djokovic to win, but if Alcaraz were to win on grass after having lost on clay, we can safely assume Alcaraz should have won both matches but for the unfortunate bout of nerves and cramps. So the 2023 RG would become something of an asterisked tournament.
It really is pretty simple. If 172cm actually wins it is a huge statement and I was wrong about the dude.

But that's the point. I have seen this one too many times...

So when I hear 172cm is going to beat djoker on grass...

the-office-dying-of-laughter.gif
 
Please note, I do fully expect Djokovic to win, but if Alcaraz were to win on grass after having lost on clay, we can safely assume Alcaraz should have won both matches but for the unfortunate bout of nerves and cramps. So the 2023 RG would become something of an asterisked tournament.
It’s hard to say who would have won that match because Djokovic is so difficult to defeat in best-of-five, and he really has no fear or worries about Carlitos, nor any other young player – he was only worried about Federer and Nadal as one can see from his facial expressions. I did not see a worry look on Djokovic, even though he was outplayed in that second set, and to me, it looks like the momentum was changing.

I do think that Carlitos had a good chance to win that match, and if he wins convincingly over Djokovic tomorrow, well, that’s definitely going to be the narrative, and really, this is the young Spaniards only chance to redeem himself, because if he gets beaten again, there’s really nothing he can do to overcome that other than win multiple calendar slams, 500+ weeks at #1, etc., and even that will not be enough because we will always go back to 36 year. Old Djokovic beating him and back to back slams in a season in which she might only lose 5 times to anyone other than Djokovic.
 

Indigo

Professional
Novak is twice Alcaraz's age. That means his socks have twice as bad odour. That means Novak wins.
 

Rattie

Legend
It’s was clearly a one off and whats really satisfying is to have all those posters mocking at the time and ever since, now with egg on their face. Carlos answered all the questions today. Truly a special talent, not that those of us who are fans had doubts.
 
Fluke confirmed...
What are the things that happened in that match was Alcaraz getting the nerves of 5-3 in that second set, and he had been dictating play for at least 45 minutes since starting off the match terribly. If no nerves, he wins that match; if he didn’t have nerves today, it’s likely he wins in straight sets.
 

Nole_King

Hall of Fame
It’s was clearly a one off and whats really satisfying is to have all those posters mocking at the time and ever since, now with egg on their face. Carlos answered all the questions today. Truly a special talent, not that those of us who are fans had doubts.

That mocking was mainly from a fanbase who were disappointed that Carlos couldnt stop Novak. I mentioned then as well that Carlos was going to win against Novak in future slams. And he did today. If he keeps a good head on his shoulders he is going to dominate for some years now
 

ADuck

Legend
It was actually a good thing Alcaraz went through that experience at the FO because he learnt from it and came much better prepared today. There's still more room for improvement obviously, but this is a massive step forward. Now he'll never play another match against Novak that he believe he can't win. You could see edging that second set had a massive positive mental effect for him, and the win today will make their next match even easier for him.
 

NeutralFan

G.O.A.T.
I am not mad about RG2023 since 23 was inevitable for Djokovic (sooner or later) and I made peace with that long ago. I might be slightly p1***ed off if RG2023 happens to be Novak's last slam win.
 

Turning Pro

Hall of Fame
I've always said it should be 3-0 in slams. Raz was on course to beat Djoker in 4 or 5 at the Fo 23.

As it stands 2-1 in slams and i don't think he'll be beaten again in a slam by Djoker, EVEN at the AO.
 
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