If Djokovic wins 2018 ATP Tour Finals is this season better than Federer's 2009?

Pheasant

Legend
I will flip this around just a bit. Which results would I rather see my favorite player have, Djoker's 2018 results(assuming that he wins the WTF), or Fed's 2009 results. Djoker's win at the WTF would mark his 5th title of the year to Fed's 4 in 2009. I'm leaning towards Djoker's 2018 results. Now granted, it was awesome to see Fed get to the finals of all 4 grand slam tourneys. And he pushed his opponent to 5 sets in the two slam events that he lost.

I would rather see my favorite player have Djoker's 2018 results. That WTF title is huge. With all of that being said, I believe that Federer had much tougher competition during his run. But as I have said before, this cannot be proven and I don't dock players for being the best in the world at an event. I am taking Djokovic's 2018 season.

I personally believe the the WTF should be worth a lot more points. It's like qualifying for the playoff in American baseball or Football. As it sits now, if Djoker goes 5-0 to raise the trophy, he'll walk away with 2.7 million dollars and 1500 points in the rankings. I would love to see both of those numbers double. There are no cakewalk draws for this event. And qualifying for it is quite an accomplishment.
 

Fiero425

Legend
I will flip this around just a bit. Which results would I rather see my favorite player have, Djoker's 2018 results(assuming that he wins the WTF), or Fed's 2009 results. Djoker's win at the WTF would mark his 5th title of the year to Fed's 4 in 2009. I'm leaning towards Djoker's 2018 results. Now granted, it was awesome to see Fed get to the finals of all 4 grand slam tourneys. And he pushed his opponent to 5 sets in the two slam events that he lost.

I would rather see my favorite player have Djoker's 2018 results. That WTF title is huge. With all of that being said, I believe that Federer had much tougher competition during his run. But as I have said before, this cannot be proven and I don't dock players for being the best in the world at an event. I am taking Djokovic's 2018 season.

I personally believe the the WTF should be worth a lot more points. It's like qualifying for the playoff in American baseball or Football. As it sits now, if Djoker goes 5-0 to raise the trophy, he'll walk away with 2.7 million dollars and 1500 points in the rankings. I would love to see both of those numbers double. There are no cakewalk draws for this event. And qualifying for it is quite an accomplishment.

I also believe the WTF should be worth more, but they have to balance it out with a Masters' event because only 8 players qualify! It just wouldn't be fair to award too much since it's an exclusive club that only the top participants can play! :sneaky: :giggle: ;) :)
 

Pheasant

Legend
I also believe the WTF should be worth more, but they have to balance it out with a Masters' event because only 8 players qualify! It just wouldn't be fair to award too much since it's an exclusive club that only the top participants can play! :sneaky::giggle:;):)

You have a good point. Tennis is far different in that the WTF matches carry over into the rankings points for the following year. This isn't the case for the other sports that I mentioned earlier. But I would still like to see this worth as much as a major. If a bottom-rung player stinks, then he won't pick up many points anyway. I'd like to see this event worth 2500 points to make things more interesting.
 

Fiero425

Legend
You have a good point. Tennis is far different in that the WTF matches carry over into the rankings points for the following year. This isn't the case for the other sports that I mentioned earlier. But I would still like to see this worth as much as a major. If a bottom-rung player stinks, then he won't pick up many points anyway. I'd like to see this event worth 2500 points to make things more interesting.

Then they need to give more points for the MAJORS since that's where most historians tend to rate players! I thought it absolutely ridiculous that Nole was pretty burned out by 2016, won 2 MAJORS (completed his Nole-Slam), was a finalist in another one (USO), took 4 Masters events, but dropping the final of the YEC to Andy, he still fell to #2 in the WORLD! WTF? That was total BS and Murray scrounged for any points he could find at the end of the season to overtake him! It cost him though and he's on the shelf for the foreseeable future playing that ridiculous defensive game allowing any and everyone to extend him to the limit! To me it was his ineptitude going 5 sets early at the FO that cost him the title! He was gassed by the time he got to the final; played out of his mind to win the 1st set, but was done after that! :sneaky:o_O:confused::)
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
I have to give it to Nole because he came out of nowhere with a lost 2017 barely registering in the rankings! He won the 2 biggest events and 2 Masters! He had all kinds of competition where Nadal was on the shelf in 2009 after his FO loss to Soderling! Fed barely squeaked to his Wimbledon win and admitted Andy choking that volley in the 2nd set TB saved his arse! There just wasn't much in his way thru his 2 big wins and then lost that USO to Del Po when up in the final! Since the summer, Nole's been almost unbeatable; Fed couldn't say the same for his '09 campaign! :sneaky::rolleyes::)
LOL what? Fed certainly had more competition in the slams in 2009 than Djokovic in 2018.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Oh stop; Nole wasn't Nole yet and the rest of those JOKERS were no comp. to Fed! Nadal owned his arse; even on grass and he was lucky he wasn't around for a lot of '09! Remember Nadal brought Fed to tears after beating him yet again at '09 AO! Roddick was Fed's b!tch so he needs to be totally discounted! :censored:o_O:mad::(
Nadal had been the tour's b*tch on grass before this year, so he needs to be discounted too.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
You people do it again and again. I've never seen people put so much stock in late tournament performances that result in losses like you do. Losing in a slam final will never be better than winning the year end championship title.
Reaching 2 slam finals is definitely better though.
 

Fiero425

Legend
LOL what? Fed certainly had more competition in the slams in 2009 than Djokovic in 2018.

Rafa had been upset by Soderling so that was the determinant of Roger even getting his one FO title; NUFF SAID! Please! At Wimbledon, his pigeon was waiting to choke away another title to his lord and master! Spare me the comp. comparisons! :censored: :rolleyes: :( ;)
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Rafa had been upset by Soderling so that was the determinant of Roger even getting his one FO title; NUFF SAID! Please! At Wimbledon, his pigeon was waiting to choke away another title to his lord and master! Spare me the comp. comparisons! :censored::rolleyes::(;)
Yeah, let's bring up Djoko's competition this year instead:

- Sub par competition at Wimb outside Nadal, who had been a tour pigeon on grass before this year, so let's discount him too.

- No top 20 players before the final at the USO and a Delpo with no BH in the final who was significantly below his 2009 level.

Yeah, Fed wins handily.

And let's not talk about Fed's FO, otherwise I might bring up Novak's FO title, which was won thanks to the disappearance of not just Nadal, but also Wawrinka ;)
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
I brainfarted.

But yeah I definitely take WTF over 2 Slam finals.

That being said, I think the comparison between the seasons is quite unnecessary, cause it's basically an amazing 5 month stretch.
Well, reaching all 4 slam finals in a season is a pretty rare feat that shouldn't be discounted.
 
Rafa had been upset by Soderling so that was the determinant of Roger even getting his one FO title; NUFF SAID! Please! At Wimbledon, his pigeon was waiting to choke away another title to his lord and master! Spare me the comp. comparisons! :censored::rolleyes::(;)
Haha these clueless Fed fanboys. With Rafa injured for the better part of the year, and Djokovic still non factor back then, outside of AO Federer's only competition at the Slams that year was green teenage boy Del Potro. And these guys have a nerve to talk about 2018 competition. Lol :D
 

Fiero425

Legend
Yeah, let's bring up Djoko's competition this year instead:

- Sub par competition at Wimb outside Nadal, who had been a tour pigeon on grass before this year, so let's discount him too.

- No top 20 players before the final at the USO and a Delpo with no BH who was significantly below his 2009 level.

Yeah, Fed wins handily.

And let's not talk about Fed's FO, otherwise I might bring up Novak's FO title, which was won thanks to the disappearance of not just Nadal, but also Wawrinka ;)

You sound like a disturbed fanboy saying "outside of Nadal" which went 5 extended sets over 2 days! That was enough comp. to justify his winning Wimbledon! If Federer had won it, would you have said the comp. stunk? I doubt it! Please seek some serious help for the hypocrisy of it all! :censored::confused:;)
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
You sound like an idiot saying "outside of Nadal" which went 5 extended sets over 2 days! That was enough comp. to justify his winning Wimbledon! If Federer had won it, would you have said the comp. stunk? I doubt it! Please seek some serious help for the hypocrisy of it all! :censored::confused:;)
You trash Roddick, but I am the hypocrite one. :rolleyes:

And yes, outside Nadal, Novak's competition at Wimb wasn't anything to write home about. Just like Fed's competition at 2007 Wimb wasn't anything to write home about outside Nadal.
 

Fiero425

Legend
You trash Roddick, but I am the hypocrite one. :rolleyes:

And yes, outside Nadal, Novak's competition at Wimb wasn't anything to write home about. Just like Fed's competition at 2007 Wimb wasn't anything to write home about outside Nadal.

Roddick was trash and overrated! What did he really do against Fed that impressed you that much? He was normally lucky to win a fk'n set at times! Please! :censored:
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Roddick was trash and overrated! What did he really do against Fed that impressed you that much? He was normally lucky to win a fk'n set at times! Please! :censored:
We're talking about how he played on that particular day and on that particular day only. He actually pushed Roger harder in the 2009 Wimb final than Rafa pushed Novak in the 2018 Wimb SF.
 

Red Rick

Bionic Poster
We're talking about how he played on that particular day and on that particular day only. He actually pushed Roger harder in the 2009 Wimb final than Rafa pushed Novak in the 2018 Wimb SF.
While you can probably look at a lot of things to compare those matches, saying one was pushed harder than the other purely based on scoreline is just not the way to go. Really, Fed/Roddick was a 'closer' match cause both are much better servers than Djokovic or Nadal.

In fact, both matches were close enough that any difference isn't really gonna be significant and the scoreline based on the %of points won is subject to a huge amount of variation. Therefor, any 'x pushed y harder' is 100% agenda driven.
 

timnz

Legend
Here we go with the delusional points! Go ahead and tell us; it'll make you feel so much better! Regardless of age, Fed's Nole & Rafa's b!tch! :censored::laughing::p:sneaky:
You don't have to reply like that. You said that Roddick was trash and overrated. But he beat Djokovic 5 times (to 4) and all matches were in Djokovic's 20s (so no teenage Djokovic). Hence, Roddick is a very good player.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
While you can probably look at a lot of things to compare those matches, saying one was pushed harder than the other purely based on scoreline is just not the way to go. Really, Fed/Roddick was a 'closer' match cause both are much better servers than Djokovic or Nadal.

In fact, both matches were close enough that any difference isn't really gonna be significant and the scoreline based on the %of points won is subject to a huge amount of variation. Therefor, any 'x pushed y harder' is 100% agenda driven.
Yeah, I agree. Not really worth cherrypicking the differences.

Just pointing out that it's disingenuous to belittle Roddick while propping up Nadal like crazy.
 

metsman

Talk Tennis Guru
Fed 09 would have laughed his way to 3 majors and the WTF this year...Relative to their primes, Djokovic 2018 is more comparable to Fed 11/12 than Fed 09, so it's not a fair comparison to make as Djokovic is a bit older.

Fed 09 is more like Djokovic 16, but still his level didn't drop as much as it did for Djokovic that year besides for a few masters events in the spring.
 
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