"If I did (what Sinner did), I would have been suspended for 20 years"

They already prohibit speculative dope talk, but Sinner did get pinged and accepted a ban.

Jonas78 said:
At least im going to kindly ask the mods to do something about the constant pollution of dope threads.

They should make a dope category and prohibit dope talk on the general pro player discussion, that would be a huge step up...
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recreationalplayer said:
She's exaggerating but any other player ranked 20 or under, in the same circumstances would have been banned for 6-12 months minimum.
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And yet historically and recently this is shown wrong. Lower ranked players have had 0 weeks for testing positive. There's cases of positive steroid detection after eating beef in Sth American.
Sharapova admitted to taking a banned substances and just didn't read the updated banned substances. There's a difference between personally taking a drug and being touched by someone you don't know using a banned substances. They let a player off who claimed his positive test was due to kissing someone!
It pretty obvious Sinner wasn't in full control of the situation and the results show that no benefit occured. His responsibility is to ensure his team is clean, similarly to my employer, they are responsible for my fit for work condition. They're meant to drug test me regularly but don't.
 
Sinners case was strangely handled procedurally from beginning to end. This was not a usual case at any level.
 
Bartelby said:
I don't remember anyone interpreting her words as a real threat...
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Sounded and looked like a real threat. Serena's own words, : "I swear to God I'll #ucking take the ball and shove it down your #ucking throat."

If you are a tiny little woman , and someone much bigger approaches you violently shaking a bludgeoning instrument, and swearing to God they're going to do something violent to you...you're probably going to believe them.

Serena was given the benefit of doubt on the matter (minor fine), as was Sinner on his (minor suspension).
 
The two matters are completely unrelated.

Mr.Lob said:
Sounded and looked like a real threat. Serena's own words, : "I swear to God I'll #ucking take the ball and shove it down your #ucking throat."

If you are a tiny little woman , and someone much bigger approaches you violently shaking a bludgeoning instrument, and swearing to God they're going to do something violent to you...you're probably going to believe them.

Serena was given the benefit of doubt on the matter (minor fine), as was Sinner on his (minor suspension).
Click to expand...
 
weakera said:
Serena Williams on Jannik Sinner’s suspension:

"I've been put down so much, I don't want to bring anyone down. Tennis needs him.

If I did that (failed the tests), I would have gotten 20 years. Let's be honest. I would have gotten Grand Slams taken away from me.

Just weirdly and oddly, I can't help but think about Maria (Sharapova) all this time. I can't help but feel for her.”
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This is a joke right

Queen of the tue

Locks herself in a safe room when they come to test.

If only sinner was treated as well as Serena.

And sinner should've got a year minimum, he got treated pretty special.
 
She’s just trying to stay relevant cause her ego is so gigantic, she can’t stand no one cares or talks about her anymore. This is generally what happens when egomaniacs are phased out of the public eye. They say crazy things to cause a stir and get attention
 
AndrewUtz said:
yep. @Jonas78 everything i’ve said in the last several days has been consistent with the case files so none of it is speculative
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Of course, ive discussed it several times myself. They should make a doping subforum, and ban all non-doping Sinner-threads, which haters pollute, turning them into doping threads.
 
Jonas78 said:
Of course, ive discussed it several times myself. They should make a doping subforum, and ban all non-doping Sinner-threads, which haters pollute, turning them into doping threads.
Click to expand...
I disagree personally. This may be the biggest, if not, one of the biggest scandals the sport has ever seen. I think it’s fine to talk about in GPPD.
 
If Serena was quoted accurately, I think her statement is irresponsible and a bit self-pitying.

How does she go from the first statement to the second?

"I’ve been put down so much, I don’t want to bring anyone down. Men’s tennis needs him."
“If I did that (tested positive for doping), I would have gotten 20 years. Let’s be honest. I would have gotten grand slams taken away from me.”
...
Once Serena became a star -- the star of both women's tennis and American tennis overall -- I think she would have gotten preferential treatment reflecting that.

Let me be clear: I am not minimizing what the Williams sisters faced it in getting established on the tour, nor the BS they still faced from some ignorant fans. But I see no evidence at all that she (as she implied in this interview) was treated unfairly by governing bodies once she became a star of Sinner's current status or much bigger.
 
TheGoldenEra1990’s said:
Top players are always going to be held to a different standard than middle of the road player or complete mugs. Without top players the sport loses revenue. So no. Nothing would have been different for Serena. Heck Agassi already told everyone in his book they slid his meth use under the rug. Why? Top guy and moneymaker for the sport. The ATP or WTA doesn’t want to lose a ton of money for years at a time LOL for some long suspensions. The ATP has already been suffering without sinner because now we got bums like Draper in the finals.


Without top players what do you got? Taylor Fritz and Medvedev slam finals. Oh yea. People are going to flock to see that GOAT match:rolleyes:
Click to expand...
What’s wrong with Medvedev being in Slam finals? He made not 1 but 6 finals, won ATP finals and was N1 for how many weeks? How many Slam finals Sinner reached?
 
Biotic said:
jason-momoa-folding-chair.gif
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Lol
 
When they let Agassi off, he was just starting his comeback and not a top player in terms of ranking.
I want the low level players to get the same benefits of doubt and treatment as Sinner or Serena.
As for fairness/integrity of the game, considering the TUE for stuff like Ritalin I think the stuff players are being banned on is much less effective in enhancing performance.

BTW, as for Serena hiding; I thought the issue was the drug tester was not identified so it looked like a rando invading her home.
Seeing what's happened on the WTA, I don't blame her for going to the panic room and calling 911. It doesn't say that she failed to comply w/ testing
after identities were verified.
 
Roforot said:
When they let Agassi off, he was just starting his comeback and not a top player in terms of ranking.
I want the low level players to get the same benefits of doubt and treatment as Sinner or Serena.
As for fairness/integrity of the game, considering the TUE for stuff like Ritalin I think the stuff players are being banned on is much less effective in enhancing performance.

BTW, as for Serena hiding; I thought the issue was the drug tester was not identified so it looked like a rando invading her home.
Seeing what's happened on the WTA, I don't blame her for going to the panic room and calling 911. It doesn't say that she failed to comply w/ testing
after identities were verified.
Click to expand...
Who says she complied and identities were verified. She didn't take the test that day.
 
She got away with it throughout her career, because the very second anyone would've declared her +ve, she'd have thrown multiple victimhood complex cards at him or her to destroy that person's career by accusing them of whatever ists & isms.
 
Sinner claimed victim status even when WADA gave him the deal of a lifetime.

Rafa4LifeEver said:
She got away with it throughout her career, because the very second anyone would've declared her +ve, she'd have thrown multiple victimhood complex cards at him or her to destroy that person's career by accusing them of whatever ists & isms.
Click to expand...
 
nolefam_2024 said:
Ok ms panic room queen.
Click to expand...

I would be careful with the accusations when your namesake has been consistently accused of being one of the more likely PED users among 21st century players.

There's only one reason the usual, dull suspects run into every thread where Serena is even mentioned, and it has not a thing to do with tennis--unless they're still ready to commit acts of terrorism because their false white "queen" Sharapova was so effectively destroyed on court by this black woman who was not going to act like a (preferred) servant, "knowing her place". Tough. She is a legend in and out of professional sports, and most assuredly brought greater international, positive attention to the generally stale 21st century tennis landscape.
 
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Better_Call_Raul said:
You dodge the question as usual.

Some dunderhead was whining that Sinner needs to be penalized for failing not one but TWO doping tests.

If we accept the Tribunal finding of accidental contamination why should Sinner be additionally penalized for failing the second test? The second failed test, eight days after the first, is to be expected and is consistent with the accidental contamination finding.
Click to expand...
Dr R., your intuition and logic are dead-on, as usual. :giggle: Though it’s irrelevant what the tribunal finding was as far as intent.

The principle is an athlete can’t be given a “second strike” until notified of the first. And the rule is you don’t get penalized for an additional ADRV unless the ADO can establish that the violation occurred after you received notice of the initial violation, which didn’t occur here — it was two positive tests from samples taken within a short period part of the same “doping cycle”; I think it was 8 days apart.

There are exceptions to the rule — not relevant to your fav Carrot’s case — to ensure substantial consequences for separate violations. Such as if there are two violations more than 12 months apart it’s presumed they resulted from separate culpable intents and you can receive longer periods of ineligibility even though the violation occurred before you received notice. This can arise, for example, when they go back and test old samples and there is a positive test.
 
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RSJfan said:
Dr R., your intuition and logic are dead-on, as usual. 8-B Except it’s irrelevant what the tribunal finding was as far as intent.

The principle is an athlete can’t be given a “second strike” until notified of the first. And the rule is you don’t get penalized for an additional ADRV unless the ADO can establish that the violation occurred after you received notice of the initial violation, which didn’t occur here — it was two positive tests from samples taken within a short period part of the same “doping cycle”; I think it was 8 days apart.

There are exceptions to the rule — not relevant to your fav Carrot’s case to ensure substantial consequences for separate violations. Such as if there are two violations more than 12 months apart it’s presumed they resulted from separate culpable intents and you can receive longer periods of ineligibility. This can arise, for example, when they go back and test old samples and there is a positive test.
Click to expand...
2>1
 
AndrewUtz said:
2>1
Click to expand...

There was one doping event. Not two.

Sinner received daily massages from Naldi at Indian Wells between March 5 and March 13.

The physiotherapist then conducted massages and treatments on Sinner between March 5 and March 13.​
Mr Naldi carried out both of these treatments on a daily basis during this period. ​
He confirmed that he did not use gloves whilst carrying out the treatments.​


Sinner provided urine samples on March 10 and March 18 at Indian Wells, but the test results were not returned until about a month later.

Both urine samples revealed trace amounts of the banned steroid Clostebol.

Three scientific experts, Professor Jean-François Naud, Dr Xavier de la Torre, and Professor David Cowan have confirmed inadvertent contamination from Mr Naldi’s treatment in the period between 5 March and 13 March 2024 in the manner described could explain the presence of Clostebol metabolites in the Player’s system.​

The Tribunal accepted that the two positives in March resulted from one episode of contamination during physiotherapy, not separate doping events.
 
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Better_Call_Raul said:
There was one doping event. Not two.

Sinner received daily massages from Naldi at Indian Wells between March 5 and March 13.

The physiotherapist then conducted massages and treatments on Sinner between March 5 and March 13.​
Mr Naldi carried out both of these treatments on a daily basis during this period. ​
He confirmed that he did not use gloves whilst carrying out the treatments.​


Sinner provided urine samples on March 10 and March 18 at Indian Wells. The results of tests came back only a month later.

Both urine samples revealed trace amounts of the banned steroid Clostebol.

Three scientific experts, Professor Jean-François Naud, Dr Xavier de la Torre, and Professor David Cowan have confirmed inadvertent contamination from Mr Naldi’s treatment in the period between 5 March and 13 March 2024 in the manner described could explain the presence of Clostebol metabolites in the Player’s system.​

The Tribunal accepted that the two positives in March resulted from one episode of contamination during physiotherapy, not separate doping events.
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i was just meming raul lol
 
Bartelby said:
The two positive tests indicate that they may have been testing Sinner quite a lot ... and with good reason.
Click to expand...
All players are randomly tested 52 weeks of the year. About twice a month on average. With no advanced notice.
Top players actually get tested even more often to set the standard for clean sport. You see, that is how a proper anti-doping programme works.
We understand that the Tribunal and the process is not to our favourite Bart's liking but Bart's perpetual state of disgruntlement and agitation is a separate issue.

The principle that Bart needs to respect here is that a second positive should not used to impugn the young Sinner when the investigation has revealed that it was a single inadvertent doping episode.

Our favourite Bart using the second positive to pile on the young Sinner just isn’t fair play.
 
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You have not provided any evidence of your claims.

Better_Call_Raul said:
All players are randomly tested 52 weeks of the year. About twice a month on average. With no advanced notice.
Top players are particularly targeted to set a good example. You see, that is how a proper anti-doping programme works.
We understand that the Tribunal and the process is not to our favourite Bart's liking but Bart's perpetual state of disgruntlement and agitation is a separate issue.

The principle that Bart needs to respect here is that a second positive should not used to impugn the young Sinner when the investigation has revealed that it was a single inadvertent doping episode.
Click to expand...
 
Bartelby said:
these are claims, not evidence

both serena and sinner were treated leniently in their respective careers

the thread however is about sinner
Click to expand...

Obviously the ITIA is not going to publish how many times an ATP player is tested.
And common sense dictates that any serious anti-doping programme will take care to target the top players for testing, especially during Slam season.
We have first-hand statements from top players on frequency of testing.
  • Federer stated, “One month, in the run-up to Wimbledon, he was tested seven times.”
How violations are punished is a separate matter but top players will be targeted for doping testing.
 
Was she suspended for US Open disgraceful moments of threats to an line umpire?
Great game and accomplishments but crip walking, threatening a linesman and chair umpire, a drama queen stealing Osaka's moment, and now trying to come off as the definition as the lady of the decade. Sure. It makes sense for her to befriend Djokovic, another player who stirs up controversy & drama. 24 must be an upsetting number for them both

Has anyone attempted to invalidate Sinner's explanation with a physiotherapist and apply that cream on an open wound, and then go get tested?
really doesn't make sense to complain/comment about the same thing week after week. It's not prison or some political trigger issue.
 
The ITIA is a body in need of urgent investigation. It failed its big test in the handling of the Sinner case.

Better_Call_Raul said:
Obviously the ITIA is not going to publish how many times an ATP player is tested.
And common sense dictates that any serious anti-doping programme will take care to target the top players for testing, especially during Slam season.
We have first-hand statements from top players on frequency of testing.
  • Federer stated, “One month, in the run-up to Wimbledon, he was tested seven times.”
How violations are punished is a separate matter but top players will be targeted for doping testing.
Click to expand...
 
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