If you could change the result of one slam final for your favorite player...?

SpicyCurry1990 said:
For sure, I honestly had no expectations for Nole to win RG last year especially with how he was playing at Rome/Madrid. Obviously being up a break in the 5th hurt when it got to that point though.

The USO Final was devastating. Leading up to that event it was Murray I was concerned with after USO 12 and Wimby 13. Never expected Nole to lose to Nadal.

Shocking that after USO 2011, Wimby 14 was his first slam win outside of his home slam and Nadal got one before him.
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After Nole won 2012 AO if someone had told me[especially considering it was his 3rd Slam in a row] that he wouldn't win another non AO title for two and a half years, I would've been absolutely shocked to my foundations given the level he was playing at the time. I've said it before but it really does show you how quickly things can change in sports.
 
triforce defender said:
I can't believe no other Nadal fan thinks this way but 2007 Wimbledon is obviously the slam final every Rafa fan should wish he had won.

Who cares about 2012 AO? It is better for Nadal's legacy that Djokovic ends up as the Australian Open GOAT.

But winning 2007 Wimbledon would mean so many awesome things:

1) The slam margin is 16-15 rather than the more daunting 17-14

2) Nadal has 3 Channel Slams

3) Nadal has a 3-2 Wimbledon Finals record rather than vice versa

4) Nadal has a winning h2h vs Federer on every surface
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Do people still care about the Channel Slam nowadays?
 
Djokovic2011 said:
After Nole won 2012 AO if someone had told me[especially considering it was his 3rd Slam in a row] that he wouldn't win another non AO title for two and a half years, I would've been absolutely shocked to my foundations given the level he was playing at the time. I've said it before but it really does show you how quickly things can change in sports.
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But Now Nole will another Non AO title That will be 4-4:shock:

And 6 Hard court Slams.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
For sure, I honestly had no expectations for Nole to win RG last year especially with how he was playing at Rome/Madrid. Obviously being up a break in the 5th hurt when it got to that point though.

The USO Final was devastating. Leading up to that event it was Murray I was concerned with after USO 12 and Wimby 13. Never expected Nole to lose to Nadal.

Shocking that after USO 2011, Wimby 14 was his first slam win outside of his home slam and Nadal got one before him.
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You missed the Montreal Rafole match. It decided who had the upperhand in the USO series
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Do people still care about the Channel Slam nowadays?
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Definitely. No matter where you land on grass speed issues, still an incredibly short turnaround b/w slams, so winning 7 Bo5 and then turning around and doing it again a few weeks later is mucho impressive in my book.

Might feel slightly less impressive starting next year with the extra week between the events - though still pretty epic.
 
eldanger25 said:
Definitely. No matter where you land on grass speed issues, still an incredibly short turnaround b/w slams, so winning 7 Bo5 and then turning around and doing it again a few weeks later is mucho impressive in my book.

Might feel slightly less impressive starting next year with the extra week between the events - though still pretty epic.
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Can Djokovic do the Channel Slam?
 
eldanger25 said:
Gotta knock Nadal off his perch in Paris first. This year's the first time he played 14 matches between the two events, though - so he's getting closer.
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Do you think he'll play better next year at the age of 28 and win both Roland Garros and Wimbledon?
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Seeing as he'll most likely never win RG I'd say probably not.
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He can Winning French Open is harder than Winning Wimbledon he just Needs to close out a 5th set against Nadal at the french just some how clutch clutch big close the match out. Will gave so much confidence as he just overcame the greatest obstacle in tennis he will feel like he can do anything right?
 
Backspin1183 said:
Do you think he'll play better next year at the age of 28 and win both Roland Garros and Wimbledon?
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I think next year is his best remaining chance, though I also think Nadal will repeat at RG for his tenth title there. I also rate Nadal's chances at Wimbledon better than most with the extra week to recuperate and reorient to grass. Somewhat draw-dependent, of course.

So I actually think Nadal has the better chance at a third Channel Slam than Novak does at a first. Unpopular opinion at the moment, I imagine.
 
xFedal said:
He can Winning French Open is harder than Winning Wimbledon he just Needs to close out a 5th set against Nadal at the french just some how clutch clutch big close the match out. Will gave so much confidence as he just overcame the greatest obstacle in tennis he will feel like he can do anything right?
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I'd dearly love for it to happen but I'll believe it when I see it.
 
eldanger25 said:
I think next year is his best remaining chance, though I also think Nadal will repeat at RG for his tenth title there. I also rate Nadal's chances at Wimbledon better than most with the extra week to recuperate and reorient to grass. Somewhat draw-dependent, of course.

So I actually think Nadal has the better chance at a third Channel Slam than Novak does at a first. Unpopular opinion at the moment, I imagine.
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Bear in mind though that that extra week's rest next year will benefit all the players, not just Nadal.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Bear in mind though that that extra week's rest next year will benefit all the players, not just Nadal.
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You're absolutely right, though I think it'll particularly benefit Nadal since he overschedules (and usually makes deep runs) during the clay court season, and has been having first week troubles on grass moreso than his peers at the top.
 
Backspin1183 said:
You missed the Montreal Rafole match. It decided who had the upperhand in the USO series
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I watched it, but I didn't think it meant much. Djok beat Nadal more decisively at MC earlier in the same year. Didn't lead me to believe he had the upper hand at RG.

I was feeling pretty good that Nole would win the title if he got by Murray in the SF. The Stanimal sighting was a shock for me then too as I thought he was a 1 hit wonder. That was a harsh realization about 4 months later as well.
 
eldanger25 said:
I think next year is his best remaining chance, though I also think Nadal will repeat at RG for his tenth title there. I also rate Nadal's chances at Wimbledon better than most with the extra week to recuperate and reorient to grass. Somewhat draw-dependent, of course.

So I actually think Nadal has the better chance at a third Channel Slam than Novak does at a first. Unpopular opinion at the moment, I imagine.
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How do you figure that? Nole will be the 2nd favorite at RG and either favorite or 2nd favorite (depending on his level at that time) to Murray at Wimb.

Nadal will be favorite at RG and probably not in the top 5 favorites at Wimb. Nadal at Wimbledon was well rested by that point. He didn't have a match for 2 weeks. He simply got hit off the court as his movement on grass has diminished. 1 extra week isn't going to change that.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
I watched it, but I didn't think it meant much. Djok beat Nadal more decisively at MC earlier in the same year. Didn't lead me to believe he had the upper hand at RG.

I was feeling pretty good that Nole would win the title if he got by Murray in the SF. The Stanimal sighting was a shock for me then too as I thought he was a 1 hit wonder. That was a harsh realization about 4 months later as well.
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That's what happens when you underestimate someone like Rafael Nadal. Last year I was confident he would do it. This year his serve has been very average. So, unless he's improved his serve by Toronto, I don't fancy his chances at Flushing.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
How do you figure that? Nole will be the 2nd favorite at RG and either favorite or 2nd favorite (depending on his level at that time) to Murray at Wimb.

Nadal will be favorite at RG and probably not in the top 5 favorites at Wimb. Nadal at Wimbledon was well rested by that point. He didn't have a match for 2 weeks. He simply got hit off the court as his movement on grass has diminished. 1 extra week isn't going to change that.
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We'll see - I got a hunch it'll matter. Seven matches at RG are gonna beat anybody up, and I expect the extra week will help Novak as well.

Plus, the draw gods work in mysterious ways - this year, Nadal had a bit of a murderer's row of SW19-friendly players b/w Rosol, NK, and the scheduled match against Raonic. Though he's far from his peak, I'm not as down on his grass game as others are here, particularly given the ceiling I see for Kyrgios.

Bottom line: he beat Rosol and made the second week again, which is spinnable in his process-oriented landscape. If the cagey veteran version of Nadal is gonna make another run at Wimbledon, it'll be next year I think.
 
Federer: 2008 Wimbledon for sure! Next would be USO 2009 loss to Del Potro. Del Potro of all people Roger? SMH.
 
McEnroe - 1984 French Open final

Would have gone down to Australia and maybe won the Grand Slam. Would have put him in the conversation of the best player ever.
 
Backspin1183 said:
That's what happens when you underestimate someone like Rafael Nadal. Last year I was confident he would do it. This year his serve has been very average. So, unless he's improved his serve by Toronto, I don't fancy his chances at Flushing.
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True, but Nole's returning level was off the charts early at Flushing. He was breaking in over 50% of his return games at one point.After the Stan match I thought he could ride that mental strength to a title like he did at the Oz.
 
NLBwell said:
McEnroe - 1984 French Open final

Would have gone down to Australia and maybe won the Grand Slam. Would have put him in the conversation of the best player ever.
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Never thought about this before, but ya thats true. If Mac wins that match its the best season of all time for sure. Dunno if just 1 of those seasons would have put him in the GOAT convo today, but he'd be in tier 1 for sure above Connors/Lendl/Agassi and in there with Borg and Laver for the time.
 
eldanger25 said:
We'll see - I got a hunch it'll matter. Seven matches at RG are gonna beat anybody up, and I expect the extra week will help Novak as well.

Plus, the draw gods work in mysterious ways - this year, Nadal had a bit of a murderer's row of SW19-friendly players b/w Rosol, NK, and the scheduled match against Raonic. Though he's far from his peak, I'm not as down on his grass game as others are here, particularly given the ceiling I see for Kyrgios.

Bottom line: he beat Rosol and made the second week again, which is spinnable in his process-oriented landscape. If the cagey veteran version of Nadal is gonna make another run at Wimbledon, it'll be next year I think.
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I'm not counting Nadal out completely, just saying the odds of Nole winning RG are far higher than Nadal winning Wimbledon and if Nole comes into Wimbledon after winning RG as the reigning Wimbledon champion, with a chance to defend his slam and win a channel slam, he will be locked in. After what we saw Fed put out there this year and still come up short, I can't realistically think anyone besides peak 2013 Wimbledon version Murray can beat Nole at Wimbledon if he is at his best.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Tell me cc0- is it because of his personality that you dislike him or just because he had the temerity to beat your favourite? :wink:
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No, I don't like his ball-bashing style and the way people overrate him. What has he won since the USO? He will be 40 and people will be going on and on about how he will win multiple slams. He is a one-slam wonder and will very likely stay that way.
 
cc0509 said:
No, I don't like his ball-bashing style and the way people overrate him. What has he won since the USO? He will be 40 and people will be going on and on about how he will win multiple slams. He is a one-slam wonder and will very likely stay that way.
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In no rush to see him make a comeback I take it? :|
 
While I would change the result of an RG final for Novak...a close second would be changing any of those damned USO finals he lost. The ones in 2012 and 2013 were especially painful (esp 2013). If he had won even one of those, he would be sitting on 6 hard court major titles now (possibly 7 if he had converted both)....and he'd be on a major run to being hard court GOAT in terms of number of hard court slam title wins. As it is, he's "only" at 5 hard court slams and the clock is running out.

I'd almost consider changing one of those messed-up USO final results for Novak over changing one of those RG final results....almost, but not quite.
 
powerangle said:
While I would change the result of an RG final for Novak...a close second would be changing any of those damned USO finals he lost. The ones in 2012 and 2013 were especially painful (esp 2013). If he had won even one of those, he would be sitting on 6 hard court major titles now (possibly 7 if he had converted both)....and he'd be on a major run to being hard court GOAT in terms of number of hard court slam title wins. As it is, he's "only" at 5 hard court slams and the clock is running out.

I'd almost consider changing one of those messed-up USO final results for Novak over changing one of those RG final results....almost, but not quite.
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Like I said change RG 2012 and then Nole is seeded #1 for USO 2012 and meets Murray in the SF instead of the finals with no wind or SF/F back-to-backs. Instead his potential finals opponent has the back-to-backs and is a more offensive player than him in the wind, as opposed to a more defensive player than him in the wind (Murray). Kill 2 birds with 1 stone. :)
 
2009 Wimbledon. And then I would give one more to Michael Chang as well.

The Djoker-Rafa flipping back and forth does not mean much to me for now. I know they will win off each other for the next 2-3 yrs to come.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
Like I said change RG 2012 and then Nole is seeded #1 for USO 2012 and meets Murray in the SF instead of the finals with no wind or SF/F back-to-backs. Instead his potential finals opponent has the back-to-backs and is a more offensive player than him in the wind, as opposed to a more defensive player than him in the wind (Murray). Kill 2 birds with 1 stone. :)
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Nothing is guaranteed, my friend! :)

But I like that thinking...
 
If I could change the result of any match, I would choose the RG 11 semi against Federer. Because he would have gone to win the calender year grand slam. would you consider him the best player ever with that?
 
Noleberic123 said:
If I could change the result of any match, I would choose the RG 11 semi against Federer. Because he would have gone to win the calender year grand slam. would you consider him the best player ever with that?
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1) I would rather take the guaranteed RG title (flipping RG 2012 final) than the potential for one, even with the CYGS at stake because beating Rafa @ RG is no guarantee no matter what the odds.

2) If he had won that match and gone on to win RG, I would rate that as the best year ever, but no his results have not been high enough to be in the discussion yet for best player ever, even with the 2011 CYGS. I would rank him near the top of tier 2 though, above Agassi, McEnroe, and Connors instead of below that group, but still a bit below Lendl and outside of tier 1.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
1) I would rather take the guaranteed RG title (flipping RG 2012 final) than the potential for one, even with the CYGS at stake because beating Rafa @ RG is no guarantee no matter what the odds.

2) If he had won that match and gone on to win RG, I would rate that as the best year ever, but no his results have not been high enough to be in the discussion yet for best player ever, even with the 2011 CYGS. I would rank him near the top of tier 2 though, above Agassi, McEnroe, and Connors instead of below that group, but still a bit below Lendl and outside of tier 1.
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if he had won the CYGS in 2011, do you think he would have go on to win much more slams than he has ?
 
Noleberic123 said:
if he had won the CYGS in 2011, do you think he would have go on to win much more slams than he has ?
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Hard to say, but possible.

Maybe Nole beating him in 4 straight finals would weigh on Nadal's mind at RG12 especially when Nole pushed back from 2 sets down. If he wins that match, his seeding changes for USO 12 and maybe he grabs that because the fatigue/wind conditions change.

RG13 at that point with Nole unbeaten in slams for almost 3 years vs Nadal, maybe he doesn't touch the net and wins that.

Nadal losing at RG13 drops his ranking so he winds up swapping spots with Del Po and Nole plays someone easier in the SF while Murray has Del Po and perhaps Murray being wiped would result in his win and of course that could lead to his USO 13 win and continued dominance over Nadal, top seed at the AO and a win over Wawrinka who was getting nervous in the final this year. In that scenario Nole would have won RG this year as well having established a 3 year dominance. Nole could be sitting at 15 slams.

This of course assumes a longitudinality of success with each playing off the other. An RG title win could certainly have set off other chain reactions as well. Like perhaps Nadal finding the ability to beat him 1 slam match earlier and taking AO 12 from him. Then from there Nole winds up in the same vein in every other slam match as he did, and is still sitting at 7 slams despite the CYGS. Never know which side of that spectrum he ends up on.

Only slam win I can rule out for sure is Wimby 12.
 
2012 AO: Rafa was so close to winning it, if only he didn't miss that backhand.

2009 Wimbledon: This match killed Roddick's confidence. He wasn't the same player after that match.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
1) I would rather take the guaranteed RG title (flipping RG 2012 final) than the potential for one, even with the CYGS at stake because beating Rafa @ RG is no guarantee no matter what the odds.

2) If he had won that match and gone on to win RG, I would rate that as the best year ever, but no his results have not been high enough to be in the discussion yet for best player ever, even with the 2011 CYGS. I would rank him near the top of tier 2 though, above Agassi, McEnroe, and Connors instead of below that group, but still a bit below Lendl and outside of tier 1.
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There is no doubt that Djokovic would have beaten Nadal at RG in 2011, Nole played that year with burning eyes and was immune to tiredness.

I think Nole's walkover over Fognini affected him, he lost his tennis rhythm to some extent. When Federer had walkover over Fish he played terrible in his next match against Berdych at USO12, same story for Novak. And even not playing his best tennis Dkokovic had a chance to win that match by serving out for 4th set, but he choked:twisted:
 
AssaultJoker said:
There is no doubt that Djokovic would have beaten Nadal at RG in 2011, Nole played that year with burning eyes and was immune to tiredness.

I think Nole's walkover over Fognini affected him, he lost his tennis rhythm to some extent. When Federer had walkover over Fish he played terrible in his next match against Berdych at USO12, same story for Novak. And even not playing his best tennis Dkokovic had a chance to win that match by serving out for 4th set, but he choked:twisted:
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You can't say that with assurance. Nadal at RG in a best of 5 has gone 21-0 since including 3 in a row over Nole. I get 2011 was his best level and he had his best chances, but its far from a sure thing.

And I would also say he was playing his best tennis in that match. That was one of the highest levels of tennis I have seen and certainly the best RG match I have seen sustained for 4 full sets. I think this was the best performance ever on clay by both Fed and Nole. The only game that dropped that level was the 4th set when Nole should have served it out, but choked. I would rate this and vs Sam Querry @ Paris in 2012 as the only two matches I have seen Djoker play his absolute best and still lose.

RG 13/AO 14/Dubai 14/IW 13 were all also very high levels from Nole when he lost, but not his absolute best.
 
SpicyCurry1990 said:
I would rate this and vs Sam Querry @ Paris in 2012 as the only two matches I have seen Djoker play his absolute best and still lose.
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No way he played his absolute best against Querry, Djokovic at 5-5 on tiebreak of second set had simple error from backhand which led to 5-6 and after that simple error from forhand which costed him a set. And I'm not talking about 3th set where he played like a clown:)
 
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