In praise of Kevlar/ZX hybrid!!!

[hurworld]

Glad to see this thread is still well and alive!

Going to save you guys some time and money, After a lot of time spent stringing, trying out, money on all sorts of mains.

I can say kevlar mains is superior to every other main I've tried (hyperG, zx monogut mains 17, pros pro red devil, blackout, blackforce, Yonex pro poly tour 17, volkl cyclone 17, ghost wire 1.10).

Superior in durability, superior in a soft feel (not sure why kevlar get the harsh bad wrap, just stringing it you can tell it's super soft), acoustics it's thud not pingy

Not just any Kevlar though. Ashaway's kevlar is braided, I believe that helps to soften the string.

 

[2ndServe]

Someone previous mentioned to walk/push down on the outer strings after each pull? So that's what I did, the tension seems to be more consistent now because I did this, wish I did this sooner.

 

[Shroud]

Someone previous mentioned to walk/push down on the outer strings after each pull? So that's what I did, the tension seems to be more consistent now because I did this, wish I did this sooner.

I always do that on every job starting in the middle.. Especially racquets with the first pull at the throat. My wise tension head hates that but the tension numbers do go above the max when I do it.

 

[2ndServe]

I always do that on every job starting in the middle.. Especially racquets with the first pull at the throat. My wise tension head hates that but the tension numbers do go above the max when I do it.

yes my middle 4 strings in the throat seems to be the loosest (especially the middle 2, I thought because it's the longest) but imo pushing on the outer mains, tightens the middle mains

 

[2ndServe]

Anyone tried zx in a full bed? I've not used gut in a long time is zx almost as powerful as gut? Would 50lbs zx be too powerful?

 

[TypeRx]

Anyone tried zx in a full bed? I've not used gut in a long time is zx almost as powerful as gut? Would 50lbs zx be too powerful?

Yes, and I have posted on it in this thread and others. In short, I like it but it is quite powerful so you need to make sure your swing is compatible with this (forget it if you are flat hitter!). It is just about as spin friendly as I get with full-bed Volkl Cyclone. The annoying ping noise is amplified. ZX will break in full bed...in my experience you will get maybe 10-15 hours? So, it isn't the most cost effective. Finally, I've had issues getting consistent performance from string job to string job. This may be driven by small variances in the pre-stretching process.

FYI, I normally string at ~53-55 lbs with ZXP full bed.

Try it. But, a full bed of this stuff is not for most.

 

[jumper67]

Normally I play with the Crossfire ZX pack which includes the 17g Kevlar Plus (Kev+) strings. I usually string at 70/45 in my 18x20 prince tt. I'm probably around a 3.5-4.0 level player who relies on placement and control and not power.

To try to get longer string life, I moved to the normal Kev (non plus) 16g half sets that TW sells. I had the stringer do 70/45 and the racket is unplayable for me. Its a board. There is absolutely no pop off the racket, no cushioning or pocketing or whatever thats called. I'm having to swing super hard and starting to feel golfers elbow. I've played 5 times with it now to try to give it enough time to break in, and its not getting any better.

I'm not sure if the thicker 16g requires lower tension, or if the Kev vs Kev+ is that much different. I will be experimenting. If anyone has any other advice that would be appreciated.

 

[srimes]

Normally I play with the Crossfire ZX pack which includes the 17g Kevlar Plus (Kev+) strings. I usually string at 70/45. I'm probably around a 3.5-4.0 level player who relies on placement and control and not power.

To try to get longer string life, I moved to the normal Kev (non plus) 16g half sets that TW sells. I had the stringer do 70/45 and the racket is unplayable for me. Its a board. There is absolutely no pop off the racket, no cushioning or pocketing or whatever thats called. I'm having to swing super hard and starting to feel golfers elbow. I've played 5 times with it now to try to give it enough time to break in, and its not getting any better.

I'm not sure if the thicker 16g requires lower tension, or if the Kev vs Kev+ is that much different. I will be experimenting. If anyone has any other advice that would be appreciated.

I've only used the Kev half set, and agree that there's a huge difference between 16 and 17. 17 is quite lively.

 

[jumper67]

There is also this:

I've asked this before but after a week or two my ashaway kevlar is super loose.

This is ashaway 17 kev+

I wonder if this is what I was noticing with the Crossfire pack. I remember starting with 60 then 65 then 70 then 75 mains and I never felt much of a difference. Maybe the kev+ don't hold tension very well. This 16g Kev regular seems to be holding my stringbed rock solid literally. So solid that I get no rebound

 

[comeback]

Great podcast by TT about Ashaway ie Kevlar, ZX etc

 

[PT280 Fan]

Great podcast by TT about Ashaway ie Kevlar, ZX etc

That was fabulous and definitely not an infomercial approach with scripted testimonials. If anything some of the feedback from Michele and Wolfman seemed a little unfairly skewed in the wrong direction.

 

[Shroud]

Normally I play with the Crossfire ZX pack which includes the 17g Kevlar Plus (Kev+) strings. I usually string at 70/45 in my 18x20 prince tt. I'm probably around a 3.5-4.0 level player who relies on placement and control and not power.

To try to get longer string life, I moved to the normal Kev (non plus) 16g half sets that TW sells. I had the stringer do 70/45 and the racket is unplayable for me. Its a board. There is absolutely no pop off the racket, no cushioning or pocketing or whatever thats called. I'm having to swing super hard and starting to feel golfers elbow. I've played 5 times with it now to try to give it enough time to break in, and its not getting any better.

I'm not sure if the thicker 16g requires lower tension, or if the Kev vs Kev+ is that much different. I will be experimenting. If anyone has any other advice that would be appreciated.

Was the stringer the same person on the same machine both times?

 

[jumper67]

Was the stringer the same person on the same machine both times?

same machine, not sure if same person

 

[PT280 Fan]

Normally I play with the Crossfire ZX pack which includes the 17g Kevlar Plus (Kev+) strings. I usually string at 70/45 in my 18x20 prince tt. I'm probably around a 3.5-4.0 level player who relies on placement and control and not power.

To try to get longer string life, I moved to the normal Kev (non plus) 16g half sets that TW sells. I had the stringer do 70/45 and the racket is unplayable for me. Its a board. There is absolutely no pop off the racket, no cushioning or pocketing or whatever thats called. I'm having to swing super hard and starting to feel golfers elbow. I've played 5 times with it now to try to give it enough time to break in, and its not getting any better.

I'm not sure if the thicker 16g requires lower tension, or if the Kev vs Kev+ is that much different. I will be experimenting. If anyone has any other advice that would be appreciated.

There's a lot of contrarian information on this thread. The manufacturer recommends a 15-20% decrease in kevlar main tension compared to ZX crosses not the opposite. Also if you listened to the podcast, the kevlar plus is a little softer than the regular kevlar due to added polymers. Beyond that, you are damaging the integrity of your frame when you exceed stringing recommendations as well as asking for tendon and ligament damage.

 

[Slowtwitcher]

There's a lot of contrarian information on this thread. The manufacturer recommends a 15-20% decrease in kevlar main tension compared to ZX crosses not the opposite. Also if you listened to the podcast, the kevlar plus is a little softer than the regular kevlar due to added polymers. Beyond that, you are damaging the integrity of your frame when you exceed stringing recommendations as well as asking for tendon and ligament damage.

I love posts that equate stringing and playing with Kev/ZX with playing with matches.

 

[jumper67]

There's a lot of contrarian information on this thread. The manufacturer recommends a 15-20% decrease in kevlar main tension compared to ZX crosses not the opposite. Also if you listened to the podcast, the kevlar plus is a little softer than the regular kevlar due to added polymers. Beyond that, you are damaging the integrity of your frame when you exceed stringing recommendations as well as asking for tendon and ligament damage.

I don't care what the manufacturer recommends

The stringbed eventually softened and was playable like normal again. It just took much longer to 'break in' or 'loosen up'. My guess is the 16g regular Kev (not Kev+) is just a bit different than the 17g Kev+ that I was used to

I will be trying the 17g regular Kev next but will try decreasing the tension diff to something like 60 main / 45 cross. If I dont like this then I will just go back to the Kev+ in the Crossfire pack

 

[Slowtwitcher]

I will be trying the 17g regular Kev next but will try decreasing the tension diff to something like 60 main / 45 cross. If I dont like this then I will just go back to the Kev+ in the Crossfire pack

I agree with this. Kevlar is more boardy at first and it takes 1-2k hits to settle. Kev+ plays better off stringing and plays more like SG.

 

[Shroud]

There's a lot of contrarian information on this thread. The manufacturer recommends a 15-20% decrease in kevlar main tension compared to ZX crosses not the opposite. Also if you listened to the podcast, the kevlar plus is a little softer than the regular kevlar due to added polymers. Beyond that, you are damaging the integrity of your frame when you exceed stringing recommendations as well as asking for tendon and ligament damage.

Let me guess, you never tried kev/zx with a big differential.

 

[Shroud]

same machine, not sure if same person

Diff people will produce diff results. Looks like you figured it out

 

[PT280 Fan]

Let me guess, you never tried kev/zx with a big differential.

I’ve always had my Kevlar mains strung 9 or 10 lbs lower than my zyex crosses and love it that way. Plenty of spin, very reliable.

Also, in the podcast, Steve Crandalll the Ashaway principal stated that zyex really only performs well between the tensions of 50-60. He said it’s not like poly that has a much broader stringing parameter.

 

[jumper67]

I’ve always had my Kevlar mains strung 9 or 10 lbs lower than my zyex crosses and love it that way. Plenty of spin, very reliable.

How long do you go between string jobs?

By the time it comes to replacing strings for me, the kevlar has hardly no tension left, strings are moving and not snapping back at all. So I try to string tighter from the start to keep it longer

 

[Shroud]

I’ve always had my Kevlar mains strung 9 or 10 lbs lower than my zyex crosses and love it that way. Plenty of spin, very reliable.

Also, in the podcast, Steve Crandalll the Ashaway principal stated that zyex really only performs well between the tensions of 50-60. He said it’s not like poly that has a much broader stringing parameter.

Sounds like i was right. Also how are you not destroying the integrity of your frames?

 

[PT280 Fan]

How long do you go between string jobs?

By the time it comes to replacing strings for me, the kevlar has hardly no tension left, strings are moving and not snapping back at all. So I try to string tighter from the start to keep it longer

I play until I break a string which actually hasn’t happened yet as I have too many rackets. My PT280 has been going strong for 2+ years with zero perceptible tension loss. Kevlar and zyex are known for having the best tension maintenance of any string. If you are experiencing tension loss on a frame with a huge differential, it’s probably because you’ve altered the structural integrity of the frame.

 

[PT280 Fan]

Sounds like i was right. Also how are you not destroying the integrity of your frames?

Wut?

 

[Shroud]

How long do you go between string jobs?

By the time it comes to replacing strings for me, the kevlar has hardly no tension left, strings are moving and not snapping back at all. So I try to string tighter from the start to keep it longer

That sounds like notching. Electrocrosses or some light oil like coconut oil can extend the life

 

[Shroud]

Wut?

I said you never tried it with a big differential. You replied with 10 lbs the wrong way. It sounded like you were saying any deviation from norm would damage frames so wouldnt a 10lb tighter cross damage frames? Its outside the norm. And arent your tendons wrecked?

 

[PT280 Fan]

I said you never tried it with a big differential. You replied with 10 lbs the wrong way. It sounded like you were saying any deviation from norm would damage frames so wouldnt a 10lb tighter cross damage frames? Its outside the norm. And arent your tendons wrecked?

I didn’t say anything like that. My hoop shape has never been altered due to exceeding manufacturer stringing tension recommendations.

 

[Shroud]

I didn’t say anything like that. My hoop shape has never been altered due to exceeding manufacturer stringing tension recommendations.

There's a lot of contrarian information on this thread. The manufacturer recommends a 15-20% decrease in kevlar main tension compared to ZX crosses not the opposite. Also if you listened to the podcast, the kevlar plus is a little softer than the regular kevlar due to added polymers. Beyond that, you are damaging the integrity of your frame when you exceed stringing recommendations as well as asking for tendon and ligament damage.

Maybe i misunderstood but you seem to say that you must string the mains lower or the racquet will be damaged (the guy you responded to was doing somthing like 70/45 iirc) yet are doing a differential anyhow and imho you dont want the racquet to elongate. That is worse than it shortening.

if you string the crosses lower its actually easier on the arm than the other way around so if you are worried about ligaments its actually worse the way you are doing it.

and dont fool yourself, hoop shape is always altered during the stringing process. Maybe its a Head thing but wilson and princes and gammas etc are all ok with the crosses 20lbs less than the mains.

 

[PT280 Fan]

Carry on,I’m happy, you’re happy, that’s all that matters!

 

[Wiztardo]

I am curious what other configurations people have tried the Zyex in?

Right now, i've got a gen 2 Pure Strike 100, Blade 104 v7, and a Pro Staff v13 all strung exactly the same with Kevlar mains at 60 and Zyex crosses at 40. I love this combo in the Pure Strike and the Blade. It absolutely fits my play style and it's what I use when I am trying to win. But I got the Pro Staff over Christmas more as a "I know this won't fit my playstyle but I want to have fun and try new things" racket. And so, in the spirit of accepting polar opposite qualities of my usual favored racket just for the fun factor, I am imagining a very powerful, strong plow-through, Pro Staff. My first thought is a full bed of Natural Gut, but then started thinking about different ways I could use the Zyex to go down this route.

Have any of you folks experimented with Zyex in any other form?

 

[TypeRx]

got a gen 2 Pure Strike 100, Blade 104 v7, and a Pro Staff v13 all strung exactly the same with Kevlar mains at 60 and Zyex crosses at 40. I love this combo in the Pure Strike and the Blade. It absolutely fits my play style and it's what I use when I am trying to win. But I got the Pro Staff over Christmas more as a "I know this won't fit my playstyle but I want to have fun and try new things" racket. And so, in the spirit of accepting polar opposite qualities of my usual favored racket just for the fun factor, I am imagining a very powerful, strong plow-through, Pro Staff. My first thought is a full bed of Natural Gut, but then started thinking about

I've used Kev/ZXP in the following rackets:
Babolat Pure Drive + (2015)
Volkl V-Sense 8 315
Volkl V-Sense 10 325
Prince CTS Graduate MP
Wilson RF97A
Wilson Clash 100 Tour
Wilson Blade 98 v7.0
Babolat Pure Strike (gen 2)
Wilson Blade 104 v7.0

For each of the rackets above, I have had a minimum of a pair so I've had plenty of experience. My go to tension now is 62/40 but have gone as high as 75 Kev and as low as 35 ZXP.

 

[Pharmer]

Hello guys,

I am waiting on a stringer to arrive in about 2 weeks. Looking to do Ash Kev 18 ga, Zyex 17ga at maybe 62/45. I've been combing through this thread from start to finish. Took about a week to go through all that, all the side chats and whoa that bit of drama later on that didn't seem to go away, but thankfully it did, and now back to the meat of the discussion . So Shroud, yes, I will do a pre-stretch.

If I had read this thread first, I might have given the 18ga a second thought, but I have a little bit of 17ga Ash kev on hand and wanted to try something new. I've moved from 16ga kev to 17ga kev and liked it a lot without sacrificing any practical durability. Hoping a further move to 18ga will sustain durability (up to 20hrs is fine) and hold the promise of good performance, if only for the first 2 hours as some have said.

On the topic of durability... I am a prolific string breaker. When I first started, it was Ash kev (the regular, non PTFE coated) with syn gut. If the syn gut gave away first, then I would get about 9-10 hours. If it came down to the kev, it would be about 17-20 hours until breakage. I was stringing the mains at 65-72, crosses at 67ish. I think my low end stringer might be a contributor to lower than expected string life, but I cannot say with any confidence. No matter, I am getting a new stringer because the old one broke down. The move to a poly on the crosses was a game changer. I am playing on a stringbed that is going over 30 hours. The poly is simply slicker than anything I have used before. It's probably the reason why I still have little notching. Surprisingly, the kev mains stay in place. In fact, I have not had to move any strings back in place. You would think slicker crosses means more movement, but not so. I think that because the poly crosses are slick, the mains are able to return to their original position...

My current setup is 17ga kev/ 17ga poly (cyber flash 1.25). So going beyond 30 hours on a stringbed, I feel like it needs a good death. It simply does not give me enough power any more. The zyex pro that I will be switching to is more than 3x the cost of the cyber flash poly. I don't expect 3x the performance, but am looking forward to a pleasant surprise. Will find out in a couple of weeks.

 

[Holdfast44ID]

I have a couple of sets of this stuff (Ashway Kevlar/Zyex). I wonder how it would play in the Prince Ripstick 100 (300)? I normally string poly between 48-52 lbs. in a full bed of poly. What tensions do you guys recommend to use as a baseline using kevlar/Zyex?

I think I tried Prince Pro Blend back in the 90's. If so, only once, as it was not too rememberable. It did try a full bed of kevlar back then and that was probably too much on my arm. One of my fellow tennis pros at a club I taught at swore by Pro Blend back then. I think that was when Agassi was using that combo.

 

[graycrait]

I couldn't begin to count the number of rackets I have strung with Ash Kev x ZX. But I gave up other gauges except 16g Ash Kev x ZXP (17g). I have also given up arcane prestretching routines save for triple pulling Ash Kev mains. I almost always tension 65 or 62 mains and 58 ZX crosses. Now that I am experimenting heavily with super OS rackets Ash Kev x ZX in these monsters is really special compared to anything I have tried. I'm personally not crazy about Ash Kev x ZX in 93-98" rackets, especially lower RA rackets even less so if they have 18x20 patterns.

I have a 20-something 5.0 friend who lives in a good tennis community about 60 miles away who had me string one of his Pure Drives with AKxZX because he wanted to try something other than 15g poly he is also trying because he busts 16g poly in short order. Both his mom and sister are tennis coaches but he decided to become a pilot. He has used his Ash Kev x ZXP PD just several hours but reported that he won his last match 3&2 using the AK/ZX PD so it seems satisfactory so far.

Problend is so much different than Ash Kev x ZX that they cannot be compared head to head. As far as I know Ashaway still only markets sets of Kevlar+ x Zyex. Kevlar+ does not play quite the same as plain Ashaway Kevlar. I ended up using my one and only reel of Kevlar+ as utility string around the home I was so disappointed in it. I have tried every kevlar/aramid string I could find and none work like Ash Kev because Ash Kev is braided, not simply strands and is also not encased in some "plasticky" stuff.

I think there is around a 15-20% drop in tension in the first 24hrs plus 2hrs of hitting with Ash Kev x ZX and then it settles. I used to try using the Tennis Tension and Racquet Tune apps but gave up on them with Ash Kev x ZX.

Out of my current accumulation of 62 rackets 20 are strung with Ash Kev x ZX.

 

[shug]

I used Problend back in the day. I moved to a 17ga strings, I never knew there were other Kevlar strings, so for several years I was looking for something as stiff as a Kevlar. Not until I started stringing did I find out about Ashaway's Kevlar 17ga (several year later). I now only use Ashaway 17ga Kevlar and Prince's 17ga SynGut/duraflex (Problend'esk). My mains and crosses are strung at 77 lbs (as I've always strung). This is not a power or control setup, I string my racquets for precision.

 

[Brad N.]

It's a joy not having to restring my rackets as often as when I use poly.

 

[shug]

It's a joy not having to restring my rackets as often as when I use poly.

The first time I went to Kevlar was due to string breakage, Since, I pretty much string after every use for accuracy.

 

[Holdfast44ID]

I have one Ripstick (300g) strung up with kevlar/Zyex 17 at 60/55 lbs. Will test it out. I feel like I'm back in the 90's. lol

 

[Shroud]

The first time I went to Kevlar was due to string breakage, Since, I pretty much string after every use for accuracy.

Wow man thats some dedication! Why not just up the tension and get through the first 30-40 min till it stabilizes?

 

[strcmp]

When do you guys cut out kevlar/zx? or just wait until it breaks? Mine has been strung about 2 months.. probably 50-70 hours of use on it. Slightly frayed in the middle, but showing no signs of breaking any time soon. I'm not a chronic string breaker.

 

[srimes]

When do you guys cut out kevlar/zx? or just wait until it breaks? Mine has been strung about 2 months.. probably 50-70 hours of use on it. Slightly frayed in the middle, but showing no signs of breaking any time soon. I'm not a chronic string breaker.

I play it until it breaks, except if I'm entering a tournament as with new strings I don't have to worry about breakage.

 

[travlerajm]

When do you guys cut out kevlar/zx? or just wait until it breaks? Mine has been strung about 2 months.. probably 50-70 hours of use on it. Slightly frayed in the middle, but showing no signs of breaking any time soon. I'm not a chronic string breaker.

If you can nail the tension right so that it settles where you like it, there is no need to cut it out until it’s about to break.

 

[croissant92]

When do you guys cut out kevlar/zx? or just wait until it breaks? Mine has been strung about 2 months.. probably 50-70 hours of use on it. Slightly frayed in the middle, but showing no signs of breaking any time soon. I'm not a chronic string breaker.

I've only played with two sets of strings of the kev/zyex so far. In the first set, when the kevlar got very frayed (after about 2 months of play) and was just hanging on by a thread, I felt like my shots were going wild. They broke later that same session. It may have not been the strings but more a bad day for me. But regardless, with my next set when I saw the Kevlar start to get very frayed I just cut it out preemptively as I figured there would only be an hour left of it and didn't want to have another subpar playing experience. I should also say, with a little bit of fraying I did not notice any issue with playability.

 

[shug]

Wow man thats some dedication! Why not just up the tension and get through the first 30-40 min till it stabilizes?

Has nothing to do with dedication, my setup is a precision setup, it's good out the gate. and is good for about 3 sets. I can not use the same used strings the following day. I have to string after every single match/day use.

 

[shug]

When do you guys cut out kevlar/zx? or just wait until it breaks?

I use the Kevlar (not the zx), I cut out my stings after every use. That's the main reason I started stringing my own racquets.

 

[travlerajm]

Has nothing to do with dedication, my setup is a precision setup, it's good out the gate. and is good for about 3 sets. I can not use the same used strings the following day. I have to string after every single match/day use.

That sounds like a pain.

 

[Shroud]

Has nothing to do with dedication, my setup is a precision setup, it's good out the gate. and is good for about 3 sets. I can not use the same used strings the following day. I have to string after every single match/day use.

Stringing every 3 sets is dedication imho.

 

[shug]

That sounds like a pain.

Considering the accuracy of my serve, it's not a pain at all.

 

[Slowtwitcher]

It's obvious that shug is the junior that can hit more cones than Federer and Serena

Seriously, what I like more about Kev/Zx is not having to constantly string my racquets. All that with great performance.

 

[Wiztardo]

Has anyone tried Natural Gut mains with Zyex Crosses? If so at what tensions? Does the string bed stay unlocked? Will the Zyex cut through the Gut a lot quicker than if I just did a full bed of Natural Gut?