Inner Game of Tennis question

[mitchishere21]

Very quickly I just got my hands on the inner game of tennis and loved it. If there is any coaches here that use this natural method of learning through observation, feel, non judgement how do they go about it and incoporate it there lessons. Very interested in this and want to apply natural learning using self 2.

 

[nabrug]

Very quickly I just got my hands on the inner game of tennis and loved it. If there is any coaches here that use this natural method of learning through observation, feel, non judgement how do they go about it and incoporate it there lessons. Very interested in this and want to apply natural learning using self 2.

In my translated copy there is a chapter about learning (ballroom) dancing by just watching. Is that chapter also in the original text?

 

[mitchishere21]

No, whats it say

 

[nabrug]

No, whats it say

It is in the beginning of the book. Around page 40-50.

 

[nabrug]

It is about his sister having dance lessons.

 

[mitchishere21]

think i have found it does he talk about a kid being able to learn the monkey just through observation too

 

[peoplespeace]

think i have found it does he talk about a kid being able to learn the monkey just through observation too

learn "the monkey" or teach a monkey (to dance?)??

 

[GetBetterer]

I coached my younger brother using the method (works), but you need to know the technical aspects of how to hit. You can't just expect them to know.

The teaching method isn't to go "get your arm up higher" or "use a closed stance" it's to tell them to notice those things themselves, so that they can fix it themselves. If they don't, teach them the technical version of it again with the correct method.

 

[mitchishere21]

I coached my younger brother using the method (works), but you need to know the technical aspects of how to hit. You can't just expect them to know.

The teaching method isn't to go "get your arm up higher" or "use a closed stance" it's to tell them to notice those things themselves, so that they can fix it themselves. If they don't, teach them the technical version of it again with the correct method.

Thanks bro makes sense. Yeah i know all the technial aspects Im a coach.
Thanks away for your insights

 

[Kevo]

I like the method in the book about focusing your attention on a particular thing and not judging it, just understanding what's happening. I use that a lot. Many people really don't observe themselves very well, and I've found that asking them to pay attention to how their shoulders feel during a forehand, for instance, allows them to better observe what they are actually doing with their body during the stroke.

It also pretty much eliminates giving do this or do that commands while they are practicing technique that they just saw demonstrated. Once they realize what is actually happening during their swing they already know what to change based on the initial instruction and demonstration of the technique.

 

[mitchishere21]

I like the method in the book about focusing your attention on a particular thing and not judging it, just understanding what's happening. I use that a lot. Many people really don't observe themselves very well, and I've found that asking them to pay attention to how their shoulders feel during a forehand, for instance, allows them to better observe what they are actually doing with their body during the stroke.

It also pretty much eliminates giving do this or do that commands while they are practicing technique that they just saw demonstrated. Once they realize what is actually happening during their swing they already know what to change based on the initial instruction and demonstration of the technique.

going to put it into effect from today thanks

 

[Timbo's hopeless slice]

look, I don't remember a lot from this book, I read it 20 years ago at least, but I still try to 'watch the seams'

 

[tennis_balla]

I used to have a very good coach when I was a junior who used a lot of the things from Inner Game. He was one of those coaches that wouldn't talk all the time, but when he said something you listened and it was always dead on, to the point and he knew exactly what he was doing. All the top juniors in the area and outside as well would take lessons from him.

I like the Inner Game approach and have used it quite a bit in my own teaching but it cannot be applied all the time. For example, I worked at Newks as an academy coach and there they want you to be verbal and loud and motivate the kids, constantly. Parents are watching so they want it to look like theres instruction given all the time.
In 2006 I was teaching at an academy in Germany that had quite a bit of good ITF junior players and I remember one incident where I had 3 players on my court working on a backhand drill, I got them to do the drill right and they were working hard, so no need to blab on every ball. I said something maybe once every 5 balls or so such as encouragement and a correction if needed, which could still be considered a lot for Inner Game type of coaching. Anyways the head coach came over, gave me a look as if to say WTF are you doing? and then took me aside and said I need to be loud and give constant feedback, pretty much on every ball hit.
For me as I player, I never liked coaches who talked a lot.

 

[meltphace 6]

Anyways the head coach came over, gave me a look as if to say WTF are you doing? and then took me aside and said I need to be loud and give constant feedback, pretty much on every ball hit.

Did he explain to you why you had to do so? Marketing? To amplify the feedback the player is receiving (trajectory, etc.)? Motivation?

 

[tennis_balla]

Did he explain to you why you had to do so? Marketing? To amplify the feedback the player is receiving (trajectory, etc.)? Motivation?

Oh I knew why, I've been teaching long enough I was just doing my own thing at the time. They want the coaches to yap a lot, keep pushing the kids cause for starters that was their style. He used to be a coach at Bollettieri's so he uses that type of mentality and it gets the kids going and looks (for the parents and people watching) like theres a lot going on. Now don't get me wrong I use my fair share of a lot of verbal instructions and I believe it has its place and needs to be done when needed especially in an academy setting such as that, but sometimes like that situation you don't need a coach who's constantly talking and doesn't shut up.
If you're coaching kids who are playing ITF juniors tournaments and are around 16 yrs old and already working hard, you don't need to yell at them all the time like if they were 9 or 10.

 

[meltphace 6]

He used to be a coach at Bollettieri's so he uses that type of mentality and it gets the kids going and looks (for the parents and people watching) like theres a lot going on.

Ah, the used car salesman method. A man's got to eat!

 

[tennis_balla]

Well in some cases its great to be loud and verbal and say a lot especially to get the kids motivated and moving. In other cases its not always needed, depends. At that moment I felt like it wasn't needed, the kids were working hard, didn't talk at all amongst each other and were hitting well and enjoying themselves so why should I yap and comment every shot, its not needed. Too much information is also not good.

Sometimes I think coaches feel the need to always be involved, as if not to show the student that they can and are capable of learning themselves as well. Maybe the coach is afraid he might not be needed as much as he puts out to be. Like Gallwey says, let the flower bloom on its own don't always try and get involved in every possible way as a coach.

 

[meltphace 6]

Sometimes I think coaches feel the need to always be involved, as if not to show the student that they can and are capable of learning themselves as well. Maybe the coach is afraid he might not be needed as much as he puts out to be.

Good point. I work as a full time coach, mostly with kids that play tennis only once a week and they keep asking me: "did I improve, did I improve?", well, uhm, yes. I actually tell them and their parents that they would be better off renting a court two times a week and skip the tennis classes (group of 4 kids) altogether.

And I'm really getting tired of the yapping part - motivating and reminding kids to, for example, employ the split step. Had four 16 year old boys on the court this afternoon and each of them understands the how and why about the split step and they are able to demonstrate it with perfect timing. OK, two minutes later two of them skip the split step. But I won't give up...

Thanks for letting me rant (no, I won't get started with the "hey, what's your real job?" question).

 

[mitchishere21]

thanks tennisballa and meltphace. i agree with everyone your saying tennis balla as well in regards to your boss wanting you to always give verbal feedback sometimes just for the sake of looking like theres lots going on to impress the parents. I believe half the time this is not needed and confuses the students as they try to remember lots of things. As they try to remember then self 1 gets involded in the shot causing mistakes.
I tried yesterday the method of having my students observe the shot, place their awarness to certain parts of the stroke and vialuse. All my lesson were fantastic using this method. i also found that the students dont need all the verbal encouragement to be pushed as there focus of attention is placed on certain aspects of the shot and they are paying close attention to that.