Is calculus important?

Fandango

Fandango

Rookie
Hi, I'm on the path to become a medical doctor but one thing I have felt a bit apprehensive about is that my math education is as good as Calculus II although I really didn't understand many of the concepts and owe a great deal of success from integration and derivation to my trusty, ole TI-89 :)

My question is that math seems to be the only thing that universe holds constant-if we go to another planet-the same mathematical truths exist as they existed on earth. The physics may be similar but the gravitational constant, and forces that go into making the smallest carbon atom (nuclear coupling force, gravitational coupling force etc.) may very in great detail.

So, I feel insecure that I only have a solid understanding of algebra 2 type math, algebra 1, geometry, and Precalculus topics, as well as the general concepts in calculus such as chain rule, quotient rule, product rule, and just knowing that calculus is the study of mathematical change.

Should I be more concerned, and start going through calculus 3 topics, linear algebra and more abstract math even if calculus might have little use for my career choice or should I educate myself even though I personally have a disdain for calculus related math, and enjoy algebra/trigonometry/geometry.
 
You won't need much calculus in medical school, except maybe differential equations for chemical reaction rates and fluid flow/diffusion models.

But then I did not go to medical school so don't take me seriously.
 
Calc II is a pretty good level for someone who doesn't need that much math. If you're going to spend time on extra classes, look into other subjects you haven't studied so much.

How's your world history, geography, economics, music history, etc.? Have you studied any foreign languages? Are there any subjects you find you've completely missed out on?
 
I think you'd be better off taking more science cources than math if you're going to be in the medical profession. Chemistry and other sciences will touch on the math necessary to apply to those areas. You're not an idiot when it comes to math as it is, but you don't need advanced math to do medical field work.
 
Never used calculus in med school, never used it after (some was used in statistical analyses when I ran a research program but there were always other people, usually psychology Ph.Ds with strong statistics backgrounds, to do that end of things)
 
You only need a year of calc for JHU and HMS, IIRC. You don't need it in medicine, unless you go the MSTP route (and it is still not a sure thing either).
 
Calculus is extremely important in medicine.


A calculus (plural calculi) is a stone (a concretion of material, usually mineral salts) that forms in an organ or duct of the body. Formation of calculi is known as lithiasis. Stones cause a number of medical conditions.
Some common principles (below) apply to stones at any location, but for specifics see the particular stone type in question.
Calculi are not to be confused with gastroliths.
 
IMO, just about any particular topic in school boils down to a "layer of abstraction" to the highest level of anything you're willing to study.

For instance: If you understand Algebra, you take trig/geometry/simple arithmetic for granted. Everything below the layer that you're currently operating on is abstracted away, and it's taken for granted that you understand how/why things work.

This is especially apparent in engineering (although it applies to any field). Low level engineering courses can be very math intensive, but once you "graduate" from those courses, you tackle much larger design problems and may never use that math again. The complexity is "abstracted" away.

For your path in study, Calculus probably isn't critical, TBH. If you really are curious in lifelong learning (just for kicks), check out Khan academy. I hear really good things.
 
ollinger said:
Never used calculus in med school, never used it after (some was used in statistical analyses when I ran a research program but there were always other people, usually psychology Ph.Ds with strong statistics backgrounds, to do that end of things)
Click to expand...

Yep. I never used it in med school or ever after, including a Critical Care fellowship.
You'd be better off taking statistics or just a good epidemiology course that covers the kind of statistics needed for that. You would probably also be much better off taking as much as you can in the social sciences and humanities because you will be as much, if not more of, a counselor/social worker as a scientist. Dealing with human quirks and foibles is much more personally challenging than any intellectual challenge medicine may provide.
 
diredesire said:
IMO, just about any particular topic in school boils down to a "layer of abstraction" to the highest level of anything you're willing to study.

For instance: If you understand Algebra, you take trig/geometry/simple arithmetic for granted. Everything below the layer that you're currently operating on is abstracted away, and it's taken for granted that you understand how/why things work.

This is especially apparent in engineering (although it applies to any field). Low level engineering courses can be very math intensive, but once you "graduate" from those courses, you tackle much larger design problems and may never use that math again. The complexity is "abstracted" away.

For your path in study, Calculus probably isn't critical, TBH. If you really are curious in lifelong learning (just for kicks), check out Khan academy. I hear really good things.
Click to expand...

Advanced engineering research uses far more math than is taught in low level courses. In fact, it uses mathematical techniques more familiar to physicists and mathematicians and engineers struggle to learn it. Most chicken out and become "systems" level people.
 
Calculus I and II yes, Business Calculus not so much.

Also you know that only Calc I is required for most health professions. This coming from a person who had aspirations of being a doctor, but decided that doing independent research is a lot more fun, professor FTW.
 
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OK, I studied in Germany. So honestly I do not know your situation in the States.

I never,never, never needed any advanced math. Not at university, not in any of my jobs. I can not deal with numbers. Math ist the Antichrist for me. I hate math. Tell me 5 numbers, and I have forgotten the first when you tell me the last. Have no idea about Algebra, no idea of trigonometry and all the other bullsh*t.

Nowadays I am assistant director of our German equivalent to CDC.

So go ahead, become a MD and be happy.
 
True mathematics is an art. It's nice to know but not really practical in every day life.

I'm a math major who changed to economics because it's easier to get a job. And while there is a bit of calculus in that, it's nothing compared to truly in depth math that Ph.Ds study. If I was going to be a doctor, I would focus ALL my energy on the relevant stuff like Chemistry, Biology, Anatomy, Physiology and so on.
 
Andreas1965 said:
OK, I studied in Germany. So honestly I do not know your situation in the States.

I never,never, never needed any advanced math. Not at university, not in any of my jobs. I can not deal with numbers. Math ist the Antichrist for me. I hate math. Tell me 5 numbers, and I have forgotten the first when you tell me the last. Have no idea about Algebra, no idea of trigonometry and all the other bullsh*t.

Nowadays I am assistant director of our German equivalent to CDC.

So go ahead, become a MD and be happy.
Click to expand...

University in Euro countries is much different than College is in the states. Here we have to take base courses again for crap we're not going to major in. In Europe, it was understood that by the time you graduated from high school, you already knew what you wanted to do in life and you went to a University to concentrate on just those courses. Most times, an entrance exam is needed and the state pays for the schooling if you pass those tests, which are super hard. In the states, you pay to have them teach you another 2 years of what you've studied for 12 years in prior schools before you can concentrate on what you really want to do for another 2 years. Basically, you're paying a school to teach you **** you don't want to learn anyway. It's crap if you ask me. College should be a place where you concentrate on a particular field and only that which applies to that field, not waste time and money on crap you don't need. It's a bs way to do school if you ask me.
 
Fandango said:
My question is that math seems to be the only thing that universe holds constant-if we go to another planet-the same mathematical truths exist as they existed on earth. The physics may be similar but the gravitational constant, and forces that go into making the smallest carbon atom (nuclear coupling force, gravitational coupling force etc.) may very in great detail.

So, I feel insecure that I only have a solid understanding of algebra 2 type math, algebra 1, geometry, and Precalculus topics, as well as the general concepts in calculus such as chain rule, quotient rule, product rule, and just knowing that calculus is the study of mathematical change.
Click to expand...

On which planet do you plan on opening your practice?
 
sureshs said:
Advanced engineering research uses far more math than is taught in low level courses. In fact, it uses mathematical techniques more familiar to physicists and mathematicians and engineers struggle to learn it. Most chicken out and become "systems" level people.
Click to expand...

That's because advanced engineering IS physics (if we're talking about "rocket science," etc). I'm talking about the engineering that the other 99% does, for instance simulations/models. The person running sims/models (be it an electrical circuit, load bearing construction, fluid mechanics, etc) doesn't necessarily have to do every little calculation, the software has abstracted that part away. The engineer definitely needs to understand how the model is coming up with the results, but that doesn't really have to do with the OP's question at this point. Calculus is important... if it's important ;)
 
Calculus is not important in medicine. You do need to know it for your required physics courses although not all people take calculus based physics. I remember liking calculus a lot as an undergrad but I stopped after one year and now have forgotten it all:). Statistics is more important. You should take a stat class as an undergrad and if possible epidemiology.
 
diredesire said:
That's because advanced engineering IS physics (if we're talking about "rocket science," etc). I'm talking about the engineering that the other 99% does, for instance simulations/models. The person running sims/models (be it an electrical circuit, load bearing construction, fluid mechanics, etc) doesn't necessarily have to do every little calculation, the software has abstracted that part away. The engineer definitely needs to understand how the model is coming up with the results, but that doesn't really have to do with the OP's question at this point. Calculus is important... if it's important ;)
Click to expand...

OP's question had nothing to do with engineering, so that is a moot point. I don't use calculus at all, for example.
 
sureshs said:
OP's question had nothing to do with engineering, so that is a moot point. I don't use calculus at all, for example.
Click to expand...

The original example indeed had something to do with the OP/OQ. I didn't call it into question, so you're preaching to the choir ;)
 
You probably don't need anymore calculus than what you already know. But if you find math interesting in general, it won't hurt to take a couple courses in linear algebra or abstract algebra.

If you want a rigorous introduction to calculus, you can torture yourself by taking real analysis.
 
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