Is Djokovic the least respected "all-time great" ever?

powerangle

Legend
I consider him an all-time great (feel free to disagree) because of his resume (6+ slams, plus quite a bit of other achievements with tons of Masters, weeks at #1, a couple WTFs, a super-dominating year, etc..). But anyway...

Is he perhaps the least respected all-time great? I've seen a lot of Djoker bashing lately after the Wimbledon final. How he's a "plexicushion specialist", how he's "only" won a slam a year post-2011 (a great year by any means before the Fedal Era spoiled us), how he's a PEDs user, a brat, an ungracious winner, throws matches for $$$, how he's a fake, how he's cheated on his girlfriend, how he kicks homeless people in the faces...

I understand he's not the most elegant ball striker and doesn't play your classical textbook tennis. But he deserves some respect by being good at what he does, and that's win tennis matches (even if mechanical at times). He's also a great fighter. Why all the disrespect? Heck, I've even seen him be compared to Wozniacki on here (LOL) because he's so "consistent" and makes it to #1.
 
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powerangle

Legend
Wilander is probably the least-respected great. Look at his accomplishments, yet he is hardly ever mentioned.
But that's from a lack of mention perspective. (Though fair enough).

I'm talking about the "hate" that Djoker gets. Has Wilander ever gotten that many comments about him being fake or classless? Of him being a cheater?
 

Govnor

Professional
But that's from a lack of mention perspective. (Though fair enough).

I'm talking about the "hate" that Djoker gets. Has Wilander ever gotten that many comments about him being fake or classless? Of him being a cheater?
Pretty sure Wilander played Pre-internet, so you can't really compare. Can you?
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
I don't know about respected but Ivan Lendl was a very unpopular great. Never exceptionally well-liked at least in N. America, probably more so than Djokovic.
 

pjonesy

Professional
I consider him an all-time great (feel free to disagree) because of his resume (6+ slams, plus quite a bit of other achievements with tons of Masters, weeks at #1, a couple WTFs, a super-dominating year, etc..). But anyway...

Is he perhaps the least respected all-time great? I've seen a lot of Djoker bashing lately after the Wimbledon final. How he's a "plexicushion specialist", how he's "only" won a slam a year post-2011 (a great year by any means before the Fedal Era spoiled us), how he's a PEDs user, how he's a brat, how he's an ungracious winner, how he's cheated on his girlfriend, how he kicks homeless people in the faces...

I understand he's not the most elegant ball striker and doesn't play your classical textbook tennis. But he deserves some respect by being good at what he does, and that's win tennis matches (even if mechanical at times). He's also a great fighter. Why all the disrespect? Heck, I've even seen him be compared to Wozniacki on here (LOL) because he's so "consistent" and makes it to #1.
I'm not sure that I buy everything you are saying. I see much more Murray and Nadal bashing, than Djokovic bashing.

First of all, Djokovic seems like an outgoing person, with charisma and a sense of humor. He seems to show respect for all of his opponents and for the history of the game. At the same time, I see him as a fierce competitor whose game is based on intensity, focus and consistency.

Djokovic has the best groundstrokes I have ever seen. He moves superbly and covers the ball better than anyone. The perfect blend of pace, spin and control. Lendl looked mechanical as well, but I certainly would put his groundstrokes up at the top of his era. Djokovic is simply a phenomenal athlete and a fantastic ball striker. The premiere example of the perfect modern day elite pro tennis player.
 

Mustard

Talk Tennis Guru
And rightfully so, he was the ultimate pusher.
Nonsense. Wilander was the ultimate intelligent tennis player, and could adapt to different styles and circumstances. If he wanted to achieve something that badly, he would do it, but he regularly had motivational issues on the tour. Wilander had no cruise game, so to play his best, he would need to go into a cocoon of concentration, which is too mentally draining to keep up long term.
 

timnz

Legend
10th in the Open era (soon to be 9th)

I am putting him at 10th in the Open era (of those who have had their full career in the open era ie not including Newcombe, Laver, Rosewall etc), soon to be 9th (he will overtake Becker very soon, almost certainly this year). He is ahead of Edberg and Wilander. That means he is a great player!

So of course he deserves respect. I really like his fearlessness when his back is against the wall.
 

Mustard

Talk Tennis Guru
I suspect THIS all-time great knew a thing or two about lack of respect!

Lendl never spoke to Sports Illustrated again, unless he's lifted it recently. The US were bitter about the early exits of McEnroe and Connors, and were acting like American tennis was struggling.
 

Antonio Puente

Hall of Fame
His reputation is sliding, no doubt - losing record against Nadal and Fed, 7-12 in slams. Murray is coming close to evening things up, now even in slams. Djoker's dropped to 6-5 in slam finals. People saw domination in 2011, yes, but looking at his career as a whole, there is 2011 and everything else.
 

Narcissist

Semi-Pro
Smashing up the Perrier bench (RG final ’12)
Sarcastic gesturing when he’s losing
Cocky over the top victory celebrations

All players have their moments but fed, nadal and murray would not do these to the same extent.
 

pjonesy

Professional
Nonsense. Wilander was the ultimate intelligent tennis player, and could adapt to different styles and circumstances. If he wanted to achieve something that badly, he would do it, but he regularly had motivational issues on the tour. Wilander had no cruise game, so to play his best, he would need to go into a cocoon of concentration, which is too mentally draining to keep up long term.
The older I get, the more I appreciate Wilander as a player and competitor. When I was coming up with 'perfect player' on the Berdych thread, I chose Wilander as the Mental superlative. But that is kind of a broad, catch all category. Wilander was very intelligent on the court, was generally even keeled and obviously was very consistent. But the fact that he checked out quite a few times and often lacked motivation, hurts his reputation. It doesn't help him to be respected as a 7 Major Champion. As it might indicate that he could have won more.
 

pjonesy

Professional
Lendl or Wilander would fit the category of least respected "all-time great".

Not Sampras or Djokovic, IMO.
 

tennis_pro

Bionic Poster
Nonsense. Wilander was the ultimate intelligent tennis player, and could adapt to different styles and circumstances. If he wanted to achieve something that badly, he would do it, but he regularly had motivational issues on the tour. Wilander had no cruise game, so to play his best, he would need to go into a cocoon of concentration, which is too mentally draining to keep up long term.
In other words - he was a pusher.
 

Tenez101

Banned
Lendl was unpopular in his time, but he was respected then and now. Wilander takes the cake for 'least respected'.

Sampras not being respected is nonsense. He's American after all.
 
Lendl never spoke to Sports Illustrated again, unless he's lifted it recently. The US were bitter about the early exits of McEnroe and Connors, and were acting like American tennis was struggling.
He must've mellowed a bit, since he's signed that particular copy. I definitely wouldn't have volunteered to stick that under his nose though, and ask "Hey Eye-van, can ah git yer autograph?"
:-?


Regards,
MDL
 

70後

Hall of Fame
He has NO net game and is FAR from the so called best returner. His outstanding ability is to never get tired, which wouldn't have counted for anything in any other era except in this farce of an anti-shotmaker era. The AO Wawrinka match was the final straw. I don't trust people who never get tired.
 

Sid_Vicious

G.O.A.T.
I consider him an all-time great (feel free to disagree) because of his resume (6+ slams, plus quite a bit of other achievements with tons of Masters, weeks at #1, a couple WTFs, a super-dominating year, etc..). But anyway...

Is he perhaps the least respected all-time great? I've seen a lot of Djoker bashing lately after the Wimbledon final. How he's a "plexicushion specialist", how he's "only" won a slam a year post-2011 (a great year by any means before the Fedal Era spoiled us), how he's a PEDs user, a brat, an ungracious winner, throws matches for $$$, how he's a fake, how he's cheated on his girlfriend, how he kicks homeless people in the faces...

I understand he's not the most elegant ball striker and doesn't play your classical textbook tennis. But he deserves some respect by being good at what he does, and that's win tennis matches (even if mechanical at times). He's also a great fighter. Why all the disrespect? Heck, I've even seen him be compared to Wozniacki on here (LOL) because he's so "consistent" and makes it to #1.
That was me, but you did not look at the context. I said that if Djokovic and Murray play at the USO and if Murray wins again, Djokovic would look like a "plexicushion specialist" ..which was more like a joke since on this forum people call Nadal a "clay specialist".
 
J

JRAJ1988

Guest
I think he'll be more respected as time goes on, he may well end up with 10+ slams at the end of his career and will go down as a great of the game though Nadal and Federer seem more of marketable all time great than Djokovic for some unknown reason.

I never took him seriously before 2011, now I do and I respect him in the same bracket like Nadal and Federer.
 

Bender

G.O.A.T.
I wouldn't use the term "respected"...forums like this one tend to accentuate people's likes / dislikes for different players. A newcomer reading some of these threads might think Nadal is Hitler reborn, Federer a fraud and Batman a nuisance.

He's not as popular as Fedal though, but I'm guessing that'd change if he keeps winning. Regularly beating the two most popular players of all time certainly doesn't help though.

Personally I'm not sure whether he will win so consistently now that Murray's playing better and given that he may not be on tour that long given his playing style...
 
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Roddick85

Hall of Fame
I say give it a few years and he'll get some respect. His likability factor will increase the day Federer and Nadal retire. He'll be one of the few faces left from the "golden years" of tennis and we all know how people like nostalgia.
 

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
I wouldn't use the term "respected"...forums like this one tend to accentuate people's likes / dislikes for different players. A newcomer reading some of these threads might think Nadal is Hitler reborn, Federer a fraud and Batman a nuisance.

He's not as popular as Fedal though, but I'm guessing that'd change if he keeps winning. Regularly beating the two most popular players of all time certainly doesn't help though.

Personally I'm not sure whether he will win so consistently now that Murray's playing better and given that he may not be on tour that long given his playing style...
I don't think it would. Djokovic is just not as popular as Federer or Nadal, and I don't think he ever will be. That said, I don't think he's the least respected all time great (assuming we call him an all time great for the purposes of this discussion) ever. We live in a time where the internet rules and people can say things here that they would never say to your face. That's the simple truth of it. So I wouldn't worry too much about stuff like that.

As for feeling free to disagree whether he's an "all-time" great right now. I will respectfully disagree. I suppose I'm kind of sidetracking this thread, but to me the tier 1 guys are "all time" greats, and those would be, again IMO, Laver, Sampras, Federer, Nadal, and Borg for the open era and in any particular order. I'll put Agassi in there too because he brought viewers in through his pure flamboyant nature. 8 slams and a career slam plus OG when compared with Djokovic who's had his chances helps too. As you can see, I have pretty high standards for all time greatness. And while I'm at it, I'll be honest about McEnroe (and to an extent Connors).

Their accomplishments are any number of superlatives, but I honestly think they've been helped by the "brat" image in discussions of all time greatness. People don't forget McEnroe or Connors as polarizing figures simply because they threw tantrums, although helped along by the fact that they won their fair share, I won't deny that. But even now, they're both American, (and that still helps) and they both commentate on popular news channels which keeps them relevant. Plus, McEnroe has constant foot in mouth/hyperbole disease these days, which will make people listen because it's controversial. If McEnroe or Connors were more stoic and reclusive, like Borg for example, I can bet you that many of the people who know McEnroe today just from watching NBC wouldn't know much about him, or at least not as much as they do now.

Getting back to present players, I'll use my dad and uncle as references. They don't watch much, if any, tennis. They might keep track of who's playing in the odd GS final, but that's about it. They might mention Djokovic in passing, but they know Federer and Nadal are legends. That, IMHO, is the bar for all time greatness. When people who don't even really follow tennis at all really know who you are. Of course, if Djokovic keeps winning, that perception will definitely change, but outside of tennis forums, and the more avid followers of the game, I just don't get the feeling that many casual followers are aware of Djokovic's accomplishments as of yet, even though he is a great player.
 
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Clarky21

Banned
I wouldn't use the term "respected"...forums like this one tend to accentuate people's likes / dislikes for different players. A newcomer reading some of these threads might think Nadal is Hitler reborn, Federer a fraud and Batman a nuisance.

He's not as popular as Fedal though, but I'm guessing that'd change if he keeps winning. Regularly beating the two most popular players of all time certainly doesn't help though.

Personally I'm not sure whether he will win so consistently now that Murray's playing better and given that he may not be on tour that long given his playing style...
But he has been winning for more than 2-1/2 years yet he is still a dud in terms of popularity. He's never going to be as popular as Fed or Nadal. It's just not going to happen.
 
6

6-3 6-0

Guest
What NDjokovic has achieved, is a LOT. Just because RFederer and RNadal spoilt us, doesn't meant NDjokovic is just another player. He has won 6 slams, 2 YECs, No. 1 for over 80+ weeks, super consistent in slams (hell he reached the finals on his least favourite surface beating the guy who beat him on grass last Olympics in the SF) etc. Plus, he is just 26. I believe he'll reach 10 slams atleast and that'll definitely put him in an all time great list.
 

Bender

G.O.A.T.
But he has been winning for more than 2-1/2 years yet he is still a dud in terms of popularity. He's never going to be as popular as Fed or Nadal. It's just not going to happen.
Now that you mention it, I guess you're right.

Must be his game. He hasn't got the flair to attract the casual viewer, but he isn't traditional enough to attract the purist either.

For me, it's a little bit of both plus the fact that I find his strokes rather ugly. Being a Nadal fan certainly hasn't helped but I don't dislike him for 2011...yet?
 

ivan_the_terrible

Hall of Fame
Lendl was the target of US jingoism in the middle of the cold war. The North American press hated him especially after he started kicking the ugly Americans' butt (the Brat & the Potty mouth). He was ridiculed for being dour and stoic in contrast to his rah-rah American foes.

Funny that ESPN would target him, I wonder if they knew anything about tennis at all?

Americans and their navel-gazing, I'm always amazed at their insularity.
 

ivan_the_terrible

Hall of Fame
Now that you mention it, I guess you're right.

Must be his game. He hasn't got the flair to attract the casual viewer, but he isn't traditional enough to attract the purist either.

For me, it's a little bit of both plus the fact that I find his strokes rather ugly. Being a Nadal fan certainly hasn't helped but I don't dislike him for 2011...yet?
Couldn't resist :)
 

DeShaun

Banned
This thread title is suggestive of a negative attitude towards somebody in Novak who, I think, is a good guy. It's tone alone strikes me as that belonging to the question, say, "Is the fertility of your mother when she conceived of you the most disastrous?" It really feels like a backhanded jab in camouflaging language, but I admit to liking Novak very much and so I'm being perhaps too sensitive.
 

TU87

Rookie
Djokovic suffers from every one believing a great player needs to win multiple slams a year, like Fed in his prime, or being so dominant on a single surface like Nadal on Clay. Djokovic is essentially the new Agassi. He is a great player, but his game is not great enough to dominate year in and year out. He can be beaten by big hitters, like Agassi could be beaten by Sampras.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
Djokovic suffers from every one believing a great player needs to win multiple slams a year, like Fed in his prime, or being so dominant on a single surface like Nadal on Clay. Djokovic is essentially the new Agassi. He is a great player, but his game is not great enough to dominate year in and year out. He can be beaten by big hitters, like Agassi could be beaten by Sampras.
eh ? the last time someone purely hit through djokovic in a slam was berdych in wimbledon 10.

agassi never had a year like djokovic's 11
 
He's unlikable and he's only won FO, W and USO a combined 2 times.
How is he unlikable? I mean his style isn't aesthetically pleasing, but he's got a great sense of humor. And Nadal has only won AO, W, and USO a combined 4 times and is considered by most to be a top 4 player of all-time.
 

Omega_7000

Legend
It's mostly Nadal fans that don't like Djokovic because they know he is the biggest threat to Nadal reaching Pete's slam record.

It's amazing how I've seen Nadal fans criticize Novak for over-the-top celebrations when you have Nadal who does this all the time.



Double standards much?
 

Clarky21

Banned
It's mostly Nadal fans that don't like Djokovic because they know he is the biggest threat to Nadal reaching Pete's slam record.

It's amazing how I've seen Nadal fans criticize Novak for over-the-top celebrations when you have Nadal who does this all the time.



Double standards much?
He doesn't do that all the time, and that clip is from more than 3 years ago. How about you find me something Nadal has done that is anywhere near as obnoxious as the way Cvac has been behaving for the last 2 years. Good luck because I think you'll be SOL trying to find it.

Let's also not forget Cvac's foul mouth toward his opponent and toward the crowd. Nadal has never done anything like that in his entire career. Here's some videos to show you how disgusting Cvac's mouth is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlSa-lVFl_g&feature=player_embedded

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geyc1GVwzLU&feature=player_embedded

And here's this pillar of sportsmanship trying to get a hindrance called on Grigor for cramping because he lost the point on his own error. Grigor didn't even make a sound yet he wants a hindrance called on him. Show me where Nadal has ever done anything like that. Good luck because I doubt you will.

Oh, and some car humping by his fat pig of a coach while Cvac cheers him on. Got a video of Toni behaving this way? I highly doubt it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g43cWPNBMU0
 

dudeski

Hall of Fame
Lendl never spoke to Sports Illustrated again, unless he's lifted it recently. The US were bitter about the early exits of McEnroe and Connors, and were acting like American tennis was struggling.
Well the US must be very used to it by now :) We are just weeks away from 10 year anniversary of last US male slam champion!
 

Tony48

Legend
Least-respected by whom? Butt hurt Fed and Nadal fans?

Yeah...they don't count.

And by that same token, Djokovic and Nadal fans have no say in regards to the "respect" of Federer.
 

Crisstti

Legend
It's mostly Nadal fans that don't like Djokovic because they know he is the biggest threat to Nadal reaching Pete's slam record.

It's amazing how I've seen Nadal fans criticize Novak for over-the-top celebrations when you have Nadal who does this all the time.



Double standards much?
Nadal doesn't do that all the time at all. And I don't think he's ever done anything like that after matches.
 

Clarky21

Banned
Nadal doesn't do that all the time at all. And I don't think he's ever done anything like that after matches.
Me neither. The Nadal haters love to bring up that one incident in Miami over 3 years ago, while totally ignoring the behavior of other players, Cvac in particular. It all goes back to 20-10, and had Nadal just stayed in his place instead of challenging Fed, they wouldn't say squat. For proof of this, look at how nothing is said about Roddick's tantrums because he was a good boy who didn't mind being Fed's *****.
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
Nadal doesn't do that all the time at all. And I don't think he's ever done anything like that after matches.
First of all, he isn't even doing anything bad, secondly, he hasn't done anything like that in years, he'll pump his fist but it's the most you get out of him these days.
 
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