Is Djokovic the most complete player ever?

[NoleIsBoat]

It is often mentioned that Federer is the most complete player, but he lacks the 2 oldest most prestigious clay masters Monte Carlo and Rome. Meanwhile Djokovic has won them both multiple times, defeating Nadal 6 times there along with a win at RG.

- NCYSG defeating Federer and Murray both ATGs
- Double golden masters
- Tied most YE #1
- Weeks at number 1 record guaranteed
- Most prize money of all time
- Completely owned both main rivals h2h since peak in 2011
- Dominated Federer on both hc & grass, dominated Nadal on clay in 2011 and 2015.

Is there any holes in his career? He has dominated every surface on the tour and mastered the game.

 

[BackhandDTL]

Most complete yes.

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Most complete yes.

he's also the best ever. Dominated both main rivals h2h since reaching peak in 2011. Highest atp points total and ELO score ever.

 

[BackhandDTL]

he's also the best ever. Dominated both main rivals h2h since reaching peak in 2011. Highest atp points total and ELO score ever.

No that’s where you’re wrong.

 

[NoleIsBoat]

No that’s where you’re wrong.

Which part of the post was wrong?? Djokovic doesn't lead h2h agaisnt both Federer and Nadal?

 

[Service Ace]

Anyone who can’t control his temper to the point where he hurts innocent line’s people cannot be the most complete player of all time. Humbalito is a more complete player on and off the court.

 

[StrongRule]

It is often mentioned that Federer is the most complete player, but he lacks the 2 oldest most prestigious clay masters Monte Carlo and Rome. Meanwhile Djokovic has won them both multiple times, defeating Nadal 6 times there along with a win at RG.

- NCYSG defeating Federer and Murray both ATGs
- Double golden masters
- Tied most YE #1
- Weeks at number 1 record guaranteed
- Most prize money of all time
- Completely owned both main rivals h2h since peak in 2011
- Dominated Federer on both hc & grass, dominated Nadal on clay in 2011 and 2015.

Is there any holes in his career? He has dominated every surface on the tour and mastered the game.

Murray an ATG?

Also, lol at hyping "domination" over 2015 Nadal on clay. Alright, Djokovic did what even Fognini could do. So Fognini is the GOAT now?

 

[alexio]

don't start this again please

 

[PilotPete]

Sorry, but Djokovic doesn't lead Nadal in the slam H2H on clay under non-rainy conditions when the weather is hotter than 80C, therefore cannot be GOAT.

 

[StrongRule]

don't start this again please

A new user is hyping Murray, the favorite argument of Djokovic fanboys.

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Murray an ATG?

Also, lol at hyping "domination" over 2015 Nadal on clay. Alright, Djokovic did what even Fognini could do. So Fognini is the GOAT now?

2015 Nadal was 26-4 on clay minus losses to Djokovic. 86% wins which is better than most players on clay.

 

[StrongRule]

2015 Nadal was 26-4 on clay minus losses to Djokovic. 86% wins which is better than most players on clay.

Same thing minus the losses to Fognini. So Djokovic=Fognini on clay in 2015.

 

[MeatTornado]

The most complete résumé, but not the most complete game.

 

[Antonio Puente]

Is Djokovic the most complete player ever?

He completely got his @SS kicked in the RG final.

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Same thing minus the losses to Fognini. So Djokovic=Fognini on clay in 2015.

Djokovic reached RG final and won 2 masters. What did Fognini do compared to that?

 

[Deleted member 770948]

He's not great at net, plus achievement-wise, he's only won ONE slam title on clay.....and it was the year Nadal withdrew from Roland Garros.
Whereas Nadal is great at net, and has won multiple slams on clay, grass and hardcourt.

 

[BackhandDTL]

The most complete résumé, but not the most complete game.

Yeah this is spot on

 

[NoleIsBoat]

The most complete résumé, but not the most complete game.

Which player has a more complete game? Djokovic dominated the Wimbledon GOAT 3-0 in finals, dominated Nadal on clay in 2011 and 2015, dominated both Fedal on slow and fast HCs since 2011.

 

[jga111]

It is often mentioned that Federer is the most complete player, but he lacks the 2 oldest most prestigious clay masters Monte Carlo and Rome. Meanwhile Djokovic has won them both multiple times, defeating Nadal 6 times there along with a win at RG.

- NCYSG defeating Federer and Murray both ATGs
- Double golden masters
- Tied most YE #1
- Weeks at number 1 record guaranteed
- Most prize money of all time
- Completely owned both main rivals h2h since peak in 2011
- Dominated Federer on both hc & grass, dominated Nadal on clay in 2011 and 2015.

Is there any holes in his career? He has dominated every surface on the tour and mastered the game.

He can’t do overheads and his volleying is average. His forehand is ok. Lovely backhand. Best mentality. So complete? No.

 

[Sport]

 

[Sport]

Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay). Djokovic only has 1 Slam on clay. 2 Slams on each surface >>>> 1 Slam on each surface.

Nadal has his Slams more evenly distributed by surface, meaning Nadal is more complete than Djokovic in outdoor conditions. Djokovic is only more complete than Nadal on indoor conditions. So no, Djokovic is not the most complete player ever. To be the most complete, he should be more complete than Nadal both on indoor and outdoor conditions, not only indoor conditions.

 

[USO]

It is often mentioned that Federer is the most complete player, but he lacks the 2 oldest most prestigious clay masters Monte Carlo and Rome. Meanwhile Djokovic has won them both multiple times, defeating Nadal 6 times there along with a win at RG.

- NCYSG defeating Federer and Murray both ATGs
- Double golden masters
- Tied most YE #1
- Weeks at number 1 record guaranteed
- Most prize money of all time
- Completely owned both main rivals h2h since peak in 2011
- Dominated Federer on both hc & grass, dominated Nadal on clay in 2011 and 2015.

Is there any holes in his career? He has dominated every surface on the tour and mastered the game.

Are you talking about Thirdwheelovic?

 

[alexio]

nadal thre most complete, no doubts about that, yea?

 

[TJfederer16]

the most complete spiritual nutcase yes

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay). Djokovic only has 1 Slam on clay. 2 Slams on each surface >>>> 1 Slam on each surface.

Nadal has his Slams more evenly distributed by surface, meaning Nadal is more complete than Djokovic in outdoor conditions. Djokovic is only more complete than Nadal on indoor conditions. So no, Djokovic is not the most complete player ever. To be the most complete, he should be more complete than Nadal both on indoor and outdoor conditions, not only indoor condtions.

Nadal has only 1 slam on Australian Open hard courts, same as Djokovic on RG clay. AO and USO do not play the same.

Djokovic is more complete on outdoor conditions as he has won every slam and masters available on hard, clay and grass. Nadal has failed to win Miami, Paris and YEC. He has zero h2h wins in Australia compared to 1 for Djokovic at RG.

 

[MeatTornado]

Which player has a more complete game? Djokovic dominated the Wimbledon GOAT 3-0 in finals, dominated Nadal on clay in 2011 and 2015, dominated both Fedal on slow and fast HCs since 2011.

You're looking at it purely from a results stand point. I'm talking about the repertoire of on-court skills. Novak has arguably the most rock solid baseline game the sport has ever seen. But he also plays in an era where he can play the same way on every single court and have the same success. It's hard for me to call him a more complete player compared to say a Borg who played like that on clay but then would win Wimbledon as a serve & volley player.

I'd put Laver & Federer above him in this regard as well.

 

[USO]

Nadal has only 1 slam on Australian Open hard courts, same as Djokovic on RG clay. AO and USO do not play the same.

Djokovic is more complete on outdoor conditions as he has won every slam and masters available on hard, clay and grass. Nadal has failed to win Miami, Paris and YEC. He has zero wins in Australia compared to 1 for Djokovic at RG.

Hardcourt is not hardcourt? I see.

Now please go visit the energy pyramids like your boyfriend...

 

[Sport]

Nadal has only 1 slam on Australian Open hard courts, same as Djokovic on RG clay. AO and USO do not play the same.

Djokovic is more complete on outdoor conditions as he has won every slam and masters available on hard, clay and grass. Nadal has failed to win Miami, Paris and YEC. He has zero h2h wins in Australia compared to 1 for Djokovic at RG.

Nadal has won 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay), something Djokovic lacks.

 

[Sport]

nadal thre most complete, no doubts about that, yea?

Nadal, Djokovic and Federer are all of them roughly equally complete.

 

[alexio]

Nadal, Djokovic and Federer are all of them roughly equally complete.

but in post 22 here you saying that nadal is more complete in outdoors, for ex, but ok, i don't mind

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Nadal has won 2 Slams on each surface (hard, grass and clay), something Djokovic lacks.

Nadal has only 1 slam on plexicushion so he hasn't won 2 on every surface. Meanwhile Nadal lacks 3 of the masters and the world tour finals.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

I would not expect it.

 

[ForehandCross]

Disguised Federer fan trying to give a bad name to Novak fandom. TTW should make it's account approval procedures a little more strict.

 

[Poisoned Slice]

I'm a secret Liverpool fan and I'm bringing United down from the inside.

 

[Sport]

Nadal has only 1 slam on plexicushion so he hasn't won 2 on every surface. Meanwhile Nadal lacks 3 of the masters and the world tour finals.

There are only 3 surfaces in tennis (hard, grass and clay). Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface, Djokovic hasn't.

 

[BackhandDTL]

I think the most complete player of all time is Borg.

Idk for sure though

 

[NoleIsBoat]

There are only 3 surfaces in tennis (hard, grass and clay). Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface, Djokovic hasn't.

It is intellectually dishonest to claim Nadal as more versatile by lumping all HC together as one. He only has 1 win in Australia, which is the same as 1 RG for Djokovic.

 

[alexio]

There are only 3 surfaces in tennis (hard, grass and clay). Nadal has won at least 2 Slams on each surface, Djokovic hasn't.

it's already been told about it..from the very start there are unequal conditions that have been set, hence a right decision for this math problem cannot be found..(nadal also has just 1 hardcourt title (AO), since we wanna play fair and intend to assume that a hardcourt slam is held once per year, just like other slams on grass and clay..
and it's funny to see that that deceptive argument about multiple slams on each surface is mentioned so many times (plus many truly take it seriously lol) while it shouldn't be mentioned at all in the first place coz initially it's absolutely false and irrelevant)

 

[Sport]

It is intellectually dishonest to claim Nadal as more versatile by lumping all HC together as one. He only has 1 win in Australia, which is the same as 1 RG for Djokovic.

It is intellectualy valid. Plexicushion is a modality of hard court, not a different surface in itself.

 

[Sport]

it's already been told about it..from the very start they are unequal conditions that have been set, hence a right decision for this math problem cannot be found..(nadal also has just 1 hardcourt title (AO), since we wanna play fair and intend to assume that a hardcourt slam is held once per year, just like other slams on grass and clay..
and it's funny to see that that deceptive argument about multiple slams on each surface is mentioned so many times (plus many truly take it seriously lol) while it shouldn't be mentioned at all in the first place coz initially it's absolutely false and irrelevant)

Nadal has 5 Slams on hard, there is nothing fair in deleting 4 Slams from Nadal's count. If you want to assume that just one Slam on hard is held per year, why should we choose his AO title rather than his 4 USO titles?

The solution is very simple: to divide. Nadal has 5 Slams on hard. There are 2 Slams held on hard. 5 ÷ 2= 2.5. Nadal averages 2,5 titles per Slam held on hard, while Djokovic only averages 1 title per Slam held on clay. 2,5 > 1. Nadal wins even if you divide his Slam count on hard by 2.

 

[alexio]

Nadal has 5 Slams on hard, there is nothing fair in deleting 4 Slams from Nadal's count.

just one if we wanna play fair or just four, and if we can choose that's another proof that that math problem cannot be solved

 

[NoleIsBoat]

Nadal has 5 Slams on hard, there is nothing fair in deleting 4 Slams from Nadal's count.

He has 4 slams at the USO.

Only 1 at AO, same as 1 at RG for Djokovic.

 

[Erhard]

"Is Djokovic the most complete player ever?"

@NoleIsBoat
No, do know a Player named Roger Federer?

 

[Sport]

just one if we wanna play fair or just four, and if we can choose that's another proof that that math problem cannot be solved

It can.

The solution is very simple: to divide. Nadal has 5 Slams on hard. There are 2 Slams held on hard. 5 ÷ 2= 2.5. Nadal averages 2,5 titles per Slam held on hard, while Djokovic only averages 1 title per Slam held on clay. 2,5 > 1. Nadal wins even if you divide his Slam count on hard by 2.

That is the only fair solution. It is unfair to deduct 4 Slams from Nadal's count. Fact is, Nadal on hard is objectively greater than Djokovic on clay.

 

[NoleIsBoat]

It can.

The solution is very simple: to divide. Nadal has 5 Slams on hard. There are 2 Slams held on hard. 5 ÷ 2= 2.5. Nadal averages 2,5 titles per Slam held on hard, while Djokovic only averages 1 title per Slam held on clay. 2,5 > 1. Nadal wins even if you divide his Slam count on hard by 2.

No, Nadal only has 1 slam in Australia so he hasn't won 2 of every slam.

 

[Sport]

He has 4 slams at the USO.

Only 1 at AO, same as 1 at RG for Djokovic.

I am discussing surface distribution, not Slam event distribution.

 

[Sport]

No, Nadal only has 1 slam in Australia so he hasn't won 2 of every slam.

I said 2 on every surface, not on every Slam event. I'm discussing surfaces, not events. AO is a Slam event, not a surface. AO and USO are different Slam events but played on the same surface (hard court).

 

[Jonesy]

 

[NoleIsBoat]

I am discussing surface distribution, not Slam event distribution.

Nadal is still behind by overall surface versatility. 0 titles on Miami, Shanghai or Paris HCs. 0 World tour finals. Completely owned in h2h in 2/3 surfaces.

 

[alexio]

It can.

The solution is very simple: to divide. Nadal has 5 Slams on hard. There are 2 Slams held on hard. 5 ÷ 2= 2.5. Nadal averages 2,5 titles per Slam held on hard, while Djokovic only averages 1 title per Slam held on clay. 2,5 > 1. Nadal wins even if you divide his Slam count on hard by 2.

no it's not a solution and you know itcoz that math problem only can be solved if conditions are equal, and if clay major is held twice per year, with that case djo could have won two clay majors with ease, hence he would be sitting with multiple slams on each surface as well, i.e. the point is they all three would be sitting with multiple slams on each surface under equal conditions, thus this argument doesn't work and can't be brought up as a valid argument