Is Federer the fittest athlete ever?

Nadal doesn't tire out when he has to play Fed though. Because then the two of them wrap up five sets in the time it normally takes for nadal to finish a 3 setter. Not only is the effort level not the same, it's drastically different. Er nobody asked Nadal or Djokovic not to hone a lethal serve.
Nadal rests a lot between points though. :D
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
He's not even close to being the fittest athlete in his era (though of course he is very fit), you're confusing longevity with fitness/stamina when reality is that many of the fittest players in the game throughout history burned out quickly due to injuries and relying on outlasting opponents. The only time Fed was at or close to the top of the game fitness wise was 2006, that's about it. Fed's longevity is due to his smooth Edberg-like movement on court and that terrific serve, not some legendary fitness.

He doesn't sweat much, so? Nadal makes a puddle of sweet 5 minutes into a match, the guy who utterly dominated the surface where fitness rules supreme (sorry it's "point construction" LOL) for nearly a decade. He doesn't grab his thigh/back/ass, make pained facial expressions, breathe heavily etc. those are largely meaningless theatrics, if you allow those to affect your opinion to such a degree then maybe it's time to switch to WWE or atleast reduce the time spent watching soap operas and cheesy Holywood sport movies.

You want to see if a player's tired? Watch how he moves his feet, that's all there is to it. Ever since 2009 Fed's footwork has had a tendency to become sloppy and labored nearly every time he got pushed the distance against opponents who make him work for it physically (Djokodal and big hitters, not Murray), it's been his Achilles heel against younger fitter opponents on today's slower surfaces much more so than his supposed mental weakness. His current success is largely built on ultra efficient playing style that won't work on clay where fitness and defense/movement get exposed which is why he's skipping an entire clay season bar FO (and even there I'm doubtful if he'll play).
 
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Omega_7000

Legend
I am dumbfounded by what I have seen this year. Does this guy ever get tired? People used to talk about Nadal and Djokovic's stamina. Federer at 35 seems to have more stamina than Nadal and Djokovic at 30 and 29. Hats off!
Federer's game style is different and he is winning by playing hyper aggressive which can also backfire with a ton of unforced errors.
 

metsman

G.O.A.T.
Lomachenko has rather outstanding movement. I'm also quite fond of Kyrie Irving.
I don't think any other sport places a premium on movement and footwork as tennis. Maybe boxing but even then it's not quite tennis.
 

-NN-

G.O.A.T.
I don't think any other sport places a premium on movement and footwork as tennis. Maybe boxing but even then it's not quite tennis.
I think boxing does, but not basketball. Footwork and distance control is utterly vital in boxing. Federer isn't moving as well as he ever has but he's the dominant player right now. I think the skill components overall are also similar. Perhaps it's more likely for raw power and strength to overcome skill in boxing than it is in tennis, but not sure. I know that boxing was argued to be the toughest sport in the world years back among experts over at ESPN.
 

metsman

G.O.A.T.
I think boxing does, but not basketball. Footwork and distance control is utterly vital in boxing. Federer isn't moving as well as he ever has but he's the dominant player right now. I think the skill components overall are also similar. Perhaps it's more likely for raw power and strength to overcome skill in boxing than it is in tennis, but not sure. I know that boxing was argued to be the toughest sport in the world years back among experts over at ESPN.
Wouldn't doubt it. Ridiculous the amount of punishment you have to take.
 

BeatlesFan

Talk Tennis Guru
Nadal doesn't tire out when he has to play Fed though.
Watch the fifth set of the 2017 AO from 3-2 onwards. It was obvious Nadal was gassed. There were four balls that Fed hit to Nadal's FH and he struggled to reach any of them and he hit UE's on every ball. A non-tired Nadal retrieves all of those balls. Nadal just can't move to his left anymore when he's tired.

When Fed broke him again to go up 5-3, Nadal was visibly tired the entire game. While crouching to receive serve, Nadal was grimacing in pain from his fatigue. Watch the fifth set on Youtube and you'll see this.
 
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SLD76

G.O.A.T.
I think boxing does, but not basketball. Footwork and distance control is utterly vital in boxing. Federer isn't moving as well as he ever has but he's the dominant player right now. I think the skill components overall are also similar. Perhaps it's more likely for raw power and strength to overcome skill in boxing than it is in tennis, but not sure. I know that boxing was argued to be the toughest sport in the world years back among experts over at ESPN.

Just do a boxing workout and.see if you arent gassed.

Throwing punches with proper technique(i.e. Slight crouch for the hook to the body, uppercut ), bobbing and weaving, maintaining the square ,.approach and backing away


And thats with no-one hitting you!

It takes really good intense fitness to be a top boxer , especially in lower weights where so many fighters.are quick and elusive


Heavy weights can get away with extra.weight because most fighters arent super quick and the extra weight helps absorb punishment
 

SLD76

G.O.A.T.
Hockey is regarded as a hard sport

Speed, strength, endurance and.good hand.eye coordination are all necessary
 

bigserving

Hall of Fame
I going to give the title of fittest athletes to the 110 mile triathletes. There are so many other athletes that do have someone to hand them a towel to dry off every minute or so.

And they do not get to sit down and chill every ten minutes or so.

It might be interesting to see how some touring pros hold up playing full-court basketball, or playing futball, or running a marathon.
 

SLD76

G.O.A.T.
I going to give the title of fittest athletes to the 110 mile triathletes. There are so many other athletes that do have someone to hand them a towel to dry off every minute or so.

And they do not get to sit down and chill every ten minutes or so.

It might be interesting to see how some touring pros hold up playing full-court basketball, or playing futball, or running a marathon.
I just watched a video last night of Monfils training (running, weights, stretching, plyometrics) and then immediately after played a pick up game of basketball
 

SLD76

G.O.A.T.
F1 drivers get overlooked


They have to be insanely fit to handle race conditions for hours


Avg F1 driver has the cardio fitness of an Olympic marathon runner with crazy low resting heartbeats


The drivers specifically train their legs to be able to apply the force necessary for braking. Their neck muscles have to withstand g forces white turning and cornering

And they have to endure high temps for hours with no break

The avg driver loses 10 to 12 percent bodyweight in sweat during a race . That leads to fatigue which leads to accidents if you aren't super fit
 

Bobby Jr

G.O.A.T.
The avg driver loses 10 to 12 percent bodyweight in sweat during a race . That leads to fatigue which leads to accidents if you aren't super fit
That's actually a myth. A 65kg guy losing 7kg of his bodyweight in sweat would be dead or close to it.

Fluid loss similar to any other sort of heavy cardio-sport athlete is more realistic - say 2 litres an hour at the particularly hot/humid races. Most F1 races take about 90-100 mins so that's in the 3kg range. That said, they all have fluids available to drink like most other athletes which helps offset that loss.

Not saying F1 isn't hard but much of the stuff thrown about relating to it is nonsense.
 

Candide

Hall of Fame
This thread is beyond mental. From the Cambridge Dictionary:

athlete noun [ C ]
UK /ˈæθ.liːt/ US /ˈæθ.liːt/
person who is very good at sports or physical exercise, especially one who competes in organized events:
"He became a professional athlete at the age of 16."

Hence, all of these athletes are extremely fit for their respective organised events i.e. sports. Federer can only be measured against other tennis players. In which case he's super fit. Fit does not just mean muscles and cardio. It's like saying who's the greatest artist ever Rembrandt, Orson Welles, Shakespeare, Dickens or Brando? (The answer is obviously Dickens by the way - he rocks!).



 

-NN-

G.O.A.T.
F1 drivers get overlooked


They have to be insanely fit to handle race conditions for hours


Avg F1 driver has the cardio fitness of an Olympic marathon runner with crazy low resting heartbeats


The drivers specifically train their legs to be able to apply the force necessary for braking. Their neck muscles have to withstand g forces white turning and cornering

And they have to endure high temps for hours with no break

The avg driver loses 10 to 12 percent bodyweight in sweat during a race . That leads to fatigue which leads to accidents if you aren't super fit
Well they haven't had to be anything special for many years now. Upped the ante this year due to the new much faster cars.
 
Watch the fifth set of the 2017 AO from 3-2 onwards. It was obvious Nadal was gassed. There were four balls that Fed hit to Nadal's FH and he struggled to reach any of them and he hit UE's on every ball. A non-tired Nadal retrieves all of those balls. Nadal just can't move to his left anymore when he's tired.

When Fed broke him again to go up 5-3, Nadal was visibly tired the entire game. While crouching to receive serve, Nadal was grimacing in pain from his fatigue. Watch the fifth set on Youtube and you'll see this.
I wouldn't use that match as an exhibit as Nadal didn't get as much rest time as Fed after a (longer) five setter. Also Fed took that MTO to avoid getting gassed. :D Tennis players showing signs of tiring in the fifth is one thing but I was genuinely shocked when Nadal and Djokovic struggled to keep standing during the presentation. In fact even in the first set, they and especially Djokovic would be bent over gasping for breath after long points. Fed simply avoids getting into those kind of rallies. Even the longest rallies are very attacking, not attritional.
 
Actually, he should win the CYGS this year because Brad Gilbert
have proved Federer is playing his best in his career.

Anyone disagree is in denial.
^^^
and you once claimed you were born and raised in the united states? ^ reading this post of yours, i'm claiming bullshlt tmf.....a big, steaming heap of bullshlt.​
 

TMF

Talk Tennis Guru
^^^
and you once claimed you were born and raised in the united states? ^ reading this post of yours, i'm claiming bullshlt tmf.....a big, steaming heap of bullshlt.​
I don't know what you're talking about.o_O

I've never claimed that I was born in the US(must be your imagination), but I was raised here.
 
I think it comes down to one of two things:
- First point: he's had a 6-month layoff, so perhaps he went all out on improving his fitness in this time and has managed to take it to another level to compensate for the slight loss in speed (quarter-step or half-step) relative to 11-12 years ago. Compared to the rest of the tour he's entered 2017 fresher and has given it everything so far.

- Second point: his fitness has always been underrated. In the past, seeing him "wilt" in deciding sets could have been linked directly to mental walkabouts rather than physical fitness (excluding 2013). The man trains during the day in Dubai in the off-season (temperatures can get close to 35C) and actually prefers day matches to night matches - lot of work has gone into keeping him in decent enough shape. In which case it's all about the mental aspect - he's finally shown no fear at all and has been determined to play through a match whilst maintaining focus and the will to win. There were episodes in the past where he would just check out of matches for brief periods (and that's costly against the very best).
Gurufils always plays year round. Therefore Gurufils > Federer
 

gn

G.O.A.T.
If Karlovic at the age of 37 can reach his career high, Federer winning titles at the age of 35 is not surprising at all.
 

chrisb

Semi-Pro
Whatever it is, is eerily unnatural and fishy. 36 y/o destroying the tour after 8 months break because of imageinjury... Yeah right!!!
Also very rich, can hire the best to train and feed him and has the motivation to win, or he really hates to lose. Many athletes have had great careers in their 30s. So it has to be some kind of PEDs? Can`t change your opinion but can disagree
 

Enga

Hall of Fame
Federer is definitely more fast right now than he was 1 or 2 years ago. That 6 month layoff is probably what did it. It seems like he's able to do more with less, because his strategy, and his hand eye coordination are really good for offense styled tennis.
 

PrinceMoron

Legend
I am dumbfounded by what I have seen this year. Does this guy ever get tired? People used to talk about Nadal and Djokovic's stamina. Federer at 35 seems to have more stamina than Nadal and Djokovic at 30 and 29. Hats off!
Hingis is pretty fit at 36 and I never tire of her. Oh, that is not what you meant....


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zep

Hall of Fame
6-0 in 5 setters since last year, has outlasted 4 top 10 -- Nadal, Cilic, Wawrinka, Nishikori.
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
if he were, then the AO organizers should have left the roof open as they did in the women's final when it was hotter.

lets see if the mods erase this...
 

TMF

Talk Tennis Guru
if he were, then the AO organizers should have left the roof open as they did in the women's final when it was hotter.

lets see if the mods erase this...
Hot outdoor would have favored Federer. Bigger player, the the problematic they deal with the heat.
 

zep

Hall of Fame
if he were, then the AO organizers should have left the roof open as they did in the women's final when it was hotter.

lets see if the mods erase this...
That doesn't change the fact that he's 6-0 in 5 setters against much younger opponents since 2017, at his age that's almost a miracle. Insane fitness. People don't talk about that often but his fitness is one of the main reasons for this revival.
 

sarmpas

Hall of Fame
He's possibly the most energy efficient tennis male player of all time, can't really say for sure as I've never seen every player in history. For peak fitness Nadal and Djokovic are at least a level above Federer. No way do I think Federer could grind like Nadal and Novak did in that Aus Open final a few years ago.
 

zep

Hall of Fame
He's possibly the most energy efficient tennis male player of all time, can't really say for sure as I've never seen every player in history. For peak fitness Nadal and Djokovic are at least a level above Federer. No way do I think Federer could grind like Nadal and Novak did in that Aus Open final a few years ago.
He can if he has to. That's just not his style. Watch the last few games of last year's AO final. It was a proper grind.
 

Krish872007

G.O.A.T.
Fitness is right up there of course (he's always been one of the fittest players like I said in an earlier post), but the fact that his style of play is less taxing is super important. All the baseline experts are suffering some sort of injury or the other right now, and the younger guys are also engaging in a lot of grinding without sufficient preparation.
 
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thrust

Hall of Fame
Fitness is right up there of course (he's always been one of the fittest players like I said in an earlier post), but the fact that his style of play is less taxing is super important. All the baseline experts are suffering some sort of injury or the other right now, and the younger guys are also engaging in a lot of grinding without sufficient preparation.
Correct!
 

maratha_warrior

Hall of Fame
No he is not.
Nadal and Djokovic will are the ones who took fitness to Legendary levels never seen before.
But Fed has all the other records.
 

BeatlesFan

Talk Tennis Guru
If you base it simply on the appearance of their bodies, there's no question who looked fitter, though Djokovic looks like a Scarecrow these days. His muscle mass has declined to a significant degree.
 

smoledman

G.O.A.T.
Who cares? Federer gets it done quickly. Let Nadalovic kill themselves grinding.


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