Is Marat Safin the most overrated player of all time?

Is Marat Safin Overrated?

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jamesblakefan#1

jamesblakefan#1

G.O.A.T.
I just don't see why so many hold him in such regard. So many people believe he could have won 6+ slams if he'd have "just had his head right". Why does Safin get to use this excuse, and not a guy like Marcelo Rios. You never hear people say, "Oh, Marcelo Rios could have had like 4 slams, if his mental game was better" People make it like Safin's one of the greatest talents to ever play the game, just because he's big and he can move well.

Marat Safin is the most overrated player of all time. Yes or No? Explain.
 
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jamesblakefan#1 said:
I just don't see why so many hold him in such regard. So many people believe he could have won 6+ slams if he'd have "just had his head right". Why does Safin get to use this excuse, and not a guy like Marcelo Rios. You never hear people say, "Oh, Marcelo Rios could have had like 4 slams, if his mental game was better" People make it like Safin's one of the greatest talents to ever play the game, just because he's big and he can move well.

Marat Safin is the most overrated player of all time. Yes or No? Explain.
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Sorry but Rios has never won any slam. Safin has won 2. I don't see how someone winning more than 1 slam and making it to #1 could be THAT overrated.
 
No. If you don't think he is good with 4 slam finals and two titles, I don't know what to say. He played in the Sampras/Agassi era, then, got injured, and on into the Federer/Nadal era.
 
He is my favorite player but unfortunately, I think he is held in extra high regard.:( I mean he is an underachiever but he certainly would have never been nadal or federer- good IMO
 
I'm not saying he's not a great player. I just don't think he'd ever have won more than 2-4 slams, while some others seem to think he's a 6+ slam type of player. I don't see that. Not consistent enough.
 
Yes. Many people on this board say he is one of the greatest of all time, and some have even said in one way or another, that he is the greatest. The way I see it, that's like saying John Daley is (one of) the greatest golfers of all time.

At least Daley has a drink named after him.
 
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On these boards, insanely overrated.

I think many posters here like to see him as GOAT or something just because he's "cool"
 
No he's not, and there's no need to explain.:evil: But he isn't a GOAT either and people who regard him as GOAT may need to explain.
 
He's not overrated, he's an underachiever. People talk a lot about guys like Safin and Nalbandian because they have all the shots but can't seem to get it together and win more slams. Safin at least won 2 slams. Nalbandian might never win a slam and that would be a tragedy.
 
No Safin is not. Safin had ton of potential, injury, party scenes and being a nutjob ruined his career. You don't beat Pete Sampras and Roger Federer in runs to slam titles with no talent. Safin had a lot of talent yet frankly Safin was just Safin it was not that important to him winning all the titles. It is kind of like he knows he can beat you and hell thats all that matters.
 
I think the game has surpassed him somewhat in the last 4 years.

He used to be about the biggest hitter out there, now there's dozens of guys who play with his kind of power. He also never developed a way to win against players who soft ball him frequently. No plan B. He never really evolved from the player he was when he first came onto the scene in 2000. I think that may be the biggest factor in his lack of success. The only 3 guys who have stayed at the top in the period since his decline have improved significantly over the past few years. Nadal has improved his serve and his hardcourt game. Fed is always trying to find different ways to beat Nadal and win on clay, Roddick has tried 3 or 4 different playing styles since his USopen win.

Safin hits all his shots just as well as Federer, but Federer can read a match about a billion times better and also has the variety in his game to make adjustments when he needs to. I think if Safin rounded out his game a bit more he could have been one of the greats, but he never did.
 
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I'd say he is a little overrated on this board, but there's many that are much more overrated than he.
 
jamesblakefan#1 said:
I just don't see why so many hold him in such regard. So many people believe he could have won 6+ slams if he'd have "just had his head right". Why does Safin get to use this excuse, and not a guy like Marcelo Rios. You never hear people say, "Oh, Marcelo Rios could have had like 4 slams, if his mental game was better" People make it like Safin's one of the greatest talents to ever play the game, just because he's big and he can move well.

Marat Safin is the most overrated player of all time. Yes or No? Explain.
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Because Safin demolished the likes of Sampras, beat Agassi at the AO (during Agassi's best years, from 2002-2005), Federer, and a plethora of other players that are highly regarded as very good players.



Meanwhile, Rios got stomped by oldman Korda, and was busy beating up a bunch of second tier players like Rusedski and Henman. That's why Rios can't use that excuse.
 
NamRanger said:
Because Safin demolished the likes of Sampras, beat Agassi at the AO (during Agassi's best years, from 2002-2005), Federer, and a plethora of other players that are highly regarded as very good players.



Meanwhile, Rios got stomped by oldman Korda, and was busy beating up a bunch of second tier players like Rusedski and Henman. That's why Rios can't use that excuse.
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I knew that was coming. Then why doesn't Hewitt get the same kind of adoration? He demolished Sampras. He owned Federer, for a period. I guess Hewitt isn't "cool" enough for all the fanboys, even though he has a more complete game than Marat, and has had the better career.
 
Yeah, that's pretty much it, blakefan. You never saw Safin show up at a tournament with a black eye from a Russian bar fight, nor did Hewitt ever moon 9,000 people, nor did Hewitt kiss the let person after pegging her. Safin is a much more compelling character than someone like Hewitt, even though Hewitt is a pretty interesting guy off the court. Oh, and Safin never got called a racist.:?
 
jamesblakefan#1 said:
I knew that was coming. Then why doesn't Hewitt get the same kind of adoration? He demolished Sampras. He owned Federer, for a period. I guess Hewitt isn't "cool" enough for all the fanboys, even though he has a more complete game than Marat, and has had the better career.
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Safin beat Federer at his absolute peak in 2005. Only he, Nadal, Nalbandian, and Gasquet can say that. Do you think Hewitt could have taken Federer at the AO in 2005? No.



Hewitt had the more complete career because he mentally stayed the course. No way he had a more "complete" game. Safin had the complete package; big groundstrokes, tall, physical, fast for his size, big serve, and a very underrated netgame. In terms of tennis ability, Safin far surpasses Hewitt in every way possible.



Hewitt beat who he was supposed to beat, but never really could upset anyone. After his period of ascending to the top from 2001-2002, he simply got surpassed by everyone. Safin however, was all well and capable of upsetting players left and right. He came into the AO 2004 unseeded and ran through the draw upsetting both Roddick and Agassi before he gassed out in the final.



Safin is simply one of the most talented players the sport has ever seen; however, like Nalbandian, he's a complete nutcase.
 
I'd be willing to bet that most people wouldn't care about those things nearly as much if Safin wasn't such an interesting character, NamRanger.
 
JeMar said:
I'd be willing to bet that most people wouldn't care about those things nearly as much if Safin wasn't such an interesting character, NamRanger.
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People (here at least) talk about Nalbandian all the time, and he's nowhere near as interesting as Safin.



However, to say people wouldn't care is an understatement. Maybe casual tennis fans wouldn't care, but many hardcore fans like us do care. It's just that many times people go overboard with it. Safin is not overrated in any way shape or form; whoever thinks he is should probably get their eyes reevaluated.
 
NamRanger said:
People (here at least) talk about Nalbandian all the time, and he's nowhere near as interesting as Safin.



However, to say people wouldn't care is an understatement. Maybe casual tennis fans wouldn't care, but many hardcore fans like us do care. It's just that many times people go overboard with it. Safin is not overrated in any way shape or form; whoever thinks he is should probably get their eyes reevaluated.
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There are people out there who say he would win 14 plus grand slam, he would have been GOAT, etc. I agree he is one of the most talented players ever but when people say stuff like that than he does appear overrated.
 
VivalaVida said:
There are people out there who say he would win 14 plus grand slam, he would have been GOAT, etc. I agree he is one of the most talented players ever but when people say stuff like that than he does appear overrated.
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That's why I said people do go overboard. 14 slams is out of the question, but with his level of talent, 4-6 slams is not out of reach TBH.
 
NamRanger said:
Safin beat Federer at his absolute peak in 2005. Only he, Nadal, Nalbandian, and Gasquet can say that. Do you think Hewitt could have taken Federer at the AO in 2005? No.


Hewitt had the more complete career because he mentally stayed the course. No way he had a more "complete" game. Safin had the complete package; big groundstrokes, tall, physical, fast for his size, big serve, and a very underrated netgame. In terms of tennis ability, Safin far surpasses Hewitt in every way possible.


Hewitt beat who he was supposed to beat, but never really could upset anyone. After his period of ascending to the top from 2001-2002, he simply got surpassed by everyone. Safin however, was all well and capable of upsetting players left and right. He came into the AO 2004 unseeded and ran through the draw upsetting both Roddick and Agassi before he gassed out in the final.

Safin is simply one of the most talented players the sport has ever seen; however, like Nalbandian, he's a complete nutcase.
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No, Safin had the more flashy game. Hewitt has the more solid, and therefore more complete game. But that's another issue.

A lot of guys show flashes of brilliance. I just don't see why Safin's so different from any other streaky player. Safin, Nalbandian, both streaky players that have shown their max talent occasionally. They just arent consistent enough. I don't see what makes them so different from so many other guys that show potential but aren't consistent enough. Safin's even worse, b/c at times during his career, it seemed like he didn't care a/b the result one way or another. He wasn't committed, and that's as big a reason for his underachievement as injury.
 
NamRanger said:
Hewitt beat who he was supposed to beat, but never really could upset anyone. After his period of ascending to the top from 2001-2002, he simply got surpassed by everyone. Safin however, was all well and capable of upsetting players left and right. He came into the AO 2004 unseeded and ran through the draw upsetting both Roddick and Agassi before he gassed out in the final.


.
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Who was he supposed to upset?? Federer? He beat EVERYONE and couldn't cause upsets because he was arguably on even terms or a favourite against everyone except Federer in '04/'05.

You're saying in '04-'05 he was surpassed by everyone?? That doesn't make any sense especially considering he was ranked above Safin yet again in the top 3 at the end of that year and top 4 end of 2005, arguably having the 2nd best year overall if not being stopped by Federer at every big event.
 
jamesblakefan#1 said:
No, Safin had the more flashy game. Hewitt has the more solid, and therefore more complete game. But that's another issue.

A lot of guys show flashes of brilliance. I just don't see why Safin's so different from any other streaky player. Safin, Nalbandian, both streaky players that have shown their max talent occasionally. They just arent consistent enough. I don't see what makes them so different from so many other guys that show potential but aren't consistent enough. Safin's even worse, b/c at times during his career, it seemed like he didn't care a/b the result one way or another. He wasn't committed, and that's as big a reason for his underachievement as injury.
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No, Hewitt had the more consistent game up top. He was more mentally solid. That translated to his game in that he was able to keep the ball in play very well, however, his game is nowhere near as dangerous as Safin's. Safin when he is on, is capable of beating anyone, anywhere. Hewitt is not capable of such a feat. In reality, Hewitt was probably more of an overachiever then anything.

Safin's game just wasn't flashy either; the man was a tactical genius when he is mentally there. He constructs points extremely well, and knows when to press his advantage. You obviously don't know much about tennis if you think Safin is all guns blazing.
 
Breaker said:
Who was he supposed to upset?? Federer? He beat EVERYONE and couldn't cause upsets because he was arguably on even terms or a favourite against everyone except Federer in '04/'05.

You're saying in '04-'05 he was surpassed by everyone?? That doesn't make any sense especially considering he was ranked above Safin yet again in the top 3 at the end of that year and top 4 end of 2005, arguably having the 2nd best year overall if not being stopped by Federer at every big event.
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04-05 were Hewitt's best years (after 2001-2002 of course), and after that, he got surpassed very quickly. 2006 he was still playing fairly well; it's just that he lost a step and simply lacked the firepower to keep up with the big boys.



Yes, if Hewitt had a supposedly more complete and better game than Safin, he should be full well and capable of beating Federer at Federer's peak. However, he simply lacks the firepower that Safin has to do it. If Safin could do it, why can't Hewitt (if he supposedly had such a complete game).
 
No Safin is not overrated at all IMO. Underachiever is the word I agree. If he is playing healthy and focused, he has such an imposing game from all corners he can take out anybody. And for a big guy, he moves well.
 
rommil said:
No Safin is not overrated at all IMO. Underachiever is the word I agree. If he is playing healthy and focused, he has such an imposing game from all corners he can take out anybody. And for a big guy, he moves well.
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I'm hearing the word underachiever a lot. How many slams did people expect him to win? 4-6? IMO, that's overrating him. His game has always been to inconsistent to be a legit guy to win 7 matches, in a row, on a consistent basis. To me, saying he's an underachiever is overrating him. He won 2 slams. Maybe he should have 1-2 more. But in the Fed/Nadal era? It's unrealistic to expect him to have won more than that.
 
jamesblakefan#1 said:
I'm hearing the word underachiever a lot. How many slams did people expect him to win? 4-6? IMO, that's overrating him. His game has always been to inconsistent to be a legit guy to win 7 matches, in a row, on a consistent basis. To me, saying he's an underachiever is overrating him. He won 2 slams. Maybe he should have 1-2 more. But in the Fed/Nadal era? It's unrealistic to expect him to have won more than that.
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Safin if he was mentally on would be a nightmare match-up for Nadal on hardcourts. Especially at the USO.
 
I think think 4-6 is too many for someone as talented as him. 4-6 is right around what I expected him to win.

His game matches up extremely well against Nadal if he plays to the full extent of his abilities. He's got a huge serve, great returns, a very good forehand, an amazing backhand, and the height to counter whatever loops Nadal throws at him.

You saw what Safin did against Federer at the 2005 Aussie Open. I suspect a lot of their matches could've gone either way, so I don't think it's unrealistic to think that he could've got 2-3 more slams than he actually got.
 
Well, he has to be the worse player mentally of all time. In that case, why do so many show so much sympathy for him and excuse his mental shortcomings?
 
He's definitely in the top 10 list of biggest discrepancies between talent and mental acumen, but he's just a really charming guy. That can go a long way in this world.
 
Safin and Nalbandian are the biggest underachievers from that generation. Safin is far from overrated.
 
gj011 said:
What is your problem with Safin? People like him, and there are reasons for that.
Get over it.
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I don't have a problem with him. I just think it's weird that he's so adored and has so many singing his praises, when he has so many shortcomings. I don't see him as a 6+ slam guy as so many others do.
 
jamesblakefan#1 said:
I don't have a problem with him. I just think it's weird that he's so adored and has so many singing his praises, when he has so many shortcomings. I don't see him as a 6+ slam guy as so many others do.
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Again he is adored and praised because we have seen what he can do when he is healthy and focused (of course he is widely criticized as well), he has the power , serve and movement. I guess people focus more on the positive than the negative on Safin. You made a comparison on Safin and Hewitt. Lleyton's game is more dogged and tenacious . Safin is more imposing and overwhelming when at best.
 
He kinda is because people always stress what he CAN do.. I think both Hewitt and Roddick have been far superior players. Being able to work hard is a more important talent to me than if you can hit the ball 10 mph faster and 10 cm closer to the line.
 
No he is not overrated. The way he went through Federer and Sampras and Hewitt in his runs for his slam titles, goes to show you he has the talent to be one of the tennis greats.

However, he is an underachiever but he has a soft spot in people's hearts because he is a generally good guy, pretty charismatic, the ladies like his looks, his tennis (when clicking) is akin to art with a racquet, and he tells it like it is with his Russian accent and has a disdain for tennis equipment!

What's more to love?

Davai Marat!!
 
jamesblakefan#1 said:
A lot of guys at their best are unbeatable. It's all about how often you're at your best. And Safin isn't at his best very often.
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well many times it happenes that 2 players are at their best and one of them has to lose
and i have seen only one tennis performance (sampras wimby finals (1999)) that i would rate above safins uso finals (2000)
 
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