Discussion in 'General Pro Player Discussion' started by Death Master, Jul 21, 2013.
is nadal good for 15 slams? yes or no.
you have the floor.
I doubt it at this point.. Maybe another RG title or two.. Thats it. Hes gonna have to win off of the French if he wants 15. He isn't going to win another 3 French Open titles
Yes, I think probably so.
It's far too early too tell. He struggled at Roland Garros this year, has had tough matches on clay, nearly lost to people he should have beaten (particularly Ferrer and Dimitrov, showing at the very least a moderate decline in his clay game, but personally I think he has declined a great deal on clay since 2005-2010, but it's amazing that mere fumes have kept him going for 3 years after) and he had an even worse result on grass this year at Wimbledon, losing in the first round. His hard court form (going from his result at Indian Wells) is something for Nadal fans to look forward to, as it looks like he might be in the middle or latter stages of his hard court prime, so there's still some hope left.
folks he is not winning anything outside the natural surfaces.
that is a bloody fact. and the way he is going on grass, you can count that out too.
if nadal is the Justin beiber of tennis then what is nole?
Go check some of your fellow classless Nadal fans trolling signatures. They started first.
^^ Djokovicforthewin has been resurrected. Marvelous !! :twisted:
These people call me many nicknames so far? This is third or fourth I think.
Not sure what you guy are talking about. And really don't care.
He'll win AT LEAST 3 more Roland Garros titles. So that means 15 is the minimum slam total. Plus I think he has a huge chance at winning the US Open and Australian Open again. I think the AO will be especially important to him, because as much as Murray is a good player, Nadal will see it essential to bury Djokovic at Djokovic's favorite slam. I think Nadal has a great shot at the Double-Career-Grand-Slam.
are you having problems with the clay warrior fans?
what exactly are they doing? are they insulting you?
and what makes you think that I am a nadal fan?
what was your first clue?
Yes, I think he'll win at least 15 to surpass Sampras.
Sampras really does not count. people are still not getting this:
nadal has had to beat the greatest player ever lived to get a lot of his slams.
also sampy was a single dimensional one trick pony.
LOL. You all are funny.
Admittedly, I am a big Nadal fan. And yes, I think he can get 15 slams. Geez, Pete won his last slam two full years after everyone thought he was done. LOL.
Because of Rafa's playing style, he has more injuries than some, and his body takes a fairly severe beating over the course of a long season. Personally, I believe if he took the same approach as Serena Williams does and simply stayed healthy and played for a few handfuls of important tournaments each year, he could probably prolong his career a good deal longer than his current style will allow. I don't see that happening, however, because he gives it all he has all the time and likely will continue to do so until he calls it quits. He chooses that path because, unlike a lot of tennis players, Rafa has other interests in his life and he will be living life to the fullest after his ATP career ends. And I applaud him for finding that balance well before he retires.
Short some career-ending injury, I see him playing another 4-5 years, and I see several more slams in that time. Nobody has more heart.
Good luck trying to stop Nadal at Roland Garros. When Nadal returned this year, he was aiming to peak for 2014. 2013 is the transition year, yet he was still too great for Djokovic. 2013 was to be Djokovic's only chance.
3 more Roland Garros titles is the minimum scenario for Nadal. The maximum could be anything. Plus the Indian Wells result proves Nadal is still a contender on hardcourts.
At the slams, Nadal is on a big winning streak over Djokovic/Murray/Federer. Nadal has won his last 11 slam meetings with those guys (2 vs Djokovic, 4 vs Murray, 5 vs Federer).
clay warrior is going to be tough in 2014.
For the past year I have had a gut feeling that he will top out at 13 slams (thirteen is a fortuitous number, IMO, despite what you may have been led to believe about it. It is a feminine number, supposedly strongly associated with Mother Earth, and I do not consider Rafa to be very masculine)- I see him winning just one more slam; it would be at RG, of course.
Rafa's been burning the candle from both ends. Already resulting in inability to win outside clay anymore, but wouldn't be surprised if 2013 was his last RG as well. He couldn't recover for Wimby FFS! That's how far he went this year. And still it took horrible misses by Djoker in the fifth to get it.
Depends on how Rafa will approach the tour in the future, but I'd say 0-1 more RG and that's it.
The thing is, if Rafa isn't going to win anymore slams, that really just leaves Djokovic and Murray. Considering the lack of competition, it's silly to think he can't. Delpo is a danger, but unless Rafa's hardcourt form goes to hell, he only has a huge worry about 2 guys.
Says who? I hope you are prepared to put your money where your mouth is.
This thread is full of people who are panicking over the decline of Federer because they can see his legacy paling into insignificance by Rafa's achievements from now on.
If I were a betting man I'd bet against it.
So anyone who doesn't think Nadal will dominate the FO for years are blind Federer lovers who are afraid of Nadal surpassing him?
The short answer is..........yes.
As much as i like Rafa, this post seems to get it right.
Rafa's decline is principally caused by his constant refusal to hit backhands, which forces him to cover an enormous amount of court.
It's is a pity because his backhand can make him win a lot of easy points; his slice very often forces the error.
He needs a trainer who will teach him how to take full advantage of his backhand instead of turning it constantly.
That or he won't be around much longer.
I asked you in the other thread how do you know that what Nadal says is to be believed at all?
I asked you whether he specified particular goals for 2014 to distinguish it from his "transitional" year?
If you don't know this you are talking BS.
And, yes, Nadal can reach 15 Majors.
You'd have to be really stupid to think Nadal was going to peak in 2013 after returning in....2013 :lol: So if you don't believe Nadal when he says he's trying to peak by 2014, you just aren't very smart.
Specified particular goals in 2014? No, he just said 2014 (that means not 2013).
15 slams minimum, because nobody can stop him at Roland Garros. That alone gets him to 15.
Everyone is a Belieber.
No. Not likely. I would think he'll struggle to equal Sampras. It will be funny to see the threads on TT trying to mathematically 14>14 if he does. I have no doubt that they will succeed however. Vivas!
I think he'll end up with 14.
15 if he manages to win next USO or AO, but I can't see it happening.
I say he retires on 14, equalling Pete.
i think nadal will win 15-17 slams
The problem is, if Nadal hasn't specified goals for 2013 and 2014 how do YOU know that he will peak in 2014 (apart from believing :lol: )?
You do realize that he has to eclipse his achievements from 2013 (which will be pretty tough, considering how many titles he has won , how many finals he was in and everything, that has not happened yet).
Besides, you didn't answer my question about how you define "peak" for Nadal. What is your measuring stick?
People like you avoid such questions like a plague, because usually they either troll hard or have no idea what they are talking about.
And, rest assured, Nadal will fall at RG at least once in the next three years. Mark my words.
Yes. People underestimate his abilities on HC. Don't forget that he's made the final of his last 2 HC slams. And he's also won Indian Wells this year. I do think that he's got 2 RG and maybe a USO, doing a safe call though
That so cool! DFT was hilarious!
lets make it 14 then.
Possible jus needs 3 more RG.
I can see Nadal being a contender at AO and RG through 2015, and he has at least a fighting chance at W and USO.
No reason why he can't pick up two of the next 9 majors. I do think his best shots are at AO and, obviously, RG. If he can pick up a USO or W he can really do some damage.
Why not? He doesn't have any intention to retire before he turns 30 and he's not the only one getting older. His main rivals are getting old as well.
I just hope he can focus more on hc and grass Slams because he's got enough RG titles.
I said that Nadal said he was aiming to peak in 2014. What don't you understand about this? Are you like, 7?
Nah, it won't be tough to eclipse his 2013 achievements, because he lost Monte Carlo and was stretched to 5 sets at Roland Garros. And he also lost at Chile. I think he'll sweep all clay events next year, and won't be stretched to 5 sets at Roland Garros. He might win Indian Wells again, or win Miami, but they aren't important either way, because form is measured by his clay level at that time of the year.
Forehand- 2010 (and 5th set of 2013 RG semi)
Movement- 2008 and earlier
I predict in 2014 Nadal will have his peak backhand, peak forehand and peak serve. His movement won't be peak but it will be better than 2013.
If I didn't answer your questions before, its because I didn't read your post entirely. You can't expect everyone to read your posts.
I'll mark your words about Nadal 'falling in the next 3 years at Roland Garros'. I'll send you an engraved watch with your words.
"It's not about the years. It's the mileage."
Yes, everyone's gaining mileage and won't get younger, but the higher your totals are after you have peaked physically, the more each additional step will add to the decline. And out of Rafa's generation, he's ahead of the curve by what is an equivalent of 4-5 years. So each year his main rivals from his own generation will be expected to play relatively better. And we will have new guys and the Darcises of the world out there too...
And as HC is the worst surface for joints, he will not push his physique there as it would mean risking the clay season, i.e. it would be a high risk, low reward option. And do we really have to discuss Rafa@Wimby? He'll go 120% at RG and with current schedule will never be in shape for Wimbledon again.
Those 4-5 years you mentioned are an exaggeration. Just because the hard courts are bad for the joints doesn't mean he will avoid them completely. He can't do that. The AO and US Open are too important and I doubt he will go there and not give 100%. He already showed at IW that he can still win hard court tournaments. As for Wimbledon, I agree his packed clay court schedule makes things very difficult, but at some point he will realize that winning titles like Barcelona or Rome a million times won't add much to his legacy and will take more breaks to make sure he arrives in good shape for the Slams. Starting from next year he will be able to skip any Masters he wants without penalty.
I don't understand how you will compare 2013 and 2014 without having a proper measuring stick in advance. As it stands, we either have to believe what Nadal says, or have a list of achievements he is aiming at for both years.
Sorry, but that sort of comment doesn't hold up when subjected to rational thought. For the fanboys it may do but not for everybody else (hence everybody else do not pay much attention to such statements).
Of course, when everything is said and done, we can objectively measure 2013 vs 2014, but that doesn't explain your drive to present his statement as some sort of truth (since you have no way to prove, that that is the case, apart from his word).
Next year he almost certainly will not be playing the entire SA swing, so in a way he will be dropping some of his results. And again you are speculating about whether or not he will be stretched at RG. He played very well in this year's RG and still had to win the SF in 5.
You are already dancing around the issue with how a peak form translates into winning. Because dropping titles will not be a sign of better form, no matter how you twist it. And that is now. I can imagine how the things will turn out to be should he lose some of his titles next year around this time.
I noticed that a new addition occured in your explanations. Now it is his "clay level". But we are talking 2013 vs. 2014 (of course, comparing the parts, where he actually played). And, if I am not mistaken, there is a lot of non clay tennis to be played yet.
Also, it is laughable how a M1000 title isn't important or indicative of playing level and current form.
Cherrypicking aspects of his game and from different years (and matches :lol: ) no less is what you come up with, when hard pressed to define "peak".
Let me guess. If we have this conversation again at any given time in the future, a case can be made, that he displayed some of this in a particular match or even a tourney. The problem with this is that we are talking about an entire year vs. another year.
We will see how your predictions will turn out, but you already conceded the point with his movement, and I am fairly certain, that that will be the case with his serve as well. It remains to be seen for the other two, if they meet your expectations.
I don't expect everyone to read my posts. But, IF you engage in a conversation with someone YOU have to read his entire posts.
Your excuse is laughable.
More empty words.
i can see nadal winning 2 more RGs...but everything depends on
if djokovic can get him next year...the dynamic changes completely...nole has the capabilty to win one or more RGs.
Of course not avoid, but the reality is that a winning chance takes that 100% (maybe not in OZ where you can get lucky with everybody not gotten into the rhythm yet, i.e. not being quite 100%) and on HC that 100% will be rough for him.
I wouldn't say 4-5 years is an exaggeration. Maybe I've been blinded a bit by the old man Fed taking such an amazing care of his body, but I still can't see Nole or Andy having to take several months off in the next five years. Not without unexpected external issues.
But I agree, it'll be interesting to see how Rafa will approach the lesser events in the future. Personally, I can't see him easing up much on the clay season as it's his best GS chance and he needs the routine. Also, I'm not sure the clay tour events are a problem for his physique really. It's when we get to the five-setters...
The real question is the balance between getting that routine down for HC Slams and the toll it takes. Wimbledon is now a lost chance unless he plays at least a handful of grass matches to prepare. But having trouble adjusting, a single grass tournament doesn't guarantee him many matches... Without any, he'll be a bit better recovered, but his traditional vulnerability in the early rounds of Wimby is not even a public secret anymore and anyone in the top 100 can exploit that.
Tough, but definitely possible. If I had to guess, I'd say he finishes with 14.
what the clay warrior has done his whole life is what the world said he could not do.
I would not count this due out. RG is off limits until he steps aside. now next year he wont be going in with a 7 month layoff.
translation: say hello to 7 doomed men again at the next RG.
that makes it 13 and then he has 3 years to get 2 more.
it is certainly possible. so people can cry all they want. he is going to end up with 14-15.
i meant to say: i would not count this dude out.
i was typing too fast so i made a mistake.
Separate names with a comma.