Is Roger Federer the greatest athlete of all time?

What a ridiculous thread.

Michael Jordan is the greatest athlete that ever lived, hands down.

To compare Federer to him is a joke.
 
Fed's up there among the greatest athletes.

Hard to say who was the greatest athlete but Babe Ruth comes to mind. He was a great pitcher and could have made the HOF in that area too, no one was close to dominating as pitcher and batter let alone having great stats in both areas.
 
LeBron is 6'9", 260 pounds, runs a 4.53, and has a 42" inch vertical, among other physical anomalies. Michael Jordan is the best basketball player ever, but LeBron is far and away a better athlete.
 
Triathlon was invented precisely to answer the question of this thread. Who is the best/fittest overall athlete?

Here's a quote from Wikipedia:
The first modern long-distance triathlon event was the Hawaiian Ironman Triathlon. It included a 2.4 mile (3.86 km; 77 lap) swim, a 112 mile (180.2 km) bike ride, and a 26.2 mile (42.195 km) run. It was conceived during the awards ceremony for the 1977 Oahu Perimeter Relay (a running race for 5-person teams).

Among the participants were numerous representatives of both the Mid-Pacific Road Runners and the Waikiki Swim Club, whose members had long been debating which athletes were more fit: runners or swimmers. On this occasion, U.S. Navy Commander John Collins pointed out that a recent article in Sports Illustrated magazine had declared that Eddy Merckx, the great Belgian cyclist, had the highest recorded "maximum oxygen uptake" of any athlete ever measured, so perhaps cyclists were more fit than anyone (...)

so they understood the concept when Collins suggested that the debate should be settled through a race combining the three existing long-distance competitions already on the island: the Waikiki Roughwater Swim (2.4 mi/3.862 km), the Around-Oahu Bike Race (115 miles (185 km); originally a two-day event) and the Honolulu Marathon (26.219 mi/42.195 km (...)

Handwritten on the last page was this exhortation:
"Swim 2.4 miles! Bike 112 miles! Run 26.2 miles! Brag for the rest of your life!"​
With a nod to a local runner who was notorious for his demanding workouts, Collins said:
"Whoever finishes first, we'll call him the Ironman."
— Commander Collins, USN (1978)​
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jerriy said:
Triathlon was invented precisely to answer the question of this thread. Who is the best/fittest athlete/sportman of all?

Here's a quote from Wikipedia:
Click to expand...

Triathlon is a great measure of fitness, but not athleticism. Athleticism includes: strength, speed, vertical leap, body control, and other factors that aren't included in a triathlon. Those guys are in amazing shape, but are not great all-around athletes. A decathlon, yeah, that may have the best pure athlete. I think the big guy in that is Bryan Clay?
 
I took the liberty of interpreting "greatest" as meaning "fit" because of all the complaints that certain sports don't count (as in for example Tiger Woods not being eligible because golf is less physically demanding than other sports, which it admittedly is)
 
Just one thing here. Contact and non-contact sports cannot be compared under any circumstances. People who trained seriously both know exactly what I am talking about. MJ is head and shoulders above Federer when it comes to pure athleticism.
 
Kobble said:
Hate to break it to anyone, but there is no such thing as the greatest athlete of all time.
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You are just wasting your time. Look at the posts ...people taking their favorite sport and favorite player in that sport and they are GOAT. Nevermind that all rationale is thrown out the window and the idea that maybe their judgement is clouded by fanatacism.



I think everyone should have their own personal GOAT and move on.
 
Justdoit10 said:
Yeah they could have gone pro in other sports but that doesnt mean they would have been amazing at them. It is extremely simplistic to say that Michael Jordan would be a soccer legend because he was a great athlete.There are a vast number of other skills involved in other sports.
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Not so sure about that, Jim Brown also played La Crosse and many consider him the greatest who ever played that sport also, Bo Jackson was an all star in football and baseball.
 
Then why not include pro wrestling? Those guys in that branch are very often extraordinarily fit and athletic AND to top that off there is more contact there than any other sport :)

And while we're at it we might as well include practitioners of wushu/Kung Fu/etc a.k.a. real marshal arts (not MMA) including the Shaolin monks.

In fact, come to find out, I think we have a winner! The greatest athlete of all time is.....

4520367514_f5830565fa_o.gif


:mrgreen:
 
jerriy said:
Then why not include pro wrestling? Those guys in that branch are very often extraordinarily fit and athletic AND to top that off there is more contact there than any other sport :)

And while we're at it we might as well include practitioners of wushu/Kung Fu/etc a.k.a. real marshal arts (not MMA) including the Shaolin monks.

In fact, come to find out, I think we have a winner! The greatest athlete of all time is.....

4520367514_f5830565fa_o.gif


:mrgreen:
Click to expand...



Hey, come to think of it he could also be the GOAT of screen. I think we have a winner...............ding.......ding..........ding .........ding ........ding
 
Falloutjr said:
LeBron is 6'9", 260 pounds, runs a 4.53, and has a 42" inch vertical, among other physical anomalies. Michael Jordan is the best basketball player ever, but LeBron is far and away a better athlete.
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Umm UNC did a study on MJ's vertical during his time at UNC and his results were such..

Vertical reach displacement during a jump from running 45.76 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 1 hand dunk 41.70 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 2 hand dunk 40.93 in.

Now, as Jordan himself mentioned, he didn't start lifting heavy weights until a few years into his pro career and a Sports Illustrated article in the early 90's reported MJ's vertical to be an astounding 48".

"Smith says Jordan is the hardest worker he's ever coached. In high school Jordan hustled so, he was nicknamed The Rabbit. Rabbit, run. When he enrolled at Chapel Hill, Jordan ran the 40-yard dash in 4.6 seconds. This fall he ran a 4.3. By running and lifting weights he has substantially built up his upper body and gained 12 pounds in two years, most of it in the shoulders."
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/bas...rchive/831128/

In reference to his running, he ran a 4.3 40 with Deion Sanders.

I'm pretty sure that trumps Lebron James.
 
Lsmkenpo said:
Not so sure about that, Jim Brown also played La Crosse and many consider him the greatest who ever played that sport also, Bo Jackson was an all star in football and baseball.
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Who does? He was stellar player in college but he didnt play professionally, right? Anyways, Michael Jackson was a tremendous athlete but even if he did become a soccer player, he wouldnt have been a maradona or Zidane type player. There are other skills involved in soccer other than pure athleticism.
 
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Justdoit10 said:
Who does? He was stellar player in college but he didnt play professionally, right?
Click to expand...

Brown played lacrosse at college in Syracuse, is a Lacrosse HOFer, and regarded by many as top 5 in that sport. Some even say that he was better at Lacrosse than Football. Top 5 in two sports is hard to argue with.
 
jerriy said:
No need for patronizing, FR.

Basketball is very popular and famous outside of teh USA. Though not equally famous everywhere, it is in fact second only to soccer in worldwide popularity (almost definitely as far as teamsports are concerned) And also the US pro league is unofficially regarded as the highest level competition in that respective sports category
.
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no it's not. ever heard of a game called cricket? then comes field hockey, followed by tennis, according to many reports:

http://www.mostpopularsports.net/

Basketball does have some awesome athletes, but when your sample consists of a majority of players from the USA national league, it's hard to argue that they are the best across all of sports.
 
Limpinhitter said:
Sorry! Been away from the 'puter.

I can't pick an absolute best. But, among those I would say are the best athletes in tennis history, in no particular order, are: Laver, Borg, Gonzalez, Ashe, Sampras, Emerson, Courier, Nastase and Bob Lutz. I'd love to put Agassi in here for his strength and conditioning, but, he was a step slow by comparison to these players. I'm not saying all of these players are greater overall athletes than Federer, but, IMO, Laver, Borg and Gonzalez were. Fed is in the mix with the rest. In his prime, it was said that Laver was the best conditioned athlete of any sport. I would also tell you that Laver trained with his fellow Aussies and they were all the best conditioned tennis players at that time. Watching Laver live, his speed, strength, power, relentless aggression, lack of any weakness in any aspect of the game, it was easy to forget he was human.

As for the greatest athletes of any sport, it's impossible to be completely objective, or pick one over another. But, I would include athletes such as: Willy Mays, Michael Jordan, Deion Sanders, Walter Payton, Wilt Chamberlain, Bo Jackson, Johnny Unitas, Joe Montana, Mickey Mantle, Mohammed Ali, Sugar Ray Leonard, Sugar Ray Robinson, John Smith, Dan Gable, Jack Niclaus, Bobby Jones, Tiger Woods.

Is Usain Bolt's pure speed, strength and conditioning enough to overcome the relative lack of skill associated with sprints compared to golf, tennis, baseball, and a few others? Considering how he annihilated the record book, I'd say so.

I don't know enough about hockey or soccer to pick from those sports. But, my understanding is that Phil Esposito, Bobby Hull, Gordie Howe, Wayne Gretsky, Mario Lemieux are among the greatest. In soccer, I only know of Pele, Maradona and Gerhard Muller.
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Ok fair enough, though I have to disagree on sampras. He had stamina and endurance problems (he was very quick and powerful around the court, though). I'd certainly have Nadal on the list, though he is injury prone, but he has to be there on the list for his athletic abilities which have enabled him to demonstrate never-seen-before defensive retrieving.

In the past 2 decades (at least), Fed has been the tennis player who has been almost injury-free, despite making it deep into almost every tournament. Laver and Borg might be the best conditioned athletes of their times, but I strongly believe that the fitness and athletic levels in tennis is higher now than in the past. And Fed is as conditioned as they come in tennis; he is hardly ever out of breath, and I've never seen him tired on a tennis court. He is very quick, and also hits a powerful ball. For that reason, I have Fed as #1.

Of the others you've mentioned (many of whom I'm not familiar with), certainly Usain Bolt has a strong case, and so does Jordan.
 
fed_rulz said:
no it's not. ever heard of a game called cricket? then comes field hockey, followed by tennis, according to many reports:

http://www.mostpopularsports.net/
Click to expand...
There are plenty of stats on teh net. Here is one that doesn't agree with yours, for example:

#1 Football/Soccer
#2 Cricket
#3 Basketball
#4 Baseball
#5 Rugby Union
#6 Field Hockey
#7 Volleyball
#8 Ice Hockey
#9 American Football
#10 Rugby League

Since we all know that one country happens to have a huge population, cricket's figures are skewed. So I still say basketball is the second most popular if one takes the world as a whole. Almost every city that has parks, and every school in the world have (at least a half size) basketball court. Heck, even baseball is played here and there in places where both of these sports aren't major traditions (like for example Europe).

On the other hand I have never bumped into even one single cricket ground outside Britain. At least you can bump into the odd baseball and hockey playgrounds here and there, but cricket? Nope, not even once.
 
asafi2 said:
Umm UNC did a study on MJ's vertical during his time at UNC and his results were such..

Vertical reach displacement during a jump from running 45.76 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 1 hand dunk 41.70 in.
Vertical reach displacement during a 2 hand dunk 40.93 in.

Now, as Jordan himself mentioned, he didn't start lifting heavy weights until a few years into his pro career and a Sports Illustrated article in the early 90's reported MJ's vertical to be an astounding 48".

"Smith says Jordan is the hardest worker he's ever coached. In high school Jordan hustled so, he was nicknamed The Rabbit. Rabbit, run. When he enrolled at Chapel Hill, Jordan ran the 40-yard dash in 4.6 seconds. This fall he ran a 4.3. By running and lifting weights he has substantially built up his upper body and gained 12 pounds in two years, most of it in the shoulders."
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/bas...rchive/831128/

In reference to his running, he ran a 4.3 40 with Deion Sanders.

I'm pretty sure that trumps Lebron James.
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Michael Jordan is also smaller than LeBron. LeBron prolly has like 5 inches and 40 pounds on Jordan, and Michael was probably even smaller in high school than he was in the NBA. LeBron was about 220-230 when he graduated HS and now hes about 260. I bet Jordan wasn't even 200 pounds when he graduated HS.
 
Falloutjr said:
Michael Jordan is also smaller than LeBron. LeBron prolly has like 5 inches and 40 pounds on Jordan, and Michael was probably even smaller in high school than he was in the NBA. LeBron was about 220-230 when he graduated HS and now hes about 260. I bet Jordan wasn't even 200 pounds when he graduated HS.
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Ok...what's your point?? MJ is the better athlete as the numbers suggest...
 
In terms of hand-eye co-ordination, could be a tennis player, golfer, baseball player, basketball player, ice hockey player, lacrosse player... I dunno...foot-eye co-ordination football player?

In terms of physical ability I'd say someone like Phelps, Bolt or Carl Lewis? Or perhaps someone who does decathlon?

A modern tennis player needs to be superbly fit, with dancer's feet, a sprinter's quickness and second-to-none hand-eye coordination.

I don't like the "of all time" but Fed is arguably the best athlete so far
 
Falloutjr said:
Michael Jordan is also smaller than LeBron. LeBron prolly has like 5 inches and 40 pounds on Jordan, and Michael was probably even smaller in high school than he was in the NBA. LeBron was about 220-230 when he graduated HS and now hes about 260. I bet Jordan wasn't even 200 pounds when he graduated HS.
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Jordan: 6'6" 215 lbs.

Lebron: 6'8" 250 lbs.

Kobe: 6'6" 205 lbs.

Wilt: 7'1" 275 lbs.
 
rofl u are all a bunch of noobs, Federer isn't even in the top 1000000 as the best athlete of all time.

Fed has one the most non athletic bodies out of all "athletes" (golf players aren't athletes).

Thats what makes him GOAT in tennis, he dominates it with skill and talent and magic
 
slicefox said:
rofl u are all a bunch of noobs, Federer isn't even in the top 1000000 as the best athlete of all time.

Fed has one the most non athletic bodies out of all "athletes" (golf players aren't athletes).

Thats what makes him GOAT in tennis, he dominates it with skill and talent and magic
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Vince Carter to me is the best athlete ive ever seen. Carter has never been to the top of basketball because he is a terrible shooter.
 
first of all if you can't stay healthy for a prolonged period of your career, you are not in contention (Nadal, Monfils, )
Second every sport has his own demands, each one focus on different things, so every sport has his GOAT, dont compraed one sport to another
Olympians aren't in this discussion the are by far the greatest athletes
For me Borg, Federer, Jeter, Jordan, Bo "2 sports " Jackson, Tiger( the only golfer that is a athlete), gretzky, Favre, any great soccer player(not named Ronaldo because thats just simply talent)
and jeff gordon...... lol thats the redneck in me
so make your list from each sport and never stop posting comments this is hilarious
 
jerriy said:
There are plenty of stats on teh net. Here is one that doesn't agree with yours, for example:

#1 Football/Soccer
#2 Cricket
#3 Basketball
#4 Baseball
#5 Rugby Union
#6 Field Hockey
#7 Volleyball
#8 Ice Hockey
#9 American Football
#10 Rugby League

Since we all know that one country happens to have a huge population, cricket's figures are skewed. So I still say basketball is the second most popular if one takes the world as a whole. Almost every city that has parks, and every school in the world have (at least a half size) basketball court. Heck, even baseball is played here and there in places where both of these sports aren't major traditions (like for example Europe).

On the other hand I have never bumped into even one single cricket ground outside Britain. At least you can bump into the odd baseball and hockey playgrounds here and there, but cricket? Nope, not even once.
Click to expand...

World's most popular TEAM sports....

Abt the bolded part: you're joking right? where do you get your info from? the sub-continental countries that play cricket, they play on roads, streets, you name it.. you might want to double-check on not encountering cricket grounds outside Britain (LOL); perhaps the names Melbourne cricket ground, Adelaide oval, Eden Gardens, Centurion, etc. should refresh your mind.

contrary to what you claim, there aren't basketball courts in every school in the world -- I can easily negate your statement by mentioning that 90% of schools in india don't have a basketball court.

And so what if india skews the statistics? it is what it is. if popularity is measured in # fans following the sport, then hell yeah, india does play a major role in elevating cricket to #2.
 
The Baseline said:
Vince Carter to me is the best athlete ive ever seen. Carter has never been to the top of basketball because he is a terrible shooter.
Click to expand...

And a selfish b@stard, not a hard worker. A guy who's never even been top 10 in his sport cannot be justified as Greatest Athlete of All Time. Vince is nowhere in all time Bball discussions, contemporaries like Duncan, Garnett, Nash all rate higher than him, and I didn't even bring out the big guns. (LeBron, Kobe, Shaq).

Leaping ability? Guys like Dr J, MJ, Spud Webb (for his size), Nate Robinson (same), and JR Smith have better leaping ability than Carter. Mentioning Robinson, here's a guy who at his size played both basketball and football at UW. Better athlete than VC.

Allen Iverson is a better athlete than VC. At his size, to be one of the best scorers in NBA history is amazing. Add to that the fact that he still holds many state records here in VA in football, some said if he could've stuck with it he may have been better in football than basketball...not GAOAT material, but certainly better than Vince "half man, half a season" Carter.

The point is, I can run down a list of 20-30 guys who I consider better all around athletes than VC, for various reasons. The fact that anyone would give him serious consideration is a joke, you must have that 2000 Slam Dunk Contest on repeat or something at your house, and missed the rest of his mediocre career.
 
LOL, there is a lot of debate if Federer is even the best in his sport, and now we talk about all sports. There are great athletes across all sports and it is not fair to compare them.

And if we have to, many players in different sports have achieved a lot more success in their field than Federer managed to in tennis.
 
fed_rulz said:
World's most popular TEAM sports....

Abt the bolded part: you're joking right? where do you get your info from? the sub-continental countries that play cricket, they play on roads, streets, you name it.. you might want to double-check on not encountering cricket grounds outside Britain (LOL); perhaps the names Melbourne cricket ground, Adelaide oval, Eden Gardens, Centurion, etc. should refresh your mind.
Click to expand...
I was referring to Europe (which I took as an example of a place where the aforementioned sports weren't long established traditions)

contrary to what you claim, there aren't basketball courts in every school in the world -- I can easily negate your statement by mentioning that 90% of schools in india don't have a basketball court.

And so what if india skews the statistics? it is what it is. if popularity is measured in # fans following the sport, then hell yeah, india does play a major role in elevating cricket to #2.
Click to expand...
You say major role? That's an understatement if there ever was one. Lemme put it this way: if it wasn't for India, cricket would be way down any list of popular sports... somewhere between I dunno, curling and wife-carrying maybe? :>)
.
 
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Spider said:
LOL, there is a lot of debate if Federer is even the best in his sport, and now we talk about all sports. There are great athletes across all sports and it is not fair to compare them.

And if we have to, many players in different sports have achieved a lot more success in their field than Federer managed to in tennis.
Click to expand...

A great post, which will no doubt be ignored.
 
jerriy said:
I was referring to Europe (which I took as an example of a place where the aforementioned sports weren't long established traditions)

You say major role? That's an understatement if there ever was one. Lemme put it this way: if it wasn't for India, cricket would be way down any list of popular sports... somewhere between I dunno, curling and wife-carrying maybe? :>)
.
Click to expand...

And if it wasn't for American where would baseball, basketball and American football be? Especially given how much America has promoted these sports across the globe

Jeeze who cares if a single country is the reason it's popular! And if you care so much, why aren't you discounting the sports I've just mentioned?!

The american bias in this thread is a little ridiculous.

Here's a name for you: Jahangir Kahn. Squash player from Pakistan. A sport that requires greater levels of fitness than tennis, equivalent levels of hand-eye coordination, superior reflexes, more refined technique and complete skill set, equivalent anticipation and superior bursts of speed (although sprint speed isn't as important).
Anyway, this guy from Pakistan won 555 matches in a row in the '80s. He was unbeaten for 5 years. He should definitely be in contention for best athlete ever.
 
piece said:
And if it wasn't for American where would baseball, basketball and American football be? Especially given how much America has promoted these sports across the globe

Jeeze who cares if a single country is the reason it's popular! And if you care so much, why aren't you discounting the sports I've just mentioned?!

The american bias in this thread is a little ridiculous.

Here's a name for you: Jahangir Kahn. Squash player from Pakistan. A sport that requires greater levels of fitness than tennis, equivalent levels of hand-eye coordination, superior reflexes, more refined technique and complete skill set, equivalent anticipation and superior bursts of speed (although sprint speed isn't as important).
Anyway, this guy from Pakistan won 555 matches in a row in the '80s. He was unbeaten for 5 years. He should definitely be in contention for best athlete ever.
Click to expand...

555 matches in a row is absolutely incredible..... too many people overseas are overlooked by too many.....
 
And to everyone that is saying golf players cant deserve the greatest athlete ever, athletes dont have to be ripped, or in shape. Athletes also have to be mentally strong. And i can tell you, Tiger Woods and other players such as Mickelson even are mentally strong. To be in a clutch situation where you have to make that 25 ft putt in order to stay in a tournament is amazing because they only get one shot to do it or its over. Whereas in tennis if you play a loose point, you can hit a winner and its even. Golf is totally a mental sport and cannot just be thrown out of this argument that it has produced the greatest player ever. Not saying it has, but let's keep that in mind...
 
It's just that cricket is more televised than squash, but other than on TV I'd say squash more popular than even cricket!

Go to any decent indoor multi-sports venue and you will likely find one or more squash boxes (or whatever those courts with big walls are called :>)
 
I think what hurts Federer in this case, is his style of play makes him make tennis look so easy, that we don't think he's as athletic than he actually is.

If we traded Nadal's accomplishment's for Federer's, we'd be saying Nadal is right up there in the top in terms of athleticism, because he looks like he's built to be an athlete. Has tons of muscle, is uber fast, is built like a linebacker and hits the ball harder than anyone on the tour pretty much from both wings.

When we picture Jordan, we picture him drenched in sweat, with his eyes on the prize and focused. Jordan was also a pretty muscular guy too. Federer barely looks like he's breaking a sweat most of the time; compared to a grinder like Nadal who needs a towel after every point and is most remembered for his matches during the clay season which is during one of the hottest times of the year where he's visibly sweating pretty bad. Federer looks skinny, but the right side of his body is actually built pretty muscular. Not as stiff like Roddick, but I do remember McEnroe saying he was surprised just at how much Federer was built, as on TV he deceivingly looks like a scrawny guy.

The thing is, Federer can hit the ball just as hard as Nadal, his quick footwork makes up if not puts him on the same level as Nadal's raw speed, and he's shown time and time again he has plenty of endurance.
 
MasturB said:
I think what hurts Federer in this case, is his style of play makes him make tennis look so easy, that we don't think he's as athletic than he actually is.

If we traded Nadal's accomplishment's for Federer's, we'd be saying Nadal is right up there in the top in terms of athleticism, because he looks like he's built to be an athlete. Has tons of muscle, is uber fast, is built like a linebacker and hits the ball harder than anyone on the tour pretty much from both wings.

When we picture Jordan, we picture him drenched in sweat, with his eyes on the prize and focused. Jordan was also a pretty muscular guy too. Federer barely looks like he's breaking a sweat most of the time; compared to a grinder like Nadal who needs a towel after every point and is most remembered for his matches during the clay season which is during one of the hottest times of the year where he's visibly sweating pretty bad. Federer looks skinny, but the right side of his body is actually built pretty muscular. Not as stiff like Roddick, but I do remember McEnroe saying he was surprised just at how much Federer was built, as on TV he deceivingly looks like a scrawny guy.

The thing is, Federer can hit the ball just as hard as Nadal, his quick footwork makes up if not puts him on the same level as Nadal's raw speed, and he's shown time and time again he has plenty of endurance.
Click to expand...

Fed is more talented than Nadal, but not as athletic!
 
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