heninfan99
Talk Tennis Guru
Thank-you chatGPT
Is the One-Handed Backhand effective in today's tennis
- Thread starter Smecz
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Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
1HBH players are well represented at all levels of the game. In fact, multiple 1HBH players have won slams recently, including Federer, Wawrinka, and Thiem… on clay, grass, and hard courts. Tsitsipas will win a slam soon, I’m sure.
While less common than the 2HBH, the 1HBH is not dying by any means.
While less common than the 2HBH, the 1HBH is not dying by any means.
JohnYandell
Hall of Fame
Let's distinguish between the pro game and the other 99.9 percent. Given the junior dominance of the two hander I think it shows a lot that the one hander is still there near the top of the pro game. I hope it never dies. As for the rest of us... In my teaching experience a lot men players are natural one-handers. I see a lot of ex college players also whose two handers don't look so good when they are in their 30s and 40s... So at the club level the one is still super viable. And then there is the opinion of the great Robert Lansdorp: if you want a one-hander use a one-hander.
PS: it's a lot prettier...
PS: it's a lot prettier...
Hey OP, there’s no need to bag on something that you cannot do, and on the historical ways of tennis. The old way isn’t necessarily the wrong way…haven’t you followed Star Wars over the last 40yrs?
The one handed backhand was the best way to play the game when it was devised. Now with the bastardized version of homogenized oversized pickleball that we have in the game, perhaps the two handed version is, like everything these days, just more convenient…doesn’t mean better.
Anyway, a thbh is not something you need to make a public spectacle of, similar to rubbing one out in the town square. If you must do it, go ahead, but please, keep it to yourself.
The one handed backhand was the best way to play the game when it was devised. Now with the bastardized version of homogenized oversized pickleball that we have in the game, perhaps the two handed version is, like everything these days, just more convenient…doesn’t mean better.
Anyway, a thbh is not something you need to make a public spectacle of, similar to rubbing one out in the town square. If you must do it, go ahead, but please, keep it to yourself.
fuzz nation
G.O.A.T.
History might be rhyming here. This conversation was bouncing around a few years ago when Federer, Henin, Wawrinka and company showed up and put the idea on hold for a while. In the here and now, I think we're seeing a case where the most dominant ATP player happens to hit a two-hander.
I don't see how the one-hander can come back to the point that half of all the tennis players on the planet are using that stroke instead of a two-hander, but there's something else to consider with the one-hander's relevance at the top levels. Let me sort of answer one aspect of your question with a question:
Do you think that Tsisipas has a stronger aptitude to hit a two-hander, but for some reason he decided to limit his potential and use the one-hander instead?
That's not being snarky - your question is totally valid - but I don't think that the top players in world make much of a choice about using one style of backhand or another. They're playing to earn their lunch money, so they use what lets them play a stronger game. Yes, that decision might be steered in one direction or another by parents, coaches, etc. while they're still young, but I believe that these world class players pretty much develop their strengths as they go.
I also watch a player like an Andrey Rublev and sometimes wonder about that. In his case, that enormous forehand makes his two-handed backhand look borderline weak in contrast, but the guy obviously has a superior ability to smoke the ball. Are there ATP players with this sort of contrast between their forehand and backhand who were coached away from their stronger aptitude (for hitting a one-hander) as a kid? Somebody will need to come up with a better crystal ball to answer that one I guess.
Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
Better question: Do junior coaches in the US even know how to teach and develop a 1HBH? Is the 1HBH really inferior, or do US coaches simply not know what they are doing? Somehow, European players keep winning slams and reaching the top 10 with a 1HBH, but American coaches keep saying the 1HBH doesn’t work in the modern game. What do European junior coaches know that Americans do not? It is quite laughable to me to hear American coaches that run academies telling parents and junior players that the 1HBH won’t work in the modern game, while European players with a 1HBH are holding trophies and making millions of dollars on tour. What they should say instead is “I do not know how to teach and develop the 1HBH. This is a limitation of my coaching ability and tennis knowledge”.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
I asked one of the club coaches who runs a Junior program whether he ever teaches junior beginners a 1HBH since he himself has one. He said No. I then asked him whether there are any parents (Fedfans!) who insist on their kid being taught a 1HBH. He said that it happens rarely and when it does, his usual reply is that then the kid then needs to schedule one or two additional weekly 1-1 lessons in addition to the couple of group weekly lessons that all the junior beginners do. So, I guess that his premise is that it is a harder shot to teach/learn and if you decide on it, you had better put in more hours of learning/practice than your peers or you will fall behind.
Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
I wonder if Thiem, Wawrinka, Federer, Henin, Gasquet, Robredo, Tsitsipas, Dimitrov, and Shapovolov all had to take extra lessons to keep up with their peers as juniors?
optic yellow
Legend
Is that because they won't get taught the 1HBH in the group lesson?
jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
The biggest problem in teaching a 1HBH to kids is that it will take them much longer to develop it into a competent stroke, for the reasons you listed
This isn't a small issue, or simple short-sightedness in wanting immediate results.
A kid with a 1HBH is going to get beat up a lot, which may make them give up on tennis well before they can learn to hit the shot effectively
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Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
But why does this not apply to European juniors? Do they not get beat up and get discouraged and quit tennis while learning a 1HBH?
jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
Still applies all the same seeing how a large majority of players European or not play a 2HBH
Possibly mitigated a bit by clay courts being more prevalent in Europe, which gives them more time to set up the shot.
Moveforwardalways
Hall of Fame
A couple of American juniors hitting 1HBH
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
In group instruction for beginners, there are not too many individual tips given to each player. So, if everyone else is hitting 2HBHs, that is what the group instruction will focus on when learning the BH.
The 1HBH kid might get some individual attention, but the group focus and instructions on learning the 2HBH will not apply to him. So, he will need to be taught additionally in a separate session.
optic yellow
Legend
Yeah to me that says it's less about the additional difficulty and more about the standard lessons simply not teaching them.
ballmachineguy
Hall of Fame
That’s strokism. Tennis’ version of racism.
optic yellow
Legend
This but unironically.
StringSnapper
Hall of Fame
Thanks for sharing.
Love Tylers forehand even though it looks a bit weird - it produces a great ball. His prep is so early, and he preps straight into slot. The other kid, his prep is a more traditional unit turn prep but he gets rushed and his forehand is a lot spinnier and less effective.
I'm actually thinking this is key to hitting consistent forehands for an amateur player not - prep straight to slot.
Tylers backhand isn't great though, much below his forehand. Sort of reminds me of Tsitsipas - way to spinny, breaks down under pressure. His slice isn't bad but not great either.
Dragy
Legend
It is short-sightedness when you want a kid to “play tennis” as soon as possible. It’s not kids’ aim most of the time. They either enjoy or don’t enjoy the process brought to them during sessions. It’s the role of coach to balance it out for long-term goals, in-moment fun and some competitiveness injection. None hurting the other.
In ice hockey they learn to skate before playing. One could possibly get better in the game faster without skating, but what then? It’s not 100% related to 1H/2H BH comparison, but the whole idea of having couple of dozens extra hours to start with prohibiting coaches from trying 1HBH with kids is terribly flawed.
Even if the shot lags half-year behind in kids, it’s nothing after 10 years when it comes out it better suits that kid.
socallefty
G.O.A.T.
Now you know how a left hander like me felt as a kid when you go for group lessons and the coaches demonstrate everything just with the right hand. It was not just in tennis, but in all sports. In fact in cricket, my coach bullied me into learning to bat right handed because it was easier for him to teach me. I threw and bowled left handed because no one forced me to do it right handed.
Even now, I keep some reversed video clips of Federer playing left handed so I can watch and visualize his serve and 1HBH before I go to play tough matches.
optic yellow
Legend
But that is what makes it a WTA forehand and no self-respecting male can be caught using that.
optic yellow
Legend
But the only reason they don't need to do the same in tennis is because people already learned how to walk.
On the topic you are absolutely right. Some kids naturally gravitate towards using one hand while others gravitate towards using two. They should be allowed to explore the options and see what they like. There is no other acceptable answer to this because the evidence shows plain as day it is possible to compete at the highest level of tennis while using a 1HBH.
ChaelAZ
G.O.A.T.
My small set of anecdotal experience coaching has been, some kids have a natural 1HBH, some automatically grab with two hands and shovel, and some kids don't show a disposition to either. In the first two cases, you teach what looks to be more natural unless the parents have been groomed by the "everyone is doing the 2HBH" ether. It is that last group that turns the number of players using a 2hbh though because if they don't show a natrual disposition to a 1HBH, most coaches will teach the 2HBH for the agreed quick results and functional use. You might still find kids/parents in that last category that request a 1HBH, but that just comes down to evaluation. Again, I wasN'T working with 100's of elite juniors or HS kids myself, I just assisted, but went to enough coaching clinics and was around some amazing coaches to see how each handled the process and decisions.
One of the reasons I got involved in coaching is my son had a very nice 1HBH and one coach we had for the first year of HS would only let him hit with a 2HBH. Needless to say, we actually switched schools and it was a mess for a while. I worked with a very well-known local college coach with my son and he actually developed both. This was an example of a coach who was only going to teach and support what HE knew, not what was best for the player.
I never saw kids with a 1HBH get beat up a lot - strategy isn't that specific starting out. And usually in Junior tourneys kids with a 1hbh have enough reps that among all the other playing and technical errors, it isn't the be-all of why they lose. At least from what I see. Now, at high levels of play, yeah picking on a 1HBH becomes a strategy if that is the weaker wing. I have friends that tell me EVERY time they face a player with a one hander they automatically send a ton of balls that way to see if it breaks down. Hell, I do it too.
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socallefty
G.O.A.T.
Your experience might be colored by the fact that you were working with elite juniors who presumably had been taught a BH already or high school beginners who already have strength if they choose to hit a 1HBH.
Most pros and advanced players start tennis at a younger age where they don’t have a lot of strength. I’ve volunteered at kids summer clinics for young beginners below the age of 8 and no one has a disposition to hit a 1HBH unless their parent has forced them to do it already - this is because the junior racquet is heavy enough where the younger kids like to support it with two hands. In fact you are more likely to run into some weaker kids (in terms of strength) who might even want to hit 2HFHs.
Agreed. Seen this. Yet, we do not see enough two-handed forehands.
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Dragy
Legend
Don't you do same against 2HBH? Most likely they'll either drop enough attackable balls - be they shortish, or slowish to pick out of the air; or they nail it at times, but make errors a lot as well. Usually "strong reliable 2HBH" comes from a generally stronger player, which is not surprising.
My perception is more or less what you say.
1HBH users are more dangerous attackers in terms of power and variety when the ball is easy enough, but it is under pressure of fast and/or heavy balls when their stroke falls apart most frequently.
Exactly the contrary with 2HBH users, who more usually find better defensive responses under pressure, but lack "bite" at the time of attacking easy balls.
So IMO, it is usually safer not going full power at the BH of 2HBH users, and you'd better not leave easy balls to one handers.
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ChaelAZ
G.O.A.T.
My opinion, I think Federer was onto something when he came back in 2017 and started to hit more driving one handers early on top of the baseline instead of falling back on the slice or letting the ball get up. I always wonder what his career would have been like using that tactic early on, especially against Nadal. Should have, would have, could have.
I think that strategy is the future of the one hander and makes it just as solid as the two hander.
The reason why you'll continue to see less usage, like many have said already, junior kids are taught two hands at a young age or are more inclined to it.
I think that strategy is the future of the one hander and makes it just as solid as the two hander.
The reason why you'll continue to see less usage, like many have said already, junior kids are taught two hands at a young age or are more inclined to it.
optic yellow
Legend
It definitely felt to me when I was watching the AO this year that the idea of the "reliable" 2HBH was a bit of a myth.
Holmes
Hall of Fame
As always, the dinosaurs, imitation artists and fanboys will advocate for this shot which is obviously unsuited to the current conditions of the game. In a groundstroke centric gamestyle, the only true advantage 1HBHs have is how well they learn to slice at a young age and this can be easily matched by a 2HBH player being taught to do the same. Yes, I know the shot looks and feels good - that doesn't mean it IS good though.
Honza
Professional
I played Robredo in youth tournaments. He had no great backhand as every OHB player in youth (including me). Guys like Marc Lopez were higher ranked in Spain at that time. Especially in young years the OHB is too exploitable. I played them in international tournaments, so we had some kind of success, but the guys with 2HB had huge advantages.
Its just much tougher to be successful in the already deciding younger years. Its not like tennis starts when turning into men or women. You have to show up in youth to get the support to reach the top.
No way i would teach my kid a OHB.
Holmes
Hall of Fame
Yes! I trained with aspiring pros, and my OHBH was a liability because of the extra time it took to set up and the more difficult timing. Not to mention hitting a 1HBH open stance is practically impossible. And I was considered to have had a relatively good OHBH despite switching to it when I was 14. If I could it over, I'd definitely stick with the 2HBH and enjoy the extra time and consistency.
Holmes
Hall of Fame
It's just a matter of practice and proper technique. Many try to hit the 2HBH with the mistaken notion that it is a "left handed forehand" or they don't use the body to rotate through the shot which results in a sort of jab rather than a real stroke. These and other common issues make the stroke feel "unnatural".
Honza
Professional
wrong. timing is a task both backhands have to master and it doesnt take longer to set it up.
the most limiting factor is strength. you simply have more strength playing higher balls and blocking faster balls. that results in more power and stability.
Holmes
Hall of Fame
The table tennis 1HBH is very different from the tennis one. You rarely if ever see a 1HBH in tt wind up and take a full stroke, and I also don't think the grip is as extreme, though I could be wrong.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
How come one hand is enough on the forehand then? Just because the muscles in the front are stronger than the back ones?
Holmes
Hall of Fame
The point about higher balls is also a great one and ties into my point about timing and setup. Many players give up a ton of ground and move way back to wait for the high ball to get into the strike zone.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
I don’t understand how it’s easier to hit high balls with 2hbh with that limited reach.
Honza
Professional
Dragy
Legend
If you think over the head, it’s not, and you maybe shouldn’t. If you think chest-shoulder height, 2HBH is much more potent here, reach is optimum for that height of ball.
Holmes
Hall of Fame
Your contact point with a 2HBH is closer than a 1 and the extra hand helps with power and stability.
Curious
G.O.A.T.
I think that’s the main factor. Doubt strength plays a big role.
In the ohbh with closed stance, the swing at shoulder and above heights is limited, whilst with two hands, yeah, the reach is limited, but you have the left arm with wider range of motion to drive the swing.
Honza
Professional
again, its the main factor
Crocodile
G.O.A.T.
I would like to see more 1 HBH’s taught and used effectively in the competitive arena. The balance has certainly shifted too much the other way.
I think from a coaching perspective, with many children these days and their more sedentary and digital lifestyles, well they tend to be weaker and less dexterous than generations gone past. A lot of children struggle to catch and throw over arm these days. And because they are weak when they turn up for their beginner/intermediate lessons they struggle with the eastern backhand grip. They also struggle with high and end range balls because of the same weakness. And yes the lighter racquets, court surfaces and strings do have an impact. The other thing is that many parents and the kids want early success, and the weakness in grip strength, grip familiarity and general dexterity means that it may take longer for that child to develop an effective backhand using an eastern backhand grip. A lot of parents and children expect instant success so coaches will find that adjusting to a continental right hand and eastern left hand to perform 2 handed backhand is easier to do, and the student then feels more happy about the situation. I think people need to be more patient and less pressured to become familiar with a 1 handed backhand grip.
Can the 1 hand backhand be effective - absolutely I do think it can.
I think from a coaching perspective, with many children these days and their more sedentary and digital lifestyles, well they tend to be weaker and less dexterous than generations gone past. A lot of children struggle to catch and throw over arm these days. And because they are weak when they turn up for their beginner/intermediate lessons they struggle with the eastern backhand grip. They also struggle with high and end range balls because of the same weakness. And yes the lighter racquets, court surfaces and strings do have an impact. The other thing is that many parents and the kids want early success, and the weakness in grip strength, grip familiarity and general dexterity means that it may take longer for that child to develop an effective backhand using an eastern backhand grip. A lot of parents and children expect instant success so coaches will find that adjusting to a continental right hand and eastern left hand to perform 2 handed backhand is easier to do, and the student then feels more happy about the situation. I think people need to be more patient and less pressured to become familiar with a 1 handed backhand grip.
Can the 1 hand backhand be effective - absolutely I do think it can.
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Honza
Professional
Sure, tell them to be more patient, when financial support in youth tennis depends on results, where the OHBH is a big disadvantage.
Top ten players told me my OHBH is nice to watch while practicing with me. Doesnt help when they and their 2HBH copes better with 90% of the situations.
We are not speaking about the beauty of a stroke, it is the effectivness.
Top ten players told me my OHBH is nice to watch while practicing with me. Doesnt help when they and their 2HBH copes better with 90% of the situations.
We are not speaking about the beauty of a stroke, it is the effectivness.
Holmes
Hall of Fame
This is the truth right here. Unless you're playing on clay where you can back way way up without too much detriment, or a very slow hard where you have a little more time to do so, the OHBH is a serious disadvantage. And even in those cases, it's more in the "manageable disadvantage" rather than "no disadvantage" arena.
