J. Henin - One of the Greatests in the Making

Chadwixx

Banned
even if ppl say henin was guilty, the arguement could be made for her youth, and how she has matured since the incident.

so it doesnt matter, it just gives ppl something to debate.

justin beat her and much like serena her fans are looking for excuses.
 

Chadwixx

Banned
Kaptain Karl said:
lothar - You're posting like an idiot.

If one cheats and gets caught that's one thing. JHH only "got caught" by those who know the letter and spirit of what sportsmanship is. She cheated in the FO and got away with it, hence she wasn't disquilified [sic].

Most people get caught when they cheat. I can only *hope* JHH tries something like that again. I don't think she'll get away with it next time. (Did you see cedric's post? The Belgians don't even like her.)

[Remember the USO last year, when Capriati tried to "play dumb" in the post-Serena match interview? The tennis-savvy NY crowd booed her *right away* for attempting to "finesse" the truth. IOW, she "got caught" by the "court of public opinion."]

- KK
tennis-savvy ny crowd made me laugh. they could put drunk baboons in the stands and it wouldnt make a difference.

this one also made me laugh " JHH only "got caught" by those who know the letter and spirit of what sportsmanship is"

like pete sampras told jared palmer, welcome to the pro's.
 

Kaptain Karl

Hall Of Fame
Chadwixx said:
... the arguement could [be] made for her youth, and how she has matured since the incident....
Still looking for that "maturity" ... in Justine ... in Serena ... in Jennifer ... Maria ... Amelie ... Elena ... Anastasia....

All the above are contributing to my respect for Kim Clijsters, Alicia Molik and Lindsay Davenport.

- KK
 
E

Evi

Guest
cedric13 said:
Hi

I'm Belgian. Belgian as Clijsters and Henin.

Henin is very disliked here. She has a such attitude.
She's used to talk a lot about her privacy in stupid newspaper, making her
incredible, that it's normal she earned all what she has, that she's the best.

Few months ago she acted for a public comedy show. The little movie
she was in showed her back from winning a tournement and having a drunk
and lazy father at home. A total drunk father. Nothing was hilarous, it
was pathetic. If she has problem with her dad, no need to put him down
in public in a such way.

After that, way way way more Belgian disliked her.

I'm not giving you my opinion about her, just telling you how she's mainly
seen here in Belgium.

We're proud of course to have 2 such players with Clijsters and Henin.
But it came to a situation that in any tennis club I've spent time lately, if
she's on tv, everyone hopes she loose.

:confused: Well I live in the same country as you do and imo Justine gets popular every week. I was at a tennisclub last saturday when Justine was playing against Schnyder. When they put on the tv everybody joined me in front of the tv and a lot of 'oooooooooh's and 'wow's' were heared all the time. Since her great victories at the Slam's Justine gained fans ... and after her unbelievable run at the OS she did it again. People see through Justine 'icequeen' image now and realise it's the right attitude to be a great champion. Ok Kim has the ability to play the nice girl in front of the camera's (and yes there's a difference when the camera's are running! I call it marketing and it works perfect.) but at this moment Justine has the big titles and I think as a sportswooman .. that's what count.
I worked with both girls several times at Fed Cups/WTA Antwerp and Hasselt and I know both girls are nice to work with.

To proove your '********' reply isn't correct ... here's a column from a Belgian (Flemish) newspaper. It's translated from Dutch and there are probably a lot of mistakes in it but I think the point is clear. (the writer used many symbolic words so it could be weird sometimes ;)) Justine is compared with Eddy Merckx ... could you get a better sort of respect as sportswoman??

Hugo Camps
PASSION & MERCI

You can see on Justine Henin Hardenne how lovely poisson can be. I don't know any other sportsperson (M/F) with that much poisson and passion in her body as our Walloon rascal. If we compare it with Tom Steels spirtit, he's just a custard bunn. Even our leatherman Stefan Everts doesn't win it of our red clay diva when we talk about character. Not even wit a 700pk under his butt.

In Berlin Justine toke her third title in a row. After a year of trouble and sorrow. Insiders had written her off. It was impossible to have a comeback at the top. Also beacause they opend a can of Russians. When we heared she went to Monaco we were 100% sure: just playing tennis as a aftermath for a mother-to-be. It's true: in all off us is a bit off 'Gazzetta dello Sport'.

But anyone who looked in Jusitne's eyes saw the fireflies and knew better. Anyone who looked at the magic in her backhand and loved it, knew even beter. Justine wouldn't give up that easy.

As beautifull as her poisson is her capriciousness. In Berlin she blowed Sharapova off the court as a wooden doll. Against less good oponents she stood there shaking on her leggs with one 'hospitallball' after the other. If she was a dropshot herself that died in the net.

Capriciousness is a sign off big champions. Justine made hers it into art. But there is more 'championsbehaviour'. This Belgian proud doesn't talk that much. She loves to keep it short, measured, with a bit of chagrin. Just like Eddy Merckx in his best days. She doens't care aboiut charisma and things for a good cause doens't need to be seen. I beg her sometimes: Justine let us see your love and get out of your role as 'sportwoman'. It doesn't work.

Nobody has heared Justine laughing out loud. Walking hand in hand with Mister Hardenne? Can't remeber when. A frensh kiss? A mounth isn't a tenniball!! Poisson is beautifull, but it also shows the result of a hurt life. The system Justine Henin.

She has my love. Also my adoration. Born little whe became great. She doesn't let herself blown away by anybody. And all that for a 'childwoman' from a bit more than 1.5 meters. In Berlin she said RG was still far away. "You want get me nervous". I'm already nervous in her place. I'm counting down the days, as Justine Henin clenched fist.

Original text
Hugo Camps
PASSIE & COMPASSIE

Aan Justine Henin kun je zien hoe mooi gif kan zijn. Ik ken geen topsporter (M/V) met zoveel gif en drift in lijf en leden als deze Waalse dondersteen. Gemeten aan de spirit van Justine is Tom Steels een puddingbroodje.

Ook de altijd zo opzichtig in leer gebalsemde Stefan Everts haalt het op karakter niet van de graveldiva. Nog niet met 700 PK onder zijn reet.

In Berlijn pakte Justine haar derde titel op rij. Na een kwakkeljaar met niets dan misère. Insiders hadden haar al afgeschreven. Een comeback aan de top leek onmogelijk. Ook al omdat er een blik stevige Russinnen was opengetrokken. Toen bekend raakte dat Henin in Monaco zou gaan resideren was het vooroordeel helemaal compleet: tennis als naspel voor een moedertje in wording. Het is niet anders: in ieder van ons woedt een Gazzetta dello Sport.

Wie goed naar de vuurvliegen in haar ogen had gekeken, wist beter. Wie het magistrale perfectionisme van haar backhand had gekoesterd, wist nóg beter. Justine zou zich niet zomaar laten afserveren.

Al even mooi als gif is haar grilligheid. In Berlijn ranselde ze Maria Sjarapova weg als een houten pop. Tegen mindere tegenstanders stond ze dan weer te schutteren met de ene ziekenhuisbal na de andere. Alsof ze zelf het dropshot was dat in het net stierf.

Grilligheid tekent grote kampioenen. Justine heeft haar onberekenbaarheid tot kunst verheven.
Er is nog meer kampioenengedrag. Deze Belgische trots heeft weinig zin in praatjes. Ze houdt het graag kort, afgemeten, met een ondertoon van chagrijn. Zoals Eddy Merckx in zijn gloriedagen. Charisma kan haar gestolen worden en werken van barmhartigheid zijn er om niet gezien te worden. Soms smeek ik haar: ‘Justine, val één keer met een woord van liefde of betovering uit die domme Adidasstrepen.’ Het lukt niet.

Nooit heeft iemand Justine Henin horen schateren. Hand in hand lopen met meneer Hardenne? Ik kan het mij niet herinneren. Een onbewaakte tongkus? Een mond is geen tennisbal, zeg. Gif is mooi, maar het staat ook de aandoenlijkheid van een gekwetst leven in de weg. Het systeem Justine Henin.

Mijn liefde heeft ze. Mijn aanbidding ook. Klein geboren, groot geworden. Door niets of niemand omver te blazen. En dat voor een kindvrouwtje van amper anderhalve meter. In Berlijn zei ze dat Roland Garros nog ver weg is. “Mij krijg je niet zenuwachtig.” Ik ben het nu al voor haar. Ik tel de dagen af, als de gebalde vuist van Justine Henin.
 
Kaptain Karl said:
Still looking for that "maturity" ... in Justine ... in Serena ... in Jennifer ... Maria ... Amelie ... Elena ... Anastasia....

All the above are contributing to my respect for Kim Clijsters, Alicia Molik and Lindsay Davenport.

- KK
Oh well .... if you say they are mature, then I'm sure they are and if you say the others arn't, then I'm sure they're not. :roll:
 
With regard to the Williams/Henin match, I think the only reason the Williams got upset was the closeness of the contest.
She didn't throw a McEnroe-esque Pits of the World oncourt tantrum.

Had she been blowing Henin out...
Which she was at that point of the match.

but Williams may/may not have seen her hold her hand up and continued anyway to provoke a situation.
Do you think it's the street level intimidation she learned growing up in Compton?

I'm not sure how my personality has anything to do with tennis or why it is people like myself that there is any speculation about the Holocaust or Iraq.
Simple. Despite the evidence (I have it on tape), you still proclaim that Justine did nothing wrong. The same is true for Holocaust deniers. That's ignorance.

Mr. Banks,
That's me.

I'm not quite sure why you'd quote me in a positive attitude and then right after, quote me again to "trash talk" me.
When I said,That right Luther, tell him like it is, I was responding to line in your message, It truly is a a sign of weakness to have to resort to name-calling and teasing. To elaborate: I've always felt that Phil gets out of hand sometimes, and needs a good tending to. I like the way did it.

Though I will not sit here and waste my time fighting with you, I will simply say that it was hypocritical and made no sense.
1. Who's fighting? I thought I was taking part in a discussion on the principles of sportsmanship. When did this become about Bertie and Lothar?
2. Your comprehension skills are lacking. Question: If a tree falls in the middle of the forest and no one's there, does it make a sound? Did it even fall down?
 
B

bustigal

Guest
I didn’t anticipate my post would stir so much emotion, hatred, and remarks. Thank you guy/gals.

Here are my closing remarks:

· This is just like the approval of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas 10-15 years ago. All we heard for several months was his alleged joke about the pubic hair in his female colleague’s Coke but nothing about the man’s qualification and his accomplishment, especially from his humble beginning. Well, when the dust settled, Mr. Thomas was our Supreme Court Justice.

· If I say the US is the best nation on earth, I bet some of you would say: “yeah, but the US kills innocent civilians in Iraq.”

· Don’t be confused with what JH had accomplished and her contribution to the game with whether or not you respect her. I don’t like Serena either. She has no respect for any other players (the “Serena Slam” thing was like as if Federer now calling the game of tennis the Federer Sport), no class, no game (she is average if not for that man’s body), and is a bad loser. However, I acknowledge Serena’s contribution to the game. She raised the power level of the women’s game to a new level. For a while, she was at the peak that no one seemed to be able to reach. The William sisters were beating up the weak sisters on the tour until some of the women caught up to them. AND, JH, the female version of Federer, was the first one to take Serena down from the top. For Serena fans, that got to hurt, and I understand. But, keep bashing JH with one little controversial call won’t undermine her accomplishment and contribution to the game. So far, the JH haters have not shown me any solid arguments to disprove JH’s greatness in the making except whining about that call. You got to ask yourselves, beside that call (again, it’s controversial at most), what else have you found and presented to support your arguments.

· Navatalova once told her opponent in the trophy ceremony after losing a final: “You go first, *****; after all, you won, right?” Some of you may have no respect for her personally, but when her career was over, we call her one of the greatests that ever play the game along with Jimbo and JMAC who are not exactly Saints.

. JH supporters, don't let them make you lose focus. This is suppose to be a celebration of JH's accomplishments, not a debate on one controversial call.

· JH Fanatic, why on earth you want to admit JH was cheating, Eaaa..? Since you are on my side, I won’t throw you those choice words, but I suggest you take a debate class. Remember, quantity does not equal to quality. Sometime, the more some people open their mouths, the more they show what a “blipping” idiot they are.

· Pascual, may I borrow you quote: "Resentment is like taking poison and hoping the other guy dies." This is exactly what you are doing to JH. You might have found a cool quote, but you have not shown that you understand it and live by it.

· Cedric13, come on, man, you are not Belgian, and you are even not living in Belgium. If you are, you should be shame of yourself. Many small countries like Belgium are dying to have someone like JH. She is your national hero, and you should let her carry the national flag on your next Olympics. But you bash her, Ohhh..! Besides good chocolates, what else do you guys have in Belgium if you trash your national hero like that because of your little trivial personal vendetta?

· Evi, great find. I am proud of you and JH. You are the real Belgians!

· Again, you JH haters can go on forever with that controversial call. Waste more energy and loose some sleep, too. Let say 2000 posts by end of this month on that call. When you get there, I will salute you once again with with Pascual’s quote: "Resentment is like taking poison and hoping the other guy dies." There you have it. So long and keep posting.
 

Kaptain Karl

Hall Of Fame
bustigal said:
I didn’t anticipate my post would stir so much emotion, hatred, and remarks. Thank you guy/gals.
What a moronic review! There's been *some* emotion ... and *no* hatred, as far as I can see.

This is just like the approval of Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas 10-15 years ago.
Stupid analogy.

Don’t be confused with what JH had accomplished and her contribution to the game with whether or not you respect her.
Asinine instruction.

Navatalova [sic] ... Some of you may have no respect for her personally, but when her career was over, we call her one of the greatests that ever play the game....
I cannot stand Navratilova, personally. But her record makes her truly one of the all time greats. JHH is a LLLOOONG way from being compared to MN. (Another stupid comparison.)

... Remember, quantity does not equal to quality. Sometime, the more some people open their mouths, the more they show what a “blipping” idiot they are.
Same goes for long boring posts ... like yours.

Cedric13, come on, man, you are not Belgian...
You've made a charge you simply cannot support. (Idiotic claim....)

- KK
 

Chadwixx

Banned
u guys need to stop insulting ppl whom u dont agree with, u act like ur posts are any more valid than theirs. just because u have more posts or use perf grammer doesnt mean ur arguements are anymore valid.

the facts are the facts, serena got beat and cried after the match blaming everyone but herself. 1 point doesnt make a match unless ur a mental twinkie, or its match point.
 

lothar

New User
Bertchel Banks said:
[quot]

Simple. Despite the evidence (I have it on tape), you still proclaim that Justine did nothing wrong. The same is true for Holocaust deniers. That's ignorance.

2. Your comprehension skills are lacking. Question: If a tree falls in the middle of the forest and no one's there, does it make a sound? Did it even fall down?
I have it on tape, too. I think that she did nothing wrong, though I did not say she did anything right either. It seems like you have this idea that I'm biased in favor of her. I'm not her fan, I'm someone who saw the match and made an assessment as objective as I can be. I like her game, but I'm no member of her fan club. Tennis is a sport for competition, not a testament of one's morality. She was not required to say anything. Her job is to play the match inside the rules, which she did in saying nothing.

The tree made a sound, since sound is defined as vibrations that can be heard and measured. And the tree did fall, as was stated at the beginning of the question. What was your point? "If I close my eyes, is the world still there?" Are you trying to promote solipsism?

And once again, you're starting a personal attack on me, which I shall not lower myself and succumb to a quarrel with you.

And quit calling me Luther.
 

scoot

Rookie
Good post lothar. Also, these people attacking Justine's character b/c of 1 incident should try to look at the big picture. I'd bet 99% of the pros have done things in competition that they are not so proud of; its part of being human. We make mistakes. But if you look at Justine over the course of her entire career, she has been nothing but a wonderful sportswoman, very gracious. Unlike Serena, Coria, ASV, Ferrero & a host of others all of who've been pieces of sh*t consistently. I would never judge another persons character based on 1 incident (which happened to be a high pressure situation).
 

fedfan

Rookie
bustigal said:
I didn’t anticipate my post would stir so much emotion, hatred, and remarks. Thank you guy/gals.
were you suprised? how can you say that she is the greatest without expecting feedback by people who are disagreeing with you? even people that post that federer may be the greatest of all time expect to disproved. next time think before you post such a ridiculous and stupid quote.
 
the facts, serena got beat and cried after the match blaming everyone but herself. 1 point doesnt make a match unless ur a mental twinkie, or its match point.
This from a man/boy/twinkie whose government opened fire on a refugee ship in the middle of shark infested seas. Hush Twinkie. Okay you don't like Serena, I understand. As an Australian it's a given that unless there's a group to hate you're miserable. Fact is, Justine is a liar and a thief. Evidence is abound.
 

Phil

Hall of Fame
You obviously have NOTHING to say about tennis, don't know anything about it, so your only possible response is to equate all of the posters here with the actions of their respective governments. You're a joke, now; a true troll if there every was one. BTW, Bertel, for everyone's reference here, which country do you belong to?
 
It seems like you have this idea that I'm biased in favor of her. I'm not her fan, I'm someone who saw the match and made an assessment as objective as I can be.
Ha. Any objective viewer of the incident will conclude that Justine was wrong.

I like her game, but I'm no member of her fan club. Tennis is a sport for competition, not a testament of one's morality. She was not required to say anything. Her job is to play the match inside the rules, which she did in saying nothing.
It may not be on the books, but the spirit and heritage of the game demanded that she spoke up. She was wrong. True, I only watch her when she plays my faves, but I admire her courage and fight. Infact, we have too much in common astrologically for me to dislike her. Also, I find her a refreshing alternative to the whiny and ungraceful Amelie Mauresmo.

Are you trying to promote solipsism?
No.

And once again, you're starting a personal attack on me...
Untrue. You were the one who waltzed in here called me weak. You were the one who just yesterday called me a hypocrite. You were the one who accused me of going off on nonsensical tangents...so what if I think Kristof Vliegen looks like a Pygmy when he's about to serve. So What?

which I shall not lower myself and succumb to a quarrel with you.
What do you mean succumb? And when did this become Bertie v. Lothar? Sportsmanship: The Unwritten Rule, that's the issue. Bertie dominates Lothar on TW messageboards, that's not it. Bertie to whip Lothar in likely best of 3/superset oncourt encounter, that's not it either. Bertie: "Disqualified" , Lothar: "Disquilified"...Bertie 3, Lothar 0... Sportsmanship and tennis, again, that's the issue.

And quit calling me Luther.
If you insist.
 
You obviously have NOTHING to say about tennis, don't know anything about it, so your only possible response is to equate all of the posters here with the actions of their respective governments. You're a joke, now; a true troll if there every was one. BTW, Bertel, for everyone's reference here, which country do you belong to?
Why, so you can color me happy with a vodka in hand and a domestic/farm animal/beating heart to shag. You hurt my feelings, Phillip, so as punishment I'm not telling you.
 

Phil

Hall of Fame
Does that mean you're from Wales? Anyway, just as I thought...too embarassed to do so-because I'm sure whatever place you're from has just as many nasty things to say about it as any other place. However, don't mistake YOU for the rest of us-I don't think anyone will hold it against you personally-where you're from. You provide plenty of ammo, and laughter without having to resort to ****ging your nationality.
 

cedric13

New User
Evi said:
:confused: Well I live in the same country as you do and imo Justine gets popular every week. I was at a tennisclub last saturday when Justine was playing against Schnyder. When they put on the tv everybody joined me in front of the tv and a lot of 'oooooooooh's and 'wow's' were heared all the time.
I'm curious about where do you live in Belgium ?
I agree she plays well, I agree she has a "nice to see" tennis.
But she's disapointing as person.

Evi said:
To proove your '********' reply isn't correct ... here's a column from a Belgian (Flemish) newspaper. It's translated from Dutch and there are probably a lot of mistakes in it but I think the point is clear. (the writer used many symbolic words so it could be weird sometimes ;)) Justine is compared with Eddy Merckx ... could you get a better sort of respect as sportswoman??
Up to you to think I wrote a "****" reply. I tell you most ppl dislike her here.

Now would you think a Belgian newspaper would put down a player like Henin ? (who I agree does great results)

Newspaper are biased.
I'm not. I don't give a damn about her, I tell you facts I see.
Make your own opinion, believe me or not, it won't avoid me to sleep at night.

Now to compare her to Eddy Merckx, I wouldn't...let's wait she wins all grand slam before doing that, since Merckx won nearly all what was possible to win.

Last point, always disapointing to read in forum personal attacks like I've read in some other topics and write replies with "*****" . It show the maturity of the writer.

and btw, Malisse isn't very well liked too.
 
bustigal said:
· JH Fanatic, why on earth you want to admit JH was cheating, Eaaa..? Since you are on my side, I won’t throw you those choice words, but I suggest you take a debate class. Remember, quantity does not equal to quality. Sometime, the more some people open their mouths, the more they show what a “blipping” idiot they are. .
Hi bustigal

What a fantastic post - love it.

The reason I said that to firstly shut him up and secondly I was being sarcastic. Bustigal, I couldn't be bothered to argue with that moron anymore, so I was being very, very sarcastic. Sorry if it didn't come across that way.

Thanks for supporting me and once again - FANTASTIC POST! Some of these people on this board are weird. Do they not have a life? Anyway, I'm off on my holidays 2 week cruisin around the Med), so enjoy the debate. I hope it's finished by the time I return!
 
once a cheater, always one in my book. i'll never look at her as one of the greats. what she did was wrong and she failed to admit it. yeah she's talented, but yeah she cheated.
 

Chadwixx

Banned
Bertchel Banks said:
This from a man/boy/twinkie whose government opened fire on a refugee ship in the middle of shark infested seas. Hush Twinkie. Okay you don't like Serena, I understand. As an Australian it's a given that unless there's a group to hate you're miserable. Fact is, Justine is a liar and a thief. Evidence is abound.
what was a refugee ship doing in shark infested waters? i have no clue what ur talking about, and why is this being posted on a tennis msg board?

if u cant stick to the topic please dont post, i dont care what ppl from terd world countries think about us policy.
 
if u cant stick to the topic please dont post, i dont care what ppl from terd world countries think about us policy.
Hush Twinkie. Outside of "Serena Sucks" you haven't added anything tennis related or substantial to this thread in days.

If you want to call a country where "Nads:You Grow 'em, We Help You Rip 'em Off," is the runaway bestselling and clinically approved female grooming product first world, go right ahead.

what was a refugee ship doing in shark infested waters? i have no clue what ur talking about, and why is this being posted on a tennis msg board?
Doing Phil's dirty laundry again, eh? I swear, you two are joined at the hip. Toss off. But first, if you don't want off topic chatter, don't ask off topic questions. Now, toss off.
 

Chloe

Rookie
That was a hilarious 6 pages. Thank you to everybody who had nothing better to do than contribute to this topic at great length (yes, I also had nothing better to do than contribute to this topic, though not yet at great length).

Now that this has been beaten to death, why don't we talk about how Justine CHEATED her way to the Australian Open title by using her evil ways to persuade the umpire into overruling THE linecall?
 
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