J McEnroe : Roger, the Best Ever

DoubleDeuce

Hall of Fame
.... like we didnt know

updated 36 minutes ago
ZURICH - John McEnroe thinks Roger Federer is the best men's tennis player of all time.

McEnroe, also considered one of the game's greats, said Tuesday he ranks the Swiss star ahead of Rod Laver, the only man to win all four Grand Slam events in one year, and seven-time Wimbledon champion Pete Sampras.

Promoting an ATP Champions Tour event in Zurich, McEnroe said Laver was his idol and Sampras was the greatest grass-court player ever. But the American left-hander said Federer, who has won a record 16 Grand Slam titles, was the greatest of all.



McEnroe said Federer's ability to average two Grand Slam titles a year was "phenomenally consistent and amazing."

Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed


http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35315514/ns/sports-tennis/
 
I don't see how one can say who was better between Federer and Laver. The eras are too different. We have no idea how Laver would have done in today's era, nor do we know how Federer would have done in Laver's time in the 1960s.
 
But what about the h2h with Nadal?!

Ha ha, kidding, let's not go there again.

This is hardly any news from McEnroe, he's been saying it since about 2006!
 
But what about the h2h with Nadal?!

Ha ha, kidding, let's not go there again.

This is hardly any news from McEnroe, he's been saying it since about 2006!

McEnroe, has been saying that Federer is amongst the best of all time for years. But I think this is the first time that he's ever come out and said that Roger is the GOAT.
 
I don't see how one can say who was better between Federer and Laver. The eras are too different. We have no idea how Laver would have done in today's era, nor do we know how Federer would have done in Laver's time in the 1960s.

I'm sure the 31 year 5-7 Laver would of been a dominate force in today game, I dont know how anybody can even consider him for Goat Tennis back then was all armatures. He won all his GS after he was 31!!!
 
It's official, Chocolate wins out over all others as Best Flavor Ever. Vanilla, Strawberry and Coffee lovers all lined up yesterday in protest, but it's now been officially declared, so let it be known. Chocolate tastes best. And that's all folks.
 
yeah.. he had said it before but I dont think abut Laver.

I love Laver, lovely guy.. what a beautiful service motion, Still I believe he would be another Davydenko in today's game.

JMc is a free soul, he says it like it is, doesnt matter if the guy is Swedish or Swiss, It would with Wilander, or Borg.
 
I'm sure the 31 year 5-7 Laver would of been a dominate force in today game, I dont know how anybody can even consider him for Goat Tennis back then was all armatures. He won all his GS after he was 31!!!

Eh? Laver won his first slam at the 1960 Australian championships when he was 21. He won his 11th and last slam at the 1969 US Open at the age of 31.
 
What I want to know is why Borg is being left out of this Federer vs. Laver debate? Borg played at the Australian Open only once in his career, played his last slam at the age of 25 and still managed to win 11 slams in his career.
 
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What I want to know is why Borg is being left out of this Federer vs. Laver debate? Borg played at the Australian Open only once in his career, played his last slam at the age of 25 and still managed to win 11 slams in his career.

Not sure why Borg is low man on the totem poll either...I'd rank him equally with Laver (below Federer and above Sampras). The one thing that detracts from his legacy in my mind is that he never won the US Open, and after losing to McEnroe again in New York and suddenly at Wimbledon, he just gave up trying. Yes he was fighting against the organizers of the tour about his schedule, but to say the continuing losses to McEnroe didn't at least play a part isn't exactly accurate.

Before 2009, I had him and Laver and Federer basically equal (although I did tend to favor Borg and Federer over Rod), but Federer's refusal to give up on winning the FO and reclaim Wimbledon and the #1 spot inevitably put him at the top of my list.. and the more he continues playing, adding to his legacy, the greater the gap increases.
 
What I want to know is why Borg is being left out of this Federer vs. Laver debate? Borg played at the Australian Open only once in his career, played his last slam at the age of 25 and still managed to win 11 slams in his career.

You make excellent points about Borg. I leave him out because I can't imagine him having a chance, head to head, with Federer. I know, I know, different equipment makes for different technique, but even with wood, in their primes with one week of wood practice for Roger, I think Fed takes 8 out of 10 matches. Of course, what the hell do I know, but not being able to imagine Borg beating Roger removes him from consideration in my book.
 
He said it in zurich, switzerland so I am not sure if he was trying to please the crowd or being honest.
 
It's official, Chocolate wins out over all others as Best Flavor Ever. Vanilla, Strawberry and Coffee lovers all lined up yesterday in protest, but it's now been officially declared, so let it be known. Chocolate tastes best. And that's all folks.


Chocolate didn't quite have the competition as Vanilla. I gotta go with Vanilla - plus look at the sprinkles, much more variety and the cones were much stiffer back then. These newcomers, Strawberry, Coffee etc are one time wonders.
 
I don't see how one can say who was better between Federer and Laver. The eras are too different. We have no idea how Laver would have done in today's era, nor do we know how Federer would have done in Laver's time in the 1960s.

This argument is getting old. How about suggesting we have no idea how Laver would have done back in the early 1900s, or Crawford in late 1800s?

The point is tennis and any other sports doesn’t stay still, it moves on and it can only get better. Roger’s is quite capable of doing great in any past decade. To question if he’s isn’t a superior player over Laver is no different from questioning Michael Phelps’s superiority over Mark Spitz if he competes in the early 70s.
 
What I want to know is why Borg is being left out of this Federer vs. Laver debate? Borg played at the Australian Open only once in his career, played his last slam at the age of 25 and still managed to win 11 slams in his career.

It's the whole "quitter" thing.

It's like Federer quitting tennis after he lost the 2008 Wimbledon final to Nadal.
 
I like both Mc's. Pat was the only one from the well known experts, Cahill, Gilbert, who picked Rodge to win in Melbourne.
 
Watch this vid, 0300 to 0410 specifically,

Now do you realistically think Nadal can come back from that?

Rodge did, That's the GOAT, right there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYPLA2ZVRNc

Wow, that's one of the better tribute videos I've seen. I usually get tired of them after the first minute or so, but I watched this one in its entirety.

I wonder how much time Federer spends watching his tributes on Youtube.

...probably a lot, lol.
 
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Mcenroe also said this after Fed's French Open win, so, like some people mentioned, this isn't the first time Mcenroe has called Federer the outright GOAT.
 
Wow, that's one of the better tribute videos I've seen.

I wonder how much time Federer spends watching his tributes on Youtube.

...probably a lot, lol.

you wouldnt? theyre so epic, lol. i probably would watch a few, just to be like 'wow, i guess i'm a pretty good tennis player, no?' :twisted:
 
With Johnny Mac, he's had so many people on the GOAT list, you got to ask ... who's next?!
Amen. He's all over the place: has made a big deal about the H2H against Rafa. And talked up Pete's chances if he and Fed played in their primes.

But the big reason: he's the same guy who said Monfils would beat Fed at RG. JMac is great doing play by play - but his predictions and 'big picture' opinions are ridiculous.

Fed is the GOAT - but not because JMac says so - he's in full CYA, bandwagon hopping mode.

PS - I respect Laver - but at 5'7" he wouldn't get enough cheap points today, no matter what racket he used. Fed, with his movement and touch, would have been a beast on grass with a wood racket.
 
What I want to know is why Borg is being left out of this Federer vs. Laver debate? Borg played at the Australian Open only once in his career, played his last slam at the age of 25 and still managed to win 11 slams in his career.

Since he retired at only 26 once someone overtook him at the top rather than continuing to fight. Since he never won a U.S Open, an even more important event than the French which Pete never won. Since it was his choice to not play the Australian, and even if you roughly estimated 3 titles there he would be only tied with Pete. Then if one insists on counting unofficial Aussies one should now consider too he might have won 1 or more less French Open had Connors not been barred in 74 and avoided the event awhile thereafter, quite likely bringing him beneath 14 again. Borg is a legend of tennis of course, but he should and to most does rate behind Laver, Sampras, and Federer.
 
.... like we didnt know

updated 36 minutes ago
ZURICH - John McEnroe thinks Roger Federer is the best men's tennis player of all time.

McEnroe, also considered one of the game's greats, said Tuesday he ranks the Swiss star ahead of Rod Laver, the only man to win all four Grand Slam events in one year, and seven-time Wimbledon champion Pete Sampras.

Promoting an ATP Champions Tour event in Zurich, McEnroe said Laver was his idol and Sampras was the greatest grass-court player ever. But the American left-hander said Federer, who has won a record 16 Grand Slam titles, was the greatest of all.

McEnroe said Federer's ability to average two Grand Slam titles a year was "phenomenally consistent and amazing."

Copyright 2010 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed


http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/35315514/ns/sports-tennis/

Blah, blah, blah. Same old Mac, the latest and the greatest . . . this week.
 


“Roger is just the greatest player of all time,” he said. “He is the most beautiful player I’ve ever seen and I don’t ever get tired of watching him. Rod Laver is my idol, Pete Sampras is the greatest grass court player ever, but Roger is just the greatest player of all. I think we can all appreciate how incredible he is even more lately, because he’s shown a bit more emotion on court and he’s become a father so he seems a bit more human, more relatable. That makes what he’s doing seem even more amazing.”

McEnroe added that, of all Federer’s astonishing records and achievements in the sport, his run of reaching 23 consecutive Grand Slam semi-finals since Wimbledon 2003 is the most remarkable of them all.

“It’s difficult to pick out one of his achievements as the best because they’re all so incredible,” said McEnroe. “But I would probably say the 23 semis or better in a row is the best record of them all. There’s probably not another player in the top 20 who’s even played 23 straight majors (Grand Slam tournaments) in a row. Then throw in the fact that he got to 18 out of 19 finals and that he’s averaging two Grand Slam titles a year, it’s just phenomenally consistent. It’s amazing.”

Federer’s glittering career has included an intense rivalry with Spaniard Rafael Nadal, whom he has battled against in seven Grand Slam finals to-date. It is something McEnroe can relate to having been part of one of the most iconic sporting rivalries of all-time with Bjorn Borg.

“It’s unfortunate that Rafa is struggling with injury because his rivalry with Roger has become an incredible one, and rivalries are great for the sport,” said McEnroe. “I think at the moment Nadal’s injury is working to Roger’s benefit because he was able to take advantage of it at the French Open and dig deep to win that one. But at the same time I think it would be nice to think that Nadal could stick around for a couple of years and push Roger a bit because competition like that can push you that bit harder.”

At the age of 28 and having just won back his Australian Open crown – his 16th Grand Slam title, Federer shows no sign of relinquishing his grip on the Number One spot, but McEnroe acknowledged that nothing lasts forever.

“When you’ve won as much as he has you have to wonder how he will react when he starts losing regularly at major events – not reaching finals or semis. That’s not going to be easy for him. But, he seems to take great care of his body, the way he moves doesn’t put a lot of strain on the body so you would think he would be able to play at this top level a few more years. I hope so, because we are lucky to have him.”

McEnroe will begin his 2010 ATP Champions Tour campaign against Pat Rafter, Pat Cash and Mats Wilander at the new Delray Beach tournament, February 20-23, before competing in the inaugural BNP Paribas Zurich Open, March 9-13, against Goran Ivanisevic, Stefan Edberg and five other tennis champions.


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Yeah, I sometimes wonder about that myself. It's not going to be easy, not for him or his fans, so his reaction to that will be very improtant. Maybe if he goes below 3 he just quits, or would play a few tournaments other than the Majors.
 
The "Bleacher Report" is starting a series of articles, comparing Federer with 10 players. It looks pretty interesting. Check out Federer vs. Laver (the first of the ten part series, next up is Connors). This is well written with lots of details included as to several players, even in this first article of the series:

See: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...eer-in-light-of-lavers?utm_source=newsletter#

Dare to Compare? Rod Laver vs. Roger Federer
By TIM RUFFIN
Featured Columnist
Written on February 05, 2010
MELBOURNE, AUSTRALIA - FEBRUARY 01:
I come to you in the spirit of reason, and understanding. Fascinated by the constant debate over whether Roger Federer is the single greatest player of all-time or not, I have decided to examine the compare him to nine players who are also on that top level of all-time greats.
In the minds hearts and minds of millions of fans, Roger Federer is without peer. Federer is loved unconditionally, his dominance unquestioned and his humanity is often questioned. After-all, only a divine being, a son of the tennis god’s could do such things as he. Only a superior being could string together his run of Major finals and an even more ridiculous run of consecutive semifinal appearances.
If the people want to crown him, then let’s go ahead and crown him! Let us initiate the process of anointing Roger Federer the greatest tennis player of all time. But, before any coronation or inauguration, there must be a vetting process.
Numbers do not lie. They are constant and they are enduring. They are a traceable, quantifiable marker that can be used to substantiate any claim. But, while numerical statistics certainly have their role, we must not give in to the temptation to believe that they alone are capable of telling the whole story. Only the simplest mind would believe so. There are also intangibles to consider. Health, longevity, competition, heart and desire. All of these things factor into building a legend, a legacy.
Let’s meet the contenders. The ten players nearly universally agreed upon as the crème de la crème of the tennis world. To be fair, only player from the Open Era have been included. After-all, few have lived to see Bill Tilden or Don Budge play live. We honor their genius, but for the purposes of this exercise they will be excluded. The list looks like this: Laver, Connors, Borg, McEnroe, Lendl, Wilander, Becker, Agassi, Sampras, Federer .

The Maestro vs. The Rocket
Federer boasts 16 slam singles titles to Rod Laver’s 11. Federer enjoys 62 ATP titles, compared to 40 ATP wins for Laver. Both players have won all four majors. Federer has won four on four different surfaces, he is only the second man ever to do that (behind Agassi). Laver is the only player ever to have won the Calendar Slam twice, a feat that Federer has fallen shot by only one match in both 2006, and 2007 (both to Nadal). Both players have a career winning percentage of about 80%.
According to the ATP numbers, Federer has the edge. 16 is greater than 11, right? But wait, there’s more. After winning the calendar slam in 1962, Laver turned professional in 1963. As a pro, he faced the men considered to be the best players in the world at the time on the professional circuit. In these pre-open era days, only amateurs were permitted to compete in Grand Slam competition.
Therefore, Laver lost his Grand Slam eligibility during his best years from 1963-1968. However, during that span he managed to capture the Professional equivalent of Wimbledon, the Wembly Pro Championship (four times) and the U.S. Open, the U.S. Pro Championships (three times) as well as the French Pro Championship (one time). In these finals he defeated the likes of multiple slam winners Ken Rosewall, and Pancho Gonzales.
When the ATP was first established in 1973, Laver was already 34-years old. Despite his advanced age, he managed to win 40 events over the next six years (more than six titles a year from the age of 34 on). The 40 titles doesn’t tell half of Laver’s story. It is estimated that overall, the Australian won at least 198 events. Even more telling are his head to head records against his rivals. Laver’s greatest rival was the genius Ken Rosewall. Rosewall, an eight-time Grand Slam winner himself (plus 15 professional slams), won 33 of the pairs first 46 matches in 1963.
However, an older and more mature Laver turned the series around dramatically after that. Laver eventually went on to take over the overall head to head, 76-61. The Rocket also enjoyed a commanding 47-18 head to head edge against 12-time Major winner, Roy Emerson.
He also holds a 35-19 head-to-head lead over the older, but ever dangerous Pancho Gonzales, a two-time grand slam winner (with11 professional slams). Laver also enjoyed a dominant 37-16 head to head record against fellow Aussie and five-time grand slam winner, Lew Hoad (a man who stood 6’3 and nearly 200 pounds, Laver was 5’8” ).
All in all, Laver was the player of the 1960’s. If he’d been allowed to play the Majors from 1963 to 1968, he would have amassed a total 19 grand slam singles titles. Okay, the argument will always arise that the players from the 1960’s played three out of four Majors on grass. This is a true, somewhat valid argument. But to counter, answer this: which is an easier transition? Moving from fast grass, to hard courts? Or making the move from slow red clay to grass?
The latter has been proven tougher over and over again. Recently only Borg, Nadal, and Federer have accomplished this. Laver and Rosewall did this consistently . One must also not allow themselves to be duped into thinking that Laver never played on hard-courts. In fact, he won many tournaments on hard-courts even though the U.S. and Australian Open’s simply were not contested on hard court surfaces during his time.
Not to be outdone, Federer has a sterling resume of his own. Let's compare streaks. Federer won five consecutive Wimbledons and six consecutive U.S. Open finals (five titles). Rare air, no doubt. However, for anyone to claim that such a feat has never been approached before is slightly misleading. Laver won four consecutive U.S. Professional championships starting in 1966 at a time when the competition on the pro circut was far stiffer than at the Grand Slams.
Laver also won Wimbledon all three times he played it during the 1960’s (1962, 1968, 1969), as well as the Wembly Professional championships three times during his leave from the Grand Slams. This adds up to six titles in a ten year span.
Federer has set new marks in both grand slam final appearances (22) and consecutive semifinals appearances (23). Laver appeared in 17 grand slam finals with a record of 11-6, compared to Federer’s 16-6. But add in Laver’s professional “slam” finals record and the more realistic record is 19-12, with 31 finals appearances.
In essence, Roger frequently appears in Majors finals and has really only been stopped by a six-time slam winner, predominately on clay. Laver did the losing primarily on clay, to an eight-time slam winner and 23-time Major championship winner.
In examining the competition, a lot of the story can be told. Federer has benefited from modern physical training methods, racquet technology and footwear. However, at the same time, Roger has had to deal with a much deeper field. From #100 right on up to the very top (we’ll say #8 or #10) the competition is as strong as its ever been. Players are stronger and much more dangerous in the early rounds of tournaments.
Federer must receive special consideration for wading through the masses of potential upsets with alarming regularity. But for every pro, there is a con. At the business end of the big events, Roger has successfully faced a three- time or greater grand slam champion only six times. If we dig deeper, and see that his first victim was a 30-year old Pete Sampras who was well past his prime in 2001(only a year from retirement). Additionally, another three wins came over a 34+ year old Andre Agassi, who was forced out of the game by back problem.
Federer is left with exactly two grand slam victories over players who have serious grand slam credentials. Not so with Rod Laver. Laver’s Grand Slam final victories read like a who’s who of tennis legends. There were thee Finals victories over Roy Emerson, as well as wins over Neale Frasier, Ken Rosewall, John Newcombe and Tony Roche. Now those may not be names that ring a bell to the modern ear, but they were without question at the very top of the sport in their own era.
Laver’s battles with Rosewall are comparable to Federer’s wars with Nadal. Rosewall was the premier clay court player of the 1960’s. Laver lost four French Pro Championships and one French Open Final to Rosewall, as he, like Federer, had the experience of having to play a clay court genius during his career. The difference is that Rosewall’s dominance over Laver never extended past the clay.
Despite the fact that Rosewall himself was a very accomplished fast court player, probably second only to Laver during the 1960’s, Laver had the edge on the grass and hard courts. Federer has had no such luck, losing five of seven Majors finals to his greatest rival, including relinquishing his beloved Wimbledon title and a Major hard court loss at the Australian Open.
The major difference here is that Rosewall and Laver had an entire career of back and forth in their rivalry. But in the end, Laver came out the better. Federer currently trails Nadal 7-13 all time, but more notable, 2-6 in Grand Slam play. In all fairness, both Federer and Nadal are in their 20’s and should have many more opportunities to square off. Federer will have his chance to bridge the gap.
 
ARTICLE FROM BLEACHER REPORT CITED ABOVE CONTINUED

If we take a deep look at the past, how can we so quickly brush aside the accomplishments of it’s champions? For every John McEnroe and Pete Sampras who proclaim Roger Federer to be the Greatest of All Time, there are/were another generation who cries foul. Take long-time tennis journalist Bud Collins and multiple Grand Slam winner, Jack Kramer.
Both have actually lived long enough to see everyone who played from the Open era to now. While they have dubbed Federer one of the best that they have ever seen, they stop short of calling him the single greatest. It depends a lot on what era a person is coming from.
But how foolish would it be for a person, relatively new to the sport to attempt to proclaim that they know beyond the shadow of a doubt that this man, Roger Federer is the greatest ever, when they themselves have never seen the legends of yesterday perform?
At the end of the day, while Roger Federer’s choke hold on the sport seems unrepeatable, remember that the same things have been said about several other players. Bill Tilden in the 1920’s, Don Budge in the 1940’s, Rod Laver in the 1960’s and Pete Sampras in the 1990’s. Similar runs of dominance have happened before. They will happen again. The difficulty of declaring one player greater than the rest is beyond description.
For instance, if we go by Major Championships alone the Ken Rosewall has 23 Majors (8 grand slams, 15 pro slams) Laver sits second with 19 (11 grand slams, 8 pro slams) Federer is third on the list with 16 (all Grand Slams). Keep in mind that the Grand Slams were not as lucrative, or valued prior to 1968.
And while the pro slams had a much smaller field, they were comprised of all marquee players. There was no such thing as a second round upset of a top seed by a player ranked in the 1950’s. There was no playing your way into form. Players needed to ready to go with their best stuff from the start.
Players can only play in their own eras. Critics can only judge them based on what they have done in their own time. How then can it be said beyond the shadow of a doubt, that Federer is greater than Laver, or vice versa, for that matter?
 
^^^^

Indeed, a well written article.

I just dont include Laver in the Open era. He was the greatest of his own time.
 
McEnroe is one of the most fickle analysts out there. He is on a new bandwagon every week it seems. Federer backers and detractors alike are best to not use him as any reliable source of your argument.
 
Since he retired at only 26 once someone overtook him at the top rather than continuing to fight. Since he never won a U.S Open, an even more important event than the French which Pete never won. Since it was his choice to not play the Australian, and even if you roughly estimated 3 titles there he would be only tied with Pete. Then if one insists on counting unofficial Aussies one should now consider too he might have won 1 or more less French Open had Connors not been barred in 74 and avoided the event awhile thereafter, quite likely bringing him beneath 14 again. Borg is a legend of tennis of course, but he should and to most does rate behind Laver, Sampras, and Federer.
borg not winning USO is not at all the same as sampras not winning RG.


borg did not have a surface weakness. sampras did.

sampras won 3 clay titles.
borg won 9 on hard and 20 on carpet.

borg made the finals of USO 4 times, 3 times on hard. sampras never made the finals of RG.


borg was a more dominant player than sampras.
 
McEnroe is clueless, just for going with this hype. There is no greatest of all time. There are so many contenders etc. and tennis is a complicated sport. All I'm sure of is that Evgeny Korolev isn't the greatest of all time.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Laver, after winning a pro-slam or a grand slam, automatically play in the finals of that championship ? In other words, no earlier rounds, just straight to the finals ?

I think I read something to that effect. I could be wrong.
 
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This debate about GOAT has nothing to do with who would win today. Obviously a tiny Rod Laver would get smashed by Fed today, but that's not the point is it?

Sergei Bubka kept breaking the world pole vault record over a course of more than 10 years. If someone then breaks the record, does that make them the GOAT? Of course not.

Fed is the GOAT, but not because he could smash Laver.
 
This debate about GOAT has nothing to do with who would win today. Obviously a tiny Rod Laver would get smashed by Fed today, but that's not the point is it?

Sergei Bubka kept breaking the world pole vault record over a course of more than 10 years. If someone then breaks the record, does that make them the GOAT? Of course not.

Fed is the GOAT, but not because he could smash Laver.

Obviously a tiny Laver would get "smashed" by a tiny Rod Laver? Equalizing for technology, I'm certainly not sure of that AT ALL. Laver "smashed" Lew Hoad quite often, who was quite a bit bigger than Federer didn't he? I know Hoad was inconsistent, but when he played his beast, he was known to be a very tough player to overcome, so I think you are making a big assumption as to Laver not being able to compete with Federer, or anyone else, given his size.

Watch Hoad, Olmedo, McKay, and Gonzales with OLD technology here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XTR8z5kjWc


First of all Federer's swingpath (especially on the forehand) would look very different with wood and Laver's game would be quite different with modern frames. So, I think the better answer is that we don't know what the results would be.
 
^^No, Laver was not only playing those "challenge matches" in the Finals of major tournaments.

The "challenge round" matches were something that went by the wayside in the early 20th century, say roughly 1920 or so (decades obviously before Laver was competing).

See the "challenge round" used at both the US Open and Wimbledon. The US Open stopped doing that in roughly 1915, and I believe Wimbledon stopped it a few years later.

So, by the 1960's Laver was typically fighting through several very tough opponents just to reach the finals of "major championships". Read a synopsis on him here:

See: http://www.tennisfame.com/famer.aspx?pgID=867&hof_id=191


Many talk of how Laver was ONLY 5' 7", but see this excerpt from the site above:

Few champions have been as devastating and dominant as Laver was as amateur and pro during the 1960s. An incessant attacker, he was nevertheless a complete player who glowed in backcourt ad at the net. Laver's 5-foot-81/2, 145 pound body seemed to dangle from a massive left arm that belonged to a gorilla, an arm with which he bludgeoned the ball and was able to impart ferocious topspin. Although others had used topspin, Laver may have inspired a wave of heavy-hitting topspin practitioners of the 1970s such as Bjorn Borg and Guillermo Vilas. The stroke became basic after Laver.
 
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Most modern players are over 6 foot. It would be a miracle if a tiny Laver could compete.

However, assuming he was born in the Federer era with better nutrition and same height, then I guess he could compete.

I guess it comes back to Laver's argument that all you can say is that you are the best of your era.
 
Well Laver is said to have been over 5' 8" in the article above. Plus, if he was born in this era, he would have likely have been bigger anyway, right?

In addition, guys like Davydenko and Santoro compete quite fiercely even at a small stature, and they are not the players Laver was. Hasn't Davydenko been able to compete at 5' 10" just fine?

Also see the women's Tour today, where many very small players routinely beat tall, less coordinated players. Greater height does not automatically translate into wins, especially when the smaller player is more skilled, quicker, and faster. Yet, if someone is fairly tall, without losing any speed/quickness, and stamina, then that is to his/her advantage. Yet, it's just one component of the matchup with another opponent. See Karlovic, Isner, and many others for example. Why do they not dominate the top 10?

This has been the case since the dawn of Tennis, but on average we have seen a uptick in height. I'm not at all convinced that we'll see lots of players that are say about 6'4" dominating in the decades to come. It's possible, but they'll need very good lateral movement, as well as the quickness/speed of their smaller opponents. Plus, injuries and stamina are concerns as well. For example, just look at how hard Del Potro has to work to pull his 6' 6" frame around the court over a 5 set match and long GS Tournaments. If "tall players" can't do that in the long term, they'll continue to lose often to small players. So, we may see top players, say in the 6 foot to 6' 2" range for quite a long time.
 
I agree with JMac.

One major point was how Fed makes it the finals so often.
Another point.
Sampras and Borg have GS's on only 2 surfaces as well as Laver, not Laver's fault but all 3 candidates are a surface short of Fed.

From now on any GOAT candidate needs to have 3 surfaces and a good number of GS's.

There's too many obvious holes in the other GOAT candidates, but this should be enough for now.
 
I've had enough of this fair-weather frivolity..JMac may have been a great player, but he isnt the greatest observer of the game..Only 2 years ago, post W2008, JMac said he didnt believe Federer could go past 12 GS titles..
:-?
 
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Laver, after winning a pro-slam or a grand slam, automatically play in the finals of that championship ? In other words, no earlier rounds, just straight to the finals ?

I think I read something to that effect. I could be wrong.
No, this was the winner challenge-round system in play at Wimbledon until 1920 and at the US championships until 1911.

Last year's champion only had to play one match, against the winner of all the challengers, to win and remain the champion.

Laver played approximately 40 years later.
 
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