AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
Agreed. I hope he can. I fear Sinner has only been inviting him to practice so much recently to gain a mental edge because he sees draper as a true potential threat.
Jack Draper will win Wimbledon 2025
- Thread starter dking68
- Start date
Musterrific
Hall of Fame
Sinner is wise to be wary of this guy. Jack definitely has the game to trouble him.
That’s too devious.
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
Wouldn’t be even close to the first and it won’t be the last.
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
i don’t think draper knew, it’s even arguable from the slow mo replay. video review should’ve been used. regardless, most have moved past this and draper would’ve won anyway. i highly doubt that he will never win a slam, unless he suffers from injury.
ChrisJR3264
Hall of Fame
I mean - he did just make a clay court M1000 final when clay isn’t nor hasn’t been his best surface. He’s now in the top 5 with more points to gain in Rome and RG.
dking68
G.O.A.T.
He will make the top 4 by Wimbledon. Fritz is not performing well these days. So it’s very possible he plays his first slam F at Wimbledon this year.
Airspun
Hall of Fame
Of course he knew
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
okay. ive been in the same situation and didnt before. but if you wanna believe he knew that's okay.
messiahrobins
Legend
Definitely and more than one as well.
ChrisJR3264
Hall of Fame
At 4 we will either draw sinner or Carlos in SF if zverev fails to defend Rome and RG final.
Carlos should make it to the final at RG and defend 60% of the points.
dking68
G.O.A.T.
I said very possible, not that it will necessarily happen. I can see him beating Sinneraz at W though. After all, he’s the only person along with Medvedev who has beaten the two of them on grass atm.
Rosstour
Talk Tennis Guru
That's how Djoko got in Carlos' head
ChrisJR3264
Hall of Fame
Djoko beat sinner in 22 and 23.
Grass season is so short you have to factor in the last 2 years or so.
We’ll see. The first week of Wimbledon the court speed is faster until about R4.
dking68
G.O.A.T.
Who has won the last 3 matchups and won the last 2 slams? Means nothing. Zverev beat Sinner at USO 23’ and look how he mauled him at AO 25’
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
he specifically gave his reasoning behind this. the fact that grass season is so short (and let’s be honest, quite a foreign surface for most of the tour).
ChrisJR3264
Hall of Fame
Thank you.
Some people lack comprehension.
Airspun
Hall of Fame
It’s obvious he knew watch the tape
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
i’ve watched it several times and watched it live. i live in cinci and was watching it live as well. even after video replay it’s still hard to tell. has nothing to do with his game at this point though. I believe the only frame you can share shows the racket touching the ball and the ball touching the court at the same time. just watched the tape again. it appears as if the ball touched the racquet and the court at the exact same time, even with slow mo footage, which is a legal shot, no? I don't believe there is a frame that shows the ball hitting the racquet before it hits the ground (or after), if you can find this frame i'd love to see it. If something is too close to call at 60 FPS slow mo replay than I don't think it's that crazy for it to go either way. Regardless this has no bearing on his game or play at this point. If it makes you not want to root for draper I understand that. But frankly, that's not even what this thread is about.
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Airspun
Hall of Fame
any good player or pro can feel exactly when the ball hits the court/frame and double bounce quite easily. stop defeneding him
Rosstour
Talk Tennis Guru
He didn't cheat intentionally
Sinner didn't dope intentionally
I have friends who argue 88 didn't exterminate the whoooooos intentionally
It's an insane thought process that constantly fixes blame outside the individual
canta_Brian
Hall of Fame
How would you know?
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
show me the frame which shows the ball hitting the racquet before it hits the ground
Rosstour
Talk Tennis Guru
We did this already
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
Vincent-C
Legend
Vincent-C
Legend
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Nah, the 90’s born just sucked on the surface
ChrisJR3264
Hall of Fame
Picking sinner to win a grand slam isn’t ground breaking.
No_Kwan_Do
Semi-Pro
I'm still not sure about Draper at Wimbledon, or about his cardiovascular fitness over 5 set matches in general right now.
He got bounced out by Norrie last year in straights. Yes, that Cameron Norrie, who's won a handful of matches over the last 18 months. A QF/SF run would be fantastic for him this year.
His form over the last couple of months tells me the game is absolutely there, but it's whether his body will allow him to sustain the level required to win slams over multiple Bo5 matches.
He got bounced out by Norrie last year in straights. Yes, that Cameron Norrie, who's won a handful of matches over the last 18 months. A QF/SF run would be fantastic for him this year.
His form over the last couple of months tells me the game is absolutely there, but it's whether his body will allow him to sustain the level required to win slams over multiple Bo5 matches.
I'm not sure either. I like his game but there's nothing about the way he plays that is what I consider grass court style. He's got a loopy forehand, is a bit of a grinder and isn't really a very spontaneous creative player. I think he will generally have better results on hard and even clay.
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
loopy forehand? him and sinner have a very similar backswing and swing path and he hits it faster and higher rpm than sinner as well.
Rosstour
Talk Tennis Guru
Maybe he's referring to a big swing
I'm not sold on Draper as The Guy yet, and definitely not at Wimbledon
Think of the tricksters who've done well at Wimbledon....my dark horse pick for a deep run there into the teeth of the Novakcarlosinner meatgrinder is Bublik
He has all the tools you need for grass and is playing well. If Kyrgios can run to a Final, why not Bublik
The backswing is similar but the swing path is completely different. Sinner swings straight through his forehand while Draper frequently whips up, like a slightly shortened version of Nadal's forehand. The depth on his forehand has improved a lot but they can still fall short often
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
very similar imo. regardless draper still hits a faster and higher rpm ball.
Don't disagree with you here but isn't it pretty clear that sinner's forehand is more compact and that he hits a much cleaner forehand? These 2 qualities are very important on grass
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
in what are you referring to when you say compact? after the contact point? because up until then they almost look the same.
Vincent-C
Legend
Draper's FH looks quite a bit like Rune's to me. Effective for now, but..
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
Vincent-C
Legend
The elbow is too far away from the body in both cases, and the swing overall looks contrived and unnatural.
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
idk, my entire time playing tennis, the club coaches/pros always have said to not keep the elbow tucked too close to the body. him and sinner both appear to be on bevel 4.5. so either could be done. Rune definitely has a much straighter arm than draper though. I do agree sinner has a more bent arm tucked elbow though.
Dropshot777
Semi-Pro
Fair, but does WImbledon 2022 really count?
Rosstour
Talk Tennis Guru
Why doesn't it? Because Rafa pulled out with an injury?
Dropshot777
Semi-Pro
No Medvedev, Rublev, Khachanov, etc. any of those would have had a good shot at Kyrgios.
"too close" is the key term. It doesn't mean you should have the elbows close to the ear. Tommy Paul is an example of having the elbow too high. He does that because he needs his arm to generate power due to not using his legs and hips to generate enough power. The initial take back of Sinner and Draper are similar but then the swing is completely different. When Sinner begins his swing forward, his racquet is pointed at about a 90 degree angle (to the side), and then he swings forward and through. Draper's racquet is pointed forward when he's ready to swing forward, so while his body and shoulders are starting the move forward, his racquet is actually moving back before snapping forward. That's pretty much the reason why Sinner hits a much cleaner ball.
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I don't think they look similar but I agree that both of their forehands may not hold up against the top players because of the flicking/snapping motion at the end of the forehand shot.
AndrewUtz
Hall of Fame
watching slow mo videos, both are pointed at a 90 degree angle right before forward racquet acceleration starts. I’ve attached images of the moment right before both start accelerating the racquet forward. In this instance it appears draper is the more coiled one as well, perhaps one reason why he’s able to generate more power and spin than sinner. If it’s specifically about a clean shot as well, Korda has them both beat, but that’s not necessarily what this is about.
I know this video. It's not a secret. Screenshots don't show the moment that draper starts his forward swing so your evidence is unconvincing. Besides, you notice that Sinner's weight is on his back foot, meaning he's already coming forward? Draper's weight is on his front foot, meaning his weight is actually moving back at that point. The timing of their strokes is quite different. Your point about Korda doesn't make any real point. Korda hits clean but lacks power, racquet head speed and isn't all that accurate on the forehand. The point is the better baseline hits both hard and accurate and does it consistently. Draper's swing causes him to have a less consistent contact point and ultimately affects his accuracy. It's not like his forehand is bad but I'd take Sinner's over his easily. None of your theoretical arguments matter unless you're really arguing that you'd take Draper's forehand over Sinners, which would cause most experts and TW members to disagree with you.watching slow mo videos, both are pointed at a 90 degree angle right before forward racquet acceleration starts. I’ve attached images of the moment right before both start accelerating the racquet forward. In this instance it appears draper is the more coiled one as well, perhaps one reason why he’s able to generate more power and spin than sinner. If it’s specifically about a clean shot as well, Korda has them both beat, but that’s not necessarily what this is about.
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