Jeff Salzenstein Total Tennis

J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
TimothyO said:
Never said there's anything wrong with making a living or marketing. Please don't put words in my mouth.

In the first two videos that I viewed the entire front end was a sales pitch which was a big turn off for me. The ratio of self promotion to value was so bad I had no interest in shelling out cash.

Recommendation: if you're truly serious about this then do the following. Instead of trying to start a forum flame war along with Torres think about my feedback as a prospective customer and know that it's very likely you never heard from many people like me. They saw the hard sell and moved on without providing you feedback. Positive or negative the most valuable prospects a business person has are those who engage you. They provide additional reference points and course corrections.

The worst are the silent ones.

Conduct yourself as a serious business person. This is a public forum. When faced with negative feedback the best course is usually to think first and respond later. And usually the best response is, "Thanks for your valuable feedback, I'll certainly think about it" and leave it at that, no matter how you really feel.

A sself-destructive and rather immature course of action is to misleadingly ascribe comments to a prospective customer.
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Definitely your feedback is welcome and encouraged. we will always work to get better for players and coaches out there. However, I feel it is more than fair to respectably disagree with an opinion and have an open and honest discussion about it. We hope you will check out what we have to offer if you are interested in improving your tennis. Plenty of free content at the blog.
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
sureshs said:
Great chance for me to clarify a basic doubt after watching the video - is the kick/second serve finish on the same side of the body or not? Yes or no only please.
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the finish can be on both sides of the body...the same side finish is a good drill to practice as long as you don't feel pain in the shoulder.
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
sureshs said:
That may be true for businesses in general when faced with negative comments on yelp for example, but I would rather see a tennis coach, especially a former pro, get passionate and angry when criticized on a tennis forum, rather than doling out robot-like responses. Leave that to the faceless big corporations.
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I agree, no anger on this end..juts interested in having an open discussion with valid opinions to consider form all all angles.
 
goober

goober

Legend
kiteboard said:
What? Tour players are the only ones with real cred. They are the ones who know how to play the best, not the couch psych businessmen like fyb. That kid is a potato. Connors is not good with people, and he sucks on camera, and Jeff is and does not. Go to a top ranked junior and ask any of them if they would rather take lessons from Jeff of fyb. Rec. players make up 99% of the world, is true, and that's a fact, and they if taught from day one to play well would play well.
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Real cred for what? For playing the best- YES. For teaching rec players? Highly doubtful.

Just to make it clear, I am NOT comparing Jeff to FYB. I am disputing the notion that being a tour player instantly translates to being a great teacher. Have you seen Henin explain how to hit backhands or Roddick talk about his serve? Roddick basically said he doesn't know how he ended up with his serve, and that he just basically went out one day and did it after being frustrated with his serve. Do you really think that he would add much to a 3.5 player struggling with his serve?

If you took a group of average rec players 3.0-4.0 level with all kinds of mechanical problems and strokes grooved with bad technique and you gave them 6 months with a top ATP player or 6 months with a teaching pro who has spent his whole career working with rec players correcting their deficiencies, who do you think would be better off at the end of the 6 months?
 
arche3

arche3

Banned
sureshs said:
I am trying to remember how I finish and I can't! I need to remember to check it the next time.
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I have a sneaking suspicion I change my serve stance from platform to pinpoint randomly. And some days I just suck. I can't remember how I was coached as a kid. I'm not sure which one I grew up using! Over 20 years away from tennis does that to a person .
 
S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
goober said:
Roddick basically said he doesn't know how he ended up with his serve, and that he just basically went out one day and did it after being frustrated with his serve. Do you really think that he would add much to a 3.5 player struggling with his serve?
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Not now, but after he is retired and if he is coaching, yes.

I think there is a lot to learn by just watching these people up close and combining it with whatever they may have to say.

The USPTA exempts pro players from taking the coaching exam. Why? In fact, it was news when Taylor Dent refused to take the exemption and insisted on taking the exam.
 
S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
arche3 said:
I have a sneaking suspicion I change my serve stance from platform to pinpoint randomly. And some days I just suck. I can't remember how I was coached as a kid. I'm not sure which one I grew up using! Over 20 years away from tennis does that to a person .
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That is another thing. I suspect I am halfway between the two stances (dragging my right foot a little)
 
arche3

arche3

Banned
sureshs said:
That is another thing. I suspect I am halfway between the two stances (dragging my right foot a little)
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If I had a full time coach now I'd own adult league lol. If even to just tell me hey you change your foot position every other serve.
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
Power Player said:
I disagree with TimO. The Internet is about transparency. I have my own web business that I have made successful because I am really good at what I do, and I respond very fast to my clients.

I also turn down business when I feel the time invested is not worth the money being made.

I too give free advice and tips and this allowed me to build a network among other reasons.

My point is that Jeff is doing you a favor by responding, especially if you factor in the argument that he needs to "think like a businessman". If he did that, he would not even acknowledge you as a potential consumer and you would receive an email with a template response.

Business has and will change on the web. It has evolved into much more transparency, and the old model in many ways is dead.
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Power Player, very good take here. It's all about being transparent!
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
SystemicAnomaly said:
Sorry, there is no simple Yes/No answer here. Some elite players finish on the same side of the body. Probably more of the current players finish across the body. The "dirty diaper" drill is not supposed to be a complete follow-thru. It is a drill that emphasizes a part of the follow-thru (just after contact).
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I agree with this explanation. The dirty diaper is a drill to learn a new skill
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
Nostradamus said:
Jeff, are you planning on adding short segment on how to read your opponent and anticipating your opponent's shots ? i think this is especially important when playing big servers and big hitters in general. Thanks in advance, my friend.
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Hmmm, good question. Can you be much more specific with your question. There are many ways to go here.
 
S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
arche3 said:
Nothing wrong in terms of visuals. It is a mental thing for me. Its the same reason a lot stores have sales of $18.00 It mentally looks like a bargain . But 20 does not. $21.00 looks like a bargain.

I'm nuts obviously.
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You can pay him $21 if you want :)
 
Cheetah

Cheetah

Hall of Fame
how about $19.99?

I'm going to join jeff's site to show my support because I like what he's doing and how he goes about it.
 
arche3

arche3

Banned
Cheetah said:
how about $19.99?

I'm going to join jeff's site to show my support because I like what he's doing and how he goes about it.
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I'm joining too. His free videos tell you actually everything. But just cuts out. The instruction is there. But the very end of video is left out. I'm dying to see the last 30 seconds.
 
T

Torres

Banned
Cheetah said:
how long are the actual subscribed videos?
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They vary depending on what's involved. But I don't think its the length of the video that is important - its the usefulness of the content, the quality of the instruction, and whether you can take something away from easily it that has some application to your tennis.

Obviously, you don't want something too short, but equally you don't want something too long either because it becomes tedious and the message gets muddled.

You want him to convey the concept clearly, demonstrate it perhaps a couple of times, perhaps from a couple of different angles where necessary (I like the fact he takes time in the course to flip the videos so that he has a 'righty' swing, since most players are right handed), and then you want to be able to get out on the court and get a feel for whatever it is that he's suggesting.

Have a look at the suggested shuffle step for the 1HB. You don't need a long video for that because he gets to the point straight away:

http://www.jeffsalzensteintennis.com/1-hand-backhand-tennis-footwork/
 
S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Torres said:
They vary depending on what's involved. But I don't think its the length of the video that is important - its the usefulness of the content, the quality of the instruction, and whether you can take something away from easily it that has some application to your tennis.

Obviously, you don't want something too short, but equally you don't want something too long either because it becomes tedious and the message gets muddled.

You want him to convey the concept clearly, demonstrate it perhaps a couple of times, perhaps from a couple of different angles where necessary (I like the fact he takes time in the course to flip the videos so that he has a 'righty' swing, since most players are right handed), and then you want to be able to get out on the court and get a feel for whatever it is that he's suggesting.

Have a look at the suggested shuffle step for the 1HB. You don't need a long video for that because he gets to the point straight away:

http://www.jeffsalzensteintennis.com/1-hand-backhand-tennis-footwork/
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I see what arche3 was saying about the video being cut off for non-subscribers.

It was a great video though, and though I have seen Federer do the big shuffle many times, I never realized how advantageous it was to him on the BH.
 
Cheetah

Cheetah

Hall of Fame
Torres said:
They vary depending on what's involved. But I don't think its the length of the video that is important - its the usefulness of the content, the quality of the instruction, and whether you can take something away from easily it that has some application to your tennis.

Obviously, you don't want something too short, but equally you don't want something too long either because it becomes tedious and the message gets muddled.

You want him to convey the concept clearly, demonstrate it perhaps a couple of times, perhaps from a couple of different angles where necessary (I like the fact he takes time in the course to flip the videos so that he has a 'righty' swing, since most players are right handed), and then you want to be able to get out on the court and get a feel for whatever it is that he's suggesting.

Have a look at the suggested shuffle step for the 1HB. You don't need a long video for that because he gets to the point straight away:

http://www.jeffsalzensteintennis.com/1-hand-backhand-tennis-footwork/
Click to expand...

That was an excellent video.
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
goober said:
Real cred for what? For playing the best- YES. For teaching rec players? Highly doubtful.

Just to make it clear, I am NOT comparing Jeff to FYB. I am disputing the notion that being a tour player instantly translates to being a great teacher. Have you seen Henin explain how to hit backhands or Roddick talk about his serve? Roddick basically said he doesn't know how he ended up with his serve, and that he just basically went out one day and did it after being frustrated with his serve. Do you really think that he would add much to a 3.5 player struggling with his serve?

If you took a group of average rec players 3.0-4.0 level with all kinds of mechanical problems and strokes grooved with bad technique and you gave them 6 months with a top ATP player or 6 months with a teaching pro who has spent his whole career working with rec players correcting their deficiencies, who do you think would be better off at the end of the 6 months?
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Goober, you are right...it's one thing to be a great player. It's quite another to be able to teach players of all levels. I am doing my best to teach players of all levels by being a true student of the game.
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
Torres said:
They vary depending on what's involved. But I don't think its the length of the video that is important - its the usefulness of the content, the quality of the instruction, and whether you can take something away from easily it that has some application to your tennis.

Obviously, you don't want something too short, but equally you don't want something too long either because it becomes tedious and the message gets muddled.

You want him to convey the concept clearly, demonstrate it perhaps a couple of times, perhaps from a couple of different angles where necessary (I like the fact he takes time in the course to flip the videos so that he has a 'righty' swing, since most players are right handed), and then you want to be able to get out on the court and get a feel for whatever it is that he's suggesting.

Have a look at the suggested shuffle step for the 1HB. You don't need a long video for that because he gets to the point straight away:

http://www.jeffsalzensteintennis.com/1-hand-backhand-tennis-footwork/
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Awesome take, Torres! Really appreciate your perspective.
 
J

Jeff Salzenstein

New User
sureshs said:
I see what arche3 was saying about the video being cut off for non-subscribers.

It was a great video though, and though I have seen Federer do the big shuffle many times, I never realized how advantageous it was to him on the BH.
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Yes, this footwork is huge for Federer.
 
Cheetah

Cheetah

Hall of Fame
Jeff,

I just tried your 1hbh shuffle footwork method you described in that last video. It works! Fantastic! I was surprised at how much court i could cover with just a couple of steps that way. And it really helps me get good preparation for the execution of the shot. It's less work than what i was doing before and feels more natural when i start the takeback; Kind of like how it feels when i'm just shadow swinging at home. I'm going to work on incorporating this for sure. That's worth the $19.95 right there.

Great stuff. Keep up the good work. I'll be joining your site this weekend.

Thanks.
 
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onehandbh

onehandbh

G.O.A.T.
The shuffle step is interesting. Not sure what I do on my 1HBH. I'll try and
pay attention the next time I play to see if it makes it easier to cover ground
quickly and judge the ball.

Oscar Wegner sent me a video on footwork. In part of it, he actually
advocates the exact opposite. He recommends a sort of walking step, where
you walk (or jog/run as needed) to the ball. His philosophy seems to be more
hand-based and less legs/torso based.

Do you think the shuffle step allows you to move quicker to the ball
or is the main advantage being able to keep both eyes on the ball?
In your video you mentioned that turning sideways and running towards
the ball makes it harder to keep both eyes on the ball. What if you turned
(to make running easier) but kept your upper body angled towards the net
as you run and only turned your shoulder (coiled) as the ball got closer?
 
1HBH Rocks

1HBH Rocks

Semi-Pro
Jeff Salzenstein said:
Hi Larry, I strongly disagree that I am just another pro trying to make a buck. I get a lot of satisfaction out of helping tennis players get solutions to their games and I am committed to being the best coach I can be. Being able to make a good living doing something you love is a great thing.
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I am not trying to be mean or something, but just claiming that you don't fit his depiction isn't peculiarly efficient, nor sensible... A saying goes that the Devil would be telling you he's not himself if you would ask him and, likewise, all criminals in jails are innocents: you can't just come up with a claim -- you need something to support your contention.

But I do agree that the accusation is a little too far gone... he could suppose that you do not have interesting material, that your courses are bad or any other comment he might have, but he can't just out of this infer that you willingly provide nonsense just so you make a few more bucks.

As for my opinion, you already read it somewhere else: I don't give coaches any credit unless they can tell me why they're right when they advise something. Your videos, you told us, are meant to be short and to the point as you are trying to please a certain market, but being this way, they can't be trusted on their own...

EDIT
I've just seen your backhand footwork video and there was finally a few sensible justifications. So long as your videos do that, even if it's short, you're at least showing things other people often overlook. It seems you've changed a tad the way you bring up issues and tips which is a good thing.
 
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1HBH Rocks

1HBH Rocks

Semi-Pro
I've been stressing the importance of justifying claims... well, here is a video footage of the 2004 Australian Open Finals. Very clear footage, by the way.

In this point, Federer hits a forehand before having to cover half the court to hit a backhand. He splits, shuffle and steps like Jeff demonstrated in his video. Later i nthe same point, he uses the same footwork pattern to hit a slice backhand.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=oZSivo7JPco#t=36s
 
1HBH Rocks

1HBH Rocks

Semi-Pro
sureshs said:
So .......... Jeff was right? What is the problem then?
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The problem was that in earlier videos he hardly ever explained the reasoning behind his tips. In this video, he at least goes through a little more details and shows that he has more to bring than the more common brand of instructional videos.

It's that you can't just take someone's word for anything... and we need more than someone who has been there doing it to show us that his stuff is good. There was a lack, but not in that case.
 
Cheetah

Cheetah

Hall of Fame
so if we take a lesson from a coach in person should we demand that they bring videos of a top 10 pro utilizing the exact technique being taught to establish the credibility of each lesson?
 
1

10sLifer

New User
Yeah that was weird. My site tennistruth.com has more of a substance intro than that! And I'm an amateur!


onehandbh said:
It's impossible to tell from his website. He has a 10 minute
video with just him talking about how awesome his training is and that you
just have to sign up. Sure he played on the ATP, but I have no idea
what his teachings will be like b/c he offers *NO* samples or much
insight to his approach, etc. He spends 10 minutes trying to pitch people to
join his INNER CIRCLE, but what will you actually be getting?
No idea. Just that he wants people to pay $9.95 a month.
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