Jim Courier on TC : Alcaraz is like Federer, Sinner is like Djokovic.. they will enthrall for years.

In the Majors Nadal broke the Djokovic FH down and it was how at the Slams Nadal dominated the rivalry. Outside the slams it wasnt the FH that damaged Nadal ,it was the Novak BH that utterly destroyed Nadal's FH CC.
Against Federer it was the Novak BH CCthat did alot of damage as those BH to BH contests always went the way of Novak.
Against Alcaraz the points you make about the Novak FH are bang on as he has spotted that Alcaraz's FH is vulnerable if he has no time and Novak absolutely creams the FH to FH rallies to get the short ball to attack. He does the same to Sinner but Sinner actually hits a much bigger ball than Alcaraz so he is harder to overpower.
Going 1-4 in AO and Wimbledon, which are Djokovic's 2 best Slams and where he won 70% of his Slams, isn't dominating the rivalry in Slams. Nadal leads the Slam rivalry because he beat Djokovic 8 times on his own turf where he is on average a much better player than Djokovic. The only match where I can say Djokovic's forehand really broke down against Nadal was that 2013 USO match. He had a total collapse at the end of the 3rd set and his game fell apart. In 2020 RG, he had a terrible day and his whole game was off in those 1st two sets.

Djokovic hurts Nadal on both wings but it's definitely the forehand that does the most damage, which is the case in all their recent hardcourt meetings. Federer was too smart to get into too many topspin backhand to backhand exchanges with Djokovic which is why he used his slice against him so well, especially on grass, to go to that wing and try to get him to hit a loose shot where he could attack with his forehand and approach the net.

Alcaraz's forehand can be more vulnerable on faster surfaces so we agree here but Sinner is much better on those surfaces; he's become so good now on med to faster hardcourts and his shot tolerance is so high, he's harder to deal with on that surface.
 
Federer was not razzle dazzle flashy at all, he was grace and efficient attacking tennis. Alcaraz is more Nadal-like than Federer.
Nadal's game is about extracting/forcing errors from his opponents with weight of his shots (FH in particular) and angles he's able to create thanks to his top/side spin, Alcaraz likes to go for his shots and hit winners and thus has a more offensive mindset. So I would say he's more similar to Fed in general.
 
Going 1-4 in AO and Wimbledon, which are Djokovic's 2 best Slams and where he won 70% of his Slams, isn't dominating the rivalry in Slams. Nadal leads the Slam rivalry because he beat Djokovic 8 times on his own turf where he is on average a much better player than Djokovic. The only match where I can say Djokovic's forehand really broke down against Nadal was that 2013 USO match. He had a total collapse at the end of the 3rd set and his game fell apart. In 2020 RG, he had a terrible day and his whole game was off in those 1st two sets.

Djokovic hurts Nadal on both wings but it's definitely the forehand that does the most damage, which is the case in all their recent hardcourt meetings. Federer was too smart to get into too many topspin backhand to backhand exchanges with Djokovic which is why he used his slice against him so well, especially on grass, to go to that wing and try to get him to hit a loose shot where he could attack with his forehand and approach the net.

Alcaraz's forehand can be more vulnerable on faster surfaces so we agree here but Sinner is much better on those surfaces; he's become so good now on med to faster hardcourts and his shot tolerance is so high, he's harder to deal with on that surface.
Nadal leads Djokovic 2-1 at the USO in finals, it is hugely significant. 2010 and 2013 Nadal broke the Novak FH down just as he repeatedly did at RG.

I take your point about Djokovic dominating Nadal at AO and W, we agree here but for different reasons. It wasnt the Djokovic FH that did the damage, it was the BH. That CC BH to Nadal's FH at the AO and W was devastating and got so many shortballs midcourt Novak then could use his FH to put easy shortballs away, but it was the BH that did the damage. Rafa couldnt damage Novak's FH on low bouncing courts in the same way as he could on higher bouncing courts just like he struggled to hurt Roger's BH on lower bouncing courts.
Courier actually did make a good point comparing Sinner to Djokovic as they are very similar actually. Sinner has a vulnerabilty on the fH if the ball gets up on him, we saw it most noticeably v Alcaraz at IW. Im going off topic here, but Alcaraz got lucky Sinner got ill at Wimbledon as i am certain but for the sickness bug he got he would have beat Medvedev and Alcaraz. Grass is going to suit Sinner
 
Nadal leads Djokovic 2-1 at the USO in finals, it is hugely significant. 2010 and 2013 Nadal broke the Novak FH down just as he repeatedly did at RG.

I take your point about Djokovic dominating Nadal at AO and W, we agree here but for different reasons. It wasnt the Djokovic FH that did the damage, it was the BH. That CC BH to Nadal's FH at the AO and W was devastating and got so many shortballs midcourt Novak then could use his FH to put easy shortballs away, but it was the BH that did the damage. Rafa couldnt damage Novak's FH on low bouncing courts in the same way as he could on higher bouncing courts just like he struggled to hurt Roger's BH on lower bouncing courts.
Courier actually did make a good point comparing Sinner to Djokovic as they are very similar actually. Sinner has a vulnerabilty on the fH if the ball gets up on him, we saw it most noticeably v Alcaraz at IW. Im going off topic here, but Alcaraz got lucky Sinner got ill at Wimbledon as i am certain but for the sickness bug he got he would have beat Medvedev and Alcaraz. Grass is going to suit Sinner
Nadal was a far better player in 2010 than Djokovic was at that time, who hadn't had a top 10 win until he beat Federer at the USO. He won because he was the better player not because Djokovic's forehand broke down. Djokovic is one of the most technically sound baseliners ever off both wings, like Agassi, and his strokes don't break down except on a rare occassion like in that 2013 USO match where he made a ton of errors.

In pretty much of all of their recent matches, Djokovic makes more forehand winners than backhand winners. In recent years, Djokovic makes more errors on that backhand side so it's really the forehand which has been his kill shot. In their 2021 RG match, Djokovic hit way more forehand winners than backhand winners, while he made half the errors on the forehand than he did on the backhand. I'm not saying the crosscourt backhand to Nadal's forehand hasn't caused damage, but just not as much damage as the forehand crosscourt to Nadal's backhand. I think we just disagree on that.

Sinner is not great on clay or in IW, where the ball jumps up high. He's only been to an IW SF once while Djokovic won it 5 times in his prime. Djokovic doesn't have a vulnerability on that side or with ball height in the same way which is why he was better on clay and IW at the age Sinner is now.
 
Nadal leads Djokovic 2-1 at the USO in finals, it is hugely significant. 2010 and 2013 Nadal broke the Novak FH down just as he repeatedly did at RG.

I take your point about Djokovic dominating Nadal at AO and W, we agree here but for different reasons. It wasnt the Djokovic FH that did the damage, it was the BH. That CC BH to Nadal's FH at the AO and W was devastating and got so many shortballs midcourt Novak then could use his FH to put easy shortballs away, but it was the BH that did the damage. Rafa couldnt damage Novak's FH on low bouncing courts in the same way as he could on higher bouncing courts just like he struggled to hurt Roger's BH on lower bouncing courts.
Courier actually did make a good point comparing Sinner to Djokovic as they are very similar actually. Sinner has a vulnerabilty on the fH if the ball gets up on him, we saw it most noticeably v Alcaraz at IW. Im going off topic here, but Alcaraz got lucky Sinner got ill at Wimbledon as i am certain but for the sickness bug he got he would have beat Medvedev and Alcaraz. Grass is going to suit Sinner
Nothing of value can be drawn from citing a 2-1 h2h record, especially when one of those matches was against a slumping young Novak who hadn't made a slam final in 3 years and was still trying to unlearn Todd Martin's service motion that led to him serving more doubles than aces for an entire season.
 
Sinner is not great on clay or in IW, where the ball jumps up high. He's only been to an IW SF once while Djokovic won it 5 times in his prime. Djokovic doesn't have a vulnerability on that side or with ball height in the same way which is why he was better on clay and IW at the age Sinner is now.

You might want to check your stats on Sinner's record at Indian Wells.

Sinner has an 11-4 record at IW, with two 4th rounds and two semifinals (the past two years where he has lost to Alcaraz in three set battles) in the four times he's played there. IW has the grittiest and slowest hard courts on the tour, which are the closest to clay as you can get on that surface. Jannik plays well there and will likely win that event eventually. Also, standing at 6' 4", he has no problem with high balls on either his backhand or forehand. If not for Alcaraz, Sinner would probably have won a title there already.

Additionally, to note, while fast hard courts are clearly Sinner's best surface, I wouldn't say he's not good on clay. He has a career 54-22 record on clay, with one title (Umag win over Alcaraz) and made the French semifinals this year (losing in 5 sets to Alcaraz). With his groundies, if he can stay healthy, he'll have a decent chance to win the Roland Garros title sometime in next 5 to 10 years.
 
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You might want to check your stats on Sinner's record at Indian Wells.

Sinner has an 11-4 record at IW, with two 4th rounds and two semifinals (the past two years where he has lost to Alcaraz in three set battles) in the four times he's played there. IW has the grittiest and slowest hard courts on the tour, which are the closest to clay as you can get on that surface. Jannik plays well there and will likely win that event eventually. Also, standing at 6' 4", he has no problem with high balls on either his backhand or forehand. If not for Alcaraz, Sinner would probably already have a title there already.

Also, to note, while fast hard courts are clearly Sinner's best surface, I wouldn't say he's not good on clay. He has a career 54-22 record on clay, with one title (Umag win over Alcaraz) and made the French semifinals this year (losing in 5 sets to Alcaraz). With his groundies, if he can stay healthy, he'll have a decent chance to win the Roland Garros sometime in next 5 to 10 years.
Jannik
Sucks

Nole

Rules
 
You might want to check your stats on Sinner's record at Indian Wells.

Sinner has an 11-4 record at IW, with two 4th rounds and two semifinals (the past two years where he has lost to Alcaraz in three set battles) in the four times he's played there. IW has the grittiest and slowest hard courts on the tour, which are the closest to clay as you can get on that surface. Jannik plays well there and will likely win that event eventually. Also, standing at 6' 4", he has no problem with high balls on either his backhand or forehand. If not for Alcaraz, Sinner would probably already have a title there already.

Also, to note, while fast hard courts are clearly Sinner's best surface, I wouldn't say he's not good on clay. He has a career 54-22 record on clay, with one title (Umag win over Alcaraz) and made the French semifinals this year (losing in 5 sets to Alcaraz). With his groundies, if he can stay healthy, he'll have a decent chance to win the Roland Garros sometime in next 5 to 10 years.
I made a mistake there so my bad. He's made 2 IW SF's but has a 73% win percentage, which is not bad but not exactly great. At his age, Djokovic was at 80% at IW and had already won it and been to another final. He also only has 1 title on clay so far while Djokovic at his age had 4, including a Rome title. So this is what I meant. Again, Sinner is doing ok though and he is improving on those surfaces as his results this year show.
 
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Djokovic has Olympics gold that's 1 tournament win. Jannik 4 and djokovic 1.

The Olympics are not an ATP event and award no ranking points.

Now, I agree that the gold medal is historically important and a capstone in Nole's career. He may care more about having won that medal than anything else he does in 2024 or the rest of his career.

That said, he technically has not won a pro tournament this year and 2024 is a very, very subpar year for him so far.

So 2024 = Sinner > Nole. :)
 
I made a mistake there so my bad. He's made 2 IW SF's but has a 73% win percentage, which is not bad but exactly great. At his age, Djokovic was at 80% at IW and had already won it and been to another final. He also only has 1 title on clay so far while Djokovic at his age had 4, including a Rome title. So this is what I meant. Again, Sinner is doing ok though and he is improving on those surfaces as his results this year show.

We actually might be in agreement on this subject.

Djokovic is clearly the greatest tennis player of all time. Sinner will never match or exceed the career accomplishments of Nole.

However, I believe there are similarities between the game styles of Sinner and Djokovic, particularly with their stroke production and competitive drive. Djokovic will always be a better player historically, but it's complimentary to compare Sinner's strengths to the GOAT and say that Jannik could be the adversary to Alcaraz like Nole has been to Fed, which will likely be the rivalry that has people's interest for the next decade (assuming both Sinner and Alcaraz can stay healthy).
 
We actually might be in agreement on this subject.

Djokovic is clearly the greatest tennis player of all time. Sinner will never match or exceed the career accomplishments of Nole.

However, I believe there are similarities between the game styles of Sinner and Djokovic, particularly with their stroke production and competitive drive. Djokovic will always be a better player historically, but it's complimentary to compare Sinner's strengths to the GOAT and say that Jannik could be the adversary to Alcaraz like Nole has been to Fed, which will likely be the rivalry that has people's interest for the next decade (assuming both Sinner and Alcaraz can stay healthy).

Yeah, except the analogy is flawed in too many ways

Sinner is almost two years older than Alcaraz, whereas Nole was six years younger than Fed and really started feasting once Fed turned 30+

Yet Sinner is three Slams behind Alcaraz, and hasn't shown us that he can win on clay or grass yet. Sinner won't be the younger guy crashing the party, which is what Djoko was.

When Sinner is "Wimbledon 2008 age" Alcaraz will be 25...it's really a stretch for me to imagine Sinner catching fire and winning five-six Slams in the next two years
 
We actually might be in agreement on this subject.

Djokovic is clearly the greatest tennis player of all time. Sinner will never match or exceed the career accomplishments of Nole.

However, I believe there are similarities between the game styles of Sinner and Djokovic, particularly with their stroke production and competitive drive. Djokovic will always be a better player historically, but it's complimentary to compare Sinner's strengths to the GOAT and say that Jannik could be the adversary to Alcaraz like Nole has been to Fed, which will likely be the rivalry that has people's interest for the next decade (assuming both Sinner and Alcaraz can stay healthy).
I think Sinner is a player who is technically sound on both wings and dangerous on both wings like Djokovic so yea they are similar in that way. They play with different degrees of spin though. Sinner hits flatter and Djokovic uses more spin. And yea Sinner has a lot of potential and ATG potential with his skills.
 
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The Olympics are not an ATP event and award no ranking points.

Now, I agree that the gold medal is historically important and a capstone in Nole's career. He may care more about having won that medal than anything else he does in 2024 or the rest of his career.

That said, he technically has not won a pro tournament this year and 2024 is a very, very subpar year for him so far.

So 2024 = Sinner > Nole. :)
He won the Olympics and that counts as a tournament win and it's a very, very subpar year? Definitely not since Wimbledon and he got the title he wanted most this year. Definitely not a very subpar year to win the Olympics, make the Wimbledon final and AO SF.
Yeah, except the analogy is flawed in too many ways

Sinner is almost two years older than Alcaraz, whereas Nole was six years younger than Fed and really started feasting once Fed turned 30+

Yet Sinner is three Slams behind Alcaraz, and hasn't shown us that he can win on clay or grass yet. Sinner won't be the younger guy crashing the party, which is what Djoko was.

When Sinner is "Wimbledon 2008 age" Alcaraz will be 25...it's really a stretch for me to imagine Sinner catching fire and winning five-six Slams in the next two years
Sinner can win on grass and he will win Wimbledon imo. Clay will be trickier for him.
 
He won the Olympics and that counts as a tournament win and it's a very, very subpar year? Definitely not since Wimbledon and he got the title he wanted most this year. Definitely not a very subpar year to win the Olympics, make the Wimbledon final and AO SF.

It's a subpar year by Djokovic standards. After all, Nole was just a couple games away from winning the calendar slam last season!

For 99% of the rest of the ATP, they'd love to have Djokovic's 2024 results. However, Nole is currently in 7th place in the Race to Turin standings, and if he doesn't have a great US Open and autumn season, it's possible he could miss the World Tour Finals for the first time in a long time.
 
Nole is the best in the world in 2023. Sinner is flash in pan , he is young of course he has many titles this year. He will not be Nole.
 
It's a subpar year by Djokovic standards. After all, Nole was just a couple games away from winning the calendar slam last season!

For 99% of the rest of the ATP, they'd love to have Djokovic's 2024 results. However, Nole is currently in 7th place in the Race to Turin standings, and if he doesn't have a great US Open and autumn season, it's possible he could miss the World Tour Finals for the first time in a long time.
Not his best season by any means but it just got a whole lot better after his last 2 tournaments.

Not that big of a deal. He was 6th in the race after Wimbledon so he dropped back 1 place after skipping Cincy. There's 4000 points up for grabs in his next 3 tournaments and the only way I see him not making the cut for ATP Finals is if he gets injured and has to skip tournaments.
 
Not his best season by any means but it just got a whole lot better after his last 2 tournaments.

Not that big of a deal. He was 6th in the race after Wimbledon so he dropped back 1 place after skipping Cincy. There's 4000 points up for grabs in his next 3 tournaments and the only way I see him not making the cut for ATP Finals is if he gets injured and has to skip tournaments.
Djokovic is near his finish line it doesn't matter if he finished 10th if he wins just USOpen and OG
Sinner is newbie his title count does not do anything for me
 
USO is most important for Djokovic right now, yes. He's not chasing the top ranking anymore and nothing left to prove.
We nolefams do not worry about ranking scenarios at all. he skipped all masters this year. He played og which gives 0 pts

The average nolefam knows where his priorities lie.
Coming back to original pt, nole won 5 IW titles, Sinner will have a lot of trouble coming close to him on gritty hard court
 
Holy sht you people have lost the plot. How can Alcaraz be  most like Federer when he doesn't have a 1 handed backhand? Do you all have eyes?

Alcaraz is known most for his physicality and speed, like Nadal. Nobody is talking about how graceful or composed he is like Federer.

It's not that complicated. What's next, you morons are going to start saying Djokovic is just like Wawrinka because they both can dominate with their backhands?
 
Holy sht you people have lost the plot. How can Alcaraz be  most like Federer when he doesn't have a 1 handed backhand? Do you all have eyes?

Alcaraz is known most for his physicality and speed, like Nadal. Nobody is talking about how graceful or composed he is like Federer.

It's not that complicated. What's next, you morons are going to start saying Djokovic is just like Wawrinka because they both can dominate with their backhands?
Exactly

Dude Federer used to take ball inside court on return many a times

This Nadal copy stands 15 feet back.

Just because he hits with less patience than rafa doesn't mean he is Federer copy.
 
Holy sht you people have lost the plot. How can Alcaraz be  most like Federer when he doesn't have a 1 handed backhand? Do you all have eyes?

Alcaraz is known most for his physicality and speed, like Nadal. Nobody is talking about how graceful or composed he is like Federer.

It's not that complicated. What's next, you morons are going to start saying Djokovic is just like Wawrinka because they both can dominate with their backhands?

I believe that Courier is mostly referencing rivalries here. We're all getting caught up in things like their ages, stroke styles, personalities, and other physical attributes. The fact is that Djokovic, Fed, Nadal, Sinner, and Alcaraz are all unique and distinctive people... one of a kind the each of them.

If Courier had said Sinner and Alcaraz are going to be the...

Borg and McEnroe...
McEnroe and Lendl...
Edberg and Becker...
Sampras and Agassi...

...of the next 10 years, would that have made more sense?

He chose Djokovic and Fed because that is a more contemporary and recent rivalry that people would understand. Plus, I do think there are simularities to how Sinner hits the ball and how he approaches winning in comparison to Nole. And Alcaraz, despite playing a different style of tennis, does hit spectacular shots like Fed and generates a similar sense of excitement about the game, even among casual fans. For example, when Alcaraz won Wimbledon last year, I had a buddy of mine who doesn't even play tennis call me up to say how exciting "that new kid from Spain" was after the final. He had just been channel surfing and got caught up in the match on television. Also, when I ask kids at the club who their favorite tennis player is, most of the time the answer is Alcaraz... which is similar to the way it was with Fed (or Nadal) 15 to 20 years ago.
 
I believe that Courier is mostly referencing rivalries here. We're all getting caught up in things like their ages, stroke styles, personalities, and other physical attributes. The fact is that Djokovic, Fed, Nadal, Sinner, and Alcaraz are all unique and distinctive people... one of a kind the each of them.

If Courier had said Sinner and Alcaraz are going to be the...

Borg and McEnroe...
McEnroe and Lendl...
Edberg and Becker...
Sampras and Agassi...

...of the next 10 years, would that have made more sense?

He chose Djokovic and Fed because that is a more contemporary and recent rivalry that people would understand. Plus, I do think there are simularities to how Sinner hits the ball and how he approaches winning in comparison to Nole. And Alcaraz, despite playing a different style of tennis, does hit spectacular shots like Fed and generates a similar sense of excitement about the game, even among casual fans. For example, when Alcaraz won Wimbledon last year, I had a buddy of mine who doesn't even play tennis call me up to say how exciting "that new kid from Spain" was after the final. He had just been channel surfing and got caught up in the match on television. Also, when I ask kids at the club who their favorite tennis player is, most of the time the answer is Alcaraz... which is similar to the way it was with Fed (or Nadal) 15 to 20 years ago.
Sinner is copy of Djokovic. Cheaper version though. Less movement but more power.

Its Carlos which majority of conversation is about.
 
Nothing of value can be drawn from citing a 2-1 h2h record, especially when one of those matches was against a slumping young Novak who hadn't made a slam final in 3 years and was still trying to unlearn Todd Martin's service motion that led to him serving more doubles than aces for an entire season.
Hang on lol. This the same Djokovic who beat Federer in the semis? And was world no.3 at the time?
 
i think if you say for a GOAT candidate this is true, but for just ATG i would say Wilander definitely, Newcombe sorta, and Emerson and Courier depending on your definition of ATG
Who is the guy from the past who reminds you the most of Nadal?

I can find binaries of almost everyone, but Rafa is just such a statistical outlier.
 
Jim Courier says whenever we speak high of Alcaraz, Sinner also needs to be in conversation.

Brett Haber points out that Alcaraz is separating himself from the rest with 4 majors to 1.

Courier agrees with that but says Sinner has been solid and the level he has shown after USO 23 has been top .

Courier then likens Alcaraz to Federer and Sinner to Djokovic, stating they will enthrall audience for years. He says Alcaraz is known for the razzle dazzle, flashy, wow breathtaking style of tennis and
Sinner Just solid like Djokovic

This is during TC coverage during the Alcaraz-Monfils 3R Cinci match 2024.

Nice to see Courier not giving up on Sinner

No ****ing way anyone with a 2 handed backhand could ever be compared to being Federer-like.
 
Jim Courier says whenever we speak high of Alcaraz, Sinner also needs to be in conversation.

Brett Haber points out that Alcaraz is separating himself from the rest with 4 majors to 1.

Courier agrees with that but says Sinner has been solid and the level he has shown after USO 23 has been top .

Courier then likens Alcaraz to Federer and Sinner to Djokovic, stating they will enthrall audience for years. He says Alcaraz is known for the razzle dazzle, flashy, wow breathtaking style of tennis and
Sinner Just solid like Djokovic

This is during TC coverage during the Alcaraz-Monfils 3R Cinci match 2024.

Nice to see Courier not giving up on Sinner
Jim Courier is lying out of his butthole.
 
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