Kick Serve v/s TopSpin Serve -- Different?

Failed

Semi-Pro
Yes, they are different. Topspin has nearly 6 to 12 spin on where as a kicker has 8 to 2 spin on it. This view is kinda biased because its impossible to hit a "pure" topspin shot. Topspin serve dives in and bounces high forward where as a kicker breaks to right and high.

Just as a bonus the difference between the kicker and the twist is that twist curves left before it breaks even more sharply than the kicker to the right.

To hit a topspin shot you must throw the ball a little behind your head so that it would slide across your neck if you didn't hit it. When hitting a kicker the same you throw the ball a little more behind as well but you also throw it a little more left as well. This is just to give the ball the little side spin component that makes it break left.

This is a subject that you can easily ruin your credibility in so I just stuck my feet into deep sheisse.
 
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kelz

Professional
Is there a difference between Kick Serve and TopSpin Serve?
What are the keys to each?
Topspin
Key: Hitting ball from bottom to top
Effect: Ball bounces higher

Kick
Key: Hitting ball diagonally
Effect: Moves to the right after bounce.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
Unfortunately, the term, kick serve, is somewhat ambiguous. Its use by the tennis community is not consistent throughout. It is often used to refer to any heavy topspin serve. Some people will use the phrase kick serve and the phrase twist serve to mean the same thing. However, many others, myself included, prefer to classify the twist serve as a specific type of kick serve. We consider 2 primary types of kick serves -- the twist kick serve & the topspin kick serve.

Refer to the following pages for a discussion of this:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serve_(tennis)#Types_of_serve

OperationDoubles.com/spindoctoringserve.htm#axisrotation
www.OperationDoubles.com/spin_serve_tennis.htm

.
 
D

Deleted member 25923

Guest
Yes, I agree with Systematic Anomaly and oneguy, the terms are ambiguous. It's good to let people know what you're asking about.
 

LuckyR

Legend
The posts on a few threads on this board prove that these words mean different things to different people.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
A kick serve can be three different types of serves: topspin, topspin slice, or twist.
I suppose that even this is possible. Kathy Krajco of Op Doubles had actually considered the twist to be a special (twisted) variation of the topspin-slice serve. It could be that the twist has a much stronger spiral (z-axis) spin than the average topspin-slice serve. It seems to me that there could quite a few variations (infinite?) between a "pure" topspin kick serve and an extreme side-bouncing twist serve. The 2 designations that I use, topspin & twist kicks, are more of a general classification.
 

rk_sports

Hall of Fame
Thanks guys for the responses..

Yes, they are different. Topspin has nearly 6 to 12 spin on where as a kicker has 8 to 2 spin on it.
Topspin
Key: Hitting ball from bottom to top
Effect: Ball bounces higher

Kick
Key: Hitting ball diagonally
Effect: Moves to the right after bounce.
Failed, Kelz -
It seems that this page (not saying its the ultimate authority on the subejct) seems to show what you say as 'Kick' serve as 'topspin-slice serve'
http://www.operationdoubles.com/spindoctoringserve.htm#axisrotation

A kick serve can be three different types of serves: topspin, topspin slice, or twist.
What is the key to these?
Topspin: 12
Topspin Slice: 1 or 2 ?
Twist: 7 or 8 ?

SystemicAnomaly - thanks mate for the links
 

kelz

Professional
I'm Australian.. so the terms I use are Australian. Americans may have alternative definitions.
 

LeeD

Bionic Poster
Kickers.....
Twisted, topped, or sliced.
Twisted bounces opposite the curving arc of the ball thru the air.
Sliced and topped bounces with the curve of the ball thru the air.
Mostly twist to go high and away from backhands, but sometimes can surprise forehands too.
All are really variations of topspun second serves, but can be used anytime.
 

In D Zone

Hall of Fame
one thing I noticed from the opponents I've played(pulbic courts). More players have seen and knows how to attack a kick serve. And when I change it to a topspin serve, most of them either missed it or just got spooked on how the ball behaves. They saw the serve coming in (loopy) and when it bounce it just kick straight at them.

I guessed not alot of players uses the topspin serve.
 

Gundam

Semi-Pro
when I change it to a topspin serve, most of them either missed it or just got spooked on how the ball behaves. They saw the serve coming in (loopy) and when it bounce it just kick straight at them.

I guessed not alot of players uses the topspin serve.
\

Isn't it Twist Kick serve = Kick straight at them :confused:? Kind of similar to Lefty serve for righty receiver.

I like this definition : Twist and Top spin serve both kick. Main difference happens after the bounce.

<prefer to classify the twist serve as a specific type of kick serve. We consider 2 primary types of kick serves -- the twist kick serve & the topspin kick serve>
 

10nistennis

Rookie
\

Isn't it Twist Kick serve = Kick straight at them :confused:? Kind of similar to Lefty serve for righty receiver.

I like this definition : Twist and Top spin serve both kick. Main difference happens after the bounce.

<prefer to classify the twist serve as a specific type of kick serve. We consider 2 primary types of kick serves -- the twist kick serve & the topspin kick serve>
Twist serves curve left in the air when hit, and when it lands, it kicks more horizontally to the right than a normal kick serve.

Kick serves curve left in the air when hit, and when it lands, it kicks diagonally.

Topspin serves curve a little bit in the air when hit, and when it lands, it kicks vertically, with maybe a chance of kicking a bit to the right, depending on how you hit it.
 

sh@de

Hall of Fame
It's so ambiguous. The way I see it is that kick = any serve with heavy topspin, of which there are three types: topspin slice, topspin, and twist.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
^ I'll accept this description & classification of kick serves. However, even these classifications are general, not absolute. For instance, a twist serve with a relatively mild spiral spin component might easily be indistinguishable from a topspin kick serve. There is a near-infinite possibilities between these kick serve archetypes. Likewise, a topspin kick serve with a very mild sidespin component might still be considered a topspin kick serve, while a serve with a little bit more of a sidespin component might be referred to as a topspin-slice kick serve. Again, there can be a continuum of possibilities between these 2 basic archetytpes.
 
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