Kicker+S&V combo and chip nd charge

[Larrysümmers]

who all here uses this combo a lot, and any tips for someone who is a Endburg wanna-be
I used this in a match in a tournament side draw and I had a lot of fun with it and it worked better than flat serve s&v. I want to use this and maybe even use it for my wain serving weapon

Also
any chip and charge tips?
Thanks

Larry

 

[GetBetterer]

(Kick) Serve & Volley is deemed still a very strong weapon. The kick makes it difficult to return - if they return it (but sadly it's slow speed means they usually will) and their struggled off-balance shot to get the ball back in play makes it easy to put away with a volley.

I don't remember who, but I think somebody on these forums (or they linked an article) recommended to still serve and volley with a Kick serve for the reason I gave above, so someone else gave the better answer. ^_^

Larrysümmers:

Also
any chip and charge tips?

What do you mean by this? The best example I could give is to do a semi-drop shot, semi-slice on it so the ball is closer to you, and your opponent has to get drawn up to it.

Slice it away from your opponent so he has to struggle to get it, and 99% of the time, struggled balls become cross-court shots, so staying in the middle of the net is usually your best bet.

Try slicing to their backhand. This list is in order of priority, so if their forehand is the shot farthest away from their (i.e. you're a righty facing a lefty or vice versa), hit it away from them still. Otherwise, if they have great court positioning, go to their backhand side, usually it's a weaker shot but I've seen some deadly backhands in my time, so know your opponent.

 

[Nellie]

I like to S&V off of the kick serve because it gives me another fraction of a second to get closer to the net - sometimes, on a flat serve, the return will be screaming back before I get done with the follow-through.

I prefer to go down the middle a lot - unless I am playing someone who chips every return because the higher ball (from the kick server) allows for more angles on the return. If the person is chipping the return, I will go to the backhand every time because that slice ball will not dip to my feet, which is a supper hard volley when you are changing forward.

 

[LeeD]

I prefer the kick mostly to use as a variety weapon, to give them that shoulder high bounce, while my normal second serve bounces upper chest, and flat serves maybe belly button heights.
The chip is also the variety, to be bounced about mid shin heights so they have to hit up for their passes. Any normal topspin approach is not effective (in my feeble mind) because it resembles the bounce of normal groundies.
And when you play S/V, better to play chip and charge on defense, to keep your groundie oriented opponent from getting into his groove. Shorten the points, and your opponent is out of sorts. Lengthen them, he gets into his hitting groove.

 

[thebuffman]

i remember the announcers were discussing this during a john isner match. on some of isner's point contructions he would set people up with a big kick serve. the announcers were explaining how this gives him time to get to a comfortable position while closing the net. they explained that his flat bomb actually takes time away from him and forces him to play from the baseline (when they return it).

 

[jdawgg]

If I notice someone moving back to hit my kick serve so they dont have to take it at the peak of its height, then I'll usually throw in a serve in volley (generally only when I'm up in the game though because I'm not a hugely confident s&v player). It's a really great play for me -- wins me a lot of easy points. When they're far back it just gives you so much time and so many angles to work with.

I think a lot of people move back because they see me as a baseliner and get comfortable. I remember a match where I hardly ever came into net until the 3rd set tiebreak where I came in on like every point, totally changed it up on the guy and won it easily LOL.

 

[LuckyR]

who all here uses this combo a lot, and any tips for someone who is a Endburg wanna-be
I used this in a match in a tournament side draw and I had a lot of fun with it and it worked better than flat serve s&v. I want to use this and maybe even use it for my wain serving weapon

Also
any chip and charge tips?
Thanks

Larry

If you S&V off of a flat serve you are likely to get weaker returns but you won't be able to get beyond first volley position, so if the returner gets used to your serve and can hit one well, you will be at a disadvantage.

If you S&V off of kicker serves and the other guy has classic strokes and is too stubborn to back up and take the serve deeper, then you will likely clean his clock since you could get to second volley position if you have the wheels and he won't be able to punish your serve. However, if he backs up or charges your serve it could be a very different story, though you do have the advantage of more time to get into a better position.

On the other hand if he has modern strokes, he may be able to tee off on your kicker and you could be in for a long day as the advantage tips towards him.

As to the chip and charge, if he has a modern game and you are a good chipper, he may cough up balls for you to feast on (if he has trouble with low, short balls). If he has a classic game, your approaches had better be of high quality since a lot of guys can hit great passes off of both sides, while running off of lower balls.

 

[Larrysümmers]

Thanks everyone.
My big thing is time. On the flat serve I barley make it to the service line. But the kicker I can get to the middle. I've been watching a lot of Stefan Edberg and watching how he comes to net and where he places his volleys after the serve.

 

[fuzz nation]

Yep, every forward step you gain toward the net behind a decent serve is gold when you S&V. Good spin serves will take lots of crazy bounces, which will force many weak returns. That's usually a better option when trying to get forward compared with only taking a step or two behind your heater and having to fish the ball out of your socks. Smart returners will simply punch that flat serve to a spot that will give you more trouble as a net rusher.

The common denominator for a good chip 'n charge return is to place the ball deep. Even if your shot is right at the server, it will put him (or her) on their heels and usually force a less offensive second shot. I've taken some time to analyze the success of chip and charging returners and so much of it rides on the depth of that return. It doesn't hurt if you can also force the server to take a few steps to reel in your ball, but I'd say that this is priority #2 for a C&C attack.

Remember too, that when you can follow a slice to the net, your opponent will typically be hitting a lower ball. Harder for them to generate an offensive reply from down low, plus it's a slower flying ball (the slice) and should give you time for an extra step or so toward the net.

 

[Turbo]

I'd say kick serves are a good idea, but it depends on your opponent and your placement. If I hit a flat serve that has pretty good location, they will not usually hit a strong reply, and S&V would work. If they have trouble with high balls then kick serves are a good idea. Also, the topspin helps you to get more 1st serves in, which is a big advantage.

However, I love shoulder high forehands. Usually I can tell by their toss if it's a kick serve, so I will move over and crush the high forehand. So against good opponents/returners, kick serves won't work if you either hit it too soft or don't put enough location on it.