Klippermate help - One Piece Stringing

[ertorque]

Hi guys, soon-to-be KM owner here and am trying to learn the basics of stringing before the machine arrives.
I think two piece stringing (TPS) is quite easy to understand from what I gather from this forum and also from Klippermate's own video. What's troubling me is with one piece stringing (OPS). Without going into ATW, my questions is about the clamping of the 1st cross when the last main from the long side makes the main-cross transition.
The KM video demonstrates the TPS. Beginning with a starting knot the 1st cross is laced to make the 2nd cross and then the 2nd cross is pulled (which also pulls the 1st cross via the grommet). Then clamp at 2nd and 1st cross nearest to frame and tension head.

My findings so far reveals the following:

1) KM when asked this question says that the pulling of 2nd cross is also applicable to OPS ie the string goes from last main to 1st cross then to 2nd cross and then only tensioned ( pull at 2nd cross).

2) Posts from this forum says that it is okay to use the flying clamps to clamp at the 1st cross while putting a dummy string on the second groove of the clamp. Here is the post,

The Meat, Sep 26, 2012Report
↑
my main concern is about when clamping when starting the first cross. The flying clamp doesn't have an anchor string to hold it on.
Don't worry about it. As long as you clamp down the first cross, the flying clamps on the Gamma Progression 200 should get stuck in between the mains and it should hold tension.

|||x|x|x|x||||||||||||||| <----------Mains
--------------------- <----------1st cross.
|||x|x|x|x|||||||||||||||

The x is where the clamp should pull against the main when you lift the tensioner.

Radicalized, Sep 26, 2012Report
^What he said. The teeth of the clamp will be held against the mains when you clamp the first cross after pulling tension. There is also the bend of the string going from a main to a cross. That's all there is with no connection to a base. Put a "dummy" piece of string in the empty side of the clamp when clamping the first cross (single) string. Then weave and tension the second cross. Clamp cross one and two. But it's late. Am I missing something in your concern?

So, which method is preferable (and the justification if it's not too hard to explain)?

I know that TPS is what a beginner should use. I am going to start with that but still this cross clamping for OPS is bothering me at the moment.
Any comments and advise would be much appreciated.

 

[esgee48]

With flying clamps, you need to weave the '1st and 2nd cross', then tension and clamp both. With fixed clamps, you can do only the '1st cross' , tension and clamp.

 

[4-string]

For two piece I tension the first two crosses, and clamp them. I do however never use a starting knot, always a starting clamp. This allows me to go back and tension that first cross later on before tying it off.

For one piece jobs I tension both crosses also, but twice (tension, clamp, pull tension again and clamp).

 

[Irvin]

Hi guys, soon-to-be KM owner here and am trying to learn the basics of stringing before the machine arrives.
I think two piece stringing (TPS) is quite easy to understand from what I gather from this forum and also from Klippermate's own video. What's troubling me is with one piece stringing (OPS). Without going into ATW, my questions is about the clamping of the 1st cross when the last main from the long side makes the main-cross transition.
The KM video demonstrates the TPS. Beginning with a starting knot the 1st cross is laced to make the 2nd cross and then the 2nd cross is pulled (which also pulls the 1st cross via the grommet). Then clamp at 2nd and 1st cross nearest to frame and tension head.

My findings so far reveals the following:

1) KM when asked this question says that the pulling of 2nd cross is also applicable to OPS ie the string goes from last main to 1st cross then to 2nd cross and then only tensioned ( pull at 2nd cross).

2) Posts from this forum says that it is okay to use the flying clamps to clamp at the 1st cross while putting a dummy string on the second groove of the clamp. Here is the post,




So, which method is preferable (and the justification if it's not too hard to explain)?

I know that TPS is what a beginner should use. I am going to start with that but still this cross clamping for OPS is bothering me at the moment.
Any comments and advise would be much appreciated.

Do you have a starting clamp?

EDIT: Also do you want a one piece pattern for any racket or a specific racket?

 

[ertorque]

Do you have a starting clamp?

EDIT: Also do you want a one piece pattern for any racket or a specific racket?

I don't have a starting clamp. Does having one help in the tensioning of the 1st cross on the KM? If so, I'd be happy to learn how it's done. I may want to add that tool later on.
What I'd like to know is without having to do ATW ie when the last main of the racquet of the short side ends in a knot near the throat and the last main of the racquet of the long side goes into cross, how should the clamping process be. So I guess my question is for any racquet with OPS without ATW.

 

[Irvin]

I don't have a starting clamp. Does having one help in the tensioning of the 1st cross on the KM? If so, I'd be happy to learn how it's done. I may want to add that tool later on.
What I'd like to know is without having to do ATW ie when the last main of the racquet of the short side ends in a knot near the throat and the last main of the racquet of the long side goes into cross, how should the clamping process be. So I guess my question is for any racquet with OPS without ATW.

Having a starting clamp is not necessary but it helps in both OPS and TPS. For TPS put the SC on the top cross and pull on the second. When you finish and tie off the bottom cross go back up tension the top cross take off the SC clamp and tie off.

For OPS make the short side 1' longer and run in the top or bottom cross depending on where you short side ended. Hold with a SC and then use the long side to run in the remaining crosses. When finished remove the SC and tie off.

EDIT: Also you can use a Flying clamp on the outside of the frame for a SC just adjust for one string or place a scrap string in the other jaw. Starting clamps are always good to have. When you run in your mains with TPS and you get to the last main your clamp with twist creating a lot of drawback and tension loss in the outer main. If you use a SC to hold the outer main you have two Flying clamps for the other main to tie off. Putting two clamps on the outer main greatly reduces drawback.

 

[ertorque]

When you run in your mains with TPS and you get to the last main your clamp with twist creating a lot of drawback and tension loss in the outer main. If you use a SC to hold the outer main you have two Flying clamps for the other main to tie off. Putting two clamps on the outer main greatly reduces drawback.

Thanks for the advice Irvin. Not very clear about where I should use the two flying clamps. Maybe an example will help.
If I have a 16 mains racquet which starts on the throat, with TPS, both RM8 LM8 will end at the throat. Do you mean that if I have a SC, use it to hold LM8 outside the frame and then use one clamp to clamp at RM7/RM8 near the throat (which we would normally do before tie off at this right side of the throat)? Where does the second clamp clamp then?
Have I understood you correctly?

 

[Irvin]

Thanks for the advice Irvin. Not very clear about where I should use the two flying clamps. Maybe an example will help.
If I have a 16 mains racquet which starts on the throat, with TPS, both RM8 LM8 will end at the throat. Do you mean that if I have a SC, use it to hold LM8 outside the frame and then use one clamp to clamp at RM7/RM8 near the throat (which we would normally do before tie off at this right side of the throat)? Where does the second clamp clamp then?
Have I understood you correctly?

You use both clamp on the same side right up against each other to reduce the drawback. The two clamps counteract each other to reduce drawback / twisting.

 

[aussie]

I find that whether you string one or two piece, weaving the first two crosses and clamping the first cross to the second with a floating clamp after tensioning works fine. There is probably a little tension loss but that is ultimately shared amongst the 19 or so total number of crosses so in other words, negligible impact on string bed stiffness.