Match Stats/Report - Djokovic vs Nadal, Wimbledon final, 2011

Waspsting

Hall of Fame
Novak Djokovic beat Rafael Nadal 6-4, 6-1, 1-6, 6-3 in the Wimbledon final, 2011 on grass

It was Djokovic's first Wimbledon title and first win over Nadal at a Slam (5 previous losses) or in best of 5. Djokovic also became world number 1 for the first time by reaching the final. He would go onto win the US Open over Nadal later in the year to claim 3 Slams for the year, having earlier won the Australian Open. Nadal had been the defending champion and was on a 20 match unbeaten streak at the event

Djokovic won 95 points, Nadal 82

Serve Stats
Djokovic...
- 1st serve percentage (69/95) 73%
- 1st serve points won (50/69) 72%
- 2nd serve points won (14/26) 54%
- Aces 7, Service Winners 2
- Double Faults 1
- Unreturned Serve Percentage (29/95) 31%

Nadal....
- 1st serve percentage (64/82) 78%
- 1st serve points won (43/64) 67%
- 2nd serve points won (8/18) 44%
- Aces 6 (1 not clean), Service Winners 2
- Double Faults 1
- Unreturned Serve Percentage (28/82) 34%

Serve Patterns
Djokovic served...
- to FH 34%
- to BH 62%
- to Body 4%

Nadal served...
- to FH 43%
- to BH 49%
- to Body 7%

Return Stats
Djokovic made...
- 53 (25 FH, 28 BH)
- 2 Winners (2 FH)
- 20 Errors, comprising...
- 4 Unforced (2 FH, 2 BH)
- 16 Forced (7 FH, 9 BH)
- Return Rate (53/81) 65%

Nadal made...
- 65 (27 FH, 38 BH), including 8 runaround FHs
- 1 Winner (1 FH)
- 20 Errors, comprising...
- 4 Unforced (2 FH, 2 BH)
- 16 Forced (8 FH, 8 BH)
- Return Rate (65/94) 69%

Break Points
Djokovic 5/6 (5 games)
Nadal 3/6 (4 games)

Winners (including returns, excluding serves)
Djokovic 19 (10 FH, 2 BH, 5 FHV, 1 BHV, 1 OH)
Nadal 15 (10 FH, 4 BH, 1 BHV)

Djokovic's FHs - 2 cc, 4 dtl (2 returns), 1 dtl/inside-out, 1 longline/inside-out and 2 inside-out
- BHs - 1 cc and 1 running-down-drop-shot cc at net

- 2 FHVs were drops - 1 inside-out and the BHV was first volley of a serve-volley point (slightly delayed)

Nadal's FHs - 1 cc, 4 dtl, 2 inside-in (1 pass), 1 longline/inside-out, 1 at net and 1 net chord dribbler return
- BHs - 2 cc (1 pass - a net chord clipper), 1 dtl/inside-out pass and 1 net chord dribbler

Errors (excluding serves and returns)
Djokovic 38
- 24 Unforced (16 FH, 6 BH, 1 BHV, 1 OH)… the OH was on bounce from no-man's land
- 14 Forced (6 FH, 7 BH, 1 BHV)
- Unforced Error Forcefulness Index 48.8

Nadal 46
- 27 Unforced (15 FH, 11 BH, 1 OH)
- 19 Forced (7 FH, 11 BH, 1 Tweener)
- Unforced Error Forcefulness Index 45.2

(Note 1: All 1/2 volleys refer to such shots played at net. 1/2 volleys played from other parts of the court are included within relevant groundstroke numbers)

(Note 2: the Unforced Error Forcefulness Index is an indicator of how aggressive the average UE was. The numbers presented for these two matches are keyed on 4 categories - 20 defensive, 40 neutral, 50 attacking and 60 winner attempt)

Net Points & Serve-Volley
Djokovic was...
- 17/23 (74%) at net, including...
- 1/1 serve-volleying, a 1st serve
---
- 1/2 forced back/retreated

Nadal was...
- 3/7 (43%) at net, with...
- 0/2 forced back/retreated

Match Report
A serve dominated match, as grass encounters tend to be, with both players serving exceptionally well. A couple of lapses by Nadal is the difference from a who-plays-big-points-better perspective. More generally, Djokovic's stronger returns pushes the odds that he'll have more chances against serve his way

First set is easy holds til Djoko breaks to take it. Down 30-0, he reels off 2 FH winners to even game at 30-30. Nadal misses FH inside-in next point after a tough rally and break point down, misses a dtl winner attempt off the third ball

Djoko steps it up in the second. He serves particularly strongly, making 16/20 first serves and holds easily. Meanwhile, there's some typical, strong deep returns that Nadal's up to handling and even retaining control of point, but Djoko's also very strong in defence. He runs down balls, puts them in play with authority and starts coming net to finish points. 6-1 Djokovic and 1 set away from the title

Play does a 180 though. Djoko's returning falls off a bit, and Nadal's able to win a number of cheap points on serve. Djoko's defence also falters, and he starts missing the tough, running shots he had been making. Nadal also ups his attacking play, hitting a bit deeper and firmer. Under the gun, Djoko's FH starts cracking, and he makes a number of unforced errors off that side. Nadal breaks twice while winning 13 serve points in a row to take the set

With the momentum, Nadal has break point in first game of the 4th on which a back pedalling Djoko hits a mediocre OH as he retreats to baseline. Nadal's able to reach the ball on the run and takes his shot FH dtl for the winner but misses

Players then trade breaks - a beautiful inside-out drop FHV winner from Djoko in his break game, while Nadal finishes a strong return game with a lucky net chord dribbling return winner. 4 easy holds later, Nadal blinks. His returning had already fallen off, and he misses makeable returns since breaking, and now his ground shots follow. his sole double fault and 3 neutral errors gives Djoko the break. This is the only genuinely bad service game played by either player in the match

Serving out the match, Djoko serve-volleys to dispatch a BHV winner to bring up match point, and takes net again to force a passing error on it

Serve & Return
Looking at the first serve percentages of 78% for Nadal and 73% for Djokovic, you might think they weren't doing much with the first shot

In fact, both belt their first serves. Placement isn't particularly good, but on a quick court, it doesn't have to be. Tremendous to have such a high in count serving as hard as both do, especially Nadal

On top of unreturned rates of 31% and 34%, serves draw a lot of weak returns that the server can jump on. Its here that Djoko scrapes a thin edge

He's able to get a reasonable number of powerful deep returns off against first serves and does so regularly against the second serve. Statistically, Djoko winning 54% second serve points to Nadal's 44% is the big difference between the two (with first serve percentage so high, that's not decisive). The key to it is Djoko's superior returns

Nadal returns from orthodox position all match. Its a good move, given how Djoko was apt to thrash him even on clay from advantageous third ball positions, but he's not comfortable there

With quality of serve near even, Djoko's superiority on the return is evident - despite Nadal returning well. Nadal makes a few good deep returns too, but fewer then Djoko. Doesn't seem to have the time to have a big rip

Nadal also runsaround to hit FHs against second serve. These are much like his returns on slower surfaces, no more damaging than BHs and heavily top spun

In a nutshell, very good serving from both. Djokovic making troublesomely strong returns a bit more frequently than Nadal giving him edge in serve-return complex
 

Waspsting

Hall of Fame
Play - Baseline & Net
Action is very different from the pair's norm. For starters, its a serve-heavy match where even when returns are made, the server retains a strong advantage most of the time

Both players look to finish points early, but rarely to the extent of going for winners. From baseline-to-baseline, Djoko has 9 winners, Nadal 10. This is quite low, given the situation with the serving

That's because both players hit "conservative" attacking shots... heavy, powerful and placed away from the other, but short of winner attempt. You could say attacking shots are played to force errors rather than hit winners. Hence, defence becomes important

Both defend with great vigour and the speed of court coverage is tremendous. Djokovic probably a bit better on the run, especially off the BH

Offensively he's the more daring and willing to step into court to hit his shots. And come to net to finish

The UEFI (Djoko 48.8, Nadal 45.2) is a reasonable reflection of how aggressive each player was. Djoko's score is probably a bit higher than what his play warrants. Note also the net approaches - 23 for Djoko, just 7 for Nadal. Djoko's winning 74% points in forecourt is a handy bonus with baseline play being a wash

Since his offence is heavily tilted to the FH, Nadal's offensive edge is dampened by his retaining a central court position. The court position is a necessity. Leaving half the court open against Djoko's BHs would have been very risky

Nadal's rushed to the FH even with normal positions... and defends on the running FH particularly well. But very little back-away or runaround FHs from Nadal. Most of Nadal's offense is FH dtl or longline and he goes for it early in rallies. He seems well out of his comfort zone doing so and falters some. The 15 UEs from his FH is highest of the match, ahead of Djoko's 11 on the same shot

Not much FH cc'ing from Rafa. Having recently watched the pair's 4 matches earlier in the year, its easy to understand. Djoko was apt to be devastating with his BH cc replies

On flip side of Djoko FH- Nadal BH rallies, the Nadal shot holds up well, but is rarely able to counter-attack

Depth causes both players plenty of trouble. More so then having to hit on the run (i. e. width). A combo of the two seems almost unplayable. Neither player good at hitting on the up

There's a stunning, tremendously powerful BH cc winner from Nadal, which raises a question about his choices on that side. Beyond this match, he's successful with this shot a very high percent of the time but rarely goes for it. He just doesn't seem to see the BH as an attacking option, but rather a fort holder. Against a strong attacking baseliner like Djokovic on a fast court like this, declining to attack of one side is a very big luxury. Its the great running FH defence that keeps Djoko's BH from doing much damage, thus keeping attacking field more or less equal

Summing up, there's little to separate the two players. Serve dominates, moderately attacking groundstrokes are aplenty, great running defence a must to cope. Djoko's heftier return gives him a slight edge and he's the more offense minded. For all that, play is near even and matters are decided by a couple of untimely error runs by Nadal

Stats for their '18 Wimbledon semi - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...ic-vs-nadal-wimbledon-semi-final-2018.647805/
 
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JackGates

Legend
Wow, amazing report and details. From now on you are the person I trust with the goat debate. What's your opinion, I give you the power to speak for all of us and decide, your word will become law.
 
Grass, reverse breadsticks, great play - not, please. Not so bad as the scoreline alone suggests, true, but unseemly for a slam final. First set was quite great and the fourth started well too but then Nadal played a krap game as you yourself mentioned, and killed all excitement as Djokovic easily served it out.
 

ibbi

Legend
I would love to see the stats of this match if you took out the third set. This felt at the time like pretty much as big a beatdown as the 2019 AO final. Ugly day.
 

Waspsting

Hall of Fame
I would love to see the stats of this match if you took out the third set. This felt at the time like pretty much as big a beatdown as the 2019 AO final. Ugly day.
Didn't seem that bad to me. 1st set - 1 odd game, half Djoko good play, some not good from Nadal
3rd set - 1 bad Nadal game
and the breadsticks cancelling out

Action mostly easy holds

I also thought Nadal's breadstick was more in his favour than Djoko's. 2nd set, some good, running shots turning defence into offense from Djoko before coming out on top in return games. 3rd set, Djoko can't put Nadal in defensive positions to begin with

At worst from Nadal's point of view, I'd say it looked like he was mentally dominated. That even or not, cometh crunch time, he'll cave. I recently watched their matches in Indian Wells, Miami, Madrid and Rome earlier in the year... so that might be colouring my perceptions (or making it more accurate, I suppose)

Serve aside, I think play is more even than '12 Aus final.... for the middle three sets, Djoko was almost toying with Nadal there

From playing point of view, Nadal looks out of his comfort zone

Its common observation that he's at his best when FH dtl is clicking, but that's only true in the context of him playing within his comfort zone, i.e. leaning on BH side of court, where he can lead his attack with back-away FH inside-outs. When that happens, FH dtl works on top of FH inside-out. Not in place of it

In this match, he isn't/can't stay on BH side of court and FH dtl has effectively replaced FH inside-out as his spearhead

Makes a lot of errors on the FH dtl or longline, mostly attacking shots. And goes for them early in rallies, not always out of necessity. Think he felt the pressure of the strong likelihood of Djoko snatching initiative of point with a strong shot from neutral position

In this match alone, Djoko doesn't actually do that too much. Did it much more in Rome and Madrid and maybe that was enough to get into Rafa's head a bit

Stats, sans set 3 -

Points - Djoko 84, Nadal 56
1st serve in - Djoko 76%, Nadal 78%
1st serve won - Djoko 76%, Nadal 60%
2nd serve won - Djoko 61%, Nadal 36%
Aces/Service Winners - Djoko 7, Nadal 7
Double Faults - Djoko 0, Nadal 1
Unreturned Serves - Djoko 35%, Nadal 28%
Break Points - 5/6 (5 games), Nadal 1/2 (2 games)
Winners - Djoko 18, Nadal 11
Errors - Djoko 26, Nadal 42
Unforced Errors - Djoko 16, Nadal 26
Forced Errors - Djoko 10, Nadal 16
Net Points - Djoko 13/19, Nadal 2/6

Comparing to Aus '19 https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...c-vs-nadal-australian-open-final-2019.644899/

Points - Djoko 89, Nadal 53
1st serve in - Djoko 72%, Nadal 64%
1st serve won - Djoko 80%, Nadal 51%
2nd serve won - Djoko 84%, Nadal 62%
Aces/Service Winners - Djoko 9, Nadal 5
Double Faults - Djoko 0, Nadal 2
Unreturned Serves - Djoko 25%, Nadal 27%
Break Points - Djoko 5/8 (6 games), Nadal 0/1
Winners - Djoko 25, Nadal 16
Errors - Djoko 17, Nadal 45
Unforced Errors - Djoko 9, Nadal 24
Forced Errors - Djoko 8, Nadal 21
Net Points - Djoko 13/15, Nadal 5/13
 

ibbi

Legend
Didn't seem that bad to me. 1st set - 1 odd game, half Djoko good play, some not good from Nadal
3rd set - 1 bad Nadal game
and the breadsticks cancelling out

Action mostly easy holds

I also thought Nadal's breadstick was more in his favour than Djoko's. 2nd set, some good, running shots turning defence into offense from Djoko before coming out on top in return games. 3rd set, Djoko can't put Nadal in defensive positions to begin with

At worst from Nadal's point of view, I'd say it looked like he was mentally dominated. That even or not, cometh crunch time, he'll cave. I recently watched their matches in Indian Wells, Miami, Madrid and Rome earlier in the year... so that might be colouring my perceptions (or making it more accurate, I suppose)

Serve aside, I think play is more even than '12 Aus final.... for the middle three sets, Djoko was almost toying with Nadal there

From playing point of view, Nadal looks out of his comfort zone

Its common observation that he's at his best when FH dtl is clicking, but that's only true in the context of him playing within his comfort zone, i.e. leaning on BH side of court, where he can lead his attack with back-away FH inside-outs. When that happens, FH dtl works on top of FH inside-out. Not in place of it

In this match, he isn't/can't stay on BH side of court and FH dtl has effectively replaced FH inside-out as his spearhead

Makes a lot of errors on the FH dtl or longline, mostly attacking shots. And goes for them early in rallies, not always out of necessity. Think he felt the pressure of the strong likelihood of Djoko snatching initiative of point with a strong shot from neutral position

In this match alone, Djoko doesn't actually do that too much. Did it much more in Rome and Madrid and maybe that was enough to get into Rafa's head a bit

Stats, sans set 3 -

Points - Djoko 84, Nadal 56
1st serve in - Djoko 76%, Nadal 78%
1st serve won - Djoko 76%, Nadal 60%
2nd serve won - Djoko 61%, Nadal 36%
Aces/Service Winners - Djoko 7, Nadal 7
Double Faults - Djoko 0, Nadal 1
Unreturned Serves - Djoko 35%, Nadal 28%
Break Points - 5/6 (5 games), Nadal 1/2 (2 games)
Winners - Djoko 18, Nadal 11
Errors - Djoko 26, Nadal 42
Unforced Errors - Djoko 16, Nadal 26
Forced Errors - Djoko 10, Nadal 16
Net Points - Djoko 13/19, Nadal 2/6

Comparing to Aus '19 https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...c-vs-nadal-australian-open-final-2019.644899/

Points - Djoko 89, Nadal 53
1st serve in - Djoko 72%, Nadal 64%
1st serve won - Djoko 80%, Nadal 51%
2nd serve won - Djoko 84%, Nadal 62%
Aces/Service Winners - Djoko 9, Nadal 5
Double Faults - Djoko 0, Nadal 2
Unreturned Serves - Djoko 25%, Nadal 27%
Break Points - Djoko 5/8 (6 games), Nadal 0/1
Winners - Djoko 25, Nadal 16
Errors - Djoko 17, Nadal 45
Unforced Errors - Djoko 9, Nadal 24
Forced Errors - Djoko 8, Nadal 21
Net Points - Djoko 13/15, Nadal 5/13
You are a legend, dude :D Maybe as a Nadal fan I just remember it as worse than it was, and yes, certainly the by that point overwhelming mental advantage that Novak had forced himself into took as much toll as anything else.
 

Hitman

G.O.A.T.
This match was the first time I had seen Nadal mentally out of sorts in a big slam match. Heading into this match, Nadal had won the last 8 slam finals he had played in.

It was 10-2 in slam final play for him. After his sequence with Djokovic ending at RG the following year, it was 11-5.
 

Nadalgaenger

G.O.A.T.
Grass, reverse breadsticks, great play - not, please. Not so bad as the scoreline alone suggests, true, but unseemly for a slam final. First set was quite great and the fourth started well too but then Nadal played a krap game as you yourself mentioned, and killed all excitement as Djokovic easily served it out.
I was amazed in the second set of that match. Djokovic had answers for everything Nadal was throwing at him, and Nadal had some tremendous shots. The Andrew Castle “strength to strength” rally stands out in my mind:

Just watch from about 12:30-14:20 for really high level tennis:
 

The Guru

Hall of Fame
Play - Baseline & Net
Action is very different from the pair's norm. For starters, its a serve-heavy match where even when returns are made, the server retains a strong advantage most of the time

Both players look to finish points early, but rarely to the extent of going for winners. From baseline-to-baseline, Djoko has 9 winners, Nadal 10. This is quite low, given the situation with the serving

That's because both players hit "conservative" attacking shots... heavy, powerful and placed away from the other, but short of winner attempt. You could say attacking shots are played to force errors rather than hit winners. Hence, defence becomes important

Both defend with great vigour and the speed of court coverage is tremendous. Djokovic probably a bit better on the run, especially off the BH

Offensively he's the more daring and willing to step into court to hit his shots. And come to net to finish

The UEFI (Djoko 48.8, Nadal 45.2) is a reasonable reflection of how aggressive each player was. Djoko's score is probably a bit higher than what his play warrants. Note also the net approaches - 23 for Djoko, just 7 for Nadal. Djoko's winning 74% points in forecourt is a handy bonus with baseline play being a wash

Since his offence is heavily tilted to the FH, Nadal's offensive edge is dampened by his retaining a central court position. The court position is a necessity. Leaving half the court open against Djoko's BHs would have been very risky

Nadal's rushed to the FH even with normal positions... and defends on the running FH particularly well. But very little back-away or runaround FHs from Nadal. Most of Nadal's offense is FH dtl or longline and he goes for it early in rallies. He seems well out of his comfort zone doing so and falters some. The 15 UEs from his FH is highest of the match, ahead of Djoko's 11 on the same shot

Not much FH cc'ing from Rafa. Having recently watched the pair's 4 matches earlier in the year, its easy to understand. Djoko was apt to be devastating with his BH cc replies

On flip side of Djoko FH- Nadal BH rallies, the Nadal shot holds up well, but is rarely able to counter-attack

Depth causes both players plenty of trouble. More so then having to hit on the run (i. e. width). A combo of the two seems almost unplayable. Neither player good at hitting on the up

There's a stunning, tremendously powerful BH cc winner from Nadal, which raises a question about his choices on that side. Beyond this match, he's successful with this shot a very high percent of the time but rarely goes for it. He just doesn't seem to see the BH as an attacking option, but rather a fort holder. Against a strong attacking baseliner like Djokovic on a fast court like this, declining to attack of one side is a very big luxury. Its the great running FH defence that keeps Djoko's BH from doing much damage, thus keeping attacking field more or less equal

Summing up, there's little to separate the two players. Serve dominates, moderately attacking groundstrokes are aplenty, great running defence a must to cope. Djoko's heftier return gives him a slight edge and he's the more offense minded. For all that, play is near even and matters are decided by a couple of untimely error runs by Nadal

Stats for their '18 Wimbledon semi - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...ic-vs-nadal-wimbledon-semi-final-2018.647805/
Awesome stuff. I've gone back and read like 25 of your past match reports in the past couple hours and their awesome and fit my memory of watching the matches very well too which is cool. I have some requests if you take them and if you already did them and I somehow missed them send me the link :).

2001 USO F Sampras vs. Hewitt
2002 San Jose F Agassi vs. Hewitt
2003 DC SF WG Hewitt vs. Federer
2008 AO Tsonga vs Djokovic
2012 AO SF Murray vs Djokovic
2013 AO 4R Djokovic vs Wawrinka
2013 FO SF Nadal vs. Djokovic
2020 AO F Djokovic vs. Thiem

As you might be able to tell I'm a Djokovic and Hewitt fan haha. Do whichever (or none) you have time for or feel like you wanna do for whatever reason? Thanks for your analysis it's awesome.
 

Waspsting

Hall of Fame
Awesome stuff. I've gone back and read like 25 of your past match reports in the past couple hours and their awesome and fit my memory of watching the matches very well too which is cool. I have some requests if you take them and if you already did them and I somehow missed them send me the link :).

2001 USO F Sampras vs. Hewitt
2002 San Jose F Agassi vs. Hewitt
2003 DC SF WG Hewitt vs. Federer
2008 AO Tsonga vs Djokovic
2012 AO SF Murray vs Djokovic
2013 AO 4R Djokovic vs Wawrinka
2013 FO SF Nadal vs. Djokovic
2020 AO F Djokovic vs. Thiem

As you might be able to tell I'm a Djokovic and Hewitt fan haha. Do whichever (or none) you have time for or feel like you wanna do for whatever reason? Thanks for your analysis it's awesome.
First of all, sorry for the late reply

Its nice to see a consistent thread in your personal favourites. Djokovic and Hewitt are similar of style.

What do you think of Andy Murray? I've found him to be the most similar player to Hewitt - like what Pete Sampras was to Boris Becker

I haven't statt-ed any of those matches yet. A few of them are on my list, but won't be on them for awhile. Would particularly like to get hands on full version of the '13 French match

Just two matches of Hewitt's -
against Sampras, '99 Queen's - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...vs-hewitt-queens-club-semi-final-1999.650384/
against Agassi, '04 Cincinnati - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...gassi-vs-hewitt-cincinnati-final-2004.658128/

For Djokovic, I have 57 (34-23) matches, earliest '06 Monte Carlo and latest '19 Wimbledon. those are spread out across -
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-12981896
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13478681
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/match-statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13661070
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/match-statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13806719
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/match-statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13916751
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/match-statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-14035176
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/match-statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-14228891
 

The Guru

Hall of Fame
First of all, sorry for the late reply

Its nice to see a consistent thread in your personal favourites. Djokovic and Hewitt are similar of style.

What do you think of Andy Murray? I've found him to be the most similar player to Hewitt - like what Pete Sampras was to Boris Becker

I haven't statt-ed any of those matches yet. A few of them are on my list, but won't be on them for awhile. Would particularly like to get hands on full version of the '13 French match

Just two matches of Hewitt's -
against Sampras, '99 Queen's - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...vs-hewitt-queens-club-semi-final-1999.650384/
against Agassi, '04 Cincinnati - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...gassi-vs-hewitt-cincinnati-final-2004.658128/

For Djokovic, I have 57 (34-23) matches, earliest '06 Monte Carlo and latest '19 Wimbledon. those are spread out across -
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-12981896
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13478681
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13661070
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13806719
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-13916751
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-14035176
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...statistics-1959-present.552865/#post-14228891
I have always preferred baseline play and good returners get into a lot more rallies than other players. I'm not a Murray fan because I'm a Djokovic fan. They're rivals so I can't really be a fan of both. I like Andy's personality a lot though. His dry humor, sarcasm, and negativity (lol) are charming to me. I definitely see the comparison between Murray and Hewitt for sure though I agree they are similar players especially in their destruction of servebots. No one in the Next Gen quite stands out to me as similar to them so I'm worried about finding a new favorite. Nishikori was the closest thing in Lost Gen but I had no reason to move on from Novak at that point. I'm thinking one of the two young Canadians might be my guy once Novak is gone.

What's your list of upcoming matches look like? Not just Djokovic and Hewitt matches but in general I'm curious.

Anyway, thanks for the work you do it's awesome. I have a lot of fun reading your match recaps and your analysis is spot on and it's great to remember old matches through your reports.
 

RS

G.O.A.T.
Novak Djokovic beat Rafael Nadal 6-4, 6-1, 1-6, 6-3 in the Wimbledon final, 2011 on grass

It was Djokovic's first Wimbledon title and first win over Nadal at a Slam (5 previous losses) or in best of 5. Djokovic also became world number 1 for the first time by reaching the final. He would go onto win the US Open over Nadal later in the year to claim 3 Slams for the year, having earlier won the Australian Open. Nadal had been the defending champion and was on a 20 match unbeaten streak at the event

Djokovic won 95 points, Nadal 82

Serve Stats
Djokovic...
- 1st serve percentage (69/95) 73%
- 1st serve points won (50/69) 72%
- 2nd serve points won (14/26) 54%
- Aces 7, Service Winners 2
- Double Faults 1
- Unreturned Serve Percentage (29/95) 31%

Nadal....
- 1st serve percentage (64/82) 78%
- 1st serve points won (43/64) 67%
- 2nd serve points won (8/18) 44%
- Aces 6 (1 not clean), Service Winners 2
- Double Faults 1
- Unreturned Serve Percentage (28/82) 34%

Serve Patterns
Djokovic served...
- to FH 34%
- to BH 62%
- to Body 4%

Nadal served...
- to FH 43%
- to BH 49%
- to Body 7%

Return Stats
Djokovic made...
- 53 (25 FH, 28 BH)
- 2 Winners (2 FH)
- 20 Errors, comprising...
- 4 Unforced (2 FH, 2 BH)
- 16 Forced (7 FH, 9 BH)
- Return Rate (53/81) 65%

Nadal made...
- 65 (27 FH, 38 BH), including 8 runaround FHs
- 1 Winner (1 FH)
- 20 Errors, comprising...
- 4 Unforced (2 FH, 2 BH)
- 16 Forced (8 FH, 8 BH)
- Return Rate (65/94) 69%

Break Points
Djokovic 5/6 (5 games)
Nadal 3/6 (4 games)

Winners (including returns, excluding serves)
Djokovic 19 (10 FH, 2 BH, 5 FHV, 1 BHV, 1 OH)
Nadal 15 (10 FH, 4 BH, 1 BHV)

Djokovic's FHs - 2 cc, 4 dtl (2 returns), 1 dtl/inside-out, 1 longline/inside-out and 2 inside-out
- BHs - 1 cc and 1 running-down-drop-shot cc at net

- 2 FHVs were drops - 1 inside-out and the BHV was first volley of a serve-volley point (slightly delayed)

Nadal's FHs - 1 cc, 4 dtl, 2 inside-in (1 pass), 1 longline/inside-out, 1 at net and 1 net chord dribbler return
- BHs - 2 cc (1 pass - a net chord clipper), 1 dtl/inside-out pass and 1 net chord dribbler

Errors (excluding serves and returns)
Djokovic 38
- 24 Unforced (16 FH, 6 BH, 1 BHV, 1 OH)… the OH was on bounce from no-man's land
- 14 Forced (6 FH, 7 BH, 1 BHV)
- Unforced Error Forcefulness Index 48.8

Nadal 46
- 27 Unforced (15 FH, 11 BH, 1 OH)
- 19 Forced (7 FH, 11 BH, 1 Tweener)
- Unforced Error Forcefulness Index 45.2

(Note 1: All 1/2 volleys refer to such shots played at net. 1/2 volleys played from other parts of the court are included within relevant groundstroke numbers)

(Note 2: the Unforced Error Forcefulness Index is an indicator of how aggressive the average UE was. The numbers presented for these two matches are keyed on 4 categories - 20 defensive, 40 neutral, 50 attacking and 60 winner attempt)

Net Points & Serve-Volley
Djokovic was...
- 17/23 (74%) at net, including...
- 1/1 serve-volleying, a 1st serve
---
- 1/2 forced back/retreated

Nadal was...
- 3/7 (43%) at net, with...
- 0/2 forced back/retreated

Match Report
A serve dominated match, as grass encounters tend to be, with both players serving exceptionally well. A couple of lapses by Nadal is the difference from a who-plays-big-points-better perspective. More generally, Djokovic's stronger returns pushes the odds that he'll have more chances against serve his way

First set is easy holds til Djoko breaks to take it. Down 30-0, he reels off 2 FH winners to even game at 30-30. Nadal misses FH inside-in next point after a tough rally and break point down, misses a dtl winner attempt off the third ball

Djoko steps it up in the second. He serves particularly strongly, making 16/20 first serves and holds easily. Meanwhile, there's some typical, strong deep returns that Nadal's up to handling and even retaining control of point, but Djoko's also very strong in defence. He runs down balls, puts them in play with authority and starts coming net to finish points. 6-1 Djokovic and 1 set away from the title

Play does a 180 though. Djoko's returning falls off a bit, and Nadal's able to win a number of cheap points on serve. Djoko's defence also falters, and he starts missing the tough, running shots he had been making. Nadal also ups his attacking play, hitting a bit deeper and firmer. Under the gun, Djoko's FH starts cracking, and he makes a number of unforced errors off that side. Nadal breaks twice while winning 13 serve points in a row to take the set

With the momentum, Nadal has break point in first game of the 4th on which a back pedalling Djoko hits a mediocre OH as he retreats to baseline. Nadal's able to reach the ball on the run and takes his shot FH dtl for the winner but misses

Players then trade breaks - a beautiful inside-out drop FHV winner from Djoko in his break game, while Nadal finishes a strong return game with a lucky net chord dribbling return winner. 4 easy holds later, Nadal blinks. His returning had already fallen off, and he misses makeable returns since breaking, and now his ground shots follow. his sole double fault and 3 neutral errors gives Djoko the break. This is the only genuinely bad service game played by either player in the match

Serving out the match, Djoko serve-volleys to dispatch a BHV winner to bring up match point, and takes net again to force a passing error on it

Serve & Return
Looking at the first serve percentages of 78% for Nadal and 73% for Djokovic, you might think they weren't doing much with the first shot

In fact, both belt their first serves. Placement isn't particularly good, but on a quick court, it doesn't have to be. Tremendous to have such a high in count serving as hard as both do, especially Nadal

On top of unreturned rates of 31% and 34%, serves draw a lot of weak returns that the server can jump on. Its here that Djoko scrapes a thin edge

He's able to get a reasonable number of powerful deep returns off against first serves and does so regularly against the second serve. Statistically, Djoko winning 54% second serve points to Nadal's 44% is the big difference between the two (with first serve percentage so high, that's not decisive). The key to it is Djoko's superior returns

Nadal returns from orthodox position all match. Its a good move, given how Djoko was apt to thrash him even on clay from advantageous third ball positions, but he's not comfortable there

With quality of serve near even, Djoko's superiority on the return is evident - despite Nadal returning well. Nadal makes a few good deep returns too, but fewer then Djoko. Doesn't seem to have the time to have a big rip

Nadal also runsaround to hit FHs against second serve. These are much like his returns on slower surfaces, no more damaging than BHs and heavily top spun

In a nutshell, very good serving from both. Djokovic making troublesomely strong returns a bit more frequently than Nadal giving him edge in serve-return complex
Do you think 2007/2008 finals Nadal could beat this Djokovic ?
 
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Third Serve

G.O.A.T.
I weirdly don’t remember this match at all. Upon reviewing it, I didn’t think it was a very remarkable match. Nadal was, as @Hitman said earlier, a bit out of sorts. The two breadstick sets didn’t really add on to the enjoyment factor at all.
 

Waspsting

Hall of Fame
Do you think 2007/2008 finals Nadal could beat this Djokovic ?
I think '08 favours Nadal more than '07

He's a lot more impressive in in play in both matches - especially '07 - then either he or Djokovic is here

But... he's serving about as well as he's capable. Just shy of 80% first serves in, banging them down 125+ mph. Not great placement, but on grass, it doesn't have to be... that kind of serving with just decent play to back it up is enough to win

Here, odd good returns Djoko manages to shift odds in his favour - and he's good enough to capitilize on that. That's often how it is on grass

Now '07, Nadal played fantastically of the ground, particularly his shotmaking, especially of the FH. That's largely enabled by his opponents unforceful returning of an average serve

You serve that way to '11 Djokovic, your going to get a lot of damaging returns

I favour Nadal '07 in play over Djokovic '11 in play... both Nadal's hitting and court coverage are a good ways up from '11, and I imagine, enough to come out ahead of Djoko

But we're talking 2 completely different situations. In the flesh in '11, he was left in charge on third ball most of the time. His '07 serving... I doubt very, very seriously could draw the same kind of returns and he's more likely to have to play half-volleys off the baseline first up

Does superior court play from '07 make up for superior serve in '11 from Nadal's point of view? Given the extent of the superiority of serve and Djoko's returning capabilities, I wouldn't expect it to

'08 Nadal showing is different in that the serving was strong. Not nearly as strong as '11 but significantly up from '07. Retaining all the good stuff in play and not losing as much on serve... that's clearly a stronger showing than this

I'd favour Nadal's '08 showing to come out ahead, and not favour '07

- '07 final - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...federer-vs-nadal-wimbledon-final-2007.633831/
- '08 final - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...nadal-vs-federer-wimbledon-final-2008.632647/

They played at Queen's prior to Wimbledon in '08. That one was close, Nadal playing quite conservatively from baseline -

 
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metsman

G.O.A.T.
Grass, reverse breadsticks, great play - not, please. Not so bad as the scoreline alone suggests, true, but unseemly for a slam final. First set was quite great and the fourth started well too but then Nadal played a krap game as you yourself mentioned, and killed all excitement as Djokovic easily served it out.
4th did not start well, it was quite sloppy at the start with traded breaks. Yeah then there was some decent play for a few games but then Nadal promptly played another crap game to get broken and that was it. Not a good set at all.

The third was just awful from Djokovic, but I guess the 2nd was a bit better than a scoreline and Nadal didn't play quite so poorly as to deserve a breadstick. But he lacked meaningful aggression, probably a sign he wasn't very mentally confident. Djokovic was fantastic.
 
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metsman

G.O.A.T.
I weirdly don’t remember this match at all. Upon reviewing it, I didn’t think it was a very remarkable match. Nadal was, as @Hitman said earlier, a bit out of sorts. The two breadstick sets didn’t really add on to the enjoyment factor at all.
I think the first set was great and honestly the 2nd wasn't nearly as bad as the scoreline and the level was scary good by Djokovic there (even though I think Nadal aided it somewhat by the amount of time he gave him). But after that the last 2 sets were just not good at all which kind of ruins it.
 
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metsman

G.O.A.T.
I think '08 favours Nadal more than '07

He's a lot more impressive in in play in both matches - especially '07 - then either he or Djokovic is here

But... he's serving about as well as he's capable. Just shy of 80% first serves in, banging them down 125+ mph. Not great placement, but on grass, it doesn't have to be... that kind of serving with just decent play to back it up is enough to win

Here, odd good returns Djoko manages to shift odds in his favour - and he's good enough to capitilize on that. That's often how it is on grass

Now '07, Nadal played fantastically of the ground, particularly his shotmaking, especially of the FH. That's largely enabled by his opponents unforceful returning of an average serve

You serve that way to '11 Djokovic, your going to get a lot of damaging returns

I favour Nadal '07 in play over Djokovic '11 in play... both Nadal's hitting and court coverage are a good ways up from '11, and I imagine, enough to come out ahead of Djoko

But we're talking 2 completely different situations. In the flesh in '11, he was left in charge on third ball most of the time. His '07 serving... I doubt very, very seriously could draw the same kind of returns and he's more likely to have to play half-volleys off the baseline first up

Does superior court play from '07 make up for superior serve in '11 from Nadal's point of view? Given the extent of the superiority of serve and Djoko's returning capabilities, I wouldn't expect it to

'08 Nadal showing is different in that the serving was strong. Not nearly as strong as '11 but significantly up from '07. Retaining all the good stuff in play and not losing as much on serve... that's clearly a stronger showing than this

I'd favour Nadal's '08 showing to come out ahead, and not favour '07

- '07 final - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...federer-vs-nadal-wimbledon-final-2007.633831/
- '08 final - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...nadal-vs-federer-wimbledon-final-2008.632647/

They played at Queen's prior to Wimbledon in '08. That one was close, Nadal playing quite conservatively from baseline -

I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss Nadal's serving style back then. He played other great returners, including Djokovic, back then and was rarely tee'd off on, at least when he was in good form. The additional spin and variety probably made his serve less predictable and tougher to read, and set up easier +1 plays. Nadal's serve was probably a bigger problem for Federer back then than it was in later years when it was flatter and more predictable. Case in point, Nadal served bigger in 08 than 07 in the finals, but honestly his first serve game in 07 may have been a tad more effective due to those reasons. Federer's biggest problem on return in 08 was dumping routine seconds into the net.

Another excellent case point is 2006. I think Nadal served similarly in style and quality here to 2011 (and clearly much better after the respective first sets), but Federer had honestly far fewer headaches on the return than 07/08 and was able to absorb the pace pretty easily and usually hit more forcing returns on balls he could reach than the next two years where Nadal constantly had him off balance and guessing. Of course his return was quite a bit better in 2006 too.

Nadal definitely wouldn't get as many totally free points off the serve in 07, and yes Djokovic would obviously return better than Federer, but I'd wager that he'd be serving smarter and would force some more weaker returns by keeping Djokovic reaching and off balance, which he was really unable to do in 2011. He got some cheaper points by going for bigger serves but his serve+1 game was totally nonexistent.

Certainly given how up for grabs Djokovic was in the 4th set of 2011, and Nadal's pretty clear edge over 2011 in groundgame and athleticism, I'd definitely favor 07 Nadal to take it 5 at least, and after that it's anybody's game. Also it's hard to overstate just how great and timely Federer's serving was in 2007. Really one of the great clutch serving performances and some of the smartest 2nd serving I've ever seen. Djokovic served very well in 2011 but Nadal wouldn't be up against that.
 
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RS

G.O.A.T.
I think '08 favours Nadal more than '07

He's a lot more impressive in in play in both matches - especially '07 - then either he or Djokovic is here

But... he's serving about as well as he's capable. Just shy of 80% first serves in, banging them down 125+ mph. Not great placement, but on grass, it doesn't have to be... that kind of serving with just decent play to back it up is enough to win

Here, odd good returns Djoko manages to shift odds in his favour - and he's good enough to capitilize on that. That's often how it is on grass

Now '07, Nadal played fantastically of the ground, particularly his shotmaking, especially of the FH. That's largely enabled by his opponents unforceful returning of an average serve

You serve that way to '11 Djokovic, your going to get a lot of damaging returns

I favour Nadal '07 in play over Djokovic '11 in play... both Nadal's hitting and court coverage are a good ways up from '11, and I imagine, enough to come out ahead of Djoko

But we're talking 2 completely different situations. In the flesh in '11, he was left in charge on third ball most of the time. His '07 serving... I doubt very, very seriously could draw the same kind of returns and he's more likely to have to play half-volleys off the baseline first up

Does superior court play from '07 make up for superior serve in '11 from Nadal's point of view? Given the extent of the superiority of serve and Djoko's returning capabilities, I wouldn't expect it to

'08 Nadal showing is different in that the serving was strong. Not nearly as strong as '11 but significantly up from '07. Retaining all the good stuff in play and not losing as much on serve... that's clearly a stronger showing than this

I'd favour Nadal's '08 showing to come out ahead, and not favour '07

- '07 final - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...federer-vs-nadal-wimbledon-final-2007.633831/
- '08 final - https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...nadal-vs-federer-wimbledon-final-2008.632647/

They played at Queen's prior to Wimbledon in '08. That one was close, Nadal playing quite conservatively from baseline -

I was thinking you would mention the serving difference of 08 compared to 07. I get the weird view Nadal does better vs a number of other top players but Djokovic ROS would be a real problem to the Nadal serve.....
 
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