Mats Wilander: ''Djokovic is better than Nadal and Federer''

RF-18 said:
Let's not overreact here.
Yea he has losing h2h, but most of those losses came before djokovic's real breakthrough. Since then, he has winning records against both.

Right now, fed is ahead with two wins, nadal is ahead with four. He is not far away in h2h. What will people say when/if he overtakes both of them, wich the chance for that is pretty good? I think many will look back at this thread.

Federer hates playing nadal, nadal doesn't like djokovic.
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Djokovic doesn't like playing Nadal any better.

And if anything Nadal reversing the trend against Djokovic is more significant because of what happened in 2011.
 
Crisstti said:
Djokovic doesn't like playing Nadal any better.

And if anything Nadal reversing the trend against Djokovic is more significant because of what happened in 2011.
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Djokovic would rather play Nadal over Federer any day of the week on hard courts and grass.
 
TheMusicLover said:
#impossible #to ###read #because #of ###overdose of ###kiddie faecesbook ########
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Nathaniel_Near said:
You can have too much of a good thing (hashtags are obviously amazing). They start to lose their impact after a while: the pulse; the rhythm; the contour; the form.

#ObservanceOfArt #ReflectionTherein
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#Kids, don't #make this all about #me. There is #other, more #pressing #historical #revisionism taking place which #deserves #increased #scrutiny by #logical #individuals. #Albeit, it is #JC who #deserves #alltheglory #allthetime.

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
 
Indeed AngieB, but the hashtag obfuscation is strangely powerful and overwhelming. It's a terrific weapon you have—it's so potent, that it can accidentally misdirect us mere weaklings and force us down into #TangentAvenue.
 
VexlanderPrime said:
So much ridiculous bs in this thread. Bottom line: People will have different opinios but objectively its hard to argue that Djokers peak wasn't as good as any peak tennis has seen including Feds. At the same time Djoker needs 2ish big years to break into the career GOAT debate so lets see how it plays out. If he gets 6 or more slams he's in the debate. Anyone who thinks that Feds 17 slams against comparatively weak top players (Roddick, ancient Agassi, Hewitt) automatically protects him from a huge finish to Djoker or even Rafa's careers just doesnt know tennis. Rafa would need to add non clay slams and obv Djoker can't be a GOAT contender without a RG win.

Bottom line: the peaks are all close, feds still ahead career wise. Should be an interedting end to the era.
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Rafa doesn't need more nonclay slams. He's more than proven himself in that respect. More than Fed has proven himself on clay.

mike danny said:
The idea of Federer facing weak competition is laughable. During 2044-2007 when he won 11 slams he defeated 13 top 5 players, which is decent
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The weak(er) era argument is about the stregth of players in that top 5 too. Not all time greats.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Djokovic would rather play Nadal over Federer any day of the week on hard courts and grass.
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Did he tell you that?. Is this the same Djokovic who names Rafa's FH as the best or toughest shot he's faced?.

BTW, him still having a losing h2h against a rather old and past prime Fed doesn't help his case at all.
 
Crisstti said:
Rafa doesn't need more nonclay slams. He's more than proven himself in that respect. More than Fed has proven himself on clay.



The weak(er) era argument is about the stregth of players in that top 5 too. Not all time greats.
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So many players have 2 wimbledons.

So many players have 2 USO's.

So many players have 1 AO.

All time greats have all of this and more.

Rafa would like to be known as an "all time all surface" great and not a 'Clay Courter who enjoyed success outside".

Fed was No.1 at age 31, when Rafa, Novak and Murray were aged 24-26.
 
Crisstti said:
Did he tell you that?. Is this the same Djokovic who names Rafa's FH as the best or toughest shot he's faced?.

BTW, him still having a losing h2h against a rather old and past prime Fed doesn't help his case at all.
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He doesn't need to tell me that, it's obvious from watching their matches.

And the fact that Fed still causes him all sorts of problems only highlights my point even more.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
He doesn't need to tell me that, it's obvious from watching their matches.

And the fact that Fed still causes him all sorts of problems only highlights my point even more.
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Now imagine Federer if he was 10 years younger. Would Djokovic still be the #1 player since 2011? Yeah no..
 
Sabratha said:
Now imagine Federer if he was 10 years younger. Would Djokovic still be the #1 player since 2011? Yeah no..
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Prob not, but he wouldn't be chopped liver either. It would have been quite a battle.
 
VexlanderPrime said:
Prob not, but he wouldn't be chopped liver either. It would have been quite a battle.
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I never said he'd be chopped liver. But he wouldn't be quite as good in my opinion. That's why he is a little more vulnerable to upsets than Federer was at his best post 2011.
 
Sabratha said:
Now imagine Federer if he was 10 years younger. Would Djokovic still be the #1 player since 2011? Yeah no..
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I don't need to imagine Federer if he were 10 years younger because unlike you I live in the here and now.


37cd60e90f3b6f6649cde6ec525232ad-getty-118137301.jpg
 
Djokovic2011 said:
I don't need to imagine Federer if he were 10 years younger because unlike you I live in the here and now.


37cd60e90f3b6f6649cde6ec525232ad-getty-118137301.jpg
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Is 2014 the "here and now" to you, or do you just live in the moment?

1 Nadal, Rafael (ESP) 14,330
2 Djokovic, Novak (SRB) 10,620
 
tennisaddict said:
So many players have 2 wimbledons.

So many players have 2 USO's.

So many players have 1 AO.

All time greats have all of this and more.

Rafa would like to be known as an "all time all surface" great and not a 'Clay Courter who enjoyed success outside".

Fed was No.1 at age 31, when Rafa, Novak and Murray were aged 24-26.
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How many of those players have a total of 14 slams and 9 RG?, not to even go into other stats.

Rafa doesn't need to prove himself on other surfaces more than Fed needs to prove himself on clay.

Credit to Fed on that.

Djokovic2011 said:
He doesn't need to tell me that, it's obvious from watching their matches.

And the fact that Fed still causes him all sorts of problems only highlights my point even more.
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It really doesn't.

Hasn't Novak lost the last three slams encounters against Rafa?. Maybe I'm misremembering.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
He doesn't need to tell me that, it's obvious from watching their matches.

And the fact that Fed still causes him all sorts of problems only highlights my point even more.
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Er... if I'm not mistaken it is Nadal who has beaten Djoko twice at USO over the last 5 years, not Fed. It's also Nadal who has pushed Djoko to a 5th at AO (as well as Murray and Wawa), not Fed...
 
Crisstti said:
It really doesn't.

Hasn't Novak lost the last three slams encounters against Rafa?. Maybe I'm misremembering.
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Yes, but best of 3 set matches are what take up most of the tour and I truly believe that Djokovic would prefer to play Nadal than Federer on 2/3 surfaces.
Not sure why you have such a problem with my saying that.
 
I tend to look at the most recent 2-ish year window as relevant.
 
veroniquem said:
Er... if I'm not mistaken it is Nadal who has beaten Djoko twice at USO over the last 5 years, not Fed. It's also Nadal who has pushed Djoko to a 5th at AO (as well as Murray and Wawa), not Fed...
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Yeah. Why on earth would Novak prefer to play Rafa on hc?. Doesn't Rafa have a better h2h against him on hc slams than Fed?.

Novak would only prefer to play Rafa on Wimbledon... nowadays. No wonder really.

Djokovic2011 said:
Yes, but best of 3 set matches are what take up most of the tour and I truly believe that Djokovic would prefer to play Nadal than Federer on 2/3 surfaces.
Not sure why you have such a problem with my saying that.
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I don't have a problem with it. I disagree. This is a forum so it's to have discussions such as this.

Why would Novak prefer to play Rafa on hc?.
 
Sabratha said:
I never said he'd be chopped liver. But he wouldn't be quite as good in my opinion. That's why he is a little more vulnerable to upsets than Federer was at his best post 2011.
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Definitely a fair point.

Djoker's career is at the tail of his prime, I'm interested to see the finish. He may never win another slam, he might win up to 8 more as his own competition gets weaker. Maybe some phenom will emerge instead and show him the door. Who knows? I think Fed fans are too quick to write him off and Djoker fans are waaaay to quick to assume a big finish.

Personally, it would be cool to see him play out of his mind and win a CYGS because I love to see elite athletes do historic things. Do I think its likely? No. Would I be just as happy if Fed or Rafa caught fire with a second wind and won a CYGS? Yep.

Enjoy the greatness of all these guys IMO. Once there gone we're gonna miss this era. Look at how lame things are after the top 3.
 
Crisstti said:
Yeah. Why on earth would Novak prefer to play Rafa on hc?. Doesn't Rafa have a better h2h against him on hc slams than Fed?.

Novak would only prefer to play Rafa on Wimbledon... nowadays. No wonder really.

.
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Definitely. It is really common sense that Djoko would pick Fed at both AO and USO (heck, Fed hasn't even taken a set off Djoko at AO since 2007!) At RG? No comment!!!! WTF is the place where I'm sure Djoko would pick Rafa. W too and probably Cincy/Paris/Shanghai.
 
Crisstti said:
I don't have a problem with it. I disagree. This is a forum so it's to have discussions such as this.

Why would Novak prefer to play Rafa on hc?.
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Because Nadal tends to give him the same ball over and over whereas Fed has a lot more variety which throws him off his rhythm, not to mention a much better serve.
 
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VexlanderPrime said:
Definitely a fair point.

Djoker's career is at the tail of his prime, I'm interested to see the finish. He may never win another slam, he might win up to 8 more as his own competition gets weaker. Maybe some phenom will emerge instead and show him the door. Who knows? I think Fed fans are too quick to write him off and Djoker fans are waaaay to quick to assume a big finish.

Personally, it would be cool to see him play out of his mind and win a CYGS because I love to see elite athletes do historic things. Do I think its likely? No. Would I be just as happy if Fed or Rafa caught fire with a second wind and won a CYGS? Yep.

Enjoy the greatness of all these guys IMO. Once there gone we're gonna miss this era. Look at how lame things are after the top 3.
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Djokovic will win more slams I am sure, but I don't think it will be enough to pass Nadal or Federer. He will have a very luxurious career by the time he is done though. Plenty of Masters, Grand Slam and WTF trophies.
 
Djokovic2011 said:
Because Nadal tends to give him the same ball over and over whereas Fed has a lot more variety which throws him off his rhythm, not to mention a much better serve.
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Yet he has at least as much trouble with Nadal as with Federer. And more so at the slams, both past and present.
 
Crisstti said:
Yeah. Why on earth would Novak prefer to play Rafa on hc?. Doesn't Rafa have a better h2h against him on hc slams than Fed?.

Novak would only prefer to play Rafa on Wimbledon... nowadays. No wonder really.
Click to expand...

Novak-Nadal HC slam h2h is 2 all
Novak-Federer HC slam h2h is 4 all


Crisstti said:
Why would Novak prefer to play Rafa on hc?.
Click to expand...

Novak-Nadal HC h2h = 14-7
Novak-Federer HC h2h = 12-13

djoko has 3 of the last encounters vs rafa on HC without losing a set ..

OTOH, federer has won 2 of the 3 last HC encounters vs djokovic ..
 
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Sabratha said:
Djokovic will win more slams I am sure, but I don't think it will be enough to pass Nadal or Federer. He will have a very luxurious career by the time he is done though. Plenty of Masters, Grand Slam and WTF trophies.
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Assuming no injuries I'd bet that he passes Nadal but short of a CYGS I don't see him passing Fed in terms of overall career. I think he's had tougher competition but Fed had TWO years as good or arguably better than Djoker's 2011, plus obv he'll have more slams overall. Djoker ain't getting to 17. So the only way Djoker really enters the Fed GOAT argument is if he gets a CYGS.

Nadal on the other hand, is an ATG across all surfaces but when you start talking about GOAT Careers, I can't match him up with Fed due to the clay-heavy slam count. He could change that with 2-3 more non-clay slams. Djoker's much more likely to end with a better career than Nads as opposed to Fed.

I also put alot more stock in Masters 1000s dominance, weeks #1 and WTF wins than the slam only folks do. Slam only is a silly concept.

Djoker really needs to show up at the Olympics too BTW to add that to his resume.
 
Nathaniel_Near said:
Not the best place?
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#Well, it's about time for #another of those #Novak#1 #photos to be #posted. #It happens about #every #twoorthree #pages in this #thread, as though, #someone has #something to #prove. #Or #not.

But then again, I guess #Andre #fans posted #Andre#1 #photos on the #heels of #PeteSamprasERA as #well, #which is what #Novakfans #are #essentially doing during on the #heels of #FedalERA whether #they #realize it or #not.

#Read #between the #hashtags, #kids.

#PTL #JC4Ever

AngieB​
 
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abmk said:
Novak-Nadal HC slam h2h is 2 all
Novak-Federer HC slam h2h is 4 all




Novak-Nadal HC h2h = 14-7
Novak-Federer HC h2h = 12-13

djoko has 3 of the last encounters vs rafa on HC without losing a set ..

OTOH, federer has won 2 of the 3 last HC encounters vs djokovic ..
Click to expand...

Nadal would rather play Fed on HC than Novak.

slam h2h Nadal 3 Federer 0
 
The_Order said:
Nadal would rather play Fed on HC than Novak.

slam h2h Nadal 3 Federer 0
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Irrelevant when it comes to Federer.

Novak dislikes playing them both. He knows both of them can beat him on their good days.
 
i never beleived in weak era myth, but now i have realized that that myth is a fact, federer has not won any slam recently but still ranked as no. 2. federer last slam win was 2012 wimbledon

the person who is injured most of time, is rank no. 3 currently
 
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Team10 said:
I really hate it when people say stuff like this. Djokovic has been around a long time, you can't just say since 2011, he's been doing this and that. You have to look at his career as a whole.

He might overtake both of them but that's a long ways away. Also, I said besides the big three, who do Fed and Nadal not like playing. Right now Djokovic is probably the hardest to beat for most players because of his style of play and that he's in his prime as opposed to Fed and Nadal.
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Vamos 8 years is no longer a long ways away, it is today the future AI. ChatDJGPT
 
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