MEP is back !!!!!

I dont understand your point.
I think still MOST of the good players want to construct points, use patterns
 
10sbeast888 said:
anybody who has basic understanding of tennis.

people who appreciate the MEP style likely just have some inferiority complex lol.

look - I do not deny it can be effective... but winning like this gives you nothing, other than winning.... players like this will never experience what it's like to rip a winner with 3k rpm, and feel the bone-crushing compression on the string bed... he will never feel what it's like to release a loaded shoulder and produce an effortless ace.

tennis is a lot more fun when you play correctly.
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See the thing is that dropping a perfectly weighted FH slice where your opponent has no chance to touch it is equally satisfying. Life is about both power and control.
 
austintennis2005 said:
People get sooo obsessed with “pusher” or “junk baller” etc…
It’s all about LEVEL.
If I’m 4.5 level and play 4.0 player it doesn’t matter if he is a pusher or hard hitter I will win every time.
If I play another true 4.5 it will be close match no matter what style he plays
If I play 5.0 player he will win every time no matter the style
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Totally agree.

But I think the fascination towards pusher/junkballer style of play is because they don't "appear" like they belog in that level. For example a 4.5 pusher does not look like he belog there, even when he has competitive matches with other 4.5. This deception factor is what amuses people.
 
toth said:
I think they goal is consract point
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dannyslicer said:
one more time than the opponent.
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Not sure what @toth is hinting here. But for sure MEV does "construct" a point his own way. He is not just getting another ball back, especially when he is in "control" of the point. Of course when he is in extreme defense, it is all about just getting another ball back. He mostly uses "vertical" change of placement when constructing the point, and his depth control is excellent compared to his peers at same level. This when added with his reduced pace, unorthodox spin, and varying height of balls deceives you into over committing on the shots. Opponent making mistake on shots he assumes he should not have, provides a big mental challenge during a competitive match.

Arguably a big hitter does not construct points as well as some one who does not have the firepower. Purely because big-hitter has enough firepower to finish the point in one shot or two shots, but someone who does not have such firepower, has to depend on constructing the point over 3 or 4 shots. This is why in clay court the point construction is a lot more obvious, since folks has to open of the court a lot more before can finish the point.
 
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He actually looks quite good in a few shots which makes me think he's something of a hustler. He hits with consistent underspin off both wings, his footwork is good, court coverage is excellent and almost all his 1st serves go in.

Its not surprising he beats weaker 4.5 players.
 
Morch Us said:
Totally agree.

But I think the fascination towards pusher/junkballer style of play is because they don't "appear" like they belog in that level. For example a 4.5 pusher does not look like he belog there, even when he has competitive matches with other 4.5. This deception factor is what amuses people.
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Agree but it’s rare that people don’t know the appx level or UTR of opponents in todays age
If I’m playing someone I don’t know and see UTR 6 or 7 I know they are solid.
 
Morch Us said:
Opponent making mistake on shots he assumes he should not have, provides a big mental challenge during a competitive match.
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To extend on this topic... this is why it is so important to learn to "appreciate" the skills of your pusher opponent. If you understand that, it was a good shot (that low paced unothodox spinning shot you missed by overcommitting), you passed one mental hurdle, and won't go down on a spiral path.
 
Jono123 said:
He actually looks quite good in a few shots which makes me think he's something of a hustler. He hits with consistent underspin off both wings, his footwork is good, court coverage is excellent and almost all his 1st serves go in.

Its not surprising he beats weaker 4.5 players.
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I see his serve weak
 
FuzzyYellowBalls said:
That is 100 % correct, although I didn't watch the video I am pretty confident, although out of curiosity what did Ian claim?
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Ybh you were probably right to not watch the video because it was kinda fluffed with content a bit. If I didn't need to be lying on my back releasing tension from my overworked scapular muscles I might not have either. Ian of course provided the 60% at 4.5 statistic then clarified that Atlanta is "one of the biggest, strongest, if not the biggest, strongest, tennis communities in the US". This naturally would run counter to your insinuation that the rankings people enjoy there are inflated relative to their actual level of play.
 
Jono123 said:
He actually looks quite good in a few shots which makes me think he's something of a hustler. He hits with consistent underspin off both wings, his footwork is good, court coverage is excellent and almost all his 1st serves go in.

Its not surprising he beats weaker 4.5 players.
Click to expand...


He is definitely way better than an untrained eye would think, very accurate, mentally tough, almost deceptive in a way to some, but beating any 4.5s has become a struggle lately, I'd say he returned to the mean or average and the earlier 4.5 dominance was an outlier, but that's my opinion based on the difference in level I see in the video 4.5s and the ones I see in postseason USTA team play and on teams gunning for glory.



One random thought I had was a lot of team USTA players who are singles rocks avoid all competition to preserve their rating (or lose on purpose to preserve it)
so there are these armies of 4.5 players just hiding out (some at 4.0 too), but then it leads to a discussion about what is a real 4.5 or 4.0 player, and the NTRP rating becomes a group with a very high top and low bottom.
 
optic yellow said:
Ybh you were probably right to not watch the video because it was kinda fluffed with content a bit. If I didn't need to be lying on my back releasing tension from my overworked scapular muscles I might not have either. Ian of course provided the 60% at 4.5 statistic then clarified that Atlanta is "one of the biggest, strongest, if not the biggest, strongest, tennis communities in the US". This naturally would run counter to your insinuation that the rankings people enjoy there are inflated relative to their actual level of play.
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Oh! That makes sense, yeah that stat might be a little old or outdated based on what some have private messaged me, but oh well, it makes the whole presentation have more pizazz or "wow" factor for some.
 
optic yellow said:
See the thing is that dropping a perfectly weighted FH slice where your opponent has no chance to touch it is equally satisfying. Life is about both power and control.
Click to expand...

most high levels play top as there is a limit on the velocity of a slice due to the lack of dip. this is further exacerbated by the polys that give massive reward for very little risk when you rip topspins.

there is a correct way to play tennis. which is what's surviving on the tour.

the 'correct way' maybe different at 4.0, but isn't that's why we are here, to get to a higher level.
 
FuzzyYellowBalls said:
Oh! That makes sense, yeah that stat might be a little old or outdated based on what some have private messaged me, but oh well, it makes the whole presentation have more pizazz or "wow" factor for some.
Click to expand...
Well that is the whole content creation game, just like it was when Willie Randolph H. was trying to sell papers around the fin de siecle. But I don't think you can necessarily expect people to know different when you are talking from privately messaged information you haven't shared in depth with the audience. That said I don't see why there has to be so much uncertainty here as I thought UTSA match results were all tracked and available online.
 
10sbeast888 said:
most high levels play top as there is a limit on the velocity of a slice due to the lack of dip. this is further exacerbated by the polys that give massive reward for very little risk when you rip topspins.

there is a correct way to play tennis. which is what's surviving on the tour.

the 'correct way' maybe different at 4.0, but isn't that's why we are here, to get to a higher level.
Click to expand...
Yes slicing is about winning with placement, not winning with power. This is a concept you see executed by the true top players on tour, generally something which distinguishes them from their peers. Alcaraz for example loves to rip hard DTL but he's also extremely good at taking power off the ball to go for shorter targets with angle.
 
optic yellow said:
Yes slicing is about winning with placement, not winning with power. This is a concept you see executed by the true top players on tour, generally something which distinguishes them from their peers. Alcaraz for example loves to rip hard DTL but he's also extremely good at taking power off the ball to go for shorter targets with angle.
Click to expand...

you are switching topic.

at the top level slices are used for change of pace, variety.... this thread is about a 4.0 who has never hit a topspin ball all career lol.
 
dannyslicer said:
1 out of 50 tennis players are in the USTA sample.
Statistics is hard
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If I understand you correctly, you are saying MEP is still top 1% if you count all the 5 year olds who joined a kids camp, and housewives who play social doubles etc.

nice going lol.

still not changing the fact that your hero is a 4.0
 
10sbeast888 said:
you are switching topic.

at the top level slices are used for change of pace, variety.... this thread is about a 4.0 who has never hit a topspin ball all career lol.
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I mean I don't disagree that the slice game is far more effective when you have a real topspin groundstroke to pair with it. That threat opens up so many opportunities for the junk.
 
FuzzyYellowBalls said:
I think a video showdown featuring @dannyslicer vs. @10sbeast888 is what the world needs.

Although 10sbeast888 is a hard name to guess who might be behind it, sounds like a younger person's choice for a username, I could be wrong, you guys need to play.
Click to expand...

would love to meet fellow tt'ers to talk shop. I am also semi-retired and can travel at any time... sure if any interesting situation arises..
 
GSG said:
It's probably better if I don't say anything- I might accidently veer from innocuous information into spoilers, which I have been asked to avoid.
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I hope you are being fairly compensated for your NIL (Name, Image, Likeness).
 
Pushers who put the ball only in the middle of the court do well only at lower levels where their opponents don’t have weapons to put away those balls and leak a high number of UFEs. But soft hitting players who can precisely place the ball where they want close to the lines including on serves can do well at 4.5 levels because they make the opponent run and they dictate point patterns with placement instead of pace - everyone misses more if you make them run and hit on the move all the time. Such a player can be a mental chore to play against for many opponents who may mentally give up if they lose the first set.

If a soft hitting player with precise placement also uses underspin a lot, they can be krypotinite for older opponents who have balky knees that make it more difficult for them to move up/down and play low balls all the time. If you look at higher ranked players who do well in Open age group tournaments in the 50+, 55+, 60+, 65+ categories and have 4.5 ratings, you are going to see a lot of them with styles resembling GSG - precise placement, soft hitting with slice, good movement for their age group etc.

Lower level players are more likely to under-rate opponents who can serve and hit balls consistently close to the lines without missing because those players don’t exist at low levels and have moved up to advanced levels already. So, it might be harder for them to appreciate why GSG wins at the level that he wins at. But I also agree with one of the posters above who said that higher rated players will win most matches irrespective of style and just style itself doesn‘t win or lose matches.
 
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socallefty said:
Pushers who put the ball only in the middle of the court do well only at lower levels where their opponents don’t have weapons to put away those balls and leak a high number of UFEs. But soft hitting players who can precisely place the ball where they want including close to the lines including on serves can do well at 4.5 levels because they make the opponent run and they dictate point patterns with placement instead of pace - everyone misses more if you make them run and hit on the move all the time. Such a player can be a mental chore to play against for many opponents and they may mentally give up if they lose the first set.

If a soft hitting player with precise placement also uses underspin a lot, they can be krypotinite for older opponents who have balky knees that make it more difficult for them to move up/down and play low balls all the time. If you look at higher ranked players who do well in Open age group tournaments in the 50+, 55+, 60+, 65+ categories and have 4.5 ratings, you are going to see a lot of them with styles resembling GSG - precise placement, soft hitting with slice, good movement for their age group etc.

Lower level players are more likely to under-rate opponents who can serve and hit balls consistently close to the lines without missing because those players don’t exist at low levels and have moved up to advanced levels already. So, it might be harder for them to appreciate why GSG wins at the level that he wins at. But I also agree with one of the posters above who said that higher rated players will win most matches irrespective of style and just style itself doesn‘t win or lose matches.
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And shockingly the same principle holds true in major ATP tournaments :eek:

It is the first (or zeroth if you are a nerd) law of tennis: placement is victory.
 
socallefty said:
Lower level players are more likely to under-rate opponents who can serve and hit balls consistently close to the lines without missing because those players don’t exist at low levels and have moved up to advanced levels already. So, it might be harder for them to appreciate why GSG wins at the level that he wins at. But I also agree with one of the posters above who said that higher rated players will win most matches irrespective of style and just style itself doesn‘t win or lose matches.
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Perfect description of @10sbeast888
 
Daniel Andrade said:
The point is this: If you don't beat a guy like this, which you called garbage, then what does that make you?
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lol I forgive you my child:)

work with me on the other thread to improve your game, along with your partner, you will eventually appreciate the tennis knowledge from the 10sBeast.

I have helped several 3.0/3.5 type and have made them 4.0's.... to create a pool of decent players locally so everybody can have good hits.
 
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