MgR/I

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
just checking my understanding. Lead T the hoop causes the swing to slow down at contact and lead at 7" causes the racquet to speed up? And the goal is to tune so the racquet face is neither lagging or speeding up at contact??

Assuming i have that right, if you have a spinny game with say a western fh would nt you want the racquet to speed up at contact??
 

Crie

Rookie
just checking my understanding. Lead T the hoop causes the swing to slow down at contact and lead at 7" causes the racquet to speed up? And the goal is to tune so the racquet face is neither lagging or speeding up at contact??

Assuming i have that right, if you have a spinny game with say a western fh would nt you want the racquet to speed up at contact??
My understanding of MgR/I is that it is the angular frequency around the axis of a double pendalum. Or in English - how fast the racquet comes through the wrist.

What @travlerajm (correct me if I'm wrong) is saying is that when you hit a tennis ball (with a racquet that is not tuned to your MgR/I), the stringbed of the racquet will sometimes be misalinged to and you apply tension to your wrist to compensate for that misalignment. This tension to the wrist --> more stiff --> less power --> bad match.

Basically finding MgR/I will help keep the racquet inline to the ball for more accuracy while using a loose grip.

If you have a racquet that is tuned to your MgR/I, you will be able to have a loose grip on the handle and be able to swing with MRHS and still be able to hit a target on the court with accuracy.

So with that all out of the way, time for your question.

I'm guessing that MgR/I is a ratio of Mass, SW, Balance and by finding your "hotspot" in the ratio. Again @travlerajm correct me if I'm wrong. If the racquet face is too fast at contact then, with a relaxed wrist, you should be hitting the ball 90degrees from where you want to hit it. Basically the ball will fly left, if you are a right. Just left. If the racquet face is too lagged/slow at contact then you will be hitting balls slightly left, remember you have a completely relaxed wrist. Obviously you can apply force to your wrist to correct the racquet face if it is too lagged/fast but how the f*** are you going to measure force applied to the wrist consistently? You can't, infact nobody can.

MgR/I deals with accuracy and power and the easiest way to obtain it. MgR/I uses a relaxed wrist as a constant and Mass, SW, Balance, GripType(E,SW,FW), arm length etc... as variables.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
I believe there are optimum spots for MgR/I. Also what I can notice that in some cases, when you go north of MgR/I optimum spot, a racquet can actually became inert to swing, while 'theory' say it will speed up.
I experienced ti again yesterday. I used added 4 grams of lead at the bottom of the throat, to the hole right next to the top of the handle, on a racquet which I suspected was not perfectly tuned for MgR/I in reality. (this spot is otherwise one of the optimal places for MgR/I increase). Yet racquet became more sluggish and I had to pull it off during warmup, after I did it it became easier to swing.

I experienced similar effect with heavier grips in certain cases. But from current perspective, it seems to happen on a heavier setup, when MgR/is overdone (possibly if higher than 21.1), which doesn't seem logical (you would expect racquet just becomes faster and faster through swing as MgR/I increases) yet I see it can happen in practice.

So, while higher MgR/I generally increases speed through swing, IMO you always need a personal fine tuning to find a good MgR/I spot, just 0.1 off of this spot can make it significantly worse, sometimes it gets too inert, sometimes too fast, and generally much harder to time your shots.
 

Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
Look at the formula MgR/I, if you take out gravity (which is a constant 980.5) you end up with M(R/I.) So what the formula is saying is that for a specific weight you should have a specific ratio of R/I.

If you have a 350 gram racket or .35 kg your ratio (R/I) must be a specific value to get a specific value. In this case Mg (.35*980.5) is 343.175 so you must have a ratio of radius to inertia of 0.06119 to get an MgR/I of 21. If you want a value grater than 21 you ratio must be higher and vice-a-versa.

So what happens if your original MgR/I is low and you want to raise it to some higher value? Add mass to 7"? If you do your total weight goes up, your balance goes down and (believe it or not) your inertia stays pretty much the same. The inertia stays pretty much the same because the radius dropped putting the balance point closer to the pivot. So you end result is the racket gets heavier, and the heavier your racket is the harder it is to swing.

IMO it is far better to begin by selecting the total mass and SW you want then tune the balance and inertia (SW at butt of racket is your inertia) to give you the MgR/I value you think is right for you. Then there's no need to add additional mass to arrive at the MgR/I value you want.

EDIT: Assuming you want a weight of 350 grams and a balance of 32 cm what I is right for you? Simple R/I=0.06119 solve for I.

EDIT: To address your quetion specifically, adding mass to the frame anywhere will slow the racket down or require more force to accelerate it. If you have a spinny game you want to find a mass, balance, and SW combination that suits your game. Many people add mass to head or butt of the racket and want to know how much to add to the other end to 'counterbalance' it. MgR/I gives you a process to figure that out.

Some people add mass to the head to get the SW they want then add mass to the butt to get the balance or total weight they want and end up with a very low MgR/I value. Then they add mass to 7" in the hope of getting an MgR/I value of 21 and a faster racket. All I can say is good luck with that.
 
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Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
@Shroud from your signature you have 362 g, SW of 400, and a balance of 4 points HL. The balance does not say but if your racket is 27" long you balance is 33.02 cm from the butt. If your racket is 26" long your balance is 31.75 cm from the butt. Assuming your racket is 27" long your MgR/I is 19.44. in order to add mass to 7" you would have to add about 90 grams to get your MgR/I up to 21 and in doing so you would have a 452 g racket with a SW of 405, and a balance of 29.9 cm. I doubt you could swing that racket faster.

EDIT: If you want to keep your weight and SW the same you would have to raise your balance to ~37.7
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
just checking my understanding. Lead T the hoop causes the swing to slow down at contact and lead at 7" causes the racquet to speed up? And the goal is to tune so the racquet face is neither lagging or speeding up at contact??

Assuming i have that right, if you have a spinny game with say a western fh would nt you want the racquet to speed up at contact??
While it sounds like a good thing to have excess angular velocity at your disposal, in reality it's not.

If your MgR/I is very much beyond your optimal value, then the only consistent way you will be able to control the ball is to hit with a huge uppercut. This might be fine for balls that are not moving fast, but it poses a problem for faster moving balls (e.g., shanking on returns). To be a good returner, you need to be able to hit with a more horizontal swingpath while keeping the racquetface perpendicular to the line toward your target. If your MgR/I is too high, the only way to do that is to use your wrist muscles to actually pull backward on the handle to keep the angular velocity in check. That's not very easy, and it tends to kill your power too, as you are fighting against the motion of the racquet. This might be what Zalive is noticing.

It's also the reason why stock racquets tend to have MgR/I values lower than optimal. MgR/I is a little like The Price is Right game: if you go too high, control and power go out the window. If it's too low, at least you can add torque from the wrist in the same direction that the racquet is already going.
 
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zalive

Hall of Fame
Recently I've unintentionally overdone MgR/I (intended value was 21). I don't have a measured SW so I'm not sure by how much (I obviously overestimated its actual SW when calculating customization) - I guess MgR/I was certainly at the point > 21.1, possibly > 21.15. Weight of a setup was at the time 359 grams, with balance at 33.5 cm. Customization was done on Ti Radical MP.

Anyway, what happened is that racquet actually became some harder to swing. I didn't experience that much the timing error (swing being too fast), but instead I found setup less easy to accelerate.
I had to take off whole 6 grams from 7'' to make it whippy (MgR/I this time came close enough to 21).

I wanted to post this to state that IME MgR/I increase doesn't always bring the sensation of speeding up the swing and generally making a racquet easier to swing. Seems that at least in certain conditions counter effect can emerge with MgR/I > 21.1, while generally it is true that lead at 7'' or throat (or a dampener) speeds up the swing, and lead at the upper hoop slows it down.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
I estimate SW. I calculate approximate SW it by using stock SW from specs, then calculate SW increase through customization. If I feel stock specs are off and SW on mine is different, I'll compensate stock SW number by estimation. It's not accurate SW, however it's good enough for purpose, as it can give me a basic orientation for a start customization point. From there I customize lead exclusively by hitting experience. I see how it feels to swing and how accurate I am on timing when hitting with it.

Realistically as for the estimated SW, I'll be within error margin of 10 units from realistic SW. Which is not little when calculating MgR/I, but still not too much for a start customization.
 
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zalive

Hall of Fame
Calculated MgR/I through estimated SW, once when I'm satisfied with customization, is usually 21 +/- 0.1. Eventually 21 +/- 0.15. Though bit more likely on the minus side. So my prefered MgR/I value might be between 20.90 and 20.95.
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
I used to make the mistake of assuming stock racquet swingweight could be accurately estimated from the specs. When I started measuring, I found that tolerances were much worse than I had assumed.

Some of my frames are more than 20 kg-cm^2 under the specified swingweight in stock form, and some are 15-20 kg-cm^2 over the spec.

That said, I've personally found that tuning the mgr/I to my 'torque neutral' optimum, which for me is 21.0 spot on, is just as accurate of a way to measure the swingweight as timing pendulum sweeps.
 
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zalive

Hall of Fame
Of course there are such.
But you can make a rough estimation of whether specified stock SW makes sense or not for your racquet, by comparing specified weight and balance vs. your actual weight and balance.
You can also measure the hitting weight, weight of the head side of your racquet.
Doing this helps me get a better estimation of SW than just relying on specs.
I'd gladly measure SW, but atm I don't have easily accessible method of measuring SW with satisfactory accuracy. I don't find methods like manual timing of 10 swings accurate enough to rely on them.
And in the end I don't care that much about numbers, I care how I play with the setup, and fine tuning is always based on hitting experience, not on numbers.
 
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travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
In other words, it's possible to accurately measure the swingweight of any racquet to within +/- 1 unit with only an accurate kitchen scale, a ruler, and a reel of lead tape. Stopwatch not required.
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
If you know your optimal mgr/I value , and you know how to recognize what it feels like when it is perfect ( I.e., the sensation of zero torque ) when you rotate your body and let the racquet swing like a golf club. This of course requires having spent the time in the past to have accurately measured swingweight on an mgr/I optimized frame in order to know your optimum mgr/I value in the first place.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
Oh, I supposed you might say this...
I know, but I wouldn't trust myself to be accurate to +/- 1 SW unit haha...within some 5 units margin, that certainly :)

I usually tune the racquet by lead at the top of the handle with 2 g increments. Further from this, I fine tune it by moving the position of the dampener between next to 6 o'clock hoop and first cross string (I don't actually care to necessarily hit the nod with a dampener, my setups are usually either muted or with gentle feedback in the end). Lately I've been using 6 grams dampeners, they have some serious power for fine tuning MgR/I.

And true, I don't know my exact perfect MgR/I value. I only suspect it might be close to 20.95.
 

esgee48

Legend
Do a search on RacquetTune in the Apple Store. Sten sells the app for $2.99 and it is up to version 6.1 as of 3-29-2017. Measure string tension, DT and SW. On Sten's website, there is also a MgR/I calculator. Why guess when for $2.99, you know within +/- 1 kg/cm^2.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
Unfortunately no iPhone or iPad, I use Android...seems there's no SW measuring for Android users...
 

Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
Do a search on RacquetTune in the Apple Store. Sten sells the app for $2.99 and it is up to version 6.1 as of 3-29-2017. Measure string tension, DT and SW. On Sten's website, there is also a MgR/I calculator. Why guess when for $2.99, you know within +/- 1 kg/cm^2.
Sten no longer has an MgR/I Calculator on his website that works.

If you don't have an iOS device I would at least use the TW SW Calculator.
 

Lukhas

Legend
@travlerajm : Do you know if adding weight at 7" changes anything in terms of recoil weight? To give it some context, I usually play with a rather heavy (around 19g) synthetic grip. I also have Wilson Featherthin grips (which I do like). They are around 10g lighter than the other grip I use. However, when using Featherthin, the recoil of the racquet is terrible. To test MgR/I, I decided to simply wrap a 5-6g overgrip at the top of the handle. I wondered if doing so improved recoil weight, which would allow me to use the Featherthin grips.
 
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Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
@Lukhas RW goes up by the mass you add times the square of the distance from balance point to the point you add the lead. Assuming you add 5 g at 17.78 cm and you had a 32 cm balance your RW goes up by 1 point.
 

Lukhas

Legend
@Lukhas RW goes up by the mass you add time the square of the distance from balance point to the point you add the lead.
Considering that the average balance point of about any racquet is relatively close to 7", it means that there won't be much increase in recoil weight unless you add a metric ton of lead tape. Alright, thanks.
 

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
Considering that the average balance point of about any racquet is relatively close to 7", it means that there won't be much increase in recoil weight unless you add a metric ton of lead tape. Alright, thanks.
Make sure you are adding in small increments of say 100g to build up to that weight. A metric ton is more than you think. The one time i added that much all at once it really messed up my elbow. Best to work up slowly
 

Lukhas

Legend
A metric ton? LOL try something a little more reasonable. What are you starting specs?
Merely an exaggeration; just meant that adding weight at 7" won't have as dramatic of an effect towards recoil weight as adding at the poles (buttcap and under the bumperguard).

As for the specs, no clue, I don't have an unstrung, ungripped racquet with me right now. However, I can tell you what the specs were unstrung when I bought them: 319g, 274SW, 30.9cm balance. I removed the dampener, which weights 7g and is located halfway up the fame at around 34cm (that's where I took the weight I "moved" down at 7"). According to the customization worksheet tool, this lowers the SW by 4 units. According to the grip specs thread, the original grip, ResiPro, weights 14g. Mine weights 19g and FeatherThin 9g.
According to the Customization Worksheet too, it brings us to around 298g, 270SW and 32.5 cm balance.
Make sure you are adding in small increments of say 100g to build up to that weight. A metric ton is more than you think. The one time i added that much all at once it really messed up my elbow. Best to work up slowly
You mean your shoulder didn't tear itself first? Must be made of something special. Perhaps you could loan it to Tommy Haas, heard he's looking for a working rotator cuff.
 

BA10S

Rookie
Do a search on RacquetTune in the Apple Store. Sten sells the app for $2.99 and it is up to version 6.1 as of 3-29-2017. Measure string tension, DT and SW. On Sten's website, there is also a MgR/I calculator. Why guess when for $2.99, you know within +/- 1 kg/cm^2.
I've been using SwingTool (which I think from your description is part of RacquetTune) for some time now and can't recommend it enough. Actually, I think I'll buy RacquetTune as well. I've never used an RDC machine but considering that SwingTool returns a SW measurement within a 1 kg*cm^2 range every time (I input mass as 10x what I measure and then divide the resulting SW by 10 to show the result to 0.1 kg*cm^2), I don't see how it could provide a more accurate result. I also make 10 measurements and then use the mean of those measurements. The only possible advantages of an RDC are that it's a bit faster and easier to use (especially for unstrung racquets) and can measure a racquet's RA flex rating. I'd also include the fact that an RDC comes with a balance board, but from what I've seen it doesn't seem very well designed and I'd never use it.
 

Crie

Rookie
I just want to do an update on MgR/I for extreme grips. I lost some lead tape at 12(its rainy where I live) and I didn't notice it until now. Looking back, it probably should have screwed up my MgR/I significantly (I use Full Western/Very Polarized). However I didn't notice any difference, not by feel atleast.

I'm going to conluclude, atm, that with an extreme under the handle grip in combination with a highly polarized frame, MgR/I seems to have a small affect in accuracy.
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
I just want to do an update on MgR/I for extreme grips. I lost some lead tape at 12(its rainy where I live) and I didn't notice it until now. Looking back, it probably should have screwed up my MgR/I significantly (I use Full Western/Very Polarized). However I didn't notice any difference, not by feel atleast.

I'm going to conluclude, atm, that with an extreme under the handle grip in combination with a highly polarized frame, MgR/I seems to have a small affect in accuracy.
You will only notice the effect of MgR/I on accuracy when comparing two different setups if one of the two setups is perfectly tuned to your optimum value, and the other is not. If neither is perfectly tuned, then you are unlikely to notice much difference.
 

esgee48

Legend
I've been using SwingTool (which I think from your description is part of RacquetTune) for some time now and can't recommend it enough. Actually, I think I'll buy RacquetTune as well. I've never used an RDC machine but considering that SwingTool returns a SW measurement within a 1 kg*cm^2 range every time (I input mass as 10x what I measure and then divide the resulting SW by 10 to show the result to 0.1 kg*cm^2), I don't see how it could provide a more accurate result. I also make 10 measurements and then use the mean of those measurements. The only possible advantages of an RDC are that it's a bit faster and easier to use (especially for unstrung racquets) and can measure a racquet's RA flex rating. I'd also include the fact that an RDC comes with a balance board, but from what I've seen it doesn't seem very well designed and I'd never use it.
You can get the SW of an unstrung frame. All you need is to temporarily string the 2 center mains and at least the 1st 1 or 2 crosses. Just weigh the mass of the frame with the 3 or 4 strings. Once you can hang the racquet and get it to swing, you're good to go.
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
You will only notice the effect of MgR/I on accuracy when comparing two different setups if one of the two setups is perfectly tuned to your optimum value, and the other is not. If neither is perfectly tuned, then you are unlikely to notice much difference.
I agree. It's when you hit your MgR/I spot, this is when you feel a difference compared to anything else.
However I did hate it with one setup, when MgR/I was too high (that time I didn't initially care to correct it). For some reason it was very difficult for me to time my shots with that setup and I was missing a lot.
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
I agree. It's when you hit your MgR/I spot, this is when you feel a difference compared to anything else.
However I did hate it with one setup, when MgR/I was too high (that time I didn't initially care to correct it). For some reason it was very difficult for me to time my shots with that setup and I was missing a lot.
That's why stock racquets tend to have lower-than-optimal MgR/I (as opposed to too high).
 

Crie

Rookie
You will only notice the effect of MgR/I on accuracy when comparing two different setups if one of the two setups is perfectly tuned to your optimum value, and the other is not. If neither is perfectly tuned, then you are unlikely to notice much difference.
I had it tuned perfectly to 20.75. Thats about a month of trial and error finding the hotspot. I lost some(lead at 12) either yesterday or the day before, but didn't notice it was missing until now. The racquet felt no different. Maybe its was just placebo toying with me.
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
I had it tuned perfectly to 20.75. Thats about a month of trial and error finding the hotspot. I lost some(lead at 12) either yesterday or the day before, but didn't notice it was missing until now. The racquet felt no different. Maybe its was just placebo toying with me.
You should also keep in mind that a racquet's MgR/I value can change on a daily basis if you are using strings that are not settled in and stable.
When you string a racquet, most of the time it will be slightly shortened by a mm or two, because the mains are tighter than the crosses (assuming you string at same reference tension). If you don't prestretch your strings, then the mains will gradually lengthen as the strings age, and the MgR/I will typically go down enough to notice (if you tuned to your optimum). Losing the lead might have restored your original tuned MgR/I value, or not.
 

Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
I've never used an RDC machine but considering that SwingTool returns a SW measurement within a 1 kg*cm^2 range every time (I input mass as 10x what I measure and then divide the resulting SW by 10 to show the result to 0.1 kg*cm^2),
I use a scale the measures the wieght in hundredths of a gram. I round off the weight to the nearest tenth multiply by 10 and input the weight in ST. I then divide the SW by ten to get the SW to 1/10. I think it is very accurate.
 
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10shoe

Professional
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BlueB

Legend
just checking my understanding. Lead T the hoop causes the swing to slow down at contact and lead at 7" causes the racquet to speed up? And the goal is to tune so the racquet face is neither lagging or speeding up at contact??

Assuming i have that right, if you have a spinny game with say a western fh would nt you want the racquet to speed up at contact??
Shroud,

It's other way round, with more polarised (lead at top of the hoop) the racquet will lag at first, but then go quicker through contact. With depolarised (mass closer to the middle of the racquet) it will be steadier but slower trough the contact.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
Shroud,

It's other way round, with more polarised (lead at top of the hoop) the racquet will lag at first, but then go quicker through contact. With depolarised (mass closer to the middle of the racquet) it will be steadier but slower trough the contact.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
The laws of physics say otherwise.
 

BlueB

Legend
The laws of physics say otherwise.
Not really...
Mass on longer lever will have more inertia, right? So it will lag more until it started moving fast, then it will move longer once it was propelled to the speed equivalent to other system on shorter lever.
This is why most of people claim that polarised racquet hits more top spin then non-polarised of similar specs...

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
This is why most of people claim that polarised racquet hits more top spin then non-polarised of similar specs...
Someone should precisely define what is a 'similar specs' when comparing polarized and standard racquet (even mass distribution).
Is it the same SW? In which case standard racquet will have significantly higher static weight - in which case I'm not convinced it would provide less spin.
Or is it the same static weight? In which case standard racquet will have inferior SW (and of course it will provide less spin and less power as well, by the laws of physics).
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
Not really...
Mass on longer lever will have more inertia, right? So it will lag more until it started moving fast, then it will move longer once it was propelled to the speed equivalent to other system on shorter lever.
This is why most of people claim that polarised racquet hits more top spin then non-polarised of similar specs...

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
I'm the one that is guilty of first introducing the idea that "polarized" racquets are more spin-friendly. My original thread on the topic was deleted more than a decade ago, and actually had some useful info. But apparently, the concept has been adopted and passed around over the forum over the years, and mutated and misrepresented more and more with each re-telling over and over again.

I assure you that the reason polarized racquets are often more spin-friendly has absolutely nothing to do with what you just wrote.
 

Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
Someone should precisely define what is a 'similar specs' when comparing polarized and standard racquet (even mass distribution)...
If a racket had even mass distribution at the center of mass the inertia of the racket would be the same as a uniform rod. For a uniform rod that weighs 350 g Icm or RW = 1/12mL^2 = 1/12*0.35*68.58*68.58 = 131.2 Kgcm*2 and the SW would be SW = Icm + mr^2 = 131.2 + 0.35*24.29*24.29 = 337.7 kgcm^2
 

BlueB

Legend
Someone should precisely define what is a 'similar specs' when comparing polarized and standard racquet (even mass distribution).
Is it the same SW? In which case standard racquet will have significantly higher static weight - in which case I'm not convinced it would provide less spin.
Or is it the same static weight? In which case standard racquet will have inferior SW (and of course it will provide less spin and less power as well, by the laws of physics).
Ok, let's then call them the same in every aspect, W, SW, balance, only different mass distribution (different MgR/I.
When I said similar, I really meant a gram or two up or down, or a point of SW, but for cleaner discussion, let's keep it to MgR/I difference only.

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Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
Ok, let's then call them the same in every aspect, W, SW, balance, only different mass distribution (different MgR/I.
When I said similar, I really meant a gram or two up or down, or a point of SW, but for cleaner discussion, let's keep it to MgR/I difference only.

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What you're saying if the Mass is the same you're only looking at the ratio of balance to inertia taking out the mass and gravity. But not sure where you're going with this.
 

Crie

Rookie
I'm the one that is guilty of first introducing the idea that "polarized" racquets are more spin-friendly. My original thread on the topic was deleted more than a decade ago, and actually had some useful info. But apparently, the concept has been adopted and passed around over the forum over the years, and mutated and misrepresented more and more with each re-telling over and over again.

I assure you that the reason polarized racquets are often more spin-friendly has absolutely nothing to do with what you just wrote.
Wait but the reason polarized racquets give more spin is because they are more maneuverable right?
 

zalive

Hall of Fame
Ok, let's then call them the same in every aspect, W, SW, balance, only different mass distribution (different MgR/I.
When I said similar, I really meant a gram or two up or down, or a point of SW, but for cleaner discussion, let's keep it to MgR/I difference only.
It's controversial, you can recognize a polarized setup by higher than usual SW to weight ratio. If it's not higher than usual, it's not polarized either.
The idea of polarized is to provide high SW with less static weight. Meaningful comparison for me would be polarized vs normal with both having the same SW, since SW is the power and spin potential when hitting, not the static mass by itself.

Wait but the reason polarized racquets give more spin is because they are more maneuverable right?
If SW's are the same, with polarized setup being lighter (lower static weight), the question is...is it more maneuverable really?
@travlerajm what does your experience tell you in this respect?
 
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Irvin

Talk Tennis Guru
Ok, let's then call them the same in every aspect, W, SW, balance, only different mass distribution (different MgR/I.
When I said similar, I really meant a gram or two up or down, or a point of SW, but for cleaner discussion, let's keep it to MgR/I difference only.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
What you're saying if the Mass is the same you're only looking at the ratio of balance to inertia taking out the mass and gravity. But not sure where you're going with this.
@zalive if you want to keep of ratio of R/I constant and mass the same the only way to do that is to redistribute the weight in such a manner that the balance goes down and the inertia goes down.
 

travlerajm

G.O.A.T.
Ok, let's then call them the same in every aspect, W, SW, balance, only different mass distribution (different MgR/I.
When I said similar, I really meant a gram or two up or down, or a point of SW, but for cleaner discussion, let's keep it to MgR/I difference only.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk
If two racquets have the same mass, balance, and swingweight, then - by definition - MgR/I is also the same.

However, the mass distributions can still be quite different, giving different feel, impact dynamics, and spin response.
 
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