More impressive pet project: Laver Cup or Rafa Nadal Academy

octogon

Hall of Fame
Federer and Nadal have both created these very different legacy projects, but which one do you consider more impressive? Rafa Nadal Academy, which is turning into something of a franchise, with different campuses around the world (and recently produced a French Open Champion in Iga Swiatek, who trained at the Manacor site):



Or The Laver Cup, Federer's invitational tournament:

 

octogon

Hall of Fame
The Academy.

Yeah. I feel the Academy is becoming a major resource to the sport, that has a real purpose. Everyone wants to train there (even Bjorn Borg is sending his son Leo there) and in the case of Swiatek, it is starting to help develop champions.

I still don't know what the Laver Cup's place is in the tennis calender beyond being a very well marketed exhibition tournament.
 

daggerman

Hall of Fame
I don't really have an opinion on which is more impressive since they're such different undertakings, but I am very impressed by Rafa's academy. They've produced some excellent players in a short amount of time, and I expect their influence on professional tennis to grow significantly over time.

Laver Cup is a pretty enjoyable event even despite the current chasm in talent between Europe and the rest of the world. When (if) that chasm ever closes, Laver Cup will become even more electric.
 

ND-13

Hall of Fame
Rafa Nadal Academy - Goal is to earn revenue
Laver Cup - Goal to honor Rod Laver, Borg and McEnroe
 

xFedal

Legend
Yeah. I feel the Academy is becoming a major resource to the sport, that has a real purpose. Everyone wants to train there (even Bjorn Borg is sending his son Leo there) and in the case of Swiatek, it is starting to help develop champions.

I still don't know what the Laver Cup's place is in the tennis calender beyond being a very well marketed exhibition tournament.
$250,000 To each member of the winning team, Rafa has benefited from this as well.
 

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Federer and Nadal have both created these very different legacy projects, but which one do you consider more impressive? Rafa Nadal Academy, which is turning into something of a franchise, with different campuses around the world (and recently produced a French Open Champion in Iga Swiatek, who trained at the Manacor site):



Or The Laver Cup, Federer's invitational tournament:

The Laver Cup is just a 3-day entertainment event held once a year.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
OP realizing all those RG aren't enough in the GOAT debate :laughing:
You have lost it. Rafa getting #20 has truly made you go bonkers. This topic has NOTHING to do with the GOAT debate. It's just a fun diversion to discuss two pet projects between rivals.
 
You have lost it. Rafa getting #20 has truly made you go bonkers. This topic has NOTHING to do with the GOAT debate. It's just a fun diversion to discuss two pet projects between rivals.
Toni is about to become the president of a futbol club. There goes the guy holding it all together. Guess Rafa may have to retire sooner than planned :eek:
 
Yeah. I feel the Academy is becoming a major resource to the sport, that has a real purpose. Everyone wants to train there (even Bjorn Borg is sending his son Leo there) and in the case of Swiatek, it is starting to help develop champions.

I still don't know what the Laver Cup's place is in the tennis calender beyond being a very well marketed exhibition tournament.
It has no other purpose than to generate revenue. Not a single player that started there or trained there for a long time has done anything of note on the pro tour (it is too early anyway). It tried to buy some prestige with attracting for a year or so players that were developed elsewhere, but that a sort of failed. Effectively it is an ultra expensive boarding school with no clear goal. Considering the nature of the other venues that bear the same name, Nadal is firmly planted in the hotel business with very high class sporting facilities.

If you want to see a venture developing champions look no further than the work of the Team 8 management, who are actually working to "create champions" by managing everything around a number of pro tour tennis players.

I bet that you forgot about that in your comparison.

:cool:
 
GOAT has always been determined by an objective, agreed upon equation:

Wimbledon Titles + US Open Titles + AO Titles - French Open Titles + Basel Titles + Halle Titles + WTF Titles

Just simply add this together. Perfectly objective.
It works perfectly fine without Basel and Halle too.
 

Patriots

Rookie
If Rafa and Federer retire in a couple of years, ie can't play it, and ATP top tennis is still European skewed, how much lasting power will the Laver Cup have?

Whereas the Rafa Academy will continue to proper/grow once Rafa has retired from the game. A retired Rafa perhaps more hands on will make the Rafa Academy even more of a magnet for promising juniors... As it is, it already has a whole slew of promising juniors.
 
If Rafa and Federer retire in a couple of years, ie can't play it, and ATP top tennis is still European skewed, how much lasting power will the Laver Cup have?

Whereas the Rafa Academy will continue to proper/grow once Rafa has retired from the game. A retired Rafa perhaps more hands on will make the Rafa Academy even more of a magnet for promising juniors... As it is, it already has a whole slew of promising juniors.
Out of curiosity, can you name a few of those promising juniors.

:cool:
 

Patriots

Rookie
Out of curiosity, can you name a few of those promising juniors.

:cool:
Alejandra Eala
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
It has no other purpose than to generate revenue. Not a single player that started there or trained there for a long time has done anything of note on the pro tour (it is too early anyway). It tried to buy some prestige with attracting for a year or so players that were developed elsewhere, but that a sort of failed. Effectively it is an ultra expensive boarding school with no clear goal. Considering the nature of the other venues that bear the same name, Nadal is firmly planted in the hotel business with very high class sporting facilities.

If you want to see a venture developing champions look no further than the work of the Team 8 management, who are actually working to "create champions" by managing everything around a number of pro tour tennis players.

I bet that you forgot about that in your comparison.

:cool:

Most players develop with multiple coaches over the years. Andy Murray started with his mother for his first 12 years, then moved to Spain at 15 to develop his game for the professional ranks for a period of months under Pato Alvarez at his Academy. Same for the Williams sisters, whose dad coached them for their first decade, then took them to Rick Macci's Academy when they needed polishing for the professional ranks.

That is how it works. Those Academies can still take credit for the development of a player, even if their parents or whomever else spent much much longer coaching them. Most exceptional players that train at tennis Academies have already been coached how to play tennis for anywhere up to a decade. The right Academy is usually there to provide the finishing touch, not create a finished product from scratch.

That is why Rafa Nadal Academy can take some credit for developing Iga Swiatek as a champion. Of course she already knew how to play tennis. But she made the choice to train there on two seperate occasions as a juinor to develop her game for the professional ranks, and it obviously helped her as she keeps crediting her stints there in interviews.

Casper Ruud and Alexandra Eala are also two full time Rafa Nadal Academy students who are showing significant promise.
 
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Most players develop with multiple coaches over the years. Andy Murray started with his mother for his first 12 years, then moved to Spain at 15 to develop his game for the professional ranks for a period of months under Pato Alvarez at his Academy. Same for the Williams sisters, whose dad coached them for their first decade, then took them to Rick Macci's Academy when they needed polishing for the professional ranks.

That is how it works. Those Academies can still take credit for the development of a player, even if their parents or whomever else spent much much longer coaching them. Most exceptional players that train at tennis Academies have already been coached how to play tennis for anywhere up to a decade. The right Academy is usually there to provide the finishing touch, not create a finished product from scratch.

That is why Rafa Nadal Academy can take some credit for developing Iga Swiatek as a champion. Of course she already knew how to play tennis. But she made the choice to train there on two seperate occasions as a juinor to develop her game for the professional ranks, and it obviously helped her as she keeps crediting her stints there in interviews.

Casper Ruud and Alexandra Eala are also two full time Rafa Nadal Academy students who are showing significant promise.
Well, if training for some time is enough to absorb someone else's work and credit it as their achievements then, sure. However, the likes of Sharapova show how it really is with these academies, when they really work, which is a completely different case than "polishing players". Sviatek is a typical example of feasting on someone else's work: she was a top tennis player with exponential improvement in the junior ranks and the Pro Tour, before landing an "invitation" to train at the Academy. I assume she won't be staying there for long either. She "keeps crediting" them as she is a Nadal fan, and obviously, because she has contractual obligations with them now. We will see if she will keep crediting them once she moves on.

:cool:
 
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BeatlesFan

Bionic Poster
Why is the OP comparing a tennis academy to an exo? It's apples and oranges.

Compare the Rafa Academy to Bolletieiri, Mouratoglou or McEnroe's tennis Academies. Compare the Laver Cup to other exos out there.
 
Why is the OP comparing a tennis academy to an exo? It's apples and oranges.

Compare the Rafa Academy to Bolletieiri, Mouratoglou or McEnroe's tennis Academies. Compare the Laver Cup to other exos out there.
Federer's "pet project" is Team 8.

The OP deliberately chose an exo for the comparison.

:cool:
 

Fedinkum

Legend
As a Fed fan, I can honestly say that the Laver Cup was pretty ill-conceived. It has entertainment value but that is about it.

Rafa’s Academy has the potential to achieve a great legacy if his camp is not greedy and genuinely wants to develop and promotes a better generation of players. With uncle Toni in-charged, I am afraid it will end up with doggie frauds, tax evasion, and overpriced camps to satisfy many well off tennis parents.
 
As a Fed fan, I can honestly say that the Laver Cup was pretty ill-conceived. It has entertainment value but that is about it.

Rafa’s Academy has the potential to achieve a great legacy if his camp is not greedy and genuinely wants to develop and promotes a better generation of players. With uncle Toni in-charged, I am afraid it will end up with doggie frauds, tax evasion, and overpriced camps to satisfy many well off tennis parents.
But their marketing strategy to basically buy already developed players and present them as their own developments works exactly for those tennis parents. They are quite active in that too.

:cool:
 

Fedinkum

Legend
But their marketing strategy to basically buy already developed players and present them as their own developments works exactly for those tennis parents. They are quite active in that too.

:cool:
That I didn’t know and if that is true, it is a waste of opportunity and resources in terms of leaving a true legacy.
 
That I didn’t know and if that is true, it is a waste of opportunity and resources in terms of leaving a true legacy.
It remains to be seen what will come out of their own developments. It is too early to say as the "academy" is too young to have some serious results, but that has been their strategy from day one: attract names that are already hugely promising, and take credit for whatever comes their way until they leave. Not only this, but they are "buying"local coaches too. Since the coaches at the Academy are not up to the task they are bringing in under contract outside coaches as is the case with Clavet, who was brought in to look after Munar.

:cool:
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Federer's "pet project" is Team 8.

The OP deliberately chose an exo for the comparison.

:cool:

I'm sorry, but I don't immediately think of Team 8 when I think of Federer's primary pet or legacy project. No one does. Laver Cup has been sold and promoted as Federer's big gift and legacy project to the tennis world, not Team 8.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Why is the OP comparing a tennis academy to an exo? It's apples and oranges.

Compare the Rafa Academy to Bolletieiri, Mouratoglou or McEnroe's tennis Academies. Compare the Laver Cup to other exos out there.
Because I'm comparing the legacy projects of two iconic rivals. It's not about comparing Laver Cup to some random exho or Rafa Nadal Academy to some random Academy. Of course the projects are different, but they are comparable in scope and ambition, so it is hardly a ridiculous comparison.

(though technically, I don't even think Laver Cup counts as an exho, since the it's now an official ATP event and matches count in offcial H2H results. Federer fastracked it into "real tournament" status)
 
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I'm sorry, but I don't immediately think of Team 8 when I think of Federer's primary pet or legacy project. No one does. Laver Cup has been sold and promoted as Federer's big gift and legacy project to the tennis world, not Team 8.
Whether you or someone else thinks of it as a "legacy" project is irrelevant.

It is a tennis project on the highest level.

If you are fighting for Instagram likes and that is your definition of a "legacy project", then, sure RNA is much more meaningful. Plenty of those with rich kids with more money than talent.

:cool:
 
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