More surprising lack of success in last 5 years - Nadal at Wimbledon or Federer at French Open

McEnroeisanartist

Hall of Fame
If someone told you in late June of 2012 that Federer would not make another French Open Semifinal (probably ever again) and Nadal would not reach another Wimbledon quarterfinal in the next 5 Wimbledons, what would surprise you more?

Federer - French Open - F, W, QF, F ,SF to QF, 4th Round, QF, DNP, DNP

Nadal - Wimbledon - F, W, DNP, W, F to 2nd, 1st, 4th, 2nd, DNP
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't nadal struggle in earlier rounds at wimbledon, despite making the finals the years he was consecutively reaching finals? then again, idk if it is all that surprising that at his age, and given how it can be taxing on the body + surface, fed wasn't doing well post 2011 at FO.
 

Rafa the King

Hall of Fame
correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't nadal struggle in earlier rounds at wimbledon, despite making the finals the years he was consecutively reaching finals? then again, idk if it is all that surprising that at his age, and given how it can be taxing on the body + surface, fed wasn't doing well post 2011 at FO.

Yeah 06 he had to come back from 2 sets down, 07 Soderling 5-setter and Youzhny 2 sets down, 08 only lost a set to Gulbis but that was his best Wimbledon, 10 he had Haase Petschner 5-setters and lost a set to Soderling and in 11 Delpo and Fish both took a set before the semi's. So most fans weren't that suprised when he went 2-1 to Rosol and when he won the 4rth playing a good level, we though OK, he got this, but suddenly Rosol played one of the most ridiculous sets of tennis and Rafa never recovered.
 

malbaker86

Hall of Fame
Obviously Nadal at Wimbledon. Dont care what physical shape he was in, no excuse to look like an amateur against Darcis and Brown. The Krygios and Rosol losses are somewhat excusable as he was just blown off the court that day yet still had his chances to win

Fed at least lost to the eventual champion in Stan and the Tsonga lost....Tsonga just caught fire that day as did Gulbis. It happens
 

icedevil0289

G.O.A.T.
Obviously Nadal at Wimbledon. Dont care what physical shape he was in, no excuse to look like an amateur against Darcis and Brown. The Krygios and Rosol losses are somewhat excusable as he was just blown off the court that day yet still had his chances to win

Fed at least lost to the eventual champion in Stan and the Tsonga lost....Tsonga just caught fire that day as did Gulbis. It happens

true, though one could argue that nadal was always more vulnerable on the slick grass in the first few rounds of wimbledon, he just made up for it in other ways
 

cc0509

Talk Tennis Guru
Nadal crashing out early to anybody and his mother at Wimbledon in the past five years has been much more surprising to me. That's why I think it's possible he could do well again this year especially if he's confident and has a decent draw. Plus his game has been more aggressive lately. With him you never know if he will crash out to somebody ranked 100+ in an early round or if he will make the final or even win it.
 

Gary Duane

Talk Tennis Guru
Nadal crashing out early to anybody and his mother at Wimbledon in the past five years has been much more surprising to me. That's why I think it's possible he could do well again this year especially if he's confident and has a decent draw. Plus his game has been more aggressive lately. With him you never know if he will crash out to somebody ranked 100+ in an early round or if he will make the final or even win it.
I have to say that Nadal's lack of success at Wimbledon after beating Federer in 2008 is far more surprising to me than Fed's lack of success outside of RG.
 

Mainad

Bionic Poster
I have to say that Nadal's lack of success at Wimbledon after beating Federer in 2008 is far more surprising to me than Fed's lack of success outside of RG.

Well, he didn't play in 2009 because of injury and he came back in 2010 to win his 2nd title and then made another final in 2011 so I think he had some success after his 2008 win over Federer. ;)

It's his poor performances since making the 2011 final that are surprising (early round losses in 2012 to Rosol, 2013 to Darcis, 2014 to Kyrgios and 2015 to Brown. Didn't play 2016).
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
I'm starting to have a weird feeling Rafa will surprise us at Wimbledon or the USO.

l0ErCz3jP4Or0gWTC.gif
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Let's see:

A 30+ year old Roger losing his grip on clay as it was supposed to happen with any ageing player

Or

A 26 year old Nadal still in his prime, completely rendered useless on a surface while still very young
 

papertank

Hall of Fame
Nadal for sure. Before 2012 grass was considered his second best surface, now it is considered by far his worst. Also his losses have been worse than Fed's. Fed's losses were to good players such as Tsonga and Stan, while Nadal lost to players way beneath him in the rankings.
 

duaneeo

Legend
Nadal at Wimbledon, and it's not even close. He went from 5 straight finals to never making any final...final, semifinal, or even a quarterfinal. And, Rosol, Darcis, Brown??
 

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
Not even a poll to actually vote in? Seems a bit stupid..

Anyway, Nadal hands down. Brown, Darcis, Kyrgios. All out of the top 100. Feds losses were all against top 20 players. In fact, all but one were top 10 players (Gulbis being around 18th).
 

dh003i

Legend
Nadal lost some of his movement on grass and that was key. However, I don't think his losses were embarrassing. People are looking at the ranking of those players and forgetting how well they played. Krygios is now a top player. Rosol and Brown played out of their minds. Not sure about Darcis.
 

every7

Hall of Fame
Nadal's disastrous Wimbledons are more surprising to me, as he has had some truly baffling losses against complete scrubs who ended up bowing out in the next round.

In contrast, the losses Federer has had at F.O. are far less suprising because he ran into established, streakily gifted players who red-lined on the day, and you could understand why he lost.

Federer's 2010 -> F.O's
2010: Ran into Soderling during Soderling's best years on clay and in hot form. Soderling held form and made it to the final.
2013: Tsonga redlined, and has beaten Federer before at majors when in this mode. He held form and ended up making SFs
2014: Got beaten by Gulbis in his second best ever clay form who kept going until SF (only stopped by Djokovic).
2015: Got beaten by Stan who was playing like a maniac and ended up winning the tournament
2016: DNP
2017: WNP
 

chjtennis

G.O.A.T.
Federer, due to his back problems and consequent recovery period + adapting time to his new racquets, is an understandable case. Nadal should've done a bit better, but I don't see him as a natural grass courter anyway, so not too much of a surprise there.
 
Obviously Nadal at Wimbledon. Dont care what physical shape he was in, no excuse to look like an amateur against Darcis and Brown. The Krygios and Rosol losses are somewhat excusable as he was just blown off the court that day yet still had his chances to win

Fed at least lost to the eventual champion in Stan and the Tsonga lost....Tsonga just caught fire that day as did Gulbis. It happens

I think Rafa became conscious about his knee and to avoid any injuries, he reduced his movement reason being grass is slippery.
Losses are not bad if you look at the scores.

Brown a grass court specialist. 2015 is Nadal's declining year, he didn't win a single grand slam this year after winning at least one grand slam per year for 10 years consecutively.
7 3 6 6
5 6 4 4

Kyrgios after beating Rosol this time
7 5 7 6
5 7 6 3

Darcis - Darcis retired after winning this match. You can imagine he might have played beyond his physical limit.
6 6 8 4
7 710 6

Rosol--Nadals season ended due to injury and he would play only in next year February
6 6 6 2 6
7
4 4 6 4


Most surprising thing is despite of these loses Rafa didn't try to get a coach who can help him.
Another surprising thing is King of Grass Federer losing to Stakhovsky in the 2nd round.
And even more surprising is Federer was not able to capitalize the absence of Nadal all these years.
 
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NatF

Bionic Poster
I think Rafa became conscious about his knee and to avoid any injuries, he reduced his movement reason being grass is slippery.
Losses are not bad if you look at the scores.

Brown a grass court specialist. 2015 is Nadal's declining year, he didn't win a single grand slam this year after winning at least one grand slam per year for 10 years consecutively.
7 3 6 6
5 6 4 4

Kyrgios after beating Rosol this time
7 5 7 6
5 7 6 3

Darcis - Darcis retired after winning this match. You can imagine he might have played beyond his physical limit.
6 6 8 4
7 710 6

Rosol--Nadals season ended due to injury and he would play only in next year February
6 6 6 2 6
7
4 4 6 4


Most surprising thing is despite of these loses Rafa didn't try to get a coach who can help him.
Another surprising thing is King of Grass Federer losing to Stakhovsky in the 2nd round.
And even more surprising is Federer was not able to capitalize the absence of Nadal all these years.

Excusing Nadal's losses due to injury but not doing the same for Federer against Stakhovsky? Double standards no?
 

merwy

G.O.A.T.
How quickly you've changed your tune mate :D

Fedal to finally get their USO clash this year? :p
ikr? At first Nadal was absolutely done for and might as well retire. Now he wins a few clay titles (basically without any proper opposition from the two top guys that he normally might lose to) and he will win Wimbledon ;). Swinging back and forth faster than a pendulum.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
ikr? At first Nadal was absolutely done for and might as well retire. Now he wins a few clay titles (basically without any proper opposition from the two top guys that he normally might lose to) and he will win Wimbledon ;). Swinging back and forth faster than a pendulum.
At least you're not going to hear about a Nadal CYGS. That ship has sailed ;)
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
ikr? At first Nadal was absolutely done for and might as well retire. Now he wins a few clay titles (basically without any proper opposition from the two top guys that he normally might lose to) and he will win Wimbledon ;). Swinging back and forth faster than a pendulum.

Well to be fair as soon as Federer won the AO I started dreaming of another triple slam year :D
 

Bender

G.O.A.T.
Nadal crashing out early to anybody and his mother at Wimbledon in the past five years has been much more surprising to me. That's why I think it's possible he could do well again this year especially if he's confident and has a decent draw. Plus his game has been more aggressive lately. With him you never know if he will crash out to somebody ranked 100+ in an early round or if he will make the final or even win it.
He was pretty confident in 2012 and 2013 as well, and we know how that turned out.

I don't think it is a matter of confidence (of course it does play a part), but despite what people think, surfaces are different enough to show that one strategy can't work on every surface, unless your strategy is executed flawlessly at an extremely high level.

I am hoping that he translates his more aggressive, "I don't want to continue grinding out this point" mindset we have seen from him on HCs and clay this year to grass, and ramp up the aggression a little more.
 

Jaitock1991

Hall of Fame
Nadal's disastrous Wimbledons are more surprising to me, as he has had some truly baffling losses against complete scrubs who ended up bowing out in the next round.

In contrast, the losses Federer has had at F.O. are far less suprising because he ran into established, streakily gifted players who red-lined on the day, and you could understand why he lost.

Federer's 2010 -> F.O's
2010: Ran into Soderling during Soderling's best years on clay and in hot form. Soderling held form and made it to the final.
2013: Tsonga redlined, and has beaten Federer before at majors when in this mode. He held form and ended up making SFs
2014: Got beaten by Gulbis in his second best ever clay form who kept going until SF (only stopped by Djokovic).
2015: Got beaten by Stan who was playing like a maniac and ended up winning the tournament
2016: DNP
2017: WNP


Decent points. Just want to add that Tsonga's loss in the SF was the very match after he'd beaten Fed(who played absolutely terribly in that match) ;)
 

Krish872007

Talk Tennis Guru
Don't hate Vive, you know you love Rafa, what would you do without him?

79077d6f34ff0f49ebf8ba3de98ab872.jpg

Anybody who is a Batman fan can understand how deep those words are. One of the best DC lines delivered by a villain.

Sooo many good lines in 1 film. Every single sentence had purpose. Probably the greatest film experience I ever had!
"Some men just want to watch the world burn."
 

Fate Archer

Hall of Fame
I'm starting to have a weird feeling Rafa will surprise us at Wimbledon or the USO.

l0ErCz3jP4Or0gWTC.gif
Nothing "weird" about it. I sometimes still get fanboy feelings from time to time too. I think he has more of a chance at the USO though. He's become too susceptible at Wimbledon to fancy anything beyond a quarterfinal. Perhaps if he manages to survive the first week he can become dangerous. A big if anyway.
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
Federer made a FO final at 29. Do you like embarrassing yourself?

oh, so age is your excuse now. Federer (and Nadal to a lesser extent) are proving that age ain't nothing but a number so far this year! its about confidence and condition and you know it.

just admit that in your normal trolling of Nadal you are inversely admitting that you expect more from him than Federer.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
oh, so age is your excuse now. Federer (and Nadal to a lesser extent) are proving that age ain't nothing but a number so far this year! its about confidence and condition and you know it.

just admit that in your normal trolling of Nadal you are inversely admitting that you expect more from him than Federer.

Are you being intentionally dense?

The question is about Federer and Nadal's lack of success since 2012. Is it strange that I expect more from Nadal at 26 than Federer at 30? Even so Federer has outperformed Nadal despite his higher age :D
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
Are you being intentionally dense?

The question is about Federer and Nadal's lack of success since 2012. Is it strange that I expect more from Nadal at 26 than Federer at 30? Even so Federer has outperformed Nadal despite his higher age :D
that's because 'age' has little to do with it! both are showing that now, so stop leaning on an excuse that doesn't hold nearly as much water anymore.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
that's because 'age' has little to do with it! both are showing that now, so stop leaning on an excuse that doesn't hold nearly as much water anymore.

What's happening now with both is unexpected let's be honest. There's a still a difference between an athlete at 26 and one over 30, it's right to expect the 26 year old to perform better. Especially when one of the surfaces is as physically demanding as clay is.

You just don't want to admit you've made a fool of yourself.
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
What's happening now with both is unexpected let's be honest. There's a still a difference between an athlete at 26 and one over 30, it's right to expect the 26 year old to perform better. Especially when one of the surfaces is as physically demanding as clay is.

You just don't want to admit you've made a fool of yourself.
you foolishly act as if because its unexpected it didn't occur. we're witnessing whats happening, reality is now, try and be a witness.
 
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