Murray : Wimbledon will never be an exhibition and will never feel like an exhibition. The end.

Frenchy-Player

Hall of Fame
BN-IK900_ANDYA_G_20150514181254.jpg



"I follow golf very closely and have no idea how many ranking points the winner of the The Masters gets. Me and my friends love football and non of us know or care how many ranking points a team gets for winning the World Cup.

"But I could tell you exactly who won the World Cup and the Masters. I'd hazard a guess that most people watching on Centre Court at Wimbledon in a few weeks time wouldn't know or care about how many ranking points a player gets for winning a 3rd round match.


 

20 20 20

Rookie
As I said before only the boycott of top players will effect Wimbledon, they could even cut down prize money and if the big names decide to play it, it will not have any big repercussions
 

Mivic

Hall of Fame
The top guys should really boycott if they truly want to take a stand against the ban. Anything less is absolutely meaningless and irrelevant and only ends up hurting the players. Murray is correct. I was really hoping that Djokovic in particular would take a stronger stance here considering the manner in which political interference cost him in Australia (we all know that Nadal is an establishment stooge who looks after himself first and foremost and one can only expect so much from those type of guys, so his stance on this matter is to be expected). Unfortunately this all feels pretty half assed to me considering how shocking Wimbledon's conduct has been.
 
Last edited:

Kralingen

Bionic Poster
The top guys should really boycott if they truly want to take a stand against the ban. Anything less is absolutely meaningless and irrelevant and only ends up hurting the players. Murray is correct. I was really hoping that Djokovic in particular would take a stronger stance here considering how political interference cost him in Australia (we all know Nadal and Federer are establishment stooges and one can only expect so much from those type of guys). This all feels pretty half assed to me considering how shocking Wimbledon's conduct has been.
I think doing that would be in poor taste to the Ukrainian people and players on tour who advocated for this ban though. You don’t want to be the guy who’s dying on the Russian hill in this situation imo.
 

Mivic

Hall of Fame
I think doing that would be in poor taste to the Ukrainian people and players on tour who advocated for this ban though. You don’t want to be the guy who’s dying on the Russian hill in this situation imo.
It might not be a good look from a superficial PR standpoint, and obviously we're talking about top ranked professional tennis players here most of whom are going to be fine regardless, but once we start making people's participation in society and their ability to earn a living contingent on their views and vague political associations it becomes a very slippery slope. It also shouldn't be OK for ordinary people to become collateral damage because elites and politicians want to send a message and further their own interests. If Russian players are to be banned then individuals from all countries should be held to the same standard, which isn't the case. Its blatant discrimination. I think the ban demands a strong stance personally, but more than anything I just don't like this half assing from the top guys. Either take a proper stance or don't do anything at all. Stripping Wimbledon of points isn't hurting anybody but the players. It's pointless half assed activism which I can't stand because it accomplishes absolutely nothing.
 
Last edited:

Checkmate

Legend
It might not be a good look, and obviously we're talking about top ranked professional tennis players here most of whom are going to be fine regardless, but once we start making people's participation in society and their ability to earn a living contingent on their views and vague political associations it becomes a very slippery slope. If Russian players are to be banned then individuals from all countries should be held to the same standard, which isn't the case. Its blatant discrimination. I think the ban demands a strong stance personally, but I also understand where you're coming from. I just don't like this half assing from the top guys. Either take a proper stance or don't do anything at all. Stripping Wimbledon of points isn't hurting anybody but the players. It's pointless half assed activism which I can't stand because it accomplishes absolutely nothing.

I thought the war demanded neutrals to be at least on the same page moving forward but I am hearing news of Wimbledon threatening to dirt-drag ATP to the court(no pun intended) and ATP dreaming of bigger and hefty action on SW-19.
 

insideguy

G.O.A.T.
It might not be a good look, and obviously we're talking about top ranked professional tennis players here most of whom are going to be fine regardless, but once we start making people's participation in society and their ability to earn a living contingent on their views and vague political associations it becomes a very slippery slope. It also shouldn't be OK for ordinary people to become collateral damage because elites and politicians want to send a message and further their own interests. If Russian players are to be banned then individuals from all countries should be held to the same standard, which isn't the case. Its blatant discrimination. I think the ban demands a strong stance personally, but I also understand where you're coming from. I just don't like this half assing from the top guys. Either take a proper stance or don't do anything at all. Stripping Wimbledon of points isn't hurting anybody but the players. It's pointless half assed activism which I can't stand because it accomplishes absolutely nothing.
Here is the thing though the ATP/WTA has been all over the map regarding this since the start. Thats the problem. They themselves pulled tournaments from Russia 5 days after the invasion. Now that hurts players who wanted to play in those tournaments. And is a purely symbolic gesture. So the ATP/WTA want to have it both ways.
 
D

Deleted member 791948

Guest
Murray is far too emotionally invested to objectively assess this, and was probably crying when he tweeted it :happydevil:
 

fedfan08

Professional
I think doing that would be in poor taste to the Ukrainian people and players on tour who advocated for this ban though. You don’t want to be the guy who’s dying on the Russian hill in this situation imo.
This isn’t about Russia. It’s about individual athletes. The Ukrainian athletes who advocated for the ban are wrong. It’s an emotional response.
 

ScottleeSV

Hall of Fame
The only people who will pull out (I imagine) are very low ranked players for whom the cost of the 3 weeks training and playing in the UK is not worth the miniscule prize money for going out in Rd 1. And I mean very low ranked players here, the type who might have to go through qualifying. They can easily be replaced though. The rankings run deep.

Nobody at the top end is pulling out. Wimbledon is still Wimbledon. It's the pinnacle of a player's career if they can win it.

And even if they can't win it - there's money, sponsorships, spotlight, you name it. Not sure how pulling out benefits a top player. They'd be martyring themselves for what? What Wimbledon have done is a polarizing decision at best.
 

tex123

Hall of Fame
Your options:

1. Do Nothing! == Putin keeps doing the same over and over. You are just bending over like you've done in Syria or Georgia or Malay Airlines or 2014 invasion or now. Spineless! Only care about your Strawberries & Cream and Pimms as Ukrainians get bombed everyday.
2. Ban Em' == Take a stand. Only Russian Players and Belarussian players get banned. Russia gets the message. Everyone else gets to play.
3. ATP takes points away == Like firing in all directions. All players suffer. No one can defend points. Med becomes a laughable no 1.
4. Players boycott == Who are you with? Aggressor or bombed Ukrainians. No one would want to look to be on Russia's side.

Given these options, I'll take (2) any day.
 

insideguy

G.O.A.T.
Your options:

1. Do Nothing! == Putin keeps doing the same over and over. You are just bending over like you've done in Syria or Georgia or Malay Airlines or 2014 invasion or now. Spineless! Only care about your Strawberries & Cream and Pimms as Ukrainians get bombed everyday.
2. Ban Em' == Take a stand. Only Russian Players and Belarussian players get banned. Russia gets the message. Everyone else gets to play.
3. ATP takes points away == Like firing in all directions. All players suffer. No one can defend points. Med becomes a laughable no 1.
4. Players boycott == Who are you with? Aggressor or bombed Ukrainians. No one would want to look to be on Russia's side.

Given these options, I'll take (2) any day.
The entire premise of taking the points away is so stupid. And its even more stupid considering the ATP/WTA took entire tournaments away from Russia.
 
D

Deleted member 791948

Guest
They could have just frozen the Russian players ranking points, but they probably were scared of the Royal family at the trophy ceremony scenario. But should have been willing to change the ceremony tradition if a Russian player was there (and its highly unlikely a Russian will be in the Final anyway). They've already made huge changes to Wimbledon like adding a roof, shortening the 5th Set, and playing on the middle Sunday, so no big deal to change another thing :happydevil:
 

insideguy

G.O.A.T.
They could have just frozen the Russian players ranking points, but they probably were scared of the Royal family at the trophy ceremony scenario. But should have been willing to change the ceremony tradition if a Russian player was there anyway (and its highly unlikely a Russian will be in the Final anyway). They've already changed other things about Wimbledon like adding a roof and playing on the middle Sunday :happydevil:
What the ATP/WTA could have done if they were really interested is give the Russian players some sort of PR status. But they didn't seem interested in anything like that. What they did is basically like if a Teacher took the toys aways from 4 kids in their class, the school came in and took the toys away from all the kids.
 

wangs78

Legend
I think doing that would be in poor taste to the Ukrainian people and players on tour who advocated for this ban though. You don’t want to be the guy who’s dying on the Russian hill in this situation imo.
What you say is 100% true if the ranking points were still on the table. With those points being taken away, the players have a reasonable excuse to not play which should not automatically be viewed as a boycott or lack of sympathy for Ukraine. One man’s view.
 

ChrisRF

Legend
I think doing that would be in poor taste to the Ukrainian people and players on tour who advocated for this ban though. You don’t want to be the guy who’s dying on the Russian hill in this situation imo.
But it's very easy to explain why promoting this ban is the real bad taste and the real discrimination, and why nobody has the right to demand such a ban, no matter if other players or Ukrainian people.
 

insideguy

G.O.A.T.
But it's very easy to explain why promoting this ban is the real bad taste and the real discrimination, and why nobody has the right to demand such a ban, no matter if other players or Ukrainian people.
Look man most sports banned Russians across the globe. UEFA banned Russian club soccer from competing in Champions league. And people can split hairs all day long on flags or representing Russia in some ways but people acting like Wimbledon alone is doing this are not paying attention.
 

BeatlesFan

Bionic Poster
at least be honest and admit money and titles mean more to them than sticking up for their fellow players.
They admit that when they play the event. They’re not going to announce it, but their mindset is obvious when they participate. Neither Djoker or Nadal care one bit about the money, but neither will give up a chance for another slam.
 

Grafil Injection

Hall of Fame
The only people who will pull out (I imagine) are very low ranked players for whom the cost of the 3 weeks training and playing in the UK is not worth the miniscule prize money for going out in Rd 1. And I mean very low ranked players here, the type who might have to go through qualifying. They can easily be replaced though. The rankings run deep.

Nobody at the top end is pulling out. Wimbledon is still Wimbledon. It's the pinnacle of a player's career if they can win it.

And even if they can't win it - there's money, sponsorships, spotlight, you name it. Not sure how pulling out benefits a top player. They'd be martyring themselves for what? What Wimbledon have done is a polarizing decision at best.
What I don't get is that Round 1 losers get £48,000. Are we saying that top 100 tennis bods don't get out of bed for less than $55,000 these days?
 
Last edited:

toby55555

Hall of Fame
Your options:

1. Do Nothing! == Putin keeps doing the same over and over. You are just bending over like you've done in Syria or Georgia or Malay Airlines or 2014 invasion or now. Spineless! Only care about your Strawberries & Cream and Pimms as Ukrainians get bombed everyday.
2. Ban Em' == Take a stand. Only Russian Players and Belarussian players get banned. Russia gets the message. Everyone else gets to play.
3. ATP takes points away == Like firing in all directions. All players suffer. No one can defend points. Med becomes a laughable no 1.
4. Players boycott == Who are you with? Aggressor or bombed Ukrainians. No one would want to look to be on Russia's side.

Given these options, I'll take (2) any day.
No one says do nothing, the economic sanctions are hitting hard and targeting the oligarchs who help keep him in power is the correct course. I don’t believe banning individual sportsmen from events would have any effect on Putin’s conduct whatsoever if anything it makes Wimbledon look like an arm of the state which Russian players are not. CSKA Moscow football team is quite another matter.
 

insideguy

G.O.A.T.
No one says do nothing, the economic sanctions are hitting hard and targeting the oligarchs who help keep him in power is the correct course. I don’t believe banning individual sportsmen from events would have any effect on Putin’s conduct whatsoever if anything it makes Wimbledon look like an arm of the state which Russian players are not. CSKA Moscow football team is quite another matter.
Why is CSKA Moscow football team another matter?
 

tex123

Hall of Fame
No one says do nothing, the economic sanctions are hitting hard and targeting the oligarchs who help keep him in power is the correct course. I don’t believe banning individual sportsmen from events would have any effect on Putin’s conduct whatsoever if anything it makes Wimbledon look like an arm of the state which Russian players are not. CSKA Moscow football team is quite another matter.
As Tesco says - Every little helps. Look back and see how the entire world have tolerated Putin's behaviour. It goes back a long way and he's getting bolder and bolder. Nothing was done after Aleppo or Grozny or Georgia or Crimea or Malay Airlines. Putin knows the world values Strawberries and Pimms to care much about what he does. Those sanctions are not enough. The wholesale isolation of Russia is needed to send a message.

Apartheid did not just end because the world did nothing - everyone boycotted SA although tennis shamelessly did not care much.
 

GabeT

G.O.A.T.
Your options:

1. Do Nothing! == Putin keeps doing the same over and over. You are just bending over like you've done in Syria or Georgia or Malay Airlines or 2014 invasion or now. Spineless! Only care about your Strawberries & Cream and Pimms as Ukrainians get bombed everyday.
2. Ban Em' == Take a stand. Only Russian Players and Belarussian players get banned. Russia gets the message. Everyone else gets to play.
3. ATP takes points away == Like firing in all directions. All players suffer. No one can defend points. Med becomes a laughable no 1.
4. Players boycott == Who are you with? Aggressor or bombed Ukrainians. No one would want to look to be on Russia's side.

Given these options, I'll take (2) any day.
I’m all for putting pressure on Putin but i see no evidence banning Russian players makes any difference. And I see even less evidence taking away the points makes a difference at all, other than hurting lower ranked players
 
Top