Nadal calls Djokovic his toughest opponent; Federer thinks the same about Nadal. Who is Novak's?

N

Nachiket Nolefam

Guest
Hard to say as both are great opponents. But I would give Nadal the edge.

Djokovic has repeatedly said, Nadal is his greatest rival, repeatedly.
Nadal is one guy who can make anyone play very long match. In USO2011, he was absolutely getting beaten 6-4 6-2 and still he would sneak third set. He is greatest competitor in last 30 years at least. So that's tough physically.
Yes, they play repetitive tennis but it doesn't mean its easy. The AO2012 final, they were playing very very hard. I mean 80-100 mph strokes repeatedly. Its not easy to play 25 shot rallies like that.
And Djokovic would be very aggressive even in mannerism vs peak Nadal, the AO2012 celebration and USO open hands gesture. He knows Nadal is mentally toughest out there.

Now, Your greatest rival can't be greatest rival if HE DOESN'T SHOW UP. Nadal's career is injury filled so many times Djokovic had easier matches. But had they both been fit for long time, their career would have been much short. Djokovic doesn't play his shots with same intensity vs field I feel as its hard to penetrate Nadal's defense than others.

Federer is another example. When he turns to his god mode, he can overwhelm even Novak. His peak level is maybe better than anyone else's. So, Djokovic would go to many tournaments as fav and at final, Federer can completely turn the result around which is not the case with Nadal. You know what to expect in Nadal-Djokovic matches, and very seldom, you are surprised by the winner.

Now, OPINION PART.
I think peak Djokovic can HANDLE peak Nadal but peak Djokovic will be beaten by peak Federer.
 
Noelan

Noelan

Legend
Djokovic2011 said:
Yep, pretty much this. Even now I fear Djokovic playing Federer more than Nadal because he's still such a nightmare when his serve and forehand are clicking. And for some reason he nearly always seems to play like his life depends on it whenever he sees Novak on the other side of the net. Grrrrrrr.
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Unlike you, he never feared Federer even when he was 19 yo or now.
Didn't federer fans said that he has match up issue against Novak just in time when he lost 3 GS finals to Novak?:rolleyes:

Toughest Novaks opponent always was Nadal, (not in 2015 form obviously)
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Djokovic2011 said:
Majors aren't the only tournaments though. Federer is a tougher matchup for Djokovic on hard courts(the predominant surface) and grass than Nadal is.
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Lol, HC is the least prestigious surface, due to the fact so much tennis is played on it. Grass is the holy grail then clay hence W and FO have the biggest global audiences.
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Nachiket Nolefam said:
Nadal called him one of the greatest in IW 2011. IW 2011. Not sure what Nadal was thinking. Djokovic returned the favor saying Nadal was greatest ever for HIM
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On another thread ive explained Federer has called Nadal his toughest opponent anywhere. Nadal has states Djokovic is his toughest opponent. However Nadal has stated Federer isGOAT and his biggest career rival.

Djokovic has stated Nadal is his greatest rival and hardest opponent over 5 sets. Djokovic has suffered multiple heartbreaking losses to Nadal.

The one thing mising from all of this is any psoitive remarks said about each other from Federer or Djokovic. Federer and Djokovic have never liked each other, their relationship is about as bad as it gets in modern tennis (its not like the hatred in the 80's or the ongoing Sampras/Agassi feud) but it is pretty toxic.

So, im not sure we can read too much into their comments. Nadal tries to be friendly with both. Federer and Djokovic talk Nadal up partly i think to do each other down.
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Nachiket Nolefam said:
Hard to say as both are great opponents. But I would give Nadal the edge.

Djokovic has repeatedly said, Nadal is his greatest rival, repeatedly.
Nadal is one guy who can make anyone play very long match. In USO2011, he was absolutely getting beaten 6-4 6-2 and still he would sneak third set. He is greatest competitor in last 30 years at least. So that's tough physically.
Yes, they play repetitive tennis but it doesn't mean its easy. The AO2012 final, they were playing very very hard. I mean 80-100 mph strokes repeatedly. Its not easy to play 25 shot rallies like that.
And Djokovic would be very aggressive even in mannerism vs peak Nadal, the AO2012 celebration and USO open hands gesture. He knows Nadal is mentally toughest out there.

Now, Your greatest rival can't be greatest rival if HE DOESN'T SHOW UP. Nadal's career is injury filled so many times Djokovic had easier matches. But had they both been fit for long time, their career would have been much short. Djokovic doesn't play his shots with same intensity vs field I feel as its hard to penetrate Nadal's defense than others.

Federer is another example. When he turns to his god mode, he can overwhelm even Novak. His peak level is maybe better than anyone else's. So, Djokovic would go to many tournaments as fav and at final, Federer can completely turn the result around which is not the case with Nadal. You know what to expect in Nadal-Djokovic matches, and very seldom, you are surprised by the winner.

Now, OPINION PART.
I think peak Djokovic can HANDLE peak Nadal but peak Djokovic will be beaten by peak Federer.
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Dont forget though Djokovic is pretty friendly with Nadal so they do tend to butt lick each other. Djokovic called Nadal GOAT in 2011 afer IW. Djokovic cannot stand Federer and vice versa. This is no secret, Becker said so this year and you can see the intensity in their matches, there is alot of animosity.
 
N

Nachiket Nolefam

Guest
Levi_Ackerman said:
You seem quite certain. Remember, the one time they met at Djokovic's best major, the AO, Rafa came very close to beating Novak. It took Novak five sets and nearly six hours to beat Rafa. Conversely, how many times has Djokovic really challenged Rafa at RG? Once: 2013. 2015 wasn't even a contest really; more a beatdown.
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So, Rafa has at his near best at AO didn't beat Novak and Novak who consistently makes RG semis and finals didn't challenge Rafa, LOL.
I would say Novak challenged Rafa more at RG than Rafa at AO. The king of clay usually fails to show up most of the times if you remember correctly.
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Nachiket Nolefam said:
So, Rafa has at his near best at AO didn't beat Novak and Novak who consistently makes RG semis and finals didn't challenge Rafa, LOL.
I would say Novak challenged Rafa more at RG than Rafa at AO. The king of clay usually fails to show up most of the times if you remember correctly.
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Apparently though in 2008 when Djokovic and Federer failed to show up, it meant nadal's achievements should devalued as he played nobody opponents at FO and W final!!! What have i been saying about hypocrisy of the Nadal haters!!!
 
N

Nachiket Nolefam

Guest
Gary20 said:
Dont forget though Djokovic is pretty friendly with Nadal so they do tend to butt lick each other. Djokovic called Nadal GOAT in 2011 afer IW. Djokovic cannot stand Federer and vice versa. This is no secret, Becker said so this year and you can see the intensity in their matches, there is alot of animosity.
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So you ask for QUOTES from DJokovic and when we provide them you call them butt lickers. Exactly what the **** do you want? Seem like a disturbed man.
 
Noelan

Noelan

Legend
Nachiket Nolefam said:
So you ask for QUOTES from DJokovic and when we provide them you call them butt lickers. Exactly what the **** do you want? Seem like a disturbed man.
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I really don't know why people keep argue with him, from his first post here it was clear that he's boring attention seeking troll.
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Noelan said:
I really don't know why people keep argue with him, from his first post here it was clear that he's boring attention seeking troll.
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Praising Nadal is not trolling....it is a statement of fact. However i would submit that all the anit-Nadal brigade on here are expert trollers, plus they keep going round in circles contradicting their own arguments. It is most amusing.
 
Gary Duane

Gary Duane

Talk Tennis Guru
Gary20 said:
Dont forget though Djokovic is pretty friendly with Nadal so they do tend to butt lick each other. Djokovic called Nadal GOAT in 2011 afer IW. Djokovic cannot stand Federer and vice versa. This is no secret, Becker said so this year and you can see the intensity in their matches, there is alot of animosity.
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I don't see animosity between them now. I think that's in the past. Now it's just that Fed keeps losing slams to Novak. ;)
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Gary Duane said:
I don't see animosity between them now. I think that's in the past. Now it's just that Fed keeps losing slams to Novak. ;)
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Becker said they dislike each other and the incidnt after W this year wasnt exactly friendly.

That said im not sure Murray and djokovic get on that well these days?
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
Gary20 said:
Djokovic called Nadal GOAT in 2011 afer IW.
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Yes, I remember this. There was a lot of talk on this site at the time about that. For many watching that was Djokovic giving Nadal a taste of his own medicine, every time Nadal beat Federer he would say Federer is GOAT. Well, Djokovic used the same tactics and made his win look even more magnificent, Nadal shaking his head at the statement during the ceremony. Great physcological stuff happening out there. I wonder how Nadal would have felt, if Novak kept calling him GOAT after the other six wins that were coming after that one.
 
Gary Duane

Gary Duane

Talk Tennis Guru
I think you have to break things by surface and age.

Nadal was always a nightmare for Fed on clay, but otherwise he mostly a non-issue on other surfaces until Wimbledon 2007, when the gap started to close.

So I don't think Nadal was even Fed's #1 rival off clay until around the end of 2007.

The rest is history. From 2008 on I agree with people who say that Nadal was Fed's kryptonite.

But I disagree with people who oversimplify with the 23/10 H2H because that puts too much emphasis on clay.

Nadal is EVERYONE'S greatest rival on clay.

But no one with any brains wants to face Fed on grass, even now.

And add to that the difference in age.

It get's REALLY complicated...
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Hitman said:
Yes, I remember this. There was a lot of talk on this site at the time about that. For many watching that was Djokovic giving Nadal a taste of his own medicine, every time Nadal beat Federer he would say Federer is GOAT. Well, Djokovic used the same tactics and made his win look even more magnificent, Nadal shaking his head at the statement during the ceremony. Great physcological stuff happening out there. I wonder how Nadal would have felt, if Novak kept calling him GOAT after the other six wins that were coming after that one.
Click to expand...

Given Nadal was the holder of three Majors at the time and had spanked Djokovic at USO 2010, at the time it was said i doubt Djokovic was playing any mindgames. At the time he was Nadals bunny.
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
Gary20 said:
Given Nadal was the holder of three Majors at the time and had spanked Djokovic at USO 2010, at the time it was said i doubt Djokovic was playing any mindgames. At the time he was Nadals bunny.
Click to expand...

That is just your opinion against the opinion I just said that many here were agreeing on. Talk about sticking it to someone, calling them GOAT after beating them. Many thought, whether you agree or don't - simply doesn't matter, that Novak played Rafa card on Rafa. Rafa immediately felt uncomfortable and shook his head at the statement.
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Hitman said:
That is just your opinion against the opinion I just said that many here were agreeing on. Talk about sticking it to someone, calling them GOAT after beating them. Many thought, whether you agree or don't - simply doesn't matter, that Novak played Rafa card on Rafa. Rafa immediately felt uncomfortable and shook his head at the statement.
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It was probably more a dig at Federer, given Federer and his spin machine invented the GOAT term.

So whe nNadal called Djokovic his toughest opponet after USO 2013, was Rafa rubbing it in? Imagine how brutal that was.
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
Gary20 said:
It was probably more a dig at Federer, given Federer and his spin machine invented the GOAT term.

So whe nNadal called Djokovic his toughest opponet after USO 2013, was Rafa rubbing it in? Imagine how brutal that was.
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Nah, many thought much different. Nadal was at the top of world. Novak was after him full throttle that year, IW was the start. That was in the minds of many the mind games that he actually learnt from Rafa himself. Beat the best and then call him GOAT straight after that.

Rafa can call Djokovic his toughest opponent, because that is HIS toughest opponent. He would know that better than anyone. Big difference is stating who is your toughest opponent and who is GOAT. No single person is authority on who is GOAT.
 
Krish872007

Krish872007

Talk Tennis Guru
They both used to pose very different problems for Novak. Of course Nadal is much closer to his age, so they've had more battles at the Slams in particular. Nadal's game was very physically demanding. So in that sense he'd be the toughest opponent. But since 2011 (with exception of bits of 2013), it looks like he's beating Nadal more easily for sure as he's achieved a similar level of physicality himself. So his problems with players now would be more from a stylistic point or just pure power, and so there's a strong case for Federer being the toughest as well.
 
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LazyNinja19

LazyNinja19

Banned
This just in. In a recent interview Novak told the media who he considers his toughest opponent ever.



gluten1.jpg
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Hitman said:
Nah, many thought much different. Nadal was at the top of world. Novak was after him full throttle that year, IW was the start. That was in the minds of many the mind games that he actually learnt from Rafa himself. Beat the best and then call him GOAT straight after that.

Rafa can call Djokovic his toughest opponent, because that is HIS toughest opponent. He would know that better than anyone. Big difference is stating who is your toughest opponent and who is GOAT. No single person is authority on who is GOAT.
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Lol, your hypocrisy is brilliant. Made me laugh.
 
roger presley

roger presley

Hall of Fame
Gary20 said:
Becker said they dislike each other and the incidnt after W this year wasnt exactly friendly.

That said im not sure Murray and djokovic get on that well these days?
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Becker is talking rubbish for a long time now. Nadal and Djokovic are not more friendly than Djokovic and Federer. Again you're writing about something that you only know and you only heard. Did you saw the last two Nadal -Djokovic matches and the handshakes at the end? Nadal did not have a friendly look at all.
 
D

Deleted member 77403

Guest
Gary20 said:
Lol, your hypocrisy is brilliant. Made me laugh.
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I'll take that as a compliment coming from one of the biggest ones on these boards.

So Safin called Santoro his toughest opponent, which he was...does that mean Santoro is GOAT for Safin? Or does this only apply when we are talking about Rafa, Novak and Roger? You want Rafa to be your GOAT, hey, no problem...I already told you that is cool with me, since it is YOUR opinion. Try not to throw your opinion around like it is fact though.
 
N

Nachiket Nolefam

Guest
Levi_Ackerman said:
Lose the "LOL"and yup, that's about the size of it.
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Can;t lose the LOL. Get off your high horse. Are you a professional player or something? Rafa has been playing every clay season for 12 years now, and still has withdrawn from AO and USO multiple times and didn't participate in WTF multiple times. And then people tell everyone about H2H
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
roger presley said:
Becker is talking rubbish for a long time now. Nadal and Djokovic are not more friendly than Djokovic and Federer. Again you're writing about something that you only know and you only heard. Did you saw the last two Nadal -Djokovic matches and the handshakes at the end? Nadal did not have a friendly look at all.
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Oh so you know more than Becker who is Djokovic's coach? You will forgive me if i give more importance to what Becker says than you!!
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Hitman said:
I'll take that as a compliment coming from one of the biggest ones on these boards.

So Safin called Santoro his toughest opponent, which he was...does that mean Santoro is GOAT for Safin? Or does this only apply when we are talking about Rafa, Novak and Roger? You want Rafa to be your GOAT, hey, no problem...I already told you that is cool with me, since it is YOUR opinion. Try not to throw your opinion around like it is fact though.
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Im the only consistent poster here as eveything i say is not opinion it is fact. I back up my comments, nobody else seems to. So according to you, Djokovic called Nadal the GOAT to get into his head? How exactly does that work. Now whether he genuinely meant it we will never know but if he was playing mind games, it was certainly directed at Federer. Perhaps he did genuinely mean it, ever think that, given he repeated it again and justified his opinion in the subsequent press conference!!
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
Nachiket Nolefam said:
Can;t lose the LOL. Get off your high horse. Are you a professional player or something? Rafa has been playing every clay season for 12 years now, and still has withdrawn from AO and USO multiple times and didn't participate in WTF multiple times. And then people tell everyone about H2H
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In the Becker/Edberg thread, many seem to think h2h is suddenely important!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
roger presley

roger presley

Hall of Fame
Gary20 said:
Im the only consistent poster here as eveything i say is not opinion it is fact. I back up my comments, nobody else seems to. So according to you, Djokovic called Nadal the GOAT to get into his head? How exactly does that work. Now whether he genuinely meant it we will never know but if he was playing mind games, it was certainly directed at Federer. Perhaps he did genuinely mean it, ever think that, given he repeated it again and justified his opinion in the subsequent press conference!!
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The only thing that is consistent with you is writing all the time. It does not matter what or does it have a sense ,just irritate people all the time with your stupid posts.
 
Gary20

Gary20

Banned
roger presley said:
The only thing that is consistent with you is writing all the time. It does not matter what or does it have a sense ,just irritate people all the time with your stupid posts.
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Fact is not stupid. Nadal fans have all but left this site due to the idiotic haters on here. Its how i ended up here, i was told it was populated by moronic Nadal haters, as i love a fight, hence my joining. I shall continue to boast about Nadal's achievements and rub it in.
 
roger presley

roger presley

Hall of Fame
Gary20 said:
Fact is not stupid. Nadal fans have all but left this site due to the idiotic haters on here. Its how i ended up here, i was told it was populated by moronic Nadal haters, as i love a fight, hence my joining. I shall continue to boast about Nadal's achievements and rub it in.
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Enjoy it then,my guess is that it won't be for long,Djokovic is getting closer and closer.
 
The_Order

The_Order

G.O.A.T.
tennis_pro said:
Who gave Djokovic the most problems before 2008? Federer, head to head 5-1 for Federer, that only loss came in Canada after Djokovic had to play near perfect tennis to beat him 7-6 2-6 7-6
2008-2010? Nadal and Federer equally.
2011-2012? Nadal was tough but Djokovic still went 7-0 against him after which Nadal had some wins on clay in 2012. Federer beat him at the FO, virtually beat him at the US Open, then in 2012 beat him at Wimbledon and Cincinnati and played him very close at the WTF.
2013? Nadal for sure.
2014-2015? Federer. He ended 2014 with a 3-2 head-to-head against Djokovic and this year is the only man to beat him in more than one match, not to mention he takes at least a set in every loss that he suffers.

Federer is also 6 years older than Djokovic and further from his prime than Djokovic is. If they were the same age there would be no question who the toughest opponent for Djokovic would be. So even tho Djokovic's head to head against Fedal is just about identical, Federer gives Djokovic a harder time given that he plays him close in every match while there have been a lot of matches when Djokovic schooled Nadal. That never happened to Federer or very rarely.
Click to expand...

Before 2008:

Nadal 6 - 2 h2h with 3 slam wins
Federer 5 - 1 h2h with 2 slam wins

2008 - 2010:

Nadal 10 -5 h2h with 2 slam wins
Federer 8 - 5 h2h 2 all with slam wins

So tell me, how on God's green Earth does Fed have the 'clear' edge pre 2008, yet from 2008-2010 it's equal?

The FACT is pre 2011, Nadal had a 16 - 7 h2h while Federer had 13 - 6 h2h. Nadal 0 losses to Novak in majors while Federer had 2.

Advantage: Nadal (beyond any delusional Fed fans imagination)

Since 2011:

Nadal 7 - 15
Federer 8 - 16

THAT is what you call quite even.

Advantage: EVEN
 
Numero Uno

Numero Uno

Semi-Pro
tennis_pro said:
Who gave Djokovic the most problems before 2008? Federer, head to head 5-1 for Federer, that only loss came in Canada after Djokovic had to play near perfect tennis to beat him 7-6 2-6 7-6
2008-2010? Nadal and Federer equally.
2011-2012? Nadal was tough but Djokovic still went 7-0 against him after which Nadal had some wins on clay in 2012. Federer beat him at the FO, virtually beat him at the US Open, then in 2012 beat him at Wimbledon and Cincinnati and played him very close at the WTF.
2013? Nadal for sure.
2014-2015? Federer. He ended 2014 with a 3-2 head-to-head against Djokovic and this year is the only man to beat him in more than one match, not to mention he takes at least a set in every loss that he suffers.

Federer is also 6 years older than Djokovic and further from his prime than Djokovic is. If they were the same age there would be no question who the toughest opponent for Djokovic would be. So even tho Djokovic's head to head against Fedal is just about identical, Federer gives Djokovic a harder time given that he plays him close in every match while there have been a lot of matches when Djokovic schooled Nadal. That never happened to Federer or very rarely.
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nadal has far more successful h2h against novak at slams than roger.. novak leads roger at slams 8-6 i think but rafa leads novak at slams by 5 or 6 victories i think.. also rafa leads overal h2h while fedovic is equal but novak would lead that if roger didn't shamefully withdraw last year in london.. rafa is harder opponent for novak without a doubt.. im big novak fan
 
O

oneness

Professional
Martin J said:
I think this is also related to the fact that Djokovic and Nadal have played only once at Novak's best Major (AO), where they've met seven times at Roland Garros, which obviously favors Nadal.
Had they played, for example, six times at the AO and only once at the FO, their H2H would've looked different.
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Also the reason why Novak has so many WTF titles and rafa has none.
This is why all the discussions about who is greater than who is so tiring, would much love if this board discussed the actual plays more.
 
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AceSalvo

AceSalvo

Legend
The_Order said:
Before 2008:

Nadal 6 - 2 h2h with 3 slam wins
Federer 5 - 1 h2h with 2 slam wins

2008 - 2010:

Nadal 10 -5 h2h with 2 slam wins
Federer 8 - 5 h2h 2 all with slam wins

So tell me, how on God's green Earth does Fed have the 'clear' edge pre 2008, yet from 2008-2010 it's equal?

The FACT is pre 2011, Nadal had a 16 - 7 h2h while Federer had 13 - 6 h2h. Nadal 0 losses to Novak in majors while Federer had 2.

Advantage: Nadal (beyond any delusional Fed fans imagination)

Since 2011:

Nadal 7 - 15
Federer 8 - 16

THAT is what you call quite even.

Advantage: EVEN
Click to expand...


you just made the whole case for Roger. Nadal is even with Roger who is a whole generation older than these kids.
 
The_Order

The_Order

G.O.A.T.
AceSalvo said:
you just made the whole case for Roger. Nadal is even with Roger who is a whole generation older than these kids.
Click to expand...

Can you not read?

Nadal had the clear edge pre 2011.
Since then it has been about even.

Hope you read that this time, I'm not going to tell you again.
 
Noleberic123

Noleberic123

G.O.A.T.
oneness said:
Sorry, I am not sure what you mean. Are you agreeing or disagreeing with me. The difference between AO and Roland Garros is the surface as well.
Click to expand...
I'm saying the reason nadal doesn't have any WTF titles is because of the surface. the balls don't bounce as high at the O2
 
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