Nadal had the toughest competition out of any player in history

Who had the toughest competition

  • Federer

    Votes: 62 40.3%
  • Nadal

    Votes: 54 35.1%
  • Djokovic

    Votes: 38 24.7%

  • Total voters
    154

REKX

Rookie
Firstly I have to state I am a Federer and Nadal fan, and this is a very unbiased thread, but just what I have observed over the years. I would still say Federer is the greatest player followed by Nadal second, then either Djokovic or Sampras number 3.

Federer had a trouble free start to his grand slam wins, there weren't many notable opponents in the early years. It was a retiring Agassi, and Roddick and few others which weren't of the highest level. Nadal troubled Federer from the very first game. When Nadal and Djokovic started to emerge as multiple grand slam winners, Federer struggled. Federer also enjoyed a very weak era last year.

Djokovic hugely benefited from the end of Federer's career where his form was low, and the same with Nadal in the last few years. Nadal was obviously going to drop off quicker due to his style of play and the impact the body takes. So Djokovic enjoyed a free ride over the last few years, before 2017, and at one point held all four grand slams I believe.

Nadal had it very tough. He was playing on the men's tour when he was a child. He had to compete against who most people consider the greatest player of all time Roger Federer. Nadal was number 2 for so many years, but him and his uncle worked out a way to beat Federer at his own home, and he did so in Wimbledon 2008. Federer was untouchable on grass from 2003 to 2009, and was still in his greatest form in 2008 and Nadal had to battle on his weakest surface to beat him. He then had to compete with Prime Djokovic, against who I would probably consider the third greatest player of all time. So to think he had to compete with the greatest and third greatest players in history in their primes.
 

REKX

Rookie
Yes he was. Like nadal was in his greatest form in 2015, 16 and djokovic is currently peaking in 2017-18
Federer was playing amazing in 2008 Wimbledon, didn't lose a set til the final. Was hitting winners from anywhere, it was amazing to watch. I was only a Federer fan back then, so the loss hurt. But once I appreciated Nadal, I appreciated how big Wimbledon 2008 was, a remarkable achievement. Number 1 Nadal's weakest surface, number 2 Federer greatest grass court player of all time.
 

pc1

G.O.A.T.
I am a little puzzled by the premise of this thread. Since Federer has played all the years Nadal has played and perhaps has missed less time than Nadal, how is Nadal's competition stronger? The argument that Nadal played Federer at his best doesn't hold water since Federer cannot play himself and yet Federer played Nadal at his best.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Nadal's competition isn't the toughest among the Big 3. Competition for all 3 of them has been pretty much the same.

Nadal having it tougher than Federer is nothing but a myth since they have been top players together since 2005 and have played against the same field.

Nadal trolls always say Nadal had it tougher because he had to deal with Federer. Well, not Fed's fault he couldn't face himself since he was the top dog for many years.
 

Fedforever

Hall of Fame
If Nadal is better than Federer then Federer has to have had the toughest competition surely? Logically Nadal cannot be the GOAT and have had tougher competition than his contemporaries.

T
 

thrust

Hall of Fame
Firstly I have to state I am a Federer and Nadal fan, and this is a very unbiased thread, but just what I have observed over the years. I would still say Federer is the greatest player followed by Nadal second, then either Djokovic or Sampras number 3.

Federer had a trouble free start to his grand slam wins, there weren't many notable opponents in the early years. It was a retiring Agassi, and Roddick and few others which weren't of the highest level. Nadal troubled Federer from the very first game. When Nadal and Djokovic started to emerge as multiple grand slam winners, Federer struggled. Federer also enjoyed a very weak era last year.

Djokovic hugely benefited from the end of Federer's career where his form was low, and the same with Nadal in the last few years. Nadal was obviously going to drop off quicker due to his style of play and the impact the body takes. So Djokovic enjoyed a free ride over the last few years, before 2017, and at one point held all four grand slams I believe.

Nadal had it very tough. He was playing on the men's tour when he was a child. He had to compete against who most people consider the greatest player of all time Roger Federer. Nadal was number 2 for so many years, but him and his uncle worked out a way to beat Federer at his own home, and he did so in Wimbledon 2008. Federer was untouchable on grass from 2003 to 2009, and was still in his greatest form in 2008 and Nadal had to battle on his weakest surface to beat him. He then had to compete with Prime Djokovic, against who I would probably consider the third greatest player of all time. So to think he had to compete with the greatest and third greatest players in history in their primes.
Since 2000, Nadal has had the toughest competition, then Djokovic, then Federer. Young pre peak Nadal had to deal with peak Federer, and did quite well. Then he had to deal with peak Djokovic and Murray. All Time, Rosewall had it tough too. Once he joined the pro tour he had to deal with peak: Gonzalez, Hoad, Sedgman, Trabert, Laver, Newcombe Smith, Ashe, then Connors, and Nastase.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
They didn't. Federer had to face a lot weaker players before Nadal and Djokovic emerged.
Just like Nadal and Djokovic have had to face lots of weaker players after they turned 26-27 with no young players to challenge them. It evens out.

By the way, "Federer and Nadal fan", Nadal emerged in 2005, while Djokovic emerged in 2007, so Federer had to deal with them too. And he was at an even bigger disadvantage since they were 5 and 6 years younger than him. So he has had it the toughest. Nadal an Djokovic have no one younger than them as competition.
 
D

Deleted member 756486

Guest
Andy Murray has had the toughest competition out of any player in history.

Still came out as the GOAT. :cool:
 
I am a little puzzled by the premise of this thread. Since Federer has played all the years Nadal has played and perhaps has missed less time than Nadal, how is Nadal's competition stronger? The argument that Nadal played Federer at his best doesn't hold water since Federer cannot play himself and yet Federer played Nadal at his best.
Nice joke...
Look at 2008 losses of federer..
If any glimpse from 2007 was there, nadal would have never capitalized in first 2 sets and would be defeated in 4/5....

Accept it new user, you're nadal fan. And VB too. No need of masking as *Fedal Fan*
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Since 2000, Nadal has had the toughest competition, then Djokovic, then Federer. Young pre peak Nadal had to deal with peak Federer, and did quite well. Then he had to deal with peak Djokovic and Murray. All Time, Rosewall had it tough too. Once he joined the pro tour he had to deal with peak: Gonzalez, Hoad, Sedgman, Trabert, Laver, Newcombe Smith, Ashe, then Connors, and Nastase.
The bolded parts are so laughable, man :D

Djokovic having it tougher than Federer given that he won half of his majors in the weak era of 2014-2016 with no young players to challenge him? Laughable.

Murray considered tough competition? Come on, man :D

You seem to completely omit that Federer has had to deal with peak Nadal and peak Djokovic at the same time while being past his prime. Nadal and Djokovic never had to deal with two Big 3 players at their peaks at the same time.
 

fundrazer

Legend
I am a little puzzled by the premise of this thread. Since Federer has played all the years Nadal has played and perhaps has missed less time than Nadal, how is Nadal's competition stronger? The argument that Nadal played Federer at his best doesn't hold water since Federer cannot play himself and yet Federer played Nadal at his best.
I think the logic is that Federer is a better player than Nadal, which makes Nadal's competition tougher.

*Shrugs
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
They didn't. Federer had to face a lot weaker players before Nadal and Djokovic emerged.
And Nadal has had a cakewalk on clay for 14 years now. Djokovic also had a cakewalk field in 2014-2016.

Yes, their competition has been more or less equal. Federer and Nadal have been top players together since 2005, so your argument is BS. :D
 

Northern

Hall of Fame
Fed had the advantage at some point, but things have evened out now. I don't think you can distinguish any of the three as having a weak competition advantage. The one area Nadal gets the short end of the stick is in injuries and layoff time. If Federer had suffered the same injuries he would be nowhere close to 20 slams.
 
D

Deleted member 756486

Guest
@REKX you should add Sir Andy Murray as a poll option, his competition is the toughest since he’s had to deal with all 3 of those players throughout his GOAT career.
 

Plamen1234

Hall of Fame
Regarding Wimbledon because the OP mentioned it ,Nadal havent faced tough competition since 2011 where he met Djokovic in the final.Since then he have lost to journeyman in Wimbledon - Steve Darcis,Dustin Brown,Lucas Rosol
 
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Northern

Hall of Fame
And Nadal has had a cakewalk on clay for 14 years now. Djokovic also had a cakewalk field in 2014-2016.

Yes, their competition has been more or less equal. Federer and Nadal have been top players together since 2005, so your argument is BS. :D
Not really cakewalk. It's just that he is so much better than the rest. Same faulty logic.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Fed had the advantage at some point, but things have evened out now. I don't think you can distinguish any of the three as having a weak competition advantage. The one area Nadal gets the short end of the stick is in injuries and layoff time. If Federer had suffered the same injuries he would be nowhere close to 20 slams.
Unlike Nadal, Fed actually had to undergo surgery on his knee.

Oh please, these timeouts have allowed Nadal to still dominate clay and win slams. Without them, he might have burned out earlier, so he didn't suffer by having timeouts since non of them were detrimental to his career.
 

REKX

Rookie
Just like Nadal and Djokovic have had to face lots of weaker players after they turned 26-27 with no young players to challenge them. It evens out.

By the way, "Federer and Nadal fan", Nadal emerged in 2005, while Djokovic emerged in 2007, so Federer had to deal with them too. And he was at an even bigger disadvantage since they were 5 and 6 years younger than him. So he has had it the toughest. Nadal an Djokovic have no one younger than them as competition.
Lol. Logic.

Nadal and Djokovic were no where near their best in 2006-2007, what are you talking about? Nadal outside of clay couldn't compete at all, of course this is the case as he wasn't in his prime yet. Just like Federer was at his best around 2007 aged 27.

That is the whole point, whilst Federer was at his best, his competition was not there. Nadal faced prime Federer and Prime Djokovic.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Not really cakewalk. It's just that he is so much better than the rest. Same faulty logic.
But Federer instead had weak competition, not that he was better than the rest.

Sorry, man, maybe you're not the one spreading this nonsense, but if Federer dominated because of weak competition, so did Nadal dominate on clay because of weak competition. Enough of these double standards.
 
D

Deleted member 756486

Guest
Nadal easily....how anyone can say Federer is beyond me. Nadal has had to face peak versions of both Federer and Djokovic when at his prime
You can say the same for Mury...

Adding some perspective here because some people can’t look beyond the Fedal fanwars.

MURY GOAT.
 

Northern

Hall of Fame
Unlike Nadal, Fed actually had to undergo surgery on his knee.

Oh please, these timeouts have allowed Nadal to still dominate clay and win slams. Without them, he might have burned out earlier, so he didn't suffer by having timeouts since non of them were detrimental to his career.
Not defending slams hasn't been detrimental to Nadal's career? Try to convince Fed to sit out Wimbledon and see what he responds. Then tell him that he would be extending his career.
 

Sport

Legend
No way had Federer a tougher competition than Nadal. Federer had the 2003-2007 weak era against Phillipoussis, Baghdatis and Roddick. (Before anyone argue that Nadal played there, it should be noted that Federer didn't win a GS outside grass until he was 22. Nadal was under 22 in the 2003-2007 era, so not at his peak outside clay. You can't demand Nadal winning GS ouside clay before being 22, when Federer never won GS outside grass before being 22).

Nadal had to face either peak Federer or peak Djokovic during all his career.

This is pretty much like asking "which is your favorite player?". There are far more fans of Federer in TTW, so of course most people vote for Federer.

In any case, the opinion of the majority is not an indicative of truth. Otherwise, we would have to accept as true things that were accepted in the past by the mejority of people. For instance, in the X century most people believed that the Earth was at the center of the universe. If the opinion of the majority were an indicative of truth, then we would have to admit that the Earth was at the center of the universe in the X century, which is obviously false.

To say that something is true only because most people think so is a logical fallacy known as argumentum ad populum:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum
 
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mike danny

Bionic Poster
Lol. Logic.

Nadal and Djokovic were no where near their best in 2006-2007, what are you talking about? Nadal outside of clay couldn't compete at all, of course this is the case as he wasn't in his prime yet. Just like Federer was at his best around 2007 aged 27.

That is the whole point, whilst Federer was at his best, his competition was not there. Nadal faced prime Federer and Prime Djokovic.
LOL, Nadal couldn't compete outside of clay in 2006-2007 :D, that's why he won HC masters and reached 2 Wimb finals giving Fed good battles in both of them. Enough with this BS.

Federer had peak Nadalovic to contend with at some point. Nadal never had peak Fedovic at the same time, so cut your BS :D

Fed wasn't at his best at age 27, but of course you don't know this since you're not actually a "Federer and Nadal fan."

Federer hasn't at his best either in 2011-present, but you don't care about this :D
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Not defending slams hasn't been detrimental to Nadal's career? Try to convince Fed to sit out Wimbledon and see what he responds. Then tell him that he would be extending his career.
Nadal only once had to withdraw from RG because of injury, all the other times they never affected him at his best slam. Fed failed to win Wimb in 2016 because of injury and injury forced him to withdraw from the USO, another one of his best slams. So it evens out.
 

Northern

Hall of Fame
But Federer instead had weak competition, not that he was better than the rest.

Sorry, man, maybe you're not the one spreading this nonsense, but if Federer dominated because of weak competition, so did Nadal dominate on clay because of weak competition. Enough of these double standards.
How can Wimbledon have been a strong era when Nadal and Djokovic have a combined 5 titles against Fed and they can barely serve? And in the case of Djokovic can't even execute a proper overhead smash?

Grass used to be THE surface. A multislam surface. Now it's a joke. It doesn't even play like grass anymore. Thast's why there is no real grass field or grass specialists to speak of.
 

Zoolander

Hall of Fame
All this thread needed to say was " Nadal had the toughest competition out of any player in history.... at the 2017 US Open" and I would have had a good laugh.

Disappointed, OP! You could have made my day.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Nadal easily....how anyone can say Federer is beyond me. Nadal has had to face peak versions of both Federer and Djokovic when at his prime
LOL what? You know nothing. Nadal never had to face both Federer and Djokovic at their peaks at the same time. Federer actually did have to face both peak Nadal and peak Djokovic at the same time. Ergo, it's not blasphemy to say Federer has had it the toughest.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
No way had Federer a tougher competition than Nadal. Federer had the 2003-2007 weak era against Phillipoussis, Baghdatis and Roddick. (Before anyone argue that Nadal palyed there, it should be noted that Federer didn't win a GS outside grass until he was 22. Nadal was under 22 in the 2003-2007 era, so not at his peak outside clay. You can't demand Nadal winning GS ouside clay before being 22, when Federer never won GS outside grass before being 22).

Nadal had to face either peak Federer or peak Djokovic during all his career.

This is pretty much like asking "which is your favorite player?". There are far more fans of Federer in TTW, so of course most people vote for Federer.

In any case, the opinion of the majority is not an indicative of truth. Otherwise, we would have to accept as true things that were accepted in the past by the mejority of people. For instance, in the X century most people believed that the Earth was at the center of the universe. If the opinion of the majority were an indicative of truth, then we would have to admit that the Earth was at the center of the universe in the X century, which is obviously false.

To say that something is true only because most people think so is a logical fallacy known as argumentum ad populum:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum
Nadal too had Anderson, Berdych, Soderling and Puerta as weak opponents. You grouping Roddick together with Phillippoussis and Baghdatis already shows you know nothing about tennis. :D

Nadal also had 2010 and 2017 to feast on, both years much weaker than Federer's 2004-2007.
 

Northern

Hall of Fame
Nadal only once had to withdraw from RG because of injury, all the other times they never affected him at his best slam. Fed failed to win Wimb in 2016 because of injury and injury forced him to withdraw from the USO, another one of his best slams. So it evens out.
Nadal missed Wimbledon 09, many USOs, lost AO14 due to injury, etc. It's not even close.
 

Sport

Legend
Nadal only had 3 easy rivals in the GS finals: Puerta, Berdych and Anderson. (Ferrer in the 2013 FO final doesn't count since Nadal defeated Djokovic in the semifinals).

Federer won 12 GS in the waek era (2003-2007) against Philippoussis, Baghdatis, old Agassi, Roddick, teenager Nadal on grass and the likes.

Not to mention an injured Cilic in the Wimbledon 2017 final (12 +1).

13 >>>3.

Simple maths. Federer weaker era.
 
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