Nadal highest peak on a single surface, Djokovic highest peak across different surfaces

Do you agree?

  • Total voters
    40
NoleFam said:
He had 56 wins in a row on hardcourt but only 8 wins against the top 10 and only 4 wins against the top 5. I'm not one of those people who claim weak era over every Federer record but this one is definitely inflated and he would never win 56 in a row on a neutral surface like hardcourt in any year from 2008-2012. His grass record on the other hand is very impressive.
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What's your point? Djokovic also wouldn't win 4 slams in a row in any year from 2008 to 2012 and wouldn't achieve other stuff in those years.
 
Crazy Finn said:
Because Roddick's not nearly as good as some think.

However, Fed was insanely good at dealing with Roddick's serve - relatively. There's zero doubt about that. That semi was exhibit A on that, even Roddick on a poor day holds pretty well. Roddick's problem was the rest of his game was pretty middling and Fed usually had some answers to his serve. Thus, the H2H between them.



Peak Djokovic never really looks unbeatable, more inevitable - which probably works out the same, though it looks different. He doesn't attack like Federer or Sampras or Agassi - the former 2 who could very much look unbeatable at their very best. Peak Federer made you wonder how the opponent was going to win a point or a game. But, that's my opinion.
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The 2007 AO SF is not the best indicator of how well Roddick can play anyway. As good as Federer looked, Roddick played poorly and he was giving Fed easy passes constantly. Their 2007 USO QF was a better indicator.
 
mike danny said:
What's your point? Djokovic also wouldn't win 4 slams in a row in any year from 2008 to 2012 and wouldn't achieve other stuff in those years.
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I think I made my point pretty clear and Djokovic was 2 sets away from doing what you just described in 2012. Not a good example.
 
NoleFam said:
I don't know the dates. I just know it was from 2005 Rotterdam to 2006 Dubai.
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Right, I just checked.

Tournaments like Rotterdam, Bangok, Doha and Dubai 2006 pre final certainly inflated his numbers and contributed to the streak. That's 19 wins right there.

However, there are 2 things that I want to mention:

1. He also beat Nadal in the final of Miami who would become no. 2 shortly after and Ljubicic did play well early in the year and was stopped by Fed a lot. He would enter the top 10 anyway. Also beat Davydenko in Rotterdam, another guy who would enter the top 10 later in the season. Also beat Nalbandian who was ranked no. 11 and would end the year as no. 6 anyway. These things need to be taken into account.

2. Fed's consistency against guys outside the top 10 finally improved after 2004, a year in which he only lost to such players. So that makes his streak more impressive because of this.
 
mike danny said:
Right, I just checked.

Tournaments like Rotterdam, Bangok, Doha and Dubai 2006 pre final certainly inflated his numbers and contributed to the streak. That's 19 wins right there.

However, there are 2 things that I want to mention:

1. He also beat Nadal in the final of Miami who would become no. 2 shortly after and Ljubicic did play well early in the year and was stopped by Fed a lot. He would enter the top 10 anyway. Also beat Davydenko in Rotterdam, another guy who would enter the top 10 later in the season. Also beat Nalbandian who was ranked no. 11 and would end the year as no. 6 anyway. These things need to be taken into account.

2. Fed's consistency against guys outside the top 10 finally improved after 2004, a year in which he only lost to such players. So that makes his streak more impressive because of this.
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Ljubicic was playing top 10 ball on the indoor circuit in 2005 easily, he also played very well in Davis Cup.

There was some decent depth in some of those tournament draws, like Doha for example - two players who YE ranking was top 10 and another in Ferrer who ended in the top 20. Shame Fed didn't play Montreal all that year, would have been interesting to see him play Nadal/Agassi.
 
mike danny said:
Right, I just checked.

Tournaments like Rotterdam, Bangok, Doha and Dubai 2006 pre final certainly inflated his numbers and contributed to the streak. That's 19 wins right there.

However, there are 2 things that I want to mention:

1. He also beat Nadal in the final of Miami who would become no. 2 shortly after and Ljubicic did play well early in the year and was stopped by Fed a lot. He would enter the top 10 anyway. Also beat Davydenko in Rotterdam, another guy who would enter the top 10 later in the season. Also beat Nalbandian who was ranked no. 11 and would end the year as no. 6 anyway. These things need to be taken into account.

2. Fed's consistency against guys outside the top 10 finally improved after 2004, a year in which he only lost to such players. So that makes his streak more impressive because of this.
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Yea a few tough wins against guys outside the top 10 but not that tough overall in that run which is the point. This is not worthy of a long drawn out debate.
 
NoleFam said:
Yea a few tough wins against guys outside the top 10 but not that tough overall in that run which is the point. This is not worthy of a long drawn out debate.
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Not willing to extend this anyway. Couldn't care less about this streak of his. Forgot he even had it.
 
NatF said:
Ljubicic was playing top 10 ball on the indoor circuit in 2005 easily, he also played very well in Davis Cup.

There was some decent depth in some of those tournament draws, like Doha for example - two players who YE ranking was top 10 and another in Ferrer who ended in the top 20. Shame Fed didn't play Montreal all that year, would have been interesting to see him play Nadal/Agassi.
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Fed skipped 4 masters 1000 in 2005. I don't think he ever skipped that many in his career during a season, outside 2013 and 2016, obviously.
 
mike danny said:
Fed skipped 4 masters 1000 in 2005. I don't think he ever skipped that many in his career during a season, outside 2013 and 2016, obviously.
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Guy made a lot of deep runs early in the season, played some big DC ties and then the wheels came off until the indoor swing.
 
NatF said:
Guy made a lot of deep runs early in the season, played some big DC ties and then the wheels came off until the indoor swing.
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I'm gonna guess he wanted some confidence back early in the season after his AO loss, which is why he decided to play Rotterdam and Dubai.
 
mike danny said:
What's your point? Djokovic also wouldn't win 4 slams in a row in any year from 2008 to 2012 and wouldn't achieve other stuff in those years.
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Djokovic in 2015-2016 defeated

Federer
Federer
Federer + Murray
Murray

To win 4 in a row. All ATG opponents.
 
RS said:
If Fed is aged 33-34 in a slam very similar indeed.
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"I think I’m a better player now than when I was at 24 because I’ve practised for another 10 years and I’ve got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don’t have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it’s ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I’ve had to adapt to a new generation of players again"


Federer himself confirmed he played better than ever in 2015 o_O
 
NoleIsBoat said:
"I think I’m a better player now than when I was at 24 because I’ve practised for another 10 years and I’ve got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don’t have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it’s ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I’ve had to adapt to a new generation of players again"


Federer himself confirmed he played better than ever in 2015o_O
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Give himself confidence.
 
NoleIsBoat said:
"I think I’m a better player now than when I was at 24 because I’ve practised for another 10 years and I’ve got 10 years more experience,” Federer said. “Maybe I don’t have the confidence level that I had at 24 when I was winning 40 matches in a row, but I feel like I hit a bigger serve, my backhand is better, my forehand is still as good as it’s ever been, I volley better than I have in the past. I think I’ve had to adapt to a new generation of players again"


Federer himself confirmed he played better than ever in 2015o_O
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Yeah, not even gonna bother.
 
Only delusional Joker fanboys think 34 year old Federer is better than 24 year old Federer.

I’m sure it’s hard to tell what you, yourself have lost, in the moment. It’s possible that some of those things ARE better than they were at 24, but simply being 24 instead of 34 allows you to do things easily that you can’t a decade later. This is something that Rafa and even Novak are dealing with to some degree. There is no way that 2019 Novak is as good as 2011 Novak.

I‘ll just point out that young, peak Fed could play ridiculous defense - in addition to his all court attacking game. He often didn’t have to, but it was there and often flipped crucial points to him.
 
Crazy Finn said:
Only delusional Joker fanboys think 34 year old Federer is better than 24 year old Federer.

I’m sure it’s hard to tell what you, yourself have lost, in the moment. It’s possible that some of those things ARE better than they were at 24, but simply being 24 instead of 34 allows you to do things easily that you can’t a decade later. This is something that Rafa and even Novak are dealing with to some degree. There is no way that 2019 Novak is as good as 2011 Novak.

I‘ll just point out that young, peak Fed could play ridiculous defense - in addition to his all court attacking game. He often didn’t have to, but it was there and often flipped crucial points to him.
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You don't even have to go that far. 2008-early 2009 Fed, who went toe to toe with absolute peak Nadal was miles better than older Fed.
 
NoleIsBoat said:
Federer of summer 2015 won 46 consecutive sets excluding losses to Djokovic.
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No one is saying the 2015 Federer wasn't good at 34. He just wasn't 24-25 year old Federer. Rafa at 34 isn't quite as good as 22-24 year old Rafa. Novak isn't 34, but I'll guess 2021 Novak won't be as good as 2011 Novak.
 
NoleIsBoat said:
Federer of summer 2015 won 46 consecutive sets excluding losses to Djokovic.
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44 sets. Ridicolous stat, beating among others #1 Djokovic, #3 Murray twice, and #5 Wawrinka.

He was IMO playing even better than Djokovic in that period but he was outclutched in the Slam finals.
 
Lew II said:
44 sets. Ridicolous stat, beating among others #1 Djokovic, #3 Murray twice, and #5 Wawrinka.

He was IMO playing even better than Djokovic in that period but he was outclutched in the Slam finals.
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Thanks, incredible form. Overall I would say yes, but Djokovic was better at wimbledon.
 
Lew II said:
44 sets. Ridicolous stat, beating among others #1 Djokovic, #3 Murray twice, and #5 Wawrinka.

He was IMO playing even better than Djokovic in that periood but he was outclutched in the Slam finals.
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He wasn’t playing better because Djokovic beat him twice lol. If he had won one of the two yes.
 
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