Nadal is past his clay prime and could lose at Roland Garros 2014

[Start da Game]

i really won't be surprised or shocked if it happens......nadal's amazing clay greatness is a standalone in tennis history, no other individual achievement by any player on any surface stands up and matches it......

but every great run has to eventually meet its end at some point......i have a feeling 2014 is that year......in the recent times, nadal's game has transformed towards hardcourts and worsened on clay......he could have easily lost that roland garros semis to djokovic last year but his sheer greatness pulled him through......he was already past his prime on clay by then......

2008 was his absolute god mode on clay, 2009 injured, 2010 again just sensational on the surface, 2011 horrible form......2012 was probably his last incredible show on clay, performance which was close to his best......2013 was a result of just his sheer greatness and nothing else......

i have a feeling that he is a great hardcourt player these days than a great clay courter......his current level on clay is three times below to what it was in 2007, 2008......so i really won't be surprised if he loses*** at roland garros this year.......

***if he is to lose it definitely has to be before the final......if he somehow manages to reach the final, then no stopping him......because it is simply impossible to take him down at a roland garros final......once again his sheer greatness and aura on the surface will see him through......

 

[Kdude]

nope he's has the heart of a lion and the only way he's going down is if

A: he has a knee problem

B: his left arm falls off

 

[Winners or Errors]

C: his back is tweaked ;-)

 

[Winners or Errors]

Seriously, Nadal at French Open is as close to a lock as tennis has at a grand slam event. Yet another thread by a fanboy of someone trying to get everyone's goat, no pun intended. I've seen no indication of a clay decline. He won six clay events last year. Djokovic won one. Wawrinka won one. Has anyone else won more than one? I looked up Ferrer and he only won one last year as well... Who else could dream of challenging Nadal on clay? I just don't see it, but a big-hitter on his best day may have a chance if the clay is fast enough. That's down to luck.

 

[Algo]

He hasn't played a Clay event this year so there is no way to conclude he's past his prime on it.

 

[Russeljones]

i really won't be surprised or shocked if it happens......nadal's amazing clay greatness is a standalone in tennis history, no other individual achievement by any player on any surface stands up and matches it......

but every great run has to eventually meet its end at some point......i have a feeling 2014 is that year......in the recent times, nadal's game has transformed towards hardcourts and worsened on clay......he could have easily lost that roland garros semis to djokovic last year but his sheer greatness pulled him through......he was already past his prime on clay by then......

2008 was his absolute god mode on clay, 2009 injured, 2010 again just sensational on the surface, 2011 horrible form......2012 was probably his last incredible show on clay, performance which was close to his best......2013 was a result of just his sheer greatness and nothing else......

i have a feeling that he is a great hardcourt player these days than a great clay courter......his current level on clay is three times below to what it was in 2007, 2008......so i really won't be surprised if he loses*** at roland garros this year.......

***if he is to lose it definitely has to be before the final......if he somehow manages to reach the final, then no stopping him......because it is simply impossible to take him down at a roland garros final......once again his sheer greatness and aura on the surface will see him through......

Arguable. Wouldn't be hard to make a case for there being only one very good clay court player in Nadal's prime, whereas in Borg's time they were a myriad.

 

[pound cat]

Nadal had the year of his career in 2013 and may be losing his motivation & it will be interesting to see how 2014 unfolds for him. He's taking his time getting back into tennis after his AO loss.

 

[Magnetite]

He's been under threat since Djokovic 2.0 emerged in 2011.

And yes, it seems like he may not be at his prime on clay, but you just never know with Nadal.

Nadal playing lights out and winning every clay tournament he enters, is not out of the realm of possibility either.

 

[poofytail]

Reality check OP: he has been past his clay prime for years and still wins RG every year instead of a peak Djokovic. It is Djokovic who will soon pass his clay prime, possibly even this year, and already long past his clay prime Nadal will be winning it even easier the next several years until someone new emerges to challenge. Nadal already had his HUGE clay decline in 2011, and will probably stay at his new much diminished clay level for awhile. He actually hasnt gotten any worse since 2011, he dropped about 3 levels down in 2011 from what he had been the previous 6 years, and has more or less stayed there since (in fact a bit better in 2012). It is Novak who has been at his absolute all time best on clay the last 3 years, arguably the last 6 minus 2010, who is due for his own clay decline; and given that he isnt even beating Nadal where it matters before it, wont be any kind of threat once he does. Then there is nobody left for awhile.

 

[Deleted member 512391]

Reality check OP: he has been past his clay prime for years and still wins RG every year instead of a peak Djokovic. It is Djokovic who will soon pass his clay prime, possibly even this year, and already long past his clay prime Nadal will be winning it even easier the next several years until someone new emerges to challenge. Nadal already had his HUGE clay decline in 2011, and will probably stay at his new much diminished clay level for awhile. He actually hasnt gotten any worse since 2011, he dropped about 3 levels down in 2011 from what he had been the previous 6 years, and has more or less stayed there since (in fact a bit better in 2012). It is Novak who has been at his absolute all time best on clay the last 3 years, arguably the last 6 minus 2010, who is due for his own clay decline; and given that he isnt even beating Nadal where it matters before it, wont be any kind of threat once he does. Then there is nobody left for awhile.

Last year he won Barcelona, Madrid, Rome and Roland Garros and played final at Monte Carlo. There hasn't been a better clay year for him, with the exception of 2010.
Check your reality once again

 

[NADALRECORD]

If Nadal loses RG it won't be to Djokovic. Because last year Nadal was dragging his leg and very unhealthy. He only got his full movement back later in the year. That's why Nadal won the USO 6-1 in the 4th set (instead of a tough 5-setter like RG). Nadal's knees are better now than they've been for years (Nadal said it in January after receiving stem-cell treatment for the first time ever). So do I give Djokovic a chance? Only of taking a set. If anyone beats Nadal at RG it will be a new kid on the block who shows Nadal something new. Djokovic has shown all he can do, and it wasn't even enough vs 2013 "recovery Nadal".

 

[OddJack]

i really won't be surprised or shocked if it happens......nadal's amazing clay greatness is a standalone in tennis history, no other individual achievement by any player on any surface stands up and matches it......

but every great run has to eventually meet its end at some point......i have a feeling 2014 is that year......in the recent times, nadal's game has transformed towards hardcourts and worsened on clay......he could have easily lost that roland garros semis to djokovic last year but his sheer greatness pulled him through......he was already past his prime on clay by then......

2008 was his absolute god mode on clay, 2009 injured, 2010 again just sensational on the surface, 2011 horrible form......2012 was probably his last incredible show on clay, performance which was close to his best......2013 was a result of just his sheer greatness and nothing else......

i have a feeling that he is a great hardcourt player these days than a great clay courter......his current level on clay is three times below to what it was in 2007, 2008......so i really won't be surprised if he loses*** at roland garros this year.......

***if he is to lose it definitely has to be before the final......if he somehow manages to reach the final, then no stopping him......because it is simply impossible to take him down at a roland garros final......once again his sheer greatness and aura on the surface will see him through......

I diasgree with bolded part. He definitely can lose the final to Novak. He was only lucky he didnt last year

 

[Goosehead]

He hasn't played a Clay event this year so there is no way to conclude he's past his prime on it.

its an alien invasion..:shock:..changing form and size as they infest and swarm planet earth.

..the attack of the sinister laughing shapeshifting cruiseheads. :twisted:

 

[Algo]

its an alien invasion..:shock:..changing form and size as they infest and swarm planet earth.

..the attack of the sinister laughing shapeshifting cruiseheads. :twisted:

That would be frightening, I should not post that ever again, don't know what kind of monster I may summon :???:

 

[mike danny]

So Nadal is allowed to be out of his prime but Federer not...

 

[The-Champ]

So Nadal is allowed to be out of his prime but Federer not...

oh please...you guys give Federer 2003-2007 as prime/peak on grass. Nadal is on his 10th year at RG and still at his best?

 

[merlinpinpin]

That would be good for tennis, especially if a younger player wins it instead, so count me in (I'm not holding my breath, though).

 

[Murrayfan31]

Nadal only hit his prime on clay for 1 year. Every other year has been a grind that he eventually wins with the exception of Soderling.

 

[newpball]

Nope, I think the clay God will win another RG in 2014.

 

[mike danny]

oh please...you guys give Federer 2003-2007 as prime/peak on grass. Nadal is on his 10th year at RG and still at his best?

What about HC then? When the 2009 match took place Federer reached 9 finals in the last 11 HC slams. And since there are 2 HC slams every year it is the equivalent of Nadal's number of RG since 2005.

So at that point Federer was not allowed to be past his prime?

 

[zam88]

It could happen. It would not have been shocking if Nadal had lost that match last year to Djoker.

I would say Nadal is beginning to slip some on clay - I think without a doubt you can say that if 2013/14 Nadal played 2008 or 2010 Nadal that he would get beat.

But really when there is probably only ONE guy that can knock you out of a clay tournament your odds are still really really great.

I hope he loses RG... but even if he did and they repeated RG the next week I'd still mark him down as the favorite.

As much as I dislike Nadal, the only thing I can say is that if my life depended on the outcome of a match and I had to back one guy on the surface of my choice... I'm picking Nadal on clay...

 

[Mustard]

News to the anti-Nadal brigade:

Keep saying that Nadal could lose at Roland Garros, and eventually you'll be correct. As it stands, 8 French Opens, and counting.

 

[Russeljones]

News to the anti-Nadal brigade:

Keep saying that Nadal could lose at Roland Garros, and eventually you'll be correct. As it stands, 8 French Opens, and counting.

I don't understand what is wrong with saying Nadal could lose in 2013, or in 2014. He was pushed to the limit in 2013 and he hasn't started off too hot in 2014. Just saying, why is it preposterous to expect difficulties after such an extended period of excellence?

 

[Winners or Errors]

Doesn't matter if Nadal is in his prime or not on clay. Given how much better he is/was on that surface than everyone he has to/had to play, I don't think this is a question of prime. The guy is, literally, the bull on clay. He is one of two CGOATs. I'd put Borg down as the other. No comparing the two, as Borg had tougher competition IMHO.

 

[Sid_Vicious]

oh please...you guys give Federer 2003-2007 as prime/peak on grass. Nadal is on his 10th year at RG and still at his best?

Nadal is a legend who started winning RG at the age of 19. He is less than an year older than Djokovic and hasn't lost at the french open for 4 years and counting now. What proof do we have that Nadal is past his prime at the RG? Basically, 2011 and 2013 were shaky performances from Nadal at the FO, but it is not like Nadal was GOATing every round in 2005-2007. He dropped sets in matches he was expected to win in straights too.


2012 FO was, in my mind, Nadal's finest RG performance after the 2008 FO. The guy played like an animal. Djokovic only won a set because Nadal had a huge meltdown about the decision to keep playing in the rain. But yeah, those first two sets were obnoxious. Nadal's forehand was heavy Djokovic's backhand became a useless shot rather than being his tool to beat Nadal.

Btw , the champ. I think Fed was in his prime at Wimbledon 2008. He rolled into the final without even dropping a set. There was no excuse, it was just Nadal's time that year. I would also throw in 2009 as part of Federer's prime on grass. 2003-2009. 2010 was the year things started going south. Losing to hewitt at Halle and then getting whooped by Berdych.

 

[swordtennis]

I agree with that premise. 2008 was Nadal's absolute clay peak. Every other year has been a slog and he comes out on top.

 

[malbaker86]

I don't understand what is wrong with saying Nadal could lose in 2013, or in 2014. He was pushed to the limit in 2013 and he hasn't started off too hot in 2014. Just saying, why is it preposterous to expect difficulties after such an extended period of excellence?

Won Qatar and made the AO final is not starting off the year too hot?

Oh you're prolly factoring in the injury too, my bad I understand

 

[E La Banana]

I agree with that premise. 2008 was Nadal's absolute clay peak. Every other year has been a slog and he comes out on top.

Nadal on clay is still improving his game : attacking more, antivic strategy special, net coverage, shortening points, better serve, better return of serve...etc ...

So be ready for another 4 wins there, we'll talk after...

 

[Murrayfan31]

Nadal on clay is still improving his game : attacking more, antivic strategy special, net coverage, shortening points, better serve, better return of serve...etc ...

So be ready for another 4 wins there, we'll talk after...

That strategy helps him more on hard courts. He was more consistent in 2008 though.

 

[Death Master]

i really won't be surprised or shocked if it happens......nadal's amazing clay greatness is a standalone in tennis history, no other individual achievement by any player on any surface stands up and matches it......

but every great run has to eventually meet its end at some point......i have a feeling 2014 is that year......in the recent times, nadal's game has transformed towards hardcourts and worsened on clay......he could have easily lost that roland garros semis to djokovic last year but his sheer greatness pulled him through......he was already past his prime on clay by then......

2008 was his absolute god mode on clay, 2009 injured, 2010 again just sensational on the surface, 2011 horrible form......2012 was probably his last incredible show on clay, performance which was close to his best......2013 was a result of just his sheer greatness and nothing else......

i have a feeling that he is a great hardcourt player these days than a great clay courter......his current level on clay is three times below to what it was in 2007, 2008......so i really won't be surprised if he loses*** at roland garros this year.......

***if he is to lose it definitely has to be before the final......if he somehow manages to reach the final, then no stopping him......because it is simply impossible to take him down at a roland garros final......once again his sheer greatness and aura on the surface will see him through......

I don't think you know what the hell you are talking about general shanks.


this guy dominated the hard courts last year which is hardly his best surface.

2013 will furnish him with plenty of confidence to deal with his adversaries on his best surface.

he is not anywhere near 100% right now. I would say not even 80% but he will give Rio Open a shot and try to increase his intensity gradually.


he will be ready to take back Monte Carlo this year and then its on.

#14 happens at RG this year. that had to have been the will of the gods.

clay is the wellspring from which he flows.

and clay it will be where he snatches his all important #14.


#15 happens at Flushing Meadows.

 

[Russeljones]

Won Qatar and made the AO final is not starting off the year too hot?

Oh you're prolly factoring in the injury too, my bad I understand

Your bad? Oh I see, you are one of those 100% certain the injury was just as bad in set 1 as it was in set 2, I get it. Yes, if you give anyone of the Nadal, Djokovic, Murray, Federer quartet the option of facing Wawrinka/Berdych for a Slam title, I am pretty sure they'd bite your arm off. However, injury or not, Nadal was flat. Got bombed out 1st set and we don't know if this problem won't reoccur.

Only on TW is it the consensus that your guy being injured is not a portent of a bad start of the year. Go figure

 

[MichaelNadal]

Nadal is a legend who started winning RG at the age of 19. He is less than an year older than Djokovic and hasn't lost at the french open for 4 years and counting now. What proof do we have that Nadal is past his prime at the RG? Basically, 2011 and 2013 were shaky performances from Nadal at the FO, but it is not like Nadal was GOATing every round in 2005-2007. He dropped sets in matches he was expected to win in straights too.


2012 FO was, in my mind, Nadal's finest RG performance after the 2008 FO. The guy played like an animal. Djokovic only won a set because Nadal had a huge meltdown about the decision to keep playing in the rain. But yeah, those first two sets were obnoxious. Nadal's forehand was heavy Djokovic's backhand became a useless shot rather than being his tool to beat Nadal.

Btw , the champ. I think Fed was in his prime at Wimbledon 2008. He rolled into the final without even dropping a set. There was no excuse, it was just Nadal's time that year. I would also throw in 2009 as part of Federer's prime on grass. 2003-2009. 2010 was the year things started going south. Losing to hewitt at Halle and then getting whooped by Berdych.

Very good post, as usual from you.

 

[Sid_Vicious]

Very good post, as usual from you.

Thanks, man.


Nadal usually gives us a very good idea of his form before the french open starts anyway, so we can have this discussion in 2 months and see whether he is over the hill. Last year people thought he was past his prime on clay when he lost to Djokovic in Monte Carlo, but really, he was just getting started. He gained a lot of confidence in Madrid and Rome while Djokovic underperformed at both events. He really played awful in Monte Carlo anyway. Especially that first set.

 

[adil1972]

nothing to do or watch till start of french open, i only follow grand slams.......

 

[chjtennis]

We'll see in Monte Carlo, Madrid and Rome how much chance Nadal has to win FO this year.

 

[poofytail]

Last year he won Barcelona, Madrid, Rome and Roland Garros and played final at Monte Carlo. There hasn't been a better clay year for him, with the exception of 2010.
Check your reality once again

Yeah since prime Nadal would have played a final like he did at Monte Carlo even on his worst day, would have lost a clay final to some random nobody, and struggled vs some of the mugs he has struggled past at RG in recent years. Anyone who thinks the Nadal of 2011-2013 on CLAY is the same as 2005-2010 is on some serious drugs. That isnt to say he wont keep winning RG though. He probably will, and when Djokovic hits his clay decline which will probably be soon, probably just as easily as 2005-2008 despite a now much lower level of clay tennis than before.

 

[poofytail]

Doesn't matter if Nadal is in his prime or not on clay. Given how much better he is/was on that surface than everyone he has to/had to play, I don't think this is a question of prime. The guy is, literally, the bull on clay. He is one of two CGOATs. I'd put Borg down as the other. No comparing the two, as Borg had tougher competition IMHO.

Nadal is by a huge margin the clay GOAT. Borg doesnt even come close. You could even argue Rosewall against Borg. Borg did not play in a remotedly strong clay era either, so the competition argument doesnt really go anywhere.

 

[Vensai]

Possibly. Nothing is set in stone.

 

[boogie]

To say Rafa is past his prime on clay although may seem crazy is actually very true if viewed in more depth...But if you look at the #s after 2010 his consistency on clay was far less than it was in the glory years of 2006-2008, 2009 he was injured but did still manage to win Monte Carlo and Rome and Barcelona all lead up tournaments to the FO. That being said Rafa still cleaned up the Clay court season in supreme fashion in 2010 i remember Rafa creaming everybody in his path to win Monte Carlo, Rome, Madrid.....FO..
Anyways since 2011 as we all know Novak has won a few clay court masters in both 2011,2012, and 2013, not to mention Fed took the Madrid (blue clay) tourmanet in 2012. However to say Rafa is no longer in his clay court prime is kinda looking at the glass half full type view, Rafa is totally a victim of his own greatness similar to Fed he set his bar so high that when it comes down a little we all want to jump to judge this and judge that. As we have all seen in the past couple FO's Novak could have beaten him in both 2012 and espcially in 2013, but as well all know beating Rafa in Paris is pretty much impossible i mean the guy lost one match in Paris in the last 9 years!!!! And if he wins again this year.... that would make it 10!!!
On paper yes Rafa isn't in his prime anymore when it comes to clay but realistically he is sooooo good that he doesn't need to be either. HE could easily win 2-3 more FO IMO. Jeez i really wish i could say the same for Federer on any surface =(.

 

[Sid_Vicious]

Yeah since prime Nadal would have played a final like he did at Monte Carlo even on his worst day, would have lost a clay final to some random nobody, and struggled vs some of the mugs he has struggled past at RG in recent years. Anyone who thinks the Nadal of 2011-2013 on CLAY is the same as 2005-2010 is on some serious drugs. That isnt to say he wont keep winning RG though. He probably will, and when Djokovic hits his clay decline which will probably be soon, probably just as easily as 2005-2008 despite a now much lower level of clay tennis than before.

Who are these mugs Nadal struggled with in 2012? That's right,none. Nadal was in outstanding form in the 2012 clay court season. He exacted revenge against Djokovic by dominating him throughout the entire season.

Nadal's 2012 claycourt season

Monte Carlo- Destroyed everyone in straight sets (beat Djokovic 6-1 6-3)
Barcelona-Destroyed everyone in straight sets
Rome- Destroyed everyone in straight sets (beat Djokovic 7-5 6-3)
RG- Destroyed everyone. Outplayed Djokovic decisively in the final. The only set he lost was because he was outraged that he was being forced to play in damp conditions. He picked up where he left of the next day and closed Djokovic out.

The only low point was the blue clay controversy in Madrid where he lost to Verdasco.

So, I think it is you who is on some serious drugs or have put on a pair of nostalgia goggles when it comes to Nadal. Along with 2008 and 2010, the 2012 claycourt season was one of Nadal's finest.

 

[Djokovic2011]

It really annoys me when people on here say how awful Nadal played in last year's MC final against Djokovic. Maybe, just maybe, Novak played a great match and should be given full credit for it but no it always has to come back to Nadal doesn't it? If there's one thing I did agree with Chico on it's that Djokovic doesn't get enough respect from certain posters on this forum. Talk about frustrating..........

 

[Sid_Vicious]

It really annoys me when people on here say how awful Nadal played in last year's MC final against Djokovic. Maybe, just maybe, Novak played a great match and should be given full credit for it but no it always has to come back to Nadal doesn't it? If there's one thing I did agree with Chico on it's that Djokovic doesn't get enough respect from certain posters on this forum. Talk about frustrating..........

Djokovic played great especially in the 2nd set when Nadal was playing at a good level. I have watched Nadal dominate people on clay for almost 10 years now, I just used the eye test and figured he was capable of playing better. I thought the same thing about Djokovic's performances against Nadal at MC 2012 and Rome 2012.

 

[MichaelNadal]

It really annoys me when people on here say how awful Nadal played in last year's MC final against Djokovic. Maybe, just maybe, Novak played a great match and should be given full credit for it but no it always has to come back to Nadal doesn't it? If there's one thing I did agree with Chico on it's that Djokovic doesn't get enough respect from certain posters on this forum. Talk about frustrating..........

It is what it is though. Rafa really didn't play well till the middle of the second set and then it was too late. That doesn't mean Djokovic didn't. But it wasn't exactly peak clay Rafa. You shouldn't get wrapped up in things like that. At the end of the day, Djokovic was the better player, which is what tennis is about, not who beat peak 17.0 god-mode who. Do I care if Djokovic could have played better in the USO 2013 final or not? :lol: no!

 

[helloworld]

Nadal may have passed his clay prime, but his level is still good enough to easily win his pet slam.

 

[Start da Game]

I agree with that premise. 2008 was Nadal's absolute clay peak. Every other year has been a slog and he comes out on top.

2008 was unreal level......2012 was incredible too......nadal's level on clay imo: 2008 > 2012 > 2007 > 2010 > 2005 > 2006 > 2013 > 2009 > 2011......

 

[TahoeTennis]

LOL at this thread. After Nadal Lost to Rosol, there were probably 25 threads about how he will never win another slam, is done, retired, discraced...etc.....

Yeah, then 2013 happened.

 

[Start da Game]

i am the biggest fan of nadal......i sense this is the year when he finally loses at roland garros......his game has transformed to suit the hardcourts more than clay in the last couple of years......

2013 roland garros was nothing but his sheer greatness, he could have easily lost that slam......it only gets difficult from here on on clay......

 

[Egoista]

The only reason nadal won last year was because djocko fluffed his lines

the last set 4 2 up 30 love up and then u manage to touch the net and lose the match

he took it for granted at that stage

 

[poofytail]

Who are these mugs Nadal struggled with in 2012? That's right,none. Nadal was in outstanding form in the 2012 clay court season. He exacted revenge against Djokovic by dominating him throughout the entire season.

Nadal's 2012 claycourt season

Monte Carlo- Destroyed everyone in straight sets (beat Djokovic 6-1 6-3)
Barcelona-Destroyed everyone in straight sets
Rome- Destroyed everyone in straight sets (beat Djokovic 7-5 6-3)
RG- Destroyed everyone. Outplayed Djokovic decisively in the final. The only set he lost was because he was outraged that he was being forced to play in damp conditions. He picked up where he left of the next day and closed Djokovic out.

The only low point was the blue clay controversy in Madrid where he lost to Verdasco.

So, I think it is you who is on some serious drugs or have put on a pair of nostalgia goggles when it comes to Nadal. Along with 2008 and 2010, the 2012 claycourt season was one of Nadal's finest.

Idiot, if you could read I did note 2012 was atleast much better than 2011 and 2013, but as a whole prime Nadal on clay >>>>>>>>>> 2011-2013. Anyone who has seen Nadal play on clay over the years would concede that the order would be something like this:

1. Nadal 2008
2. Nadal 2010
3. Nadal 2007
4. Nadal 2006
5. Nadal 2005 = 2012
----huge gap------



6. Nadal 2013
7. Nadal 2011

Even if you put 2012 on par with say 2007 (which most who know tennis would not believe as far level of play) it still wouldnt change my overall point.

Only a blind man like yourself and that other moron I was responding to would deny that on the whole Nadal of the last 3 years is far below his previous clay best overall. That doesnt mean he wont keep winning RG though, he will, and when Novak has his own clay decline (soon most likely, while Nadal has already had his so will probably stay around this much diminished level for several more years anyway) he will be back to winning it even easier like before.

 

[poofytail]

It really annoys me when people on here say how awful Nadal played in last year's MC final against Djokovic.

It is you who has problems with reality or eyesight (or both) it seems. If Nadal did ultimately play great and still lost people would say that, but to anyone with a pair of eyes Nadal was playing like royal sh1t that match, the worst clay match he has ever played vs Djokovic, including the two straight set losses in 2011. It has nothing to do with not giving due credit (worship) to your beloved Djokovic, if someone plays crap that is what people will say. It doesnt mean Djokovic didnt play very well and deserved to win. Saying Nadal played well in that match is like one saying Djokovic played absolutely great and his best tennis vs Nadal at Monte Carlo in 2012, which I am sure you would oppose (of course you would, as it isnt even true of course); but by your logic that would be taking credit away from Nadal to not say Djokovic was playing sensational that day.