Nadal News 2.0

DRII

G.O.A.T.
I said from the beginning there is no chance for Nadal. And I was right. It was clear to anybody who understands tennis.
anyone who claims a match where the winner won 20 games and the loser won 19 means there was no chance is utterly ignorant.

Nadal should have won the 1st set, but it is what it is. he most certainly had chances, plenty!
 

StrongRule

Hall of Fame
anyone who claims a match where the winner won 20 games and the loser won 19 means there was no chance is utterly ignorant.

Nadal should have won the 1st set, but it is what it is. he most certainly had chances, plenty!
He didn't have any chances. It was clear he was going to lose all the big points, and this is what happened. On every big point he made an error. Even in the last game he had a chance to break back and he missed it.
 

StrongRule

Hall of Fame
Proud of Rafa, it was a great WC, and he showed he is just as GOAT as Fed. Their rivalry is a great thing in sports. Rafa will get his. Nothing but respect and admiration for one of the GOATS.

Rafa is a great man, and he showed how great in this tourney. Rafa can hold his head high after this tourney. He is awesome!
Nadal again lost a match to one of his main rivals. He didn't beat them even once outside of clay for five and a half years now. They own him mentally.
 

Lleytonstation

Hall of Fame
Nadal again lost a match to one of his main rivals. He didn't beat them even once outside of clay for five and a half years now. They own him mentally.
Not true, as a Fed fan, there is a reason I fear Rafa, and after this WC, it is because I realized he is great in every aspect of the game.

Cheer up, he will equal Fed (if not pass him). The odds were against him here and you should be proud of Rafa. Fed and Rafa are simply GREAT.

Rafa will have longevity as well, his heart and passion is amazing. He will give you many more great moments.
 

StrongRule

Hall of Fame
Not true, as a Fed fan, there is a reason I fear Rafa, and after this WC, it is because I realized he is great in every aspect of the game.

Cheer up, he will equal Fed (if not pass him). The odds were against him here and you should be proud of Rafa. Fed and Rafa are simply GREAT.

Rafa will have longevity as well, his heart and passion is amazing. He will give you many more great moments.
I doubt that. Outside of clay he just can't win anymore. Federer and Djokovic are nowhere near declining, so they will keep beating him there all the time.
 

Rafa.the.Magnificent

Hall of Fame
I’m proud of Rafa. He showed us today the exact quality that makes him the incredible champion he is by giving it 1000% in every.....single......point, no matter how unlikely his chances. He played a great match and made Roger work for it, which he indeed did and congrats to him for this fantastic win. The match was very exciting all the way through. Rafa, you did great!
 

zep

Hall of Fame
Bad performance from Nadal. Federer played well but Nadal had his chances. He had two mini breaks in the first set TB but couldn't capitalize. He wins that breaker and it's a different match. Without taking anything away from Federer, who played really well, Nadal played well below the level he has shown in this tournament. His backhand was really poor and second serve returns were horrible. Above all he played the big points much worse than Federer. He was way too tentative on big points.
 
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miko

Rookie
I just want one more slam off clay :D he's missed so many chances! Especially at the AO
Yes, IMO, he should really make AO '20 his priority. Shut down the season after the USO. Get married. Get rest. Heal the body. Work on stamina and his game. Hire a statistical company (I read an article claiming he is the only one of the Big 3, who do not take advantage of this kind of professional service available on the market). Develop improved strategies against Djokovic and Federer, and start the new year with guns blazing.

Unfortunately, chances for that to happen are slim. The new DC relies on him too much. Unless he is really injured (and that is never good news mid-November), he will be in Madrid to support his friend.
 

miko

Rookie
Bad performance from Nadal.
He was visibly stressed. As a consequence, he fell back on his old patterns while Roger was all over him. If he played a few more points like the match points he defended, this might look entirely different. I saw only a handful of DTL forehands (which seems a good barometer of the state of his game)

Sadly, outside the clay, he does not seem to have the belief to conquer Novak and Djokovic.
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
I wonder what Rafa is doing right now. Probably locked in a room alone thinking while Xisca is trying to make him feel better lol. Id be surprised if these guys still don't get upset for a couple days after a big loss. I know my boy will be fine, but there's no way you can shake something like that immediately off. Maybe he can though. I wish I knew :D
 

Lleytonstation

Hall of Fame
I wonder what Rafa is doing right now. Probably locked in a room alone thinking while Xisca is trying to make him feel better lol. Id be surprised if these guys still don't get upset for a couple days after a big loss. I know my boy will be fine, but there's no way you can shake something like that immediately off. Maybe he can though. I wish I knew :D
Of course it hurts, but one thing I know about Rafa is his fighting spirit. As a Fed fan, I know what it feels like (even worst as he couldn't get over the hurdle for 5 years). I can definitely see Rafa making a splash like Fed did at AO17 by beating Fed or djoker in a final such as USO or AO.
 

MichaelNadal

Bionic Poster
Of course it hurts, but one thing I know about Rafa is his fighting spirit. As a Fed fan, I know what it feels like (even worst as he couldn't get over the hurdle for 5 years). I can definitely see Rafa making a splash like Fed did at AO17 by beating Fed or djoker in a final such as USO or AO.
I still believe he has one more non-clay slam in him, and that's all I want :D
 

Biggest3

New User
Nadal lost ALL of his matches against Federer and Djokovic outside of clay in the last five and a half years. He basically turned into Andy Murray. It doesn't matter how he plays against weaker players, against them he always finds a way to lose no matter what. Chokes and misses on big points. It was never in doubt that this is going to happen again here. My prediction was based on pure logic, and I was right-he indeed lost all the important points.

You say there is always chance? Well, Nadal's chances to ever beat Federer or Djokovic outside of clay again are equal to the chances they had to beat prime Nadal in Roland Garros-which is not so much. He can only win another non clay slam if he gets USO 2017 type of a draw.
Well Murray has managed to win some slams in the end while defeating both Djokovic and Federer. But yeah, Nadal is the one that declined the most out of them and in need of an easy draw to win. As long as he makes deep runs he gives himself chances.There will be a point were Djokovic and Federer will slip and if he is up there he can ''vulture'' one more slam.Even though Djokovic will probably end up with the most slams in the end especially if he wins today(very likely) he can't win them all is he?
 
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TennisFan3

Legend
I wonder what Rafa is doing right now. Probably locked in a room alone thinking while Xisca is trying to make him feel better lol. Id be surprised if these guys still don't get upset for a couple days after a big loss. I know my boy will be fine, but there's no way you can shake something like that immediately off. Maybe he can though. I wish I knew :D
Well if Nadal has pride, he would be livid with his poor performance in the SF. This should add fuel to his inner fire. He should come with all guns blazing in NYC out for revenge against the Fed. With some big changes: A bigger serve, heavier racquet, new coach and new all out aggressive strategy. He would not rest until he gets the win against Fedovic in a slam match.

But that is all wishful thinking. Nadal won't change anything. He will probably be hoping for Fed/Djoker to decline and/or wait for F.O 2020.
 

Apun94

Hall of Fame
Yes, IMO, he should really make AO '20 his priority. Shut down the season after the USO. Get married. Get rest. Heal the body. Work on stamina and his game. Hire a statistical company (I read an article claiming he is the only one of the Big 3, who do not take advantage of this kind of professional service available on the market). Develop improved strategies against Djokovic and Federer, and start the new year with guns blazing.

Unfortunately, chances for that to happen are slim. The new DC relies on him too much. Unless he is really injured (and that is never good news mid-November), he will be in Madrid to support his friend.
He needs matches to be ready against Djokovic or Federer. No tournaments before won't do him any good. We saw that this year in the AO
 

weakera

Hall of Fame
The people proclaiming Bull finished now off of clay are the same ones who said he was finished everywhere after Monte Carlo, Madrid, Barcelona.

Posters on this forum are always prisoners of the moment and always fail to view things with proper perspective. The optics behind a Federer-Wimbledon loss feel 'devastating' - Roger is old, no? h2h got worse, no? Another "missed opportunity," no? Realities like those ones sting, but you can only be in position to be stung if you've made it deep into the tourney. Bull made his second consecutive W SF after going 6 W's without a QF appearance - this bodes poorly for his chances moving forward? Grass is his most troublesome surface and Rafael is nothing if not more capable elsewhere.

He has a Fedovic problem yes, but not on clay and in NY the conditions will be much more Rafa-friendly. The pendulum can always swing back in these rivalries, and as unlikely as that may seem to some, more unlikely things have happened in the rivalries themselves. And when you put yourself in position to win tournaments (6 consecutive slam semis), sooner or later fortune can break your way anyway in terms of draw, conditions, dumb luck, etc.

I've said it before on here but there would be less doom and gloom regarding Bull's future had he lost to Querrey/Kyrgios than there is now with the result we got. There would even be less doom and gloom had Maestro gotten hurt or lost to Nishikori on a bad day, only for Bull to beat whomever in the SF and get beaten soundly by Nole in the final. The point I'm making is - don't overreact because of one grandiose loss at Wimbledon. Rafa played a crappy TB and a spotty match on grass, he'll get over it and move on and have chances to play a better semi-final elsewhere. He was the 3rd to best player in the Wimbledon 2019 draw, there are worse positions to be in.
 

TennisFan3

Legend
The people proclaiming Bull finished now off of clay are the same ones who said he was finished everywhere after Monte Carlo, Madrid, Barcelona.

Posters on this forum are always prisoners of the moment and always fail to view things with proper perspective. The optics behind a Federer-Wimbledon loss feel 'devastating' - Roger is old, no? h2h got worse, no? Another "missed opportunity," no? Realities like those ones sting, but you can only be in position to be stung if you've made it deep into the tourney. Bull made his second consecutive W SF after going 6 W's without a QF appearance - this bodes poorly for his chances moving forward? Grass is his most troublesome surface and Rafael is nothing if not more capable elsewhere.

He has a Fedovic problem yes, but not on clay and in NY the conditions will be much more Rafa-friendly. The pendulum can always swing back in these rivalries, and as unlikely as that may seem to some, more unlikely things have happened in the rivalries themselves. And when you put yourself in position to win tournaments (6 consecutive slam semis), sooner or later fortune can break your way anyway in terms of draw, conditions, dumb luck, etc.

I've said it before on here but there would be less doom and gloom regarding Bull's future had he lost to Querrey/Kyrgios than there is now with the result we got. There would even be less doom and gloom had Maestro gotten hurt or lost to Nishikori on a bad day, only for Bull to beat whomever in the SF and get beaten soundly by Nole in the final. The point I'm making is - don't overreact because of one grandiose loss at Wimbledon. Rafa played a crappy TB and a spotty match on grass, he'll get over it and move on and have chances to play a better semi-final elsewhere.
There is no doom and gloom. Nadal is still ranked #2 and subjectively the 3rd best player and it's hardly a disaster.
However, the fact is that he has not improved or changed at the rate that Federer and Novak have. How is Novak serving bigger than ever. And Fed hitting his backhand bigger than ever . At their age and past their prime.
That is why Nadal has no wins against Fedovic outside clay for the past 4 years. And now he clearly lacks belief. Otherwise how would you explain Nadal playing amazing against Kygrios but garbage against Fed. Same thing in AO 2019 F, play well before and then succumb in the final vs Novak.

So yeah, there is nothing wrong but if Rafa wants to win more non clay slams and does not want to the 3rd in this trifecta of great champions - he will need to make some hard decisions and make some changes. It won't happen automatically. And wishing for Novak/Fed to decline is just hoping against hope. It's not a strategy.
 

weakera

Hall of Fame
There is no doom and gloom. Nadal is still ranked #2 and subjectively the 3rd best player and it's hardly a disaster.
However, the fact is that he has not improved or changed at the rate that Federer and Novak have. How is Novak serving bigger than ever. And Fed hitting his backhand bigger than ever . At their age and past their prime.
That is why Nadal has no wins against Fedovic outside clay for the past 4 years. And now he clearly lacks belief. Otherwise how would you explain Nadal playing amazing against Kygrios but garbage against Fed. Same thing in AO 2019 F, play well before and then succumb in the final vs Novak.

So yeah, there is nothing wrong but if Rafa wants to win more non clay slams and does not want to the 3rd in this trifecta of great champions - he will need to make some hard decisions and make some changes. It won't happen automatically. And wishing for Novak/Fed to decline is just hoping against hope. It's not a strategy.

He'll probably have chances in NY, had plenty of chances v. Nole in W2018, Fed in AO17, even had chances on Friday. The notion that he's hopeless against them off of clay is false. I agree that his psyche is likely compromised, but change for the sake of change is not a strategy either. No one mentioned waiting for a Fedovic decline, all you can do is wait for your next opportunity and seize it - play better and take advantage of opportunities when they present themselves along with favorable circumstances. That's the real thing, no?
 

TennisFan3

Legend
He'll probably have chances in NY, had plenty of chances v. Nole in W2018, Fed in AO17, even had chances on Friday. The notion that he's hopeless against them off of clay is false. I agree that his psyche is likely compromised, but change for the sake of change is not a strategy either. No one mentioned waiting for a Fedovic decline, all you can do is wait for your next opportunity and seize it - play better and take advantage of opportunities when they present themselves along with favorable circumstances. That's the real thing, no?
I agree with you in principle, but disagree with some things. Nadal HAS to change some tactics. If you see the match vs Fed - Nadal returned very poorly. I've never seen Nadal return as poorly vs Fed in the 15 years I've watched their matches since 2004. He failed to put ANY pressure on Fed's second serve and refused to come in closer to the baseline to receive 2nd serve (and Fed wasn't even serving that big). If you recall, he used to do that earlier in their rivalry and even did it in AO 2017.
Nadal also had no answers to Fed's CC backhand. He did not adjust his placement or give Fed different looks. He hardly came to the net, and when he did he botched it up like on a critical break point. He also lacked power many times and a lot of shots landed short especially in set 3 and first half of set 4. He did not hit his off-forehand enough and lost confidence in the backhand as well.

Nadal will need clear tactics and a more aggressive mindset. Wimbledon 2019 SF was more of a AO 2017 5th set debacle. Nadal was just getting outplayed from the ground. When that happens, he loses belief.
So the next slam match vs Fed, Nadal will need to come up with a plan and some better tennis. Otherwise I cannot see a different outcome to be honest..
 

Biggest3

New User
There is no doom and gloom. Nadal is still ranked #2 and subjectively the 3rd best player and it's hardly a disaster.
However, the fact is that he has not improved or changed at the rate that Federer and Novak have. How is Novak serving bigger than ever. And Fed hitting his backhand bigger than ever . At their age and past their prime.
That is why Nadal has no wins against Fedovic outside clay for the past 4 years. And now he clearly lacks belief. Otherwise how would you explain Nadal playing amazing against Kygrios but garbage against Fed. Same thing in AO 2019 F, play well before and then succumb in the final vs Novak.

So yeah, there is nothing wrong but if Rafa wants to win more non clay slams and does not want to the 3rd in this trifecta of great champions - he will need to make some hard decisions and make some changes. It won't happen automatically. And wishing for Novak/Fed to decline is just hoping against hope. It's not a strategy.
He made changes but when he plays vs them he reverts back to his old patterns when he is being pressured, especially on big points.I mean, this WB Sf, he only really let loose near the end of the 4th set when he felt that he had nothing to lose anymore.It's definitely a mental game between those 3, a game that Nadal loses.Both AO17 and WB18 that Nadal lost demotivated him while at the same time gave Djokovic and Federer a big surge of confidence when it comes to them facing Rafa.

The same can be said when it comes to Federer.Djokovic has dominated Federer in pretty much every slam for a good while now and today will further cement it.I expect a pretty comfortably win in 4 sets.
 
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weakera

Hall of Fame
I agree with you in principle, but disagree with some things. Nadal HAS to change some tactics. If you see the match vs Fed - Nadal returned very poorly. I've never seen Nadal return as poorly vs Fed in the 15 years I've watched their matches since 2004. He failed to put ANY pressure on Fed's second serve and refused to come in closer to the baseline to receive 2nd serve (and Fed wasn't even serving that big). If you recall, he used to do that earlier in their rivalry and even did it in AO 2017.
Nadal also had no answers to Fed's CC backhand. He did not adjust his placement or give Fed different looks. He hardly came to the net, and when he did he botched it up like on a critical break point. He also lacked power many times and a lot of shots landed short especially in set 3 and first half of set 4. He did not hit his off-forehand enough and lost confidence in the backhand as well.

Nadal will need clear tactics and a more aggressive mindset. Wimbledon 2019 SF was more of a AO 2017 5th set debacle. Nadal was just getting outplayed from the ground. When that happens, he loses belief.
So the next slam match vs Fed, Nadal will need to come up with a plan and some better tennis. Otherwise I cannot see a different outcome to be honest..

I don't necessarily disagree, new strategies and approaches can help, but I also don't think it's JUST a matter of strategy and tactics. Bull didn't play well on Friday. Was his game plan completely sound and ideal in terms of breaking down maestro? No, but if he played to his full capability, he still could have won the match. His FH DTL was MIA and yes Roger took time away from him on the backhand side but it was weak even when he didn't with the exception of a couple of nice points. And look, it's grass, is Bull supposed to be able to break down the Federer serve easily? He couldn't break Kyrgios for like 3 sets, yes he had a beat on Querrey but in that instance all Rafael really had to do was get the ball back in and dominate from the baseline. Not an option against Roger who can serve big and handle baseline rallies, so the margin of error for Rafa was very thin, and it got him in the end.

I'm really not trying to make excuses here. Rafael was the lesser player on Friday and lost. But it's important to put things in proper perspective. Rafa still had his chances in the match despite playing spotty and will have more chances elsewhere, especially at tournaments where the conditions are more suited to his game and less so to big servers and the like. This isn't as simple as calling it a matchup problem that Rafa cannot overcome. Rafa is still a great player who will have better days and his opponents will have worse days.
 

miko

Rookie
He needs matches to be ready against Djokovic or Federer. No tournaments before won't do him any good. We saw that this year in the AO
I did not suggest Rafa enters AO cold without match play. I suggest taking the rest of the year (post US Open) to renew and reinvent himself and his game. He used to start a year with an exhibition followed by a 250 tournament but in the last two years, it was all in shambles (i.e. withdrawals, interrupted tournaments, etc.) due to injuries.
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Professional
I cheered myself up by looking at all that Rafa has achieved in his career. He is 18-8 in Grand Slam finals and has only lost to 3 players! (Djokovic, Federer and once to Stan Wawrinka). He has won an Olympic Gold medal. He is 6-3 in Grand Slam finals vs. Roger Federer and 4-4 vs. Djokovic. He is 26-6 in Grand Slam semi-finals. He has 34 ATP Tour Masters 1000 titles!

4 of his Grand Slam losses in finals have been at the Australian Open, 3 at Wimbledon and 1 at the U.S. Open. 3 of his losses to Djokovic were in 2011-12, when Djokovic was super dominant.

He has 4 different years at #1 at the end of the year, with 196 weeks at #1 (3rd highest). He also has the most weeks at #2 of anyone in history.

I am hoping he is able to figure things out and win at the U.S. Open and/or the Australian Open. Regardless, he has had a tremendous career and is one of the greatest of all time! :)
 

weakera

Hall of Fame
I don't think he has much to have to figure out. Grass is a difficult surface for him and he played a good tournament, in spite of a poor semi-final showing. He has a strong chance to win the US Open.
 

Robin3381

New User
After watching yesterday's final, I can't help but feel pissed at last year semifinal between Nadal and Djokovic. Had Nadal won that match, Nadal would have 3 instead of 2 Wimbledons and Djokovic will have 4 Wimbledons (only 1 more than Nadal). But, now Djokovic has more than twice the amount of Wimbledon that Nadal has. Not only that, Nadal would also be the Year End No 1 for 2018, adding more weeks at No 1. Seriously, I feel a little heartbroken at that missed opportunity last year. Nadal most likely will never win another Wimbledon and only have 2 Wimbledons to his name.
 

Rafa.the.Magnificent

Hall of Fame
What’s next on Rafa’s tournament schedule? Will he be in Montreal for the Rogers Cup, and/or Cincinnati? I really hope his hard court season will once again show him playing beautifully, but without the dreaded over-straining of his knee(s)/quads.
 

MugOpponent

Hall of Fame
What’s next on Rafa’s tournament schedule? Will he be in Montreal for the Rogers Cup, and/or Cincinnati? I really hope his hard court season will once again show him playing beautifully, but without the dreaded over-straining of his knee(s)/quads.
I'd like to see him play Cincy this year. I doubt he will though. I suspect it will be Montreal and then rest up for the USO.
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
Well Murray has managed to win some slams in the end while defeating both Djokovic and Federer. But yeah, Nadal is the one that declined the most out of them and in need of an easy draw to win. As long as he makes deep runs he gives himself chances.There will be a point were Djokovic and Federer will slip and if he is up there he can ''vulture'' one more slam.Even though Djokovic will probably end up with the most slams in the end especially if he wins today(very likely) he can't win them all is he?
why are you posting in this thread?

also, your advice is horrible, which is not surprising given your judgement.

Nadal does not need to be more aggressive vs Federer, thats been his problem when Federer turns into slasher/basher!

what Nadal needs to do vs Federer is slow up the pace and keep the ball deep once Federer starts taking high risks from the ground. He actually needs to 'moonball' more when this happens (or perhaps slice), instead of trying to match Federer's pace, because when Nadal does his ball lands short which allows Federer to take control.

Nadal is actually being too aggressive and trying to take the ball too early when facing Federer!
 

Vamos Rafa Nadal

Professional
Curious to know if anybody knows Rafa's statistics as to how many years and also how many weeks he has been ranked #2? I know his numbers for #1 by heart! :)
 

Goof

Semi-Pro
Is Nadal planning to play both Montreal and Cincy?
In his post-match press conference after the Federer match, he said he is playing Montreal and "maybe Cincinnati". I have not heard any further updates. My pure guess would be he plays Montreal, and if he loses somewhat early in Montreal he ends up playing Cincy as well for more match tune-up for the USO (and rankings points to hold off Fed for the 2 seed).
 

DSH

Hall of Fame
Nadal has to make sure to be the second seed.
No way should he face Djokovic in the semifinals.
Despite the defeat at Wimbledon, I am sure that this time the staff of Nadal has drawn conclusions from his confrontation with Federer and if they face in New York, the Spaniard this time will be victorious.
 
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Sephiroth

Semi-Pro
I don't think Nadal cares about the #2 seed at USO (Wimbledon is different since less chances to beat both Federer and Djokovic) for him it's about protecting his knees and being healthy for the USO. Everything was going right last year until he started to get into tight matches in the early rounds then getting injured.

Even then he still produced the best two matches last year despite not winning the tournament.
 
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