NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Do I think he would have won if Djokovic didn't get deported? No, but that's really not important to Nadal because he played who was in the draw.
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Nadal owns Phillippe Chartrier - But Djokovic....
- Thread starter Hitman
- Start date
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
We have only 3 to compare but that's still enough and I don't care about the weak Slams theory. He beat the best player of clay season in 2016, 2021 and 2023 to win his RG Slams. The end and case closed.
Murray was the #1 player of clay season in 2016 going into the RG final. Wawrinka is a worse matchup for Djokovic but Murray dissected him like microscopic biologist in the SF. So not really Djokovic's problem if he couldn't make it to him.
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StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Djokovic fans can NEVER admit he had weak competition, even though they are true masters in blaming others for winning weak tournaments.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
It's already been explained and I'm not going around in circles since you're clearly gaslighting and wasting my time. This is my last post to you about it.
messiahrobins
G.O.A.T.
Hang on thats a bit ambiguous. Yes or no please. Was it asterisked or not?
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
All the big 3 had some weak Slams. You just pretend Djokovic had significantly more than the others because it makes you feel better about him ending up with more than Nadal.Djokovic fans can NEVER admit he had weak competition, even though they are true masters in blaming others for winning weak tournaments.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
If you think Murray was a strong opponent in 2016 then you surely think Djokovic never had any weak slam wins. If that wasn't weak, I have no idea what is.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
No, and I never said it was.
messiahrobins
G.O.A.T.
It is identical scenarios. The point being made was that Djokovic achieved his most significant milestones on his weakest surface, and the inference to be drawn given a thread was made was that it was something unique. The point i am making is Nadal did the exact same thing! Alcaraz if he wins the AO will have done similar.
messiahrobins
G.O.A.T.
Cool, you are one of the better Novak fans.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Strong is subjective. Formidable opponent? Yes and he proved that in his SF and by winning Rome by beating Djokovic, and making the Madrid final. Djokovic obviously had weaker Slams but it's interesting that you love to discuss his ad-nauseum while you pretend Nadal's don't exist.
sportsfan1
Legend
This is true recognition. 14 RG slams makes most other achievements pale in comparison. A player would have to win each and every year from age 21 to 35 (longer than an average career at the top) on the most physically demanding of all surfaces to break that record. It's unimaginable.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
So Schwartzman beating Nadal in Rome made him a strong opponent when they met in DO 2020?
As I've seen, Djokovic's fans are the only fanbase that never admits he had weak wins. Some of them called 2024 Nadal a very dangerous opponent in Olympics.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Imagine winning 3 titles, reaching 7 finals, 12 semi-finals, winning nearly 100 matches, beating countless top 10 opponents and that tournament being considered your least successful major!! Djokovic is the GOAT for a reason lol.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Not very surprising, the wins all came in the asterisk era.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Did Schwartzman win Rome, make the Madrid final and RG final, and was the #2 player in the world? Do you honestly think he's on the same level of player as Murray?
Well I concede he's had weaker Slams and you're deflecting again. Why the hesitation to discuss Nadal's weaker ones and instead focus on Djokovic's all the time?
messiahrobins
G.O.A.T.
Simply the Greatest Achievement in any sport ever. As time goes on Nadal will be immortalised the same way Muhamed Ali was. Reading what you put just defies actual belief.
In fact, it probably is the greatest achievement by anyone in human history in any discipline. I think that argument could be made. Obviously we have things like Newton defining gravity, and people who invented things and medicines to cure diseases but none of them were one person excelling for such a sustained period. Its hard to explain what i am trying to say, but what i am trying to say is Nadal literally pushed the boundaries of what a human being can do to a level that has never been seen before and probably wont ever be. Those 14 RGs go beyond sport.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Making 15 QFs in a row also, which is the record at RG. Most give Djokovic the GOAT title now and for good reason.
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mtommer
Hall of Fame
Not really. You're the one who said he wasn't being recognized for his achievements the way you he feel he ought to be. Okay, but he still isn't. No, that doesn't have to mean a statue, that's just a stand in for what x is to you. To that end, apparently enough people don't care about the man enough to do as you feel ought to be done. Really, your only come back is, "Well, they should". Okay. They don't. Deal with it.....hence the *shrug*.
DropWideShot
Semi-Pro
So after the Fedal 2009 "peak" you believe those two could not compete against Djokovic's level? Are you also saying a 24 year old Nadal didn't have the "peak" level to beat 23 year old Djokovic at the slams? If your answer is yes to any of these, even though you may be somewhat correct, the points you make are no better than AI garbage used to push someone's biased opinion as fact. There is only one man who has reached the peak of men's tennis if you believe in numbers and not lore.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
At least he didn't collapse after 1 set.
Actually, I don't remember any Nadal fans claiming the last few years were strong era, even when Nadal was the one benefitting from it.
DropWideShot
Semi-Pro
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA These guys are just skillfully hitting tennis balls so we should probably leave it at that. When you draw comparisons of the sporting achievement of a PIF ambassador to that of a monumental moment in human history like gravity or penicillin you have to take a step back. Love the passion but that was a bit much! Next thing you know Joey Chesnut's 16 championships will start to rival the light bulb.
darthrafa
Hall of Fame
not a trolling post hereI know there is a lot of projection from salty fans, a lot of is coming from the fact that Djokovic is still out there and can still add to his career, while the other's are gone. It is what it is, I mean looking at the overtime being put into this thread, because it pressed so much is sad. Hopefully it all calms down when Djokovic also rides off into the sunset. Those achievements are legit factual milestones that will be part of tennis history, no one's opinion on what counts doesn't change that. Anyways bro, I think its all good.
sometimes i feel sorry for djoker's supporters
for some reasons, to me it is the playing style, ppl including me does not regard djoker as goat
nevertheless, if fed or rafa has the records of djoker, many many ppl, excluding me, would say that guy would be goat
when djoker has won so many (and i dont think anyone can break his records, except the slam total), the goat debate still has not ended (or answer not accepted), i would insist there is no goat, since greatness cannot be measured.
well his crybabies no need to come out saying that i am salty
i just want to appreciate djoker is one of the great players and let his supporters know djoker is underappreciated, which is unfair to him
that is what i want to say
Troicki’sCat
Rookie
“lolympics” bro
I’m using that
Hitman
Bionic Poster
I think you are the one struggling to deal with it, I've just stated in the post that you replied to that they DID recognize his achievements. They gave him a miniature replica of the RG trophy with all his slam wins on it, as way to acknowledge that he broke the record and won the slam race at PC last year....they just needed to be sure to only give it to him once they knew Nadal was officially retired. I would accept plausible deniability that you weren't told, but I did just tell you, if you are STILL failing to acknowledge the reality of this, and think otherwise, well I guess deal with it, right?
Now if you are going to argue it was some fake video, go ahead, but your argument is null and void, clearly they cared enough to give him that, and that is enough. Still don't believe, go look for yourself.
Hitman
Bionic Poster
You know, I think you are a good poster, for whatever that is worth to you.
Djokovic_is_the_best#1
Bionic Poster
I agree. That is why if Alcaraz gets the records he the best. We can’t criticise players for competition that outside their control. Alcaraz already proved he can deal with tough competition anyway just like the big 3 did.
No title won is weak in my eyes and both Alcaraz and sinner are already showing they elite.
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mtommer
Hall of Fame
Okay. If that is enough for you then good for you. As I said before, I don't care about Djokovic's achievements or if he's recognized or not. My point isn't even really about Djokovic at it's foundation. Players don't deserve or are owed recognition for their achievements. They may get it or they may not and many times it's more about who the player is as a person. Good for them if they do. Good for them if they don't. Their achievements don't go away regardless.
Hitman
Bionic Poster
We can agree to disagree on this. I think players deserve recognition, because they created special moments in the history of the sport. Overdoing it, I can understand, for instance they don't need it year after year, but certain achievements IMO do at least deserve their moment in the sun. Anyways, I think we can leave it there unless there is something you want to add.
Cabeza del Demonio
Hall of Fame
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