Nadal's performance this Davis Cup enhancing GOAT credentials?

octogon

Hall of Fame
Oddly enough we don't seem to talk about Davis Cup much when considering the greatest player of all time, but perhaps we ought to more.

More people are finding out Nadal's Davis Cup record is insane and means he probably the greatest ever player in the competition.

But his performance this week has been ridiculous. He's almost like a one-man team for Spain, willing them to victory in doubles and singles. This may be the best sustained effort I've seen from Nadal, and that is saying a lot.

Win or lose against Canada in the final tommorow, Nadal's epicness in this Davis Cup has been the highlight of the tournament and won't soon be forgotten.
 

Sport

G.O.A.T.
Oddly enough we don't seem to talk about Davis Cup much when considering the greatest player of all time, but perhaps we ought to more.

More people are finding out Nadal's Davis Cup record is insane and means he probably the greatest ever player in the competition.

But his performance this week has been ridiculous. He's almost like a one-man team for Spain, willing them to victory in doubles and singles. This may be the best sustained effort I've seen from Nadal, and that is saying a lot.

Win or lose against Canada in the final tommorow, Nadal's epicness in this Davis Cup has been the highlight of the tournament and won't soon be forgotten.
Emerson won 8 Davis Cup titles, while Nadal has 5 Davis Cup titles (if he wins tomorrow).

Now it could be argued Nadal to be the greatest DC player ever. Emerson had an incredible team with other ATGs like Ken Rosewall or Rod Laver. Nadal did not have a Spanish team full of ATGs.

Nadal is also carrying the Spanish Team alone in this DC. He is basically winning this DC on himself. Yesterday, in the Spain-Argentina match, Carreño lost his match and Nadal saved Spain. Today, Feliciano lost his match and Nadal saved Spain again.

Brutal. Of course the DC enhances GOAT credentials. Even if it is a team competition, there are cases where a single player is almost the responsible of winning the DC, like Nadal this year. Spain this year has a joke of team, and Nadal alone is winning the title. Brutal dominance of the sport.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Emerson won 8 Davis Cup titles, while Nadal has 5 Davis Cup titles (if he wins tomorrow).

Now it could be argued Nadal to be the greatest DC player ever. Emerson had an incredible team with other ATGs like Ken Rosewall or Rod Laver. Nadal did not have a Spanish team full of ATGs.

Nadal is also carrying the Spanish Team alone in this DC. He is basically winning this DC on himself. Yesterday, in the Spain-argentina match, Carreño lost his match and Nadal saved Spain. Today, Feliciano lost his match and Nadal saved Spain again.

Brutal. Of course the DC enhances GOAT credentials. Even if it is a team competition, there are cases where a single player is almost the responsible of winning the DC, like Nadal this year.

Spain this year has a joke of team, and Nadal alone is winning the title. Brutal dominance of the sport.


Well said!

Funnily enough, John McEnroe used to talk about Nadal's Davis Cup record all the time as part of his argument for Nadal potentially being GOAT.

When McEnroe (ever the flip-flopper) eventually settled on Federer as his pick for GOAT (for now) he stopped talking about how great Nadal was at Davis Cup.

But yeah, Nadal's greatness in this competition is something special and needs more recognition. If Spain wins tommorow it'll be one of Nadal's greatest achievements, and you have covered why.

I think more impressive than the titles he's won is his match record. I think he's only lost one singles match in Davis Cup and is ubeaten since 2004.
 
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The Blond Blur

G.O.A.T.
Davis Cup used to be at or close to the level of the slems back in the day. Unfortunatly, it is a mere shadow of it's former glory :cry: And now we have the ATP CUP :rolleyes: I swear if there slems weren't already the most important events in the sport, the ATP would try to replace them too.
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
The actual Davis Cup is already DEAD

This BO3 show with some random pairing is a poor copy and has failed miserably. When ATP cups starts in Jan , this will be forgotten and erased or lesser players who want to get into form like Pospisil and Andy Murray will play.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
The actual Davis Cup is already DEAD

This BO3 show with some random pairing is a poor copy and has failed miserably. When ATP cups starts in Jan , this will be forgotten and erased or lesser players who want to get into form like Pospisil and Andy Murray will play.


Nah...the format has revived the competition. The last two nights have had some of the most exciting and nailbiting tennis ties of the year.

And the players care DEEPLY. Andy Murray calling for Brit fans in Madrid to support them. The Serbian Team pretty much crying in the press conference after being eliminated. Nadal killing himself to try and win this thing.

There have been some teething problems and negative early press because of some poorly attended matches early in the tournament, but honestly, this is the best Davis Cup has been in years. Those issues can be fixed. This one-week winner takes all format has revived Davis Cup. And it makes Laver Cup seem like even more of an exhibition than it already is.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
This current, sparsely attended exho tournament is called the "Davis Cup".

It bears no relation to the now defunct Davis Cup - one of the most prestigious and historic tournaments in tennis.


The courts have been jam-packed the last two days. And the atmosphere for some of these ties have been electric.

The format clearly works. Sorting out attendence in earlier ties is a very fixable thing for the next time. I think some people were just excited at the negative early press and don't want to acknowledge that the tournament has fully come alive.
 

TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
The courts have been jam-packed the last two days. And the atmosphere for some of these ties have been electric.

Oh yeah(!)

That's why Andy Murray himself had to implore British people to attend, and the LTA were offering free tickets (x4) - all to fill up a paltry allocation of 800.

There's over 250,000 British people living in Spain...
 
Excuses. Just recognize greatness.

This year Spain is NOTHING without Nadal. There is nothing "solid" about this Spain.

And in 2004, a 18 years old Nadal had to defeat the #1 Roddick to give Spain the trophy.
How is it an excuse? Ok this year Nadal is doing it the hard way I suppose. Really he's always had a good team. It must have been nice to have Ferrer, Verdasco, JCF, Lopez etc to take up the slack. Nadal didn't always show up. 2008 Lopez & Verdasco won it for them. The win over Roddick in 04 was on clay. Roddick was never good on clay.
 
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TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Oddly enough we don't seem to talk about Davis Cup much when considering the greatest player of all time, but perhaps we ought to more.

More people are finding out Nadal's Davis Cup record is insane and means he probably the greatest ever player in the competition.

But his performance this week has been ridiculous. He's almost like a one-man team for Spain, willing them to victory in doubles and singles. This may be the best sustained effort I've seen from Nadal, and that is saying a lot.

Win or lose against Canada in the final tommorow, Nadal's epicness in this Davis Cup has been the highlight of the tournament and won't soon be forgotten.
Think I saw he has participated 19 times?
He was so young when he started. It was the match he beat Roddick in DC I started to become a fan of his. So young and fearless.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
This current, sparsely attended exho tournament is called the "Davis Cup".

It bears no relation to the now defunct Davis Cup - one of the most prestigious and historic tournaments in tennis.
You should have seen how much it meant for Canada and Russia today! How sad the Serbs were. It means a lot for the players. Maybe not anymore for you and others in here.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Oh yeah(!)

That's why Andy Murray himself had to implore British people to attend, and the LTA were offering free tickets (x4) - all to fill up a paltry allocation of 800.

There's over 250,000 British people living in Spain...

So what dude? Attendence issues are fixable for the next edition. The point is, even people (like myself) who were critical of the first few days are now loving what they are seeing. Jo Durie, Former World no.5 WTA tennis player was also critical of the early stages of the tournament, but has recognised it's come to life and is now a fantastic spectacle.



I know you are all-in on this "Gerard Pique has destroyed Davis Cup" campaign of yours, but you are being ridiculously overdramatic at this point

It hasn't all gone smoothly, but it's ending brilliantly and the potential with this new format is great.

Now carry on your campaign...
 

r2473

G.O.A.T.
Emerson won 8 Davis Cup titles, while Nadal has 5 Davis Cup titles (if he wins tomorrow).

Now it could be argued Nadal to be the greatest DC player ever. Emerson had an incredible team with other ATGs like Ken Rosewall or Rod Laver. Nadal did not have a Spanish team full of ATGs.

Nadal is also carrying the Spanish Team alone in this DC. He is basically winning this DC on himself. Yesterday, in the Spain-Argentina match, Carreño lost his match and Nadal saved Spain. Today, Feliciano lost his match and Nadal saved Spain again.

Brutal. Of course the DC enhances GOAT credentials. Even if it is a team competition, there are cases where a single player is almost the responsible of winning the DC, like Nadal this year. Spain this year has a joke of team, and Nadal alone is winning the title. Brutal dominance of the sport.
How many Davis Cups does Federer have?
 

TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
You should have seen how much it meant for Canada and Russia today! How sad the Serbs were. It means a lot for the players. Maybe not anymore for you and others in here.

Only because their teams are largely made up of young players who never experienced playing seriously in the latter stages of the Davis Cup.

Of course this "Davis Cup" is going to be novel and exciting for them. These are the same players who don't bat an eyelid at playing single-serve, 4-4 sets at the NextGen tournament.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Only because their teams are largely made up of young players who never experienced playing seriously in the latter stages of the Davis Cup.

Of course this "Davis Cup" is going to be novel and exciting for them. These are the same players who don't bat an eyelid at playing single-serve, 4-4 sets at the NextGen tournament.


The Serbs were distraught at losing, and their team are mostly veterans.
 

Mike Sams

G.O.A.T.
Oddly enough we don't seem to talk about Davis Cup much when considering the greatest player of all time, but perhaps we ought to more.

More people are finding out Nadal's Davis Cup record is insane and means he probably the greatest ever player in the competition.

But his performance this week has been ridiculous. He's almost like a one-man team for Spain, willing them to victory in doubles and singles. This may be the best sustained effort I've seen from Nadal, and that is saying a lot.

Win or lose against Canada in the final tommorow, Nadal's epicness in this Davis Cup has been the highlight of the tournament and won't soon be forgotten.
What's interesting is that there's no mysterious abdomen tear this time around which made him pull out of Paris while Djokovic was waiting on the other side. :laughing:
 

TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
It hasn't all gone smoothly, but it's ending brilliantly and the potential with this new format is great.

Now carry on your campaign...

It's not "ending brilliantly" at all, because no-one gives a cr*p about it.

The stadium is empty unless Spain is playing.

The fact that even Andy Murray had to implore people to attend, tells you everything you need to know about this disastrous exho.
 

Lleytonstation

Talk Tennis Guru
Emerson won 8 Davis Cup titles, while Nadal has 5 Davis Cup titles (if he wins tomorrow).

Now it could be argued Nadal to be the greatest DC player ever. Emerson had an incredible team with other ATGs like Ken Rosewall or Rod Laver. Nadal did not have a Spanish team full of ATGs.

Nadal is also carrying the Spanish Team alone in this DC. He is basically winning this DC on himself. Yesterday, in the Spain-Argentina match, Carreño lost his match and Nadal saved Spain. Today, Feliciano lost his match and Nadal saved Spain again.

Brutal. Of course the DC enhances GOAT credentials. Even if it is a team competition, there are cases where a single player is almost the responsible of winning the DC, like Nadal this year. Spain this year has a joke of team, and Nadal alone is winning the title. Brutal dominance of the sport.
I think you can be considered the greatest DC player even with 3 or 4 less DC wins. Many athletes have less championships in leagues but are better players.

Rafa to me would be the best DC player of all time regardless of whether he wins tomorrow or not. That being said I never watched Emerson play.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Only because their teams are largely made up of young players who never experienced playing seriously in the latter stages of the Davis Cup.

Of course this "Davis Cup" is going to be novel and exciting for them. These are the same players who don't bat an eyelid at playing single-serve, 4-4 sets at the NextGen tournament.
Hm.. lots of old players in DC too!!
And... Russia and Canada doesn’t really have that many old good players these days ;) their best players are spring chickens.
 

Mike Sams

G.O.A.T.
It's not "ending brilliantly" at all, because no-one gives a cr*p about it.

The stadium is empty unless Spain is playing.

The fact that even Andy Murray had to implore people to attend, tells you everything you need to know about this disastrous exho.

I think the Davis Cup is just passe. A tournament that holds no relevance today. I'd rather buy tickets for any of the 4 grand slams than pay to see Davis Cup! LOL
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Only because their teams are largely made up of young players who never experienced playing seriously in the latter stages of the Davis Cup.

Of course this "Davis Cup" is going to be novel and exciting for them. These are the same players who don't bat an eyelid at playing single-serve, 4-4 sets at the NextGen tournament.
BTW.. Felix said no to Laver Cup.
But very much into Davis! You should have seen him. One of the players on the bench I’ve seen being most into it, a part from Rafa of course. Lol
Felix my fav Canadian so great to see his passion for the team. Shapo, who I normally don’t like a lot showed a great performance as well. Lots of passion and good sportsmanship.
 

TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
What does ex-Yugoslavia history have to do with Serbian team's emotional reaction to their dramatic loss at this Davis Cup?

Because international representation is very important to the countries which used to make up Yugoslavia.

Especially Serbia, as they were portrayed as the "bad guys" by the Western media.

Serbians would probably get equally hyped at an invitational tiddlywinks event.
 

TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
BTW.. Felix said no to Laver Cup.
But very much into Davis! You should have seen him. One of the players on the bench I’ve seen being most into it, a part from Rafa of course. Lol
Felix my fav Canadian so great to see his passion for the team. Shapo, who I normally don’t like a lot showed a great performance as well. Lots of passion and good sportsmanship.

The fact that you're even comparing Roger's self-indulgent ego-vehicle exho (Laver Cup) to this farcical spectacle which is masquerading as the "Davis Cup", tells us all that we need to know about this disastrous current event in Madrid.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
The fact that you're even comparing Roger's self-indulgent ego-vehicle exho (Laver Cup) to this farcical spectacle which is masquerading as the "Davis Cup", tells us all that we need to know about this disastrous current event in Madrid.
You were a second away from landing on my ignore list cause of your twisted views on Serbians and humans itself. Took a u turn with your dislike of Laver!
I just love that Felix said no to all that cash and rather likes to do things with his team! I’m not comparing Laver and DC of course.
 

TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
You were a second away from landing on my ignore list cause of your twisted views on Serbians and humans itself. Took a u turn with your dislike of Laver!
I just love that Felix said no to all that cash and rather likes to do things with his team! I’m not comparing Laver and DC of course.

What?
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
The courts have been jam-packed the last two days. And the atmosphere for some of these ties have been electric.

The format clearly works. Sorting out attendence in earlier ties is a very fixable thing for the next time. I think some people were just excited at the negative early press and don't want to acknowledge that the tournament has fully come alive.

Format is a copy from Laver Cup. Hopefully they are paying for the copyrights.

1000+ free tickets and food vouchers were handed over for the Spain vs Britain match.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Man what happened to just watching and appreciating people playing the sport at this insane level. Why does everything have to be about the GOAT “debate” every damn time smh


What happened to staying out of or ignoring topics you have no interest in?

People like to talk about the G topic. You won't stop it by jumping in threads to give a righteous "tut-tut" about it. Just comes off pretentious and designed to make you look above it all.
 

Sport

G.O.A.T.
I'm trying to understand how beating Schwartzmann & Evans can improve one's GOAT credentials :laughing:
My friend, I am aware that Federer is your favorite player. But from time to time it is healthy to recognize the merit in other players :).

This Davis Cup, a 33 years old Nadal had to win not only his single matches (against Schwartzmann and Evans as you correctly pointed out), but also the doubles matches of Spain. Considering both singles and doubles matches, Nadal will have played... 9 matches in 5 days!!!! That is absolutely brutal for his body. Nadal is winning this DC on its own, playing 2 matches per day many days in a row. That is brutal domination of the field in the DC.
 
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TimHenmanATG

Hall of Fame
That Serbs got an extra reason for having a lot of emotions in DC cause of their history.
All of the teams have lots of emotions. Can’t really see a difference between Canada, Serbia, Russia, Spain etc. They are playing as if it was a slam SF.

How would you think that my observation was remotely critical of Serbia or their people?

Djokovic himself, over the years, has acknowledged that he is an unofficial ambassador for Serbia and their international reputation.

I wouldn't have thought that it was remotely controversial to suggest that people from a smaller nation - especially one which has received extremely negative press over the last few decades - would be extremely passionate about representing themselves positively at an international event.
 

Doctor/Lawyer Red Devil

Talk Tennis Guru
Because international representation is very important to the countries which used to make up Yugoslavia.

Especially Serbia, as they were portrayed as the "bad guys" by the Western media.

Serbians would probably get equally hyped at an invitational tiddlywinks event.
Did you see the manner in which Serbia were knocked out? Do you know that this tournament marked the end of the golden generation since it was Tipsarevic's last appearance? A very good shot at fighting for the title tomorrow, or at least a better farewell, was wasted.

Serbia lost plenty of times in the Davis Cup before. Djokovic was forced to retire due to injury back in 2011 in front of the home crowd which lost his national team the tie. Young Lajovic lost a decisive 5th match in the 2013 final, also in front of the home crowd. Yet the post match reactions weren't as emotional as this one. There is definitely great national pride just to be clear, but not every reaction from the Serbs is related to the past injustices that the western scum in power delivered. Or to put it better, if anyone is mature enough to not have spite as their main motivation, it's these athletes.

It's fine to point out the atrocious attendance of non-Spain ties this week. In that sense the Davis Cup flopped badly. But don't question the commitment of participants, young or old, to this event that still means a lot to them. They obviously care, which makes the competition at least a little bigger than an exhibition. Otherwise they wouldn't have sacrificed a week of what is a short off season to begin with.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
My friend, I am aware that Federer is your favorite player. But from time to time it is healthy to recognize the merit in other players :).

This Davis Cup, a 33 years old Nadal has to win not only his single matches (against Schwartzmann and Evans as you correctly pointed out), but also the doubles matches of Spain. Considering both singles and doubles matches, Nadal will have played... 9 matches in 5 days!!!! That is absolutely brutal for his body. Nadal is winning this DC on its own.
I’m glad it is soon over :laughing: It is too much play for him! In a way good he didn’t play finals in WTF.
 
My friend, I am aware that Federer is your favorite player. But from time to time it is healthy to recognize the merit in other players :).

This Davis Cup, a 33 years old Nadal has to win not only his single matches (against Schwartzmann and Evans as you correctly pointed out), but also the doubles matches of Spain. Considering both singles and doubles matches, Nadal will have played... 9 matches in 5 days!!!! That is absolutely brutal for his body. Nadal is winning this DC on its own.
Nadal is the King of Clay and 2nd on my GOAT list. What he has done in DC is great. Still we have to look at who he is playing to correctly evaluate just how great it is. I don't see how it adds anything to his credentials. He's had a lot of help because it's a team event. Federer and Djokovic never had it so lucky as far as teammates when looking at his career in DC.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
How would you think that my observation was remotely critical of Serbia or their people?

Djokovic himself, over the years, has acknowledged that he is an unofficial ambassador for Serbia and their international reputation.

I wouldn't have thought that it was remotely controversial to suggest that people from a smaller nation - especially one which has received extremely negative press over the last few decades - would be extremely passionate about representing themselves positively at an international event.
I think the man from Serbia over here said this better than me. But I think it is time we start to stop looking at Serbs as if they have this sign over their head. I know Serbs that are really tired of being related to that war all the time. Move on.
 
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