Nakashima and Brooksby
- Thread starter jrstrat
- Start date
atatu
Legend
My mistake, I meant he did well to to get into the third round, but Garin is proving to be a bit more than just a clay court player this week.
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
How far will Brooksky fall if he is going to lose in first round of both the CitiOpen and the USOpen in the next two months?
Liam Grennon
Professional
He has a couple of points to defend but I think it's pretty unlikely he drops both first rounds.
lol, hoping for a young American to fail, just because he made you look like an idiot / a terrible scout
the ego is strong with this one
he may or may not improve on his career high ranking of 33 during the remainder of 2022, very possible he won’t, but he’ll be in the top 20 long before he falls out of the top 100 (feel free to publicly disagree)
It’s worth noting that he has earned essentially no points in grand slams this year (injured AO, lost R1 at RG, received no points for his third rd performance at Wimbledon) - so, while he has points to defend this fall, that’s true, he also has a lot of places to improve next year
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
I don't wish will on Brooksby. I am glad that I was wrong and he is climbing the ranking.
That being said, he has 180 points to defend at the CitiOpen and another 180 points to defend at the USOpen. It is one thing to beat other players as an unknown, it is another thing to beat players that you're supposed to be as a higher seed player. Radacanu is an example. My boy Wolf made it to the 3rd round of the USO in 2020 (and was embarrassed by Mevedev) and didn't qualify for '21 USO. Lot of things can change in 12 months.
It's not unusual for a young player who bursts on the scene to have a tougher 2nd and 3rd year at the tour level. Tour level players figure out new players pretty quick finding patterns and strategies that work. Not saying this will happen to Brooksby. That said he has another tournament or two he can play this summer on top of D.C. and the Open plus the remainder of the year.
jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
Hey Bob, does City Open still have the wild card challenge open tourney? I know Fenty of MIch won one year. ATL 250 runs a WC to Qualis. Citi open used to have 128 draw tourney for WC. ATL 250 has 4 WC tourneys each summer, and the 4 winners play each other for the Quali spot. Usually it is a college student, but now Donald Young plays it each year to get in the Quali of a tourney where he used to be a seed. Tyler Stice of Auburn lost to him in WC finals last year-they may end up playing each other for the WC again. Wish the WC could be limited to someone who had never been in top 100 before...
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
They do. The qualifying run on Saturday and Sunday (July 30th and 31st). I normally go on Saturday, Sunday and Monday when tickets are still cheap and not crowded.
Last year or the year before, they let Fenty played on the main stadium where he was embarrassed by another unknown ATP player. I guess it help to be the son of a DC former mayor
atatu
Legend
I don't think they do it anymore, if you're talking about the one that any hack could sign up for ?
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
Just received a text from my avid tennis sister, who recently retired from the government, that she will let a couple of tennis qualifiers stay at her unoccupied condo near Rock Creek park, free of charge, during the qualifying round, and longer if they make it to the MD. She also texted me to order 10 lbs of crawfish so that she could cook crawfish in tomato sauce and organic pasta for them to eat while they are here. She will let them use the Tesla Model 3 for transportation when they are here. My brother has a much bigger place in Vienna Virginia (swimming pool and indoor gym) but it is far from Rock Creek so they decided to stay at the condo near Rock Creek park.
Wish more people would do this for up and coming tennis players.
happyandbob
Legend
it's weird that some of the best people in the world at their profession have to beg and gather crumbs to stay on tour
silentkman
Professional
They do. The qualifying run on Saturday and Sunday (July 30th and 31st). I normally go on Saturday, Sunday and Monday when tickets are still cheap and not crowded.
Last year or the year before, they let Fenty played on the main stadium where he was embarrassed by another unknown ATP player. I guess it help to be the son of a DC former mayor
They don't have the the WC challenge anymore just the regular qualifying to my knowledge. Yes, I believe Fenty lost to Krueger on the main Stadium on the first day of qualifying. I was there. Only the tennisheads go to first day qualifying. Do you consider a 6-4, 6-4 lost a embarrassment?
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silentkman
Professional
All players on the tour should get a per deim just like a government worker when he travels for business.
silentkman
Professional
The DC per deim is $172 plus $79 for meals in July. Everyone would have a 3 day minimum.
jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
How would you define "players on the tour"? There are 2000+ male players who have at least one ATP point. Some earned points in weaker tourneys or areas and may have UTRs (as low as 10.5) much lower than guys without ATP points who lost in the final rd of Qualis playing strong tourneys (where multiple UTR 13.5+s are in Qualis and have to play each other). Do you define the Tour players who should get free housing as players at the Future level or above, Challenger, or ATP 250? Do you include qualifiers which increase number significantly? In 2019, the ATP/WTA changed the points system, so ATP points were only earned at the SFs or above at 25K, and 15Ks and Qualifying wins only earned ITF world points (can't remember exactly). The goal was to decrease the 14K players (M + F) to a more reasonable number to increase chances players could make a living. The system received a ton of backlash and was reversed in about 6 months with points restored but still there is ITF world (those points help players who have won Quali matches get into Qualis after ATP points). The problem with the changed system was that it made it very hard for players to move from Futures to Challengers (if I remember right). Right idea but wrong process...
The alternate list for Future Qualis for players without ATP, ITF or national ranking is randomly generated by a computer. This week a 4.0 UTR 4.06 got into a Future where he lost 0,0 to a 14.0 because he was higher on the alternate list than some UTR 13+ college players who had not played a Future when they registered. One alternate earned an ATP point last week, but because the acceptance list was based on his no ranking 3 weeks ago, he was 41 alt spots below the overweight 30 year old 4.0 who got in . I hope in the near future that WTN will be used to rank players with no other ranking. It is ironic that the UTR PTT pro tour has a minimum floor of high 11 but the real Tour doesnt.
Anyway going back to my question who is tour player, consider 2 guys who lost in 1st rd of Qualis-the bucket list guy who wants to boast he played an All American on twitter and post highlights of his 0,0 loss (really-he did) and a 13+ college player who may draw another 13+ in the 1st rd of Qualis. Is either, both or neither a Tour player? One loser could have the possibility to win later matches in Futures or Challengers, possibly beyond if he improves from 13+ to 14+. Should tourneys fund the per diem of the amateur playing on a larK? Maybe one day there will be a minimum ranking to enter a Future-could be UTR, WTN, etc. When TDs have last minute WDs, they may fill with low level local who signed up. The pro tour should not be be an ego boosting exercise for rec tennis enthusiasts. There is a 39 y/o lawyer from Dayton who got in a Future once as an alternate with no ranking; his current UTR is 6.7. At that event, he drew a local level local with a UTR lower than him. He won and earned an ITF world point. Since then, the guy has played 16 more Future Qualis getting in on his one point, never winning another match, never winning more than 2 games with many double bagels. Meanwhile there were 16 events where talented players didnt travel to site to get in as an alternate because they thought they were too far down to have a chance. Do any other sports allow a few random middle aged rec level guys to play their low level pro events? Seems like the TD should just leave a bye rather than placing a rec player in the draw.
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silentkman
Professional
off the top my head, I would say two years of consistent play on the tour. I'm fine with struggling for two years then getting a per deim if the commitment is there. The players could still pocket that money and mooch off a family or share a room with another player at the right hotel. I think this would eliminate the ego boosting guys. Some people want that ATP point for their resume for teaching pro position. i agree, we don't need anymore Gail Falkenbergs' out on the tour.
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
Source? And what are the requirements to qualify for this perk?
silentkman
Professional
C'mon man: this is simple stuff from the GSA website. sheesh
FY 2022 Per Diem Rates for District of Columbia
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
C'mon man: this is simple stuff from the GSA website. sheesh
FY 2022 Per Diem Rates for District of Columbia
www.gsa.gov
How is that related to the ATP/WTA tour? Does CitiOpen offer per diem to qualifiers?
silentkman
Professional
The point I'm making again is this what the players should be paid. this is a business trip.
jcgatennismom
Hall of Fame
Agree with a limit-no per diem for players on the way down, e.g. Ryan Harrison (playing Futures!) and Donald Young challengers with a time limit for players to move from Futures/Challengers to 250s and above. With the best players leaving college ranked 350-500 and some even better like Nakishima, several years of support to get them to 100 would be great. Definitely better than spending $ on bloated USTA bureaucracy. Even USTA giving the top guys 150-350 $50K each would help. Oracle used to give the best US male and female college player $100K.
happyandbob
Legend
Maybe a limit on career earnings would work. Players with career earnings less than $xxxxxx are eligible for per diem from their first event onward.
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
Unfortunately, the ATP is NOT the US federal government where it can literally print money and run a deficit year after year like the US Federal government. That money the tournaments use to pay for hotel and per diem will have to come from somewhere and it means the winner, finalist, SF, QF, will get less. Not sure if everyone will go for that.
This might sound good on paper but it is not going to pass the legal litmus test. In the land of a lot of lawyers (aka the US), it will get shut down before it even starts
silentkman
Professional
I remember the Oracle days. I'm ok with giving the top players a stipend or something. The per deim makes it more equitable for everyone. Some of the ITF tournaments are providing hotel now. I've seen some players try to pick ups sponsors online. it's embarrassing that professional athletes can't afford a hotel. The U.S. Open the largest money making sporting event in the country. My assumption that they are helping players financially. in addition to the training facilities.
silentkman
Professional
Unfortunately, the ATP is NOT the US federal government where it can literally print money and run a deficit year after year like the US Federal government. That money the tournaments use to pay for hotel and per diem will have to come from somewhere and it means the winner, finalist, SF, QF, will get less. Not sure if everyone will go for that.
Yes, everyone in the free world knows the ATP is NOT the federal government. The ATP doesn't care which is embarrassing. As i indicated, some ITF tournaments are providing hotel. This is making the minor league baseball players living conditions look good. People need to think outside of the box for once. The US govt per deim is a guide. The US Open brings almost a billion to the city over four weeks. The money is there. Wimbledon changed their pay structure to help the players at the bottom. it's very hard sport to make a living because the interest is not there.
This might sound good on paper but it is not going to pass the legal litmus test. In the land of a lot of lawyers (aka the US), it will get shut down before it even starts
happyandbob
Legend
The boys are playing back to back today. A good day to play some hooky from work this afternoon
vandre
Hall of Fame
hooky? you mean "working remotely" don't you???
Brooksby moves on to play the title character from Bob's "Tiafoe is not good." thread
tt.tennis-warehouse.com
if Tiafoe wins, he'll reach a new career high of #24
Tiafoe is not good.
ESPN’s James Blakes and Gilbert really hyped him against Medvedev. It is currently the middle of the 2nd set and Medvedev is really taking Tiafoe to school.
tt.tennis-warehouse.com
if Tiafoe wins, he'll reach a new career high of #24
Thought about replying to that thread but changed my mind. No need to give that nut any fuel. Such a weak thread. Bad Prediction Bob pretty much only posts when FT loses, It's really kinda of a ugly thread, and the same thing could be said about most any player ranked below #20 or so. Why would he spew this garbage on a kid from his own backyard? Let me guess, jealousy.Brooksby moves on to play the title character from Bob's "Tiafoe is not good." thread
Tiafoe is not good.
ESPN’s James Blakes and Gilbert really hyped him against Medvedev. It is currently the middle of the 2nd set and Medvedev is really taking Tiafoe to school.
if Tiafoe wins, he'll reach a new career high of #24
with Tiafoe up to a career high #25
and Wolf up to a career high #95
i expect bob to go all in on hoping Brooksby drops some of his DC and USO points from last year
don't do it, bob, just celebrate the success of these Americans - has been too long since the US has had this many guys in the top 100 (6 in the top 34, 13 in the top 95)
and Wolf up to a career high #95
i expect bob to go all in on hoping Brooksby drops some of his DC and USO points from last year
don't do it, bob, just celebrate the success of these Americans - has been too long since the US has had this many guys in the top 100 (6 in the top 34, 13 in the top 95)
bobleenov1963
Hall of Fame
Brooksby probably lost due to exhaustion from the previous Atlanta tournament. You could see near the end of the final with De Minar that Brooksby was exhausted. Even TC commentators mentioned that Brooksby doesn't spend much time in the gym, he just wants to play tennis. The weather in Washington DC, hot and humid, is also not in Brooksby's favor. Hopefully, he will recover for the next tournament.
yeah, improved physical fitness probably needs to be on his 2023 checklist - has played a very sporadic schedule so far in his young pro career, intermittent breaks for injuries, and some early round losses especially on clay that made for some short tournament weeks - if he plans to be a top 20 guy, playing a heavier schedule and more reliably going deep in tournaments, going to have to step up that aspect
would've faced the demon again had he won, so maybe wasn't in the cards to back up last year's DC performance
His playing style looks like it's rough on the body. Hopefully his team is trying to build his durability and stamina up the right way.
Good call on the possible demon match up had he won his 1st round, I hadn't noticed that. Seeing how hard he likes to compete, gotta think he wanted another shot at him, but his long week in ATL wouldn't let him.
happyandbob
Legend
Let's go!
both young Americans won in straights today. tough win by paul yesterday.
is it too much to hope for wolf to take down kyrgios tomorrow?
both young Americans won in straights today. tough win by paul yesterday.
is it too much to hope for wolf to take down kyrgios tomorrow?
if Kyrgios brings his A game, yes
but never know what butterfly traveling across the court or fan shouting something from the stands makes him decide to flip the switch to bad Nick
yep, heck of a day for the title characters of this thread, 6 sets to 0 against seeds, one of which just came off the best week of his career
happyandbob
Legend
Brooksby running into a buzzsaw at the moment. His serve hasn’t progressed much over the last two years like Nakashima’s has.
I hope that’s in his improvement plan
I hope that’s in his improvement plan
Even his ground game didn’t pressure Alcaraz who pretty much dictated at will. Kind of tough to watch
yep, Brooksby may be just what his ranking suggests for now, a 33-50 guy in the world - but he’ll make another push forward I bet next year, still hasn’t had a full / healthy year on tour
fortunately for American tennis, it was followed by a world class performance by Tiafoe, who is playing the best tennis of his career - he could have a real chance against Nadal, he’ll love playing on that stage in primetime on Ashe
Nakashima wins the San Diego Open 250 tourney and Brooksby lost in the quarterfinals. Overall, a pretty weak field for a ATP 250 event with Daniel Evans a #1 seed and Brooksby a # 2 seed but still a big ATP tourney win for Nakashima. Brandon is now ranked #48 and Brooksby is #46.
I admire people who know what they want and do it. Nakashima knew he was ready for college tennis when he graduated high school early in December and went to UVA even though he technically still had a semester of high school left. And after playing that one semester at UVA knew he was ready for the pros.
happyandbob
Legend
Heading to third set in Basel for Nakashima vs Stan. Big hitting at the end of the second set to recover from down a set and a break to take the second.
happyandbob
Legend
Some bad misses by Brandon at the end of the third, leaving Giron the only American left in Basel and Vienna
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