Natural Gut experts...

TripleB

Hall of Fame
Went to the doc 2 weeks ago due to some pain in the back of my right upper arm (sort of between my bicep and tricep...closer to the tricep) and the doctor said it sounds like possibly arthritis - the good news is she said something that would help is starting to play tennis again (took off since September to ride my bike more).

Due to that diagnosis I've been looking to move to a softer set up than my Tour Bite 1.20/Gosen OG Sheep Micro Super 1.25 hybrid. I'm getting ready to try a few set ups: all Prince Premier Control, Hyper G/Gosen hybrid, and Revolution/Gosen hybrid. Not sure how much of a difference that will make with the pain but in theory they will play softer than my normal set up. I'm looking at those in hopes of maintaining a high spin potential from the set up...something I rely on both in singles and doubles.

If none of those set ups work then I'll turn my attention towards using natural gut in some fashion. I have no experience with natural gut other than some $20 "natural gut" in which one set broke during stringing and the other set broke while in my bag before I had a chance to try it.

So I thought I'd turn to you natural gut experts for some help and advice.

Are there any benefits to using natural gut in the crosses (compared to a multi or synthetic) with a poly in the mains? I assume using a shaped poly like I'm used to wouldn't be smart with a natural gut in the cross?

Is using natural gut mains with a poly (I assume a smooth one) cross be a better option than the poly mains/gut cross set up? What benefits would this set up give me? Any suggestions for a smooth poly that works well with natural gut?

Or should I only consider an all gut set up? Or natural gut/synthetic hybrid to save money?

Is there a "cheaper but decent" natural gut that you would recommend so that I could 'test the waters' with natural gut without putting a huge amount of money into it to start with.

Thank you again for all your time, help, and advice.

TripleB

info: 4.5 player, heavy top/slice off both side, play both singles and doubles, best shot 2 handed backhand, worst shot serve, medium length and fast strokes
 
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DANMAN

Professional
I know I suggested gut in another thread so I feel obligated to give more thoughts here. I have used Klip Legend, Pacific Classic, Bow brand, BDE Rallye, and Babolat Tonic. I honestly am a huge Klip Legend fan. It is firmer than Pacific which coming from poly will be welcome. It is durable and at $28 and $26 for 15G it is the best value in my opinion. Tonic can be had for $30.50 and is a nice string as well but the BT7 coating is real. I like Pacific as well and never had problems with it. I personally don't believe moving to the >$40 range is worth it. BDE and Bow brand no longer are in the business.

Given this, if I were you, I would start with Klip and or Tonic. With the Klip you could even get a half set.

I would no doubt start with gut in the mains since the bulk of the playability of the string bed comes from them. I believe in a smooth poly cross and Ripspin or revolve is among the best given the tension maintenance and SnapBack. Luxilon ALU is nice but defeats the purpose of keeping cost down. I've even used ISO speed baseline as a cheap option in Wilson Blade 98S frames but now with the new strikes I don't need to go that cheap as string lasts much longer.

For reference, 5.0 player with all court game
 

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
Went to the doc 2 weeks ago due to some pain in the back of my right upper arm (sort of between my bicep and tricep...closer to the tricep) and the doctor said it sounds like possibly arthritis - the good news is she said something that would help is starting to play tennis again (took off since September to ride my bike more).

Due to that diagnosis I've been looking to move to a softer set up than my Tour Bite 1.20/Gosen OG Sheep Micro Super 1.25 hybrid. I'm getting ready to try a few set ups: all Prince Premier Control, Hyper G/Gosen hybrid, and Revolution/Gosen hybrid. Not sure how much of a difference that will make with the pain but in theory they will play softer than my normal set up. I'm looking at those in hopes of maintaining a high spin potential from the set up...something I rely on both in singles and doubles.

If none of those set ups work then I'll turn my attention towards using natural gut in some fashion. I have no experience with natural gut other than some $20 "natural gut" in which one set broke during stringing and the other set broke while in my bag before I had a chance to try it.

So I thought I'd turn to you natural gut experts for some help and advice.

Are there any benefits to using natural gut in the crosses (compared to a multi or synthetic) with a poly in the mains? I assume using a shaped poly like I'm used to wouldn't be smart with a natural gut in the cross?

Is using natural gut mains with a poly (I assume a smooth one) cross be a better option than the poly mains/gut cross set up? What benefits would this set up give me? Any suggestions for a smooth poly that works well with natural gut?

Or should I only consider an all gut set up? Or natural gut/synthetic hybrid to save money?

Is there a "cheaper but decent" natural gut that you would recommend so that I could 'test the waters' with natural gut without putting a huge amount of money into it to start with.

Thank you again for all your time, help, and advice.

TripleB

info: 4.5 player, heavy top/slice off both side, play both singles and doubles, best shot 2 handed backhand, worst shot serve, medium length and fast strokes
copy Federer, can't go wrong there.
 

TripleB

Hall of Fame
I have used Klip Legend, Pacific Classic, Bow brand, BDE Rallye, and Babolat Tonic. I honestly am a huge Klip Legend fan. It is firmer than Pacific which coming from poly will be welcome. It is durable and at $28 and $26 for 15G it is the best value in my opinion.

I would no doubt start with gut in the mains since the bulk of the playability of the string bed comes from them. I believe in a smooth poly cross and Ripspin or revolve is among the best given the tension maintenance and SnapBack.
The Klip Legend Natural Gut and Wilson Revolve 17g hybrid looks very enticing!

Being a topspin player I worry about going as thick as 1.35...how much less durable and how much more spin should I expect out of the 1.30 instead of the 1.35?

Thanks for all the help!!!

TripleB
 

CopolyX

Hall of Fame
don't go cheap on your arms, you deserve the best for you and your game. don't limit yourself.
ton of great choices out there. my take the time, have patients, be open and have fun.
 
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DANMAN

Professional
The Klip Legend Natural Gut and Wilson Revolve 17g hybrid looks very enticing!

Being a topspin player I worry about going as thick as 1.35...how much less durable and how much more spin should I expect out of the 1.30 instead of the 1.35?

Thanks for all the help!!!

TripleB
Natural gut is surprisingly durable in my book. Prior to the Blade 98S frames, I used it in pure drives and got two weeks out of it and it's playable the whole time unlike poly. I would not go 1.35 as it will be less spinny and you may not like it because of that and then you'll feel like you wasted money. I'd go 1.30 in mains and 1.25 in crosses to start to keep the stringbed as open as possible. If you love it and that breaks too fast you can try 1.35 mains, if not you can move down to 1.25 which in my book is the ideal gauge of all strings.

For reference, I broke Klip Legend mains and isospeed baseline crosses in about 3.5 hours in my Blade 98S and broke full ALU in 2 hours (one hitting session). The Legend was 1.35mm. It took me 4 hitting sessions to break ALU in my new strike (probably 10 hours). I'm about to try the gut hybrids in it. The point of these hours is to note that the gut outlasted the poly (noting it was thicker). I think with as expensive as polys have gotten and with a sensitive arm you'd be cheating yourself to settle on a multi without trying this hybrid. It really is the best of both works. Comfort of gut and near power of gut tamed with the spin of poly. I've tried full gut before and found it to be a giant waste of money for my game. The hybrid is the real deal.
 

TripleB

Hall of Fame
Thanks for all the help and advice...I appreciate everyone taking the time to respond!

In the past I've usually strung my racquets (POG Mid, Pure Strike 16x19, Steam 99LS, etc) around 46m/49c with a Tour Bite 1.20/Gosen Super 1.25 hybrid.

What tension should I think about starting at with my Klip Legend 1.30 / Wilson Revolve 1.25 hybrid? It will be going in a Tecnifibre TFight 295 Dynacore.

Thank you very much for all the responses!!!

TripleB
 

DANMAN

Professional
I'd consider 50/52. I think you need to up the tension some but would not go up too much or the stringbed will feel quite different (which it already will with gut).
 

KaiserW

Hall of Fame
What tension should I think about starting at with my Klip Legend 1.30 / Wilson Revolve 1.25 hybrid?
I have used this exact setup and go 56/54. Currently using Pacific Classic but either works well for me.
 

Rabbit

G.O.A.T.
3B, you can go thick with natural gut. The difference in spin between 1.30 and 1.35 (or even 1.25) is not noticeable at our level. What is noticeable is the durability. You'll get a whole lot more play out of 1.35. As far as which gut, depending on how bad your arm is (how sore), really sore, go with Pacific Prime 1.30. Anything bearable, Babolat Tonic or Pacific Tough. I don't like Klip as much as the others, but I string for one guy who loves it in his Shark Hybrid 110 at 61. As far as your tension you might want to bump it up 3 - 4 pounds to start.
 

TripleB

Hall of Fame
I'd consider 50/52. I think you need to up the tension some but would not go up too much or the stringbed will feel quite different (which it already will with gut).
I have used this exact setup and go 56/54. Currently using Pacific Classic but either works well for me.
3B, you can go thick with natural gut. The difference in spin between 1.30 and 1.35 (or even 1.25) is not noticeable at our level. What is noticeable is the durability. You'll get a whole lot more play out of 1.35. As far as which gut, depending on how bad your arm is (how sore), really sore, go with Pacific Prime 1.30. Anything bearable, Babolat Tonic or Pacific Tough. I don't like Klip as much as the others, but I string for one guy who loves it in his Shark Hybrid 110 at 61. As far as your tension you might want to bump it up 3 - 4 pounds to start.
Thanks for the replies!

One last question (for now): when using a natural gut mains / poly crosses hybrid, are the gut mains usually strung higher than the poly crosses? If so, by how much?

Again, I appreciate the help.

TripleB
 

DANMAN

Professional
Thanks for the replies!

One last question (for now): when using a natural gut mains / poly crosses hybrid, are the gut mains usually strung higher than the poly crosses? If so, by how much?

Again, I appreciate the help.

TripleB
I wouldn't change too many things at once. You're changing strings and tensions. It's reasonable to have the crosses tighter with this setup. I liked gut best around 55 when I was playing poly at 52. I strung my poly crosses at 55 with the gut mains. I've never changed tensions between mains and crosses.
 

speedysteve

Legend
Arm pain, I'd forget poly. As others have said go for Pacific Classic (softest I've tried) or firmer feel, but equally good on the arm Klip Legend.
Klip is a also more durable and surprisingly slick even gut and gut if you lube it!
Probably just means you don't have to straighten the strings and get more durability rather than any snap back spin;)
Once you have no arm pain try gut mains and poly crosses but be prepared to go back to full gut at the slightest arm twinge.
Consider also your racquet stiffness. Go for a really low RA if you are thinking of playing with a little pain or returning too early.
Usual Flexibar and massage stick deep massage before and after each play and I find magnesium oil soothes the muscles of not the tendon.
 

ShahofTennis

Professional
My dad's physician made a similar recommendation for his arthritis, except he recommended that he play more golf. Old man's goes missing every weekend.
 

McLovin

Legend
I've said this before, but what the hell, once more for old time's sake...

Please, please, please...ignore all tension value recommendations. Why? Because my 52/50 may be equivalent to someone else's 46/44 or 58/56. It depends on the machine (drop weight, lock-out, electronic), whether they are pre-stretching the gut and possibly the poly, as well as the stringer's technique. I used to string my frames at 58/56 on a drop weight machine. When I bought a WISE tension head, I did a little experiment using RacquetTune, and learned that my new machine's equivalent tension was 54/52! A 4lb difference!

If you're used to 46/49, then I'd stay close to that (assuming you're using the same stringer). Maybe 50/48 to compensate for the increased power of the gut.

Also, the practice of dropping the poly tension is completely random. Some do 2lbs, some do 5lbs, some don't change it at all. You need to experiment a little before settling on the value(s).
 

g4driver

Hall of Fame
TripleB,

Are you stringing these frames yourself ? If you are stringing and not experienced with stringing gut my 02:

1) Go very slowly so you don't kink the gut.

2) Never tie a poly cross off on a gut main. (This will prevent the gut from snapping prematurely on a shank.)

3) Hand tighten all gut knots, don't pull the gut with a starting clamp or other pliers when tying the gut knots.

If you pay someone to string, get a USRSA CS or MRT to do it for you.

http://www.racquettech.com/top/cert_description.php
 

jmc3367

Rookie
As someone who suffers from some tennis elbow I can tell you what worked for me. I used pacifica gut in the mains at 56 and goosen Sidewinder 17 in the crosses at 52. I love the feel of the gut and the Goosen helps to tame it down just a bit. My tennis elbow is all but gone and I feel like I am playing as well as ever. I would think that whatever is good for tennis elbow couldn't hurt for any other condition. I also string my own rackets as well as a few friends. I also wanted to try the Technifibre NRG with the Goosen but haven't had a chance yet
 

ramon.gtown

New User
Triple B, I'm rarely on the boards, but happened to catch your thread on natural gut, which I've played with consistently with for at least 2 decades, regardless if I try something less expensive or someone advertises, "as good as".

But, as a trauma surgeon and a former D1 player, I think I have some useful insight.

Feel free to email me: ramon.gtown@gmail.com

Best of luck!
 
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