need help on particular breed of player

[counterpunchingrules]

hey all......so, when i was back in highschool and conquering the 4.0's and all of the hardcore slice and dice pushers, i thought i had rid myself of them forever......Au Contraire evidently.

now...when i say "hardcore slice and dice pushers" im talking about extremely fast persons who literally hit every single ball with an open racquet face and put underspin on every single stroke. these guys have no real technique and look like they belong playing some ping pong rather than tennis, but to each their own and im a fan of doing whatever it takes to win so in a sense i admire them, HOWEVER im tired of extremely long, drawn out matches with them. it seems as of lately im meeting up with more and more of them in big draws in higher divisions (4.5-5.0) and its quite annoying.

lemme explain a little about my game. im an all court player, excellent volleys, and extremely consistent from the baseline. as my name implies im pretty much a counter puncher, but NOT a pusher. i hit deep with topspin, but im adept at using my opponents pace and turning it against them. i also like to play in the opens when its available in the tournament because i can do well against the baseline bashers. in any case im getting off topic here but wanted to explain my game a little.


also, let me tell you, i dont have problems losing to this player im describing to you, this slice and dice speed machine, however, i have to EXTREMELY alter my game and essentially beat them at their own game. sometimes i have success at the net if i can get a ball from them high enough off the ground to drill with some loop and plenty of top high to their backhand, but for those of you who know this type of player im talking about, you know that they keep every ball maybe a few inches at most off the ground, like clockwork. essentially, i start hitting like they do, and eventually out rally them. this last tournament i was in, i played one in the first round, beat him in 3 hours 14 minutes, and was completely destroyed for my next match which i only had an hour rest for. NO, im not lazy, NO im not in terrible shape. 3 hours 14 minutes of hardcore side to side grinding for 2 outta 3 sets is a lot, and only an hour of rest when my opponent finished his match in 45 minutes was a bit of a disadvantage, but courts were short and it was a big tournament.


please........how do i beat these types of players using the solid techniques i have? the good ones can still hit nice lobs or passing shots so just bum rushing the net every point does not work. like i said, i dont get the chance to have a ball to drill with extra top and push them back and off the court. my only success has been "pushing" back, waiting, waiting, waiting, finally getting ONE ball i have a chance to do something with, and doing it. however its hella frustrating when you miss those opportunities because you realize you just spend a ton of effort working the point to get there heh.



does anyone here play that particular style im referring to? ive heard they eventually run into a "wall" at higher levels, but i dont understand how i can have such trouble with them at 4.5+ tournaments when my technique is sound and what not. the good ones can still get every ball back, and keep it extremely low sigh.


any and all feedback is appreciated

 

[counterpunchingrules]

anyone?

 

[Jonny S&V]

anyone?

Dropshot, lob, high loopy topspin, hit crosscourt mostly, try out different things, come into net, etc...

 

[darkblue]

anyone?

i would do some background research on these players.

* have this pusher/dicer lost quick matches in the past?
if NEVER, it's quite unlikely that you'd find that silver bullet.
if YES, i'd see who he lost to. did his opponent have a weapon(s)
that would allow for a quick match? if yes, can you develop
a strategy that would expose the weakness that was exploited by this
weapon?

it's my view that these "pushers/dicers" have different weaknesses.
so i never look for a single pre-determined "how to beat" strategies.

in tennis, past record is indicative of the current (esp. at 4.5+ where
rate of player evolution is slower (for most us, anyway)).
i'd look for clues in the warm-ups. i'd try to see my next-round opponent's matches. i'd have set plays which tests opponent's shots during matches.

i wish i could play matches the WAY I LIKE TO PLAY THEM =)

 

[ktownva]

My advice would be to never understimate this type of player. Always be prepared for a solid drive even if this player never seems to hit one. It has been my experience that as soon as they sense your reaction time slowing, they will surprise you with a ripper, usually on a big point.

 

[LoveThisGame]

Brother, I'm with you .

If you don't have a drop shot, develop one. Against these players it is fairly easy to hit.

Try standing well inside the baseline even hitting volleys from there. Everything in tennis comes down to time and distance. Doing this cuts down on the opponent's time while opening up angles for you. At times they don't even realize you've moved in some.

Quick anecdote: Last year I played one of these folks. I stood in, kept the ball away from short forehands for him because he could hit them well crosscourt, and ran the dickens out of him. I was preparing for the third set, particularly after losing 7-5 in the first set while figuring out what to do. We get to the third set and ... it rains :sad: .

 

[counterpunchingrules]

lovethisgame - OUCH haha! that totally sucks


as for underestimating them, i would never do that. ive had enough matches with them at earlier levels that i know what theyre capable of doing.

 

[KFwinds]

As mentioned, there are a couple of things you can do;

Instead of resorting to "out-playing" them at their game, figure out what their weakness(es) are and play your strength(s) against them.

Pushers hate to come to the net; bring them in with a dropshot or short ball. Then have your way with them...

 

[sliceworks76]

As a player of this mold, I'll give you some tips. Most of the time, players of this type don't have huge serves. I played a match yesterday where they guy pounded away at my serves and took the advantage in many points. Don't let your opponents get away with just spinning a serve in. The guy I played yesterday (a strong 4.0) has a really nice forehand, and he consistently ran around it and hit deep forcing balls into the corners. He wasn't going for winners, but eventually got me out of position.

It's important to come to the net too, but you have to do it at the right time. If you just hit the ball hard and come in, the player will use your pace and hit a nasty pass. The key is to hit penetrating ground strokes to get the player out of position, then approach and take over. Combine that with strong serving, and you have a recipe for success. The match will still probably take a while, but even if the player is in good shape, they'll be worn out by the end.

One note: I like to see players attempt drop shots or try to bring me to the net. It means they've dropped out of their comfort zone, which is almost always the goal. Of course, I wouldn't call myself a "pusher," as its insulting and unfair, but that's just me.