New Phantom Pro (18x20) (320)

Holdfast44ID

Semi-Pro
Difference is you don't get a chance in tennis to switch sticks every single shot like in golf! Lol
And, unlike golf courses, tennis courts are all the same size. Pros don't use different racquets. At most, they just switch for different string tensions. Some use one at different tension for serving vs returning, for instance.

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Dartagnan64

Legend
And, unlike golf courses, tennis courts are all the same size. Pros don't use different racquets. At most, they just switch for different string tensions. Some use one at different tension for serving vs returning, for instance.

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I don’t think tennis courts being the same dimension matters. In tennis you play a variety of shots which all may be better suited to different racquets. I know my best serving racquets aren’t my best BH racquets and my best BH racquets aren’t my best FH racquets.
Just like my best driving club isn’t my best pitching club.

The advantage in golf is I have time to switch between shots and take a few practice swings. In tennis you pretty much have to stick with one frame for a match because every swing counts.

But I have no problem picking a different stick for a match depending on conditions, opponent and whether it’s doubles or singles.

I know the pros don’t but they’re not out there for fun, so I really don’t fuss about what they do. They are playing a different game entirely.
 

emn8

Rookie
Had my first hit with the 18x20 today. Few grams at 10 and 2 and an overgrip. Strung up with Oehms Black Pearl Rough 1.21. Intense hitting session with a hard hitter (he was using the new Pure Drive) and former top junior. Have to say I really didn't get pushed around. This is one stable racquet from the back as well as the net. I play semi western FH and OHBH. Forehand totally dialled in with a few mins (quite familiar with the 93p so the transition was seamless) OHBH was better than I expected. For 100" frame it comes around fairly quickly, although I still prefer a smaller head size. BH slice was nice and got some good bite. Don't think I missed a volley all morning, drive volleys from mid court were satisfying - so forgiving on slight mishits. Spin from both wings was good for a 18x20 and heavy ball is possible if you prep early. Flat serves and playing on the run to wide balls were weak. you just cant stab the ball deep to get back in the rally...often they would fall short and left me open. Some adjustment needed here methinks. Think I served around four to five slice serve aces which surprised me as the curve I got was more than I typically get with my Beast. Thinner beam perhaps? Have to say I played rather well with it and I can see it working well for a multitude of game styles. Bit of a swiss army knife imo.

Will be having a another hit over the weekend and maybe some dubs as well. Will update my thoughts here in due course.
 

B Cubed

Semi-Pro
Just now finally had my second demo with this. I really felt at home with it. Today it was feeling smooth and solid. I usually use my PP100P, but today it was feeling sluggish compared to this. Would love to try 17 gauge in it.
 

B Cubed

Semi-Pro
One area where the PP100 18x20 shines is that it is more headlight than the other Phantoms. It's still got good weight, so it's stable, but it's pretty maneuverable, more so than the PP100P.
 

2nd Serve Ace

Hall of Fame
One area where the PP100 18x20 shines is that it is more headlight than the other Phantoms. It's still got good weight, so it's stable, but it's pretty maneuverable, more so than the PP100P.
That box beam on the PP100P is a bit clunky feeling to me. All the other phantom 100s are easy swinging , imho.
 
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B Cubed

Semi-Pro
That box beam on the PP100P is a bit clunky feeling to me. All the other phantom 100s are easy swinging , imho.
True. I still get pulled back to it, because at the same time it’s got a touch more power, and it’s easy to translation between that and my POG 107.
 

J B

Semi-Pro
I thought the phantom is over powered compared to the 100p. It’s really hard to keep anything in where the 100p feels like a 2015 blade
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
I thought the phantom is over powered compared to the 100p. It’s really hard to keep anything in where the 100p feels like a 2015 blade
Phantoms? Overpowered? That’s a first.

I did a side by side comparison and the Pro 100 18x20 was lower powered than the TT 100 (310).

So it likely is a string and string bed issue, not the frame.
 

J B

Semi-Pro
Phantoms? Overpowered? That’s a first.

I did a side by side comparison and the Pro 100 18x20 was lower powered than the TT 100 (310).

So it likely is a string and string bed issue, not the frame.
tried it with different string and the pro 18x20 100p still had better feel
 

markwillplay

Hall of Fame
How does the pp100 18 20 compare to the pp100p? I am beginning to look at these harder. I did not like the pp100p as much when I demoed it but honestly I did not hit it much.

18 20 would be closer to my tour 18 20s but it looks as though it might have slightly more power. Anyone switched from one of the tours to one of these with success?
 

time_fly

Hall of Fame
I thought the phantom is over powered compared to the 100p. It’s really hard to keep anything in where the 100p feels like a 2015 blade
Since the PP 100 18x20 is heavier and has a more dense string pattern than the pp 100p, you most likely had a timing issue or weren't getting the spin you expected. There's no way this racquet could be considered over-powered.
 

flanker2000fr

Professional
Since the PP 100 18x20 is heavier and has a more dense string pattern than the pp 100p, you most likely had a timing issue or weren't getting the spin you expected. There's no way this racquet could be considered over-powered.
I would agree: the heavier weight and tighter pattern would mechanically lead to flatter shots, which is probably why the balls sail long. None of the racquets in Phantom line are particularly powerful.
 

B Cubed

Semi-Pro
How does the pp100 18 20 compare to the pp100p? I am beginning to look at these harder. I did not like the pp100p as much when I demoed it but honestly I did not hit it much.

18 20 would be closer to my tour 18 20s but it looks as though it might have slightly more power. Anyone switched from one of the tours to one of these with success?
They definitely play different. I think the PP100P because of its swingweight and box beam make it feel a little firmer and heavier (cumbersome to some peeps). The PP100 18x20 is more head light and plush in the flex. Per your back ground, you should try it.
 

markwillplay

Hall of Fame
I am beginning to think that unless there is easier spin and power with the 100 18 20), I am interested in trying something with a little more of both and that may mean a little more open pattern. If an 18 20 is not way better than my tours then I would stay with them in that string pattern. Wondering if I might get a little extr pop and spin from the 18 16.... even with the text tour 310 or phantom 100 with ports
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
I am beginning to think that unless there is easier spin and power with the 100 18 20), I am interested in trying something with a little more of both and that may mean a little more open pattern. If an 18 20 is not way better than my tours then I would stay with them in that string pattern. Wondering if I might get a little extr pop and spin from the 18 16.... even with the text tour 310 or phantom 100 with ports
To be honest I get more spin from 18x20 Phantoms than I do my Phantom 100 with ports. I'm just more confident swinging out with the tighter Phantoms that the added RHS combine with thin gauge strings gets me much better spin and depth. I find with open string patterns, the lack of precision gets me holding back and brushing the ball too much. TBH, my best racquet for baseline grinding is my POG 107. I get get very easy depth and spin on that frame with more control than you'd expect from an OS frame.
 

markwillplay

Hall of Fame
I get plenty of spin with my tours and did so with the tt100p as well. I hit with an old graphite pro the other day and did realize that there was more to be had on serve. The thin beamed phantoms probably play closer to the old graphite pro 110s than anything. I think I will demo the 18 20 and maybe the pro 100. I just don’t want a frame that I have to string in low 40s for power sake. I could use a bit more pop on my serve. That is the one area where I think I could do a bit better than my tours.
 

ls206

Professional
What is the inside of the handle like on these racquets?
Has anyone tried to remove any weight?

I would prefer a strung balance of ~6pts HL so I'm wondering if I'd be able to lose some weight from the handle.
Perhaps replacing the butt cap is an option - I think the Head butt caps are quite light but not sure how heavy the Prince ones are.
 

J B

Semi-Pro
Since the PP 100 18x20 is heavier and has a more dense string pattern than the pp 100p, you most likely had a timing issue or weren't getting the spin you expected. There's no way this racquet could be considered over-powered.
I was saying compared to another underpowered racquet. For most yes its not but went my balls are hitting 2 feet inside the baseline and still rising as they hit the fence, I dont think spin is the problem. I just felt that with the textreme 100p i knew where the ball was landing due to the feel vs the Phantom was generally less feel which probably resulted in overhitting or the feeling of too much power.
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
I was saying compared to another underpowered racquet. For most yes its not but went my balls are hitting 2 feet inside the baseline and still rising as they hit the fence, I dont think spin is the problem. I just felt that with the textreme 100p i knew where the ball was landing due to the feel vs the Phantom was generally less feel which probably resulted in overhitting or the feeling of too much power.
Or more likely the TT100P was spec'd closer to what you're muscle memory was used to.

Because Phantom 18x20's by design have a ton of feel and low power. The ported 100 is a lot more muted from the ports but still has touch from the thin beams.

Power is always the worst described attribute on these forums. Too many definitions. For some its when a frame hits their usual swings long. That's not power. That's control and spin. Power is simply the attribute of a frame to efficiently transfer energy of the swing to the ball. But if a more powerful racquet adds spin to the ball, people think that the power level is reduced rather than the more right interpretation that the spin is increased.

I still think the Phantom 18x20's are the crown jewels of the Phantom line, both the 100 and 93P. You can run low tension polys in these things to get comfort and spin and still get great control and touch and they feel fantastic especially with the FH. The 16x18 string beds are a little too muted and less controlled but very comfortable.
 

J B

Semi-Pro
I also wanted something like the old blades and the tour 100P 18x20 is the closest to that. You are not 100% correct on long equalling spin, technique equals spin not racquets. Too many people are confusing power with a rating. For instance a whippy racquet can produce more power for one swinger, and a board stiff racquet can provide more power for someone else. Its all dependent on your swing how its applied. What I am saying is IMHO the racquet adds more energy to the ball and i do NOT get the shot I am looking for. Who knows perhaps I am using my hips and core to swing instead of just arm and its not good for a whippy racquet.

I had no trouble keeping the ball in, i noticed that the depth was different to the point of humm, now maybe there was some string issues but I restrung it and it produced the same issues. As to spin and control my swing according to a number of coaches is usually technically correct, I have a pretty good rate of consistency of shot placement. I feel the phantom doesnt provide the feel to apply the power to the ball. I will again say that the phantom touch and feel does not compare to what I feel the tour has. I previously had a 355 gram and played with a new pure strike that is 300grams the past three weeks. I usually play with a 340 2014 pure strike with nat gut/poly hybrid , at 59/57

The tour feels so much better than the phantom. Thats just me though.
 

Travis.s

New User
I have been using the 93p 18x20 since mid-2018.
The 93p plays nice, but I have issues with the off-center hits, especially on the BH and volleys, so looking for something with a similar feel but more forgiveness.
After following this thread for a while, plus a great deal with the FOURTH coupon, I ordered matched a pair of Phantom Pro 100 (18x20).
Hoped that the PP 100(18x20) would relief my issue!

I have some question on the transition;
1. I usually strung the 93p with full bed 1.20 poly string,@46/44lbs, usually rotate the strings btw RS Lyon, Yonex PTP, Solinco Tour Bite Soft.
What do you recommend the tension for the PP 100(18x20)? I'm thinking 50/48? or maybe switch to 1.25 strings but with lower tension?

2. From specs, the PP100 (18x20) is a bit lighter than the 93p, I'm thinking to change to grips to leather(+overgrip as usual)
Should I add some weight in the hoops to make it feel like the 93p SW?
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
I have been using the 93p 18x20 since mid-2018.
The 93p plays nice, but I have issues with the off-center hits, especially on the BH and volleys, so looking for something with a similar feel but more forgiveness.
After following this thread for a while, plus a great deal with the FOURTH coupon, I ordered matched a pair of Phantom Pro 100 (18x20).
Hoped that the PP 100(18x20) would relief my issue!

I have some question on the transition;
1. I usually strung the 93p with full bed 1.20 poly string,@46/44lbs, usually rotate the strings btw RS Lyon, Yonex PTP, Solinco Tour Bite Soft.
What do you recommend the tension for the PP 100(18x20)? I'm thinking 50/48? or maybe switch to 1.25 strings but with lower tension?

2. From specs, the PP100 (18x20) is a bit lighter than the 93p, I'm thinking to change to grips to leather(+overgrip as usual)
Should I add some weight in the hoops to make it feel like the 93p SW?
I ordered a smaller grip and added a second overgrip and then threw about 4g lead at 12 Oclock in my 100 18x20 and strung about 2 lbs higher tension in my hybrid over my 93P. So what you are proposing is about the same. I'd stick with 1.20 strings though.
 

Travis.s

New User
I ordered a smaller grip and added a second overgrip and then threw about 4g lead at 12 Oclock in my 100 18x20 and strung about 2 lbs higher tension in my hybrid over my 93P. So what you are proposing is about the same. I'd stick with 1.20 strings though.
Hi Dartagnan64, thank you for your reply. Love your posts; they are very useful. I'm a big fan of yours.
My situation on the grip is quite the opposite - my 93p is a 4 3/8", and I put two overgrips to increase its size, which I don't quite like since I like to feel the bevels, and 4 3/8" grip is the largest I could find here in Asia. So I decided to get the grip one size larger - 4 1/2" and I think it should fit my hand fine with one overgrip.

Before deciding on the PP100 (18x20), I have been looking into several choices - I have demoed the prototype Head Gravity MP, nice feel on that racquet there and think that the Gravity PRO would be the one. Also, I have thoughts on the Prince Texteme Tour 100p (18x20), my nerdy mind falls for the Tawaron, and that gold Prince logo looks sexy, and according to the specs, it should play the same as the Gravity PRO?
Anyway, nothing beats the feels of the thin beam in Phantoms + the 4th sale helps seal the deal!
 

DustinW

Professional
Just picked up one of these and had a light hit this morning. I'm thinking it might need just a bit of lead in the hoop. Where have people been adding lead? I usually like it at 9/3 or 10/2, but I'm wondering if 12 is the better location since it has such a round head shape?

And a bit of eye candy...
 

time_fly

Hall of Fame
Just picked up one of these and had a light hit this morning. I'm thinking it might need just a bit of lead in the hoop. Where have people been adding lead? I usually like it at 9/3 or 10/2, but I'm wondering if 12 is the better location since it has such a round head shape?
I added it at 12. I think that's what the TW playtesters did as well. My reasoning is that I wanted to give it a bit more plow-through and make it less head light, but I wanted to add as little static weight as possible.
 

dgoran

Hall of Fame
If I play at least once a month I’m good with 93p but I’m more like once in 2 months now so started looking for 93 alternatives and I chose to go with gravity pro as it feels very similar to 93p with even more plushness.

I’ll report back when I log in more hours
 

DustinW

Professional
Anyone having the serving issues with this frame that the testers bashed it for?
I think it serves great. There's enough mass to hit a heavy ball yet it is still headlight enough to generate good racket head speed. And of course you get great accuracy with the 18x20 pattern. Typically my kicker doesn't kick as well with 18x20 patterns, but I was getting plenty of spin to keep me satisfied.

I played a doubles match with it today and was really impressed overall. There's some magic in that frame at the net... it was just begging me to serve and volley (which I don't always do). It was also fantastic on returns. There is plenty of mass to push thru the ball against big servers, and I was equally comfortable stepping in and hitting a big deep ball or driving thru it on a backhand slice.

I have absolutely no complaints after 3 sessions with it. I've been pleasantly surprised by how much plow it has while still being very maneuverable.

And the best thing is absolutely no twinge in the elbow (which I've had for the last 3-4 years).
 

Dartagnan64

Legend
Just picked up one of these and had a light hit this morning. I'm thinking it might need just a bit of lead in the hoop. Where have people been adding lead? I usually like it at 9/3 or 10/2, but I'm wondering if 12 is the better location since it has such a round head shape?

And a bit of eye candy...
Added a little lead to the 12 O'clock position. Moves the sweetspot a little higher and gives a bit more plow.
 

graycrait

Hall of Fame
Can anyone tell me how the 93P 18x20 plays vs the Volkl Tour 10 or Wilson Rok 93 or even the 14x18 POG 90 4-stripe?
 
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