Observations on my daughter's first year playing girls varsity HS tennis

[eah123]

My girl has been playing tennis since age 9. She is 15 years old now, a sophomore (10th grade) in high school.
She takes her tennis seriously, although she's not played in any tournaments. It's most clinics and playing with her family.

9th grade was her first exposure to competition. She tried out for the varsity team but did not make it. On the Junior Varsity team, she was one of the best players but mostly played doubles. It was a good learning experience for her - she definitely felt the ups and downs of winning, losing, playing well, and playing lower than her ability.

This year (10th grade), she wanted to make the varsity team. I figured the best way to optimize her training over the summer would be to work on serve and volley. This would allow her to "win" try outs, and also train her to play good doubles. Pretty much every junior is taught a defensive baseliner style, and they do not know how to handle serve and volley tactics.

She succeeded in making the Varsity team. For context, she attends a private co-ed school that is usually the league champion and top 3 at the state level. The league matches are 3 singles and 2 doubles.
The tryouts consist of fast-4 single set matches. Last year's varsity players don't need to try out. She beat all of the other players trying out. 2 other players also made it to Varsity.

After making the varsity team, the coach decides on the singles line up based on fast-4 single set matches. He decides on the double line up based on doubles fast-4 matches with rotating partners.
Even though my daughter was undefeated, she was relegated to playing "exhibition". That means that her matches don't count toward the point total in the league matches. The coach doesn't move people around unless there are injuries or absences.

She felt pretty upset that she didn't make the doubles line up because her tryout results showed that she was better than the 2 players who were selected by the coach to play second doubles. Not only did she beat them in the Varsity tryouts, she also beat them while playing rotating partners matches. She even played against them with her exhibition partners (2 players that were on varsity last year, but are worse than her) during practice all season and usually won the practice matches. The second doubles team had a losing record and even lost 0,1 once.

My daughter believe that the reason the coach didn't put her in the doubles lineup was because she is less consistent hitting from behind the baseline. In watching all of the home matches this year, I saw that the doubles teams all play the same style - one up / one back for the entire point. Basically singles baseliner with a net player. When the players are at net, they don't move unless the ball is popped up, and otherwise they only volley when the ball is hit near or at them. The winning team is the team that has the most consistent baseliners.

My daughter is a better player because she moves in the triangle at net (alternating between challenging the back player, poaching, and covering middle), and serve/volleys chip/charges on returns. However, she plays poorly when she stays back after the serve or return of serve. She wins points on her serve, return of serve, volleys and overheads. She loses points from the baseline.

So looking back on this season, I regret the choice of focusing on serve and volley, even though I believe this made her a better player and a winning player. She is the dominant player on the court whenever she is at net. But she never got the opportunity to show that she could win in a 'real' match. Her coach and teammates are always telling her to stay back after serving and returning during practice because that seems to be what is expected at this level. In the coming year, we are planning to focus almost exclusively on playing from the baseline like everyone else.

 

[PKorda]

a lot of high school tennis coaches don't have much of a clue, not moving people around mid season doesn't make any sense and sounds un American. she's still just a sophomore so can focus more on baseline game now, if she can get both to a decent level that would likely give her an edge

 

[Happi]

Could she not compete for the singles lineup ?

 

[eah123]

Could she not compete for the singles lineup ?

Only 1 singles spot was open because of returning 2nd and 3rd singles players who were moved up. 3 returning varsity players were allowed to compete for the 3rd singles spot.

 

[Happi]

Only 1 singles spot was open because of returning 2nd and 3rd singles players who were moved up. 3 returning varsity players were allowed to compete for the 3rd singles spot.

Why dont they want the best players to play singles ? are there some kind of ranking system, perhaps she could play some tournaments to get ranking points.

 

[LOBALOT]

I am not clear on the OP. Decent tennis players/tournament kids know that high school tennis offers something they don't get with their tournament play. That is a team atmosphere and support from their team when they battle out there. No high school play is going to make or break any aspirations of their future pursuits if they have any in tennis. That comes with tournament play and results there.

The tennis coach is usually some gym or shop teacher or if the school is some elite academy some local pro well under paid to to coach the team. I wouldn't look for any major stroke / techniques taught. They are there usually to find athletes they can make doubles players for lower in their lineup and to assemble a sequential lineup by ability, keep order, match coaching (rah rah) and keep things organized.

You and your daughter should enjoy the experience and have fun with it.

 

[eah123]

Why dont they want the best players to play singles ? are there some kind of ranking system, perhaps she could play some tournaments to get ranking points.

I think this is just the expectation of HS sports. Our school does not recruit athletes and the sports teams are not run in a way that would prepare an athlete to get an athletic scholarship. Basically the coach needs a mechanism to choose a lineup that appears on the surface to be logical and fair.

To be clear, I’m not complaining. My reason for posting this is that I think it might help other parents understand how some HS teams are run. I learned all of this from speaking with my girl. Understanding the expectations of high school coaches could help you prepare your child in the best way possible to have a good experience.

 

[ChaelAZ]

There are a lot of factors in play here, so I am not sure anyone can really comment to help. You have presented one side as a parent, and not that it might not be exactly as you mentioned, but having coached HS tennis I know what parents see isn't always the full picture. Then again, as others already mentioned, many times coaches do no understand tennis and are more focused on fair play for all kids, especially in a none-rated HS program - that can be simply based on kids who are graduating seniors, that have dedicated their time throughout HS to the team, so they get their returning spots. Not saying that is right, but I have seen HS's run teams like that. Also as mentioned, unless it is a ranked HS, playing 1 or 5 spot isn't more than a talking point in terms of college possibilities or player development. The main focus is usually on team, having fun competing, and keeping kids active.

If your daughter is serious about tennis, as in trying to get a scholarship for college or such, get her in Juniors programs and tournaments ASAP for exposure.

Good luck.

 

[socallefty]

Ask the coach what improvement he needs to see in your daughter. Only the coach knows why she is not in the lineup and it may not have anything to do with her S/V style.

 

[LeastExhaustingPlayer]

"she attends a private co-ed school"

1. You did not donate enough,
2. The starters are seniors or
3. Both

 

[nyta2]

My reason for posting this is that I think it might help other parents understand how some HS teams are run. I learned all of this from speaking with my girl. Understanding the expectations of high school coaches could help you prepare your child in the best way possible to have a good experience.

my $0.02, having finished my first year coaching hs in ny...

...
This year (10th grade), she wanted to make the varsity team. I figured the best way to optimize her training over the summer would be to work on serve and volley. This would allow her to "win" try outs, and also train her to play good doubles. Pretty much every junior is taught a defensive baseliner style, and they do not know how to handle serve and volley tactics.

how were her transition volleys & overheads in the mid court...? imo the hardest part of s&v.
defensive baseliners just throw up moonballs, which are hard to handle as overheads & high volleys, unless you're already a utr6+
imo it takes longer to develop an good s&v'er.

She succeeded in making the Varsity team. For context, she attends a private co-ed school that is usually the league champion and top 3 at the state level. The league matches are 3 singles and 2 doubles.

gratz,... that's a pretty good team if they are finishing top 3 in the state
the 2022 nys public high school champs for example ranged from utr4 to utr8 (their top 3 being utr7+)

The tryouts consist of fast-4 single set matches.

i did similar. in general, it takes a long time to do challenge matches.

Last year's varsity players don't need to try out.

i can see that especially if they were on the team before, and/or they are seniors and this is their last year to play.

She beat all of the other players trying out. 2 other players also made it to Varsity.

After making the varsity team, the coach decides on the singles line up based on fast-4 single set matches.

was she good enough to play singles? did the coach allow new folks to challenge the singles spots?

He decides on the double line up based on doubles fast-4 matches with rotating partners.
Even though my daughter was undefeated,

interesting... could be the coach was attributing the success to the partner, vs your duaghter.
could also be the coach doesn't actually play tennis, and may not recognize the value of her playing well at net
personally i'd have counted game won, and ordered folks by the games won (presuming a round robin format where everyone plays and rotates with everyone)

she was relegated to playing "exhibition". That means that her matches don't count toward the point total in the league matches.
The coach doesn't move people around unless there are injuries or absences.

in the coaches defense, once the season starts it can be extremely hard to play challenges every week, especially given this season in ny where weather caused many cancellations... we hardly practiced once the season started.

She felt pretty upset that she didn't make the doubles line up because her tryout results showed that she was better than the 2 players who were selected by the coach to play second doubles.

were 2dubs seniors? presuming playing ability was "close" i can see favoring seniors & juniors over a sophomore... unless the sophomore was head & shoulders above everyone else.

Not only did she beat them in the Varsity tryouts, she also beat them while playing rotating partners matches. She even played against them with her exhibition partners (2 players that were on varsity last year, but are worse than her) during practice all season and usually won the practice matches. The second doubles team had a losing record and even lost 0,1 once.

that seems pretty obvious that she should have played 2d... can only guess that the coach was favoring juniors & especially seniors.
also can see a non-tennis playing coach favoring the right "style" (ie. moonball), not realizing how valuable having a good net player can be in dubs.

My daughter believe that the reason the coach didn't put her in the doubles lineup was because she is less consistent hitting from behind the baseline. In watching all of the home matches this year, I saw that the doubles teams all play the same style - one up / one back for the entire point. Basically singles baseliner with a net player. When the players are at net, they don't move unless the ball is popped up, and otherwise they only volley when the ball is hit near or at them. The winning team is the team that has the most consistent baseliners.

to be fair, common all the way up the ntrp4.0 (men's)... ~utr6

if she wasn't given the chance to actually challenge them, it might just be a "visual test" that the coach does (ie does her strokes look good) - which imo is what most non-playing tennis coaches do (unless utr is avail/obvious).
honestly, last year, when my daughter was trying out for the team for the first time after only play 6mos, i taught her to "look good", vs. play good... but i also knew that's how the tennis coach (not a tennis player), was judging folks
had the coach made all players play challenge matches for their spot on the team (like i did), not sure my daughter would have made it due to lack of match experience.
(despite 75% of team having frying pan serves, and blocky fh/bh (ie. no topspin) - except they've been playing that way for longer in "real" matches... and while my daughter had "proper" topspin fh/bh, spin serve with conti grip, etc... she didn't have the match experience)

My daughter is a better player because she moves in the triangle at net (alternating between challenging the back player, poaching, and covering middle), and serve/volleys chip/charges on returns. However, she plays poorly when she stays back after the serve or return of serve. She wins points on her serve, return of serve, volleys and overheads. She loses points from the baseline.

how does she do on her appoach shot? why not ignore the coach & just always come to net if her volley&overhead (especially in the mid court) are good.
guessing she was missing transition volleys & overheads in the midcourt when opposing baseliner inevitably moonballed her...

So looking back on this season, I regret the choice of focusing on serve and volley, even though I believe this made her a better player and a winning player. She is the dominant player on the court whenever she is at net. But she never got the opportunity to show that she could win in a 'real' match. Her coach and teammates are always telling her to stay back after serving and returning during practice because that seems to be what is expected at this level.

can only think that the opposing teams were moonballing/lobbing over them... so even if she's good, probably her partners not good at mid court volley&overhead
that's what i trained my daughter to do (she's ~utr2-3)
alternatively you could have recommended playing two back, where your daughter would always come up, and leave her partner at the baseline.

In the coming year, we are planning to focus almost exclusively on playing from the baseline like everyone else.

i think that's normal up to the the utr6 range mainly because of inability to handle volleys&overheads in the midcourt
that said, she probably only needs to develop a cc moonball tolerance of say 6 shots, and that's good enough, and add on the transition game (eg. recognizing short ball, approach, first volley, overhead)

 

[jimmy8]

My girl has been playing tennis since age 9. She is 15 years old now, a sophomore (10th grade) in high school.
She takes her tennis seriously, although she's not played in any tournaments. It's most clinics and playing with her family.

9th grade was her first exposure to competition. She tried out for the varsity team but did not make it. On the Junior Varsity team, she was one of the best players but mostly played doubles. It was a good learning experience for her - she definitely felt the ups and downs of winning, losing, playing well, and playing lower than her ability.

This year (10th grade), she wanted to make the varsity team. I figured the best way to optimize her training over the summer would be to work on serve and volley. This would allow her to "win" try outs, and also train her to play good doubles. Pretty much every junior is taught a defensive baseliner style, and they do not know how to handle serve and volley tactics.

She succeeded in making the Varsity team. For context, she attends a private co-ed school that is usually the league champion and top 3 at the state level. The league matches are 3 singles and 2 doubles.
The tryouts consist of fast-4 single set matches. Last year's varsity players don't need to try out. She beat all of the other players trying out. 2 other players also made it to Varsity.

After making the varsity team, the coach decides on the singles line up based on fast-4 single set matches. He decides on the double line up based on doubles fast-4 matches with rotating partners.
Even though my daughter was undefeated, she was relegated to playing "exhibition". That means that her matches don't count toward the point total in the league matches. The coach doesn't move people around unless there are injuries or absences.

She felt pretty upset that she didn't make the doubles line up because her tryout results showed that she was better than the 2 players who were selected by the coach to play second doubles. Not only did she beat them in the Varsity tryouts, she also beat them while playing rotating partners matches. She even played against them with her exhibition partners (2 players that were on varsity last year, but are worse than her) during practice all season and usually won the practice matches. The second doubles team had a losing record and even lost 0,1 once.

My daughter believe that the reason the coach didn't put her in the doubles lineup was because she is less consistent hitting from behind the baseline. In watching all of the home matches this year, I saw that the doubles teams all play the same style - one up / one back for the entire point. Basically singles baseliner with a net player. When the players are at net, they don't move unless the ball is popped up, and otherwise they only volley when the ball is hit near or at them. The winning team is the team that has the most consistent baseliners.

My daughter is a better player because she moves in the triangle at net (alternating between challenging the back player, poaching, and covering middle), and serve/volleys chip/charges on returns. However, she plays poorly when she stays back after the serve or return of serve. She wins points on her serve, return of serve, volleys and overheads. She loses points from the baseline.

So looking back on this season, I regret the choice of focusing on serve and volley, even though I believe this made her a better player and a winning player. She is the dominant player on the court whenever she is at net. But she never got the opportunity to show that she could win in a 'real' match. Her coach and teammates are always telling her to stay back after serving and returning during practice because that seems to be what is expected at this level. In the coming year, we are planning to focus almost exclusively on playing from the baseline like everyone else.

That's almost exactly how my high school tennis went. It's also similar to travlerajm's high school tennis experience.

I think coaches prefer playing older kids, even if they aren't as good, not sure why. Maybe because the older kids are going to graduate and not have a chance to play after graduation. Or maybe parents paid the coach to play their kids.

If i was a coach, I would play whoever is the best, whoever is most deserving, whoever is going to win. Maybe the coach gives prior year high school tennis experience a lot of weight. I don't know. I thought my experience was unfair and stupid.

 

[ey039524]

I think the coach doesn't understand doubles. I wouldn't change her game, except that she should put focus on returns, which is similar to playing at the baseline.

My son is a doubles player. He was the best doubles player on the team as a freshman, which sounds like your daughter. The difference was that his coach realized that he was good for 3 points (3 lines of dubs here) for most of the time. He and his partner only lost 2 league sets in the beginning of the season and avenged those losses to the same teams later in the season. He went on to win league w his team and partner for individuals, then went to CIF. Sophomore year, he partnered a different kid, bc his partner didn't practice during the off season. His new partner didn't practice enough, either. They lost in the league playoffs and didn't make CIF. This year, he transferred schools, has a new partner (that still doesn't practice as much as my son would like), but is still one of the better players in the league, and should win league and qualify for CIF. So similar upbringing, but different coach mentality.

Now that she'll be a junior next season, she should be in the lineup regularly, and she can show how good she is at dubs. Keep her moving at the net. It's rare to see high schoolers who know how to move in dubs. She should work on all aspects of her game, not just the baseline.

 

[Alcawrath]

I think this is just the expectation of HS sports. Our school does not recruit athletes and the sports teams are not run in a way that would prepare an athlete to get an athletic scholarship. Basically the coach needs a mechanism to choose a lineup that appears on the surface to be logical and fair.

To be clear, I’m not complaining. My reason for posting this is that I think it might help other parents understand how some HS teams are run. I learned all of this from speaking with my girl. Understanding the expectations of high school coaches could help you prepare your child in the best way possible to have a good experience.

HS boys head coach here. I'm surprised there are no in season challenge matches allowed. I would tell your daughter to ask the coach in front of other players to challenge up to take a varsity spot every chance she gets. I usually let my boys challenge each other for roster spots until a few weeks before season's end. When she's told no over and over at least everyone will recognize how unfair this setup is...

 

[eah123]

My daughter is a terror as a doubles returner. I taught her to stand near the service line and to slice it short angle with her forehand. It drops in the box and barely bounces. Almost always results in a winner!

 

[fuzz nation]

My girl has been playing tennis since age 9. She is 15 years old now, a sophomore (10th grade) in high school.
She takes her tennis seriously, although she's not played in any tournaments. It's most clinics and playing with her family.

9th grade was her first exposure to competition. She tried out for the varsity team but did not make it. On the Junior Varsity team, she was one of the best players but mostly played doubles. It was a good learning experience for her - she definitely felt the ups and downs of winning, losing, playing well, and playing lower than her ability.

This year (10th grade), she wanted to make the varsity team. I figured the best way to optimize her training over the summer would be to work on serve and volley. This would allow her to "win" try outs, and also train her to play good doubles. Pretty much every junior is taught a defensive baseliner style, and they do not know how to handle serve and volley tactics.

She succeeded in making the Varsity team. For context, she attends a private co-ed school that is usually the league champion and top 3 at the state level. The league matches are 3 singles and 2 doubles.
The tryouts consist of fast-4 single set matches. Last year's varsity players don't need to try out. She beat all of the other players trying out. 2 other players also made it to Varsity.

After making the varsity team, the coach decides on the singles line up based on fast-4 single set matches. He decides on the double line up based on doubles fast-4 matches with rotating partners.
Even though my daughter was undefeated, she was relegated to playing "exhibition". That means that her matches don't count toward the point total in the league matches. The coach doesn't move people around unless there are injuries or absences.

She felt pretty upset that she didn't make the doubles line up because her tryout results showed that she was better than the 2 players who were selected by the coach to play second doubles. Not only did she beat them in the Varsity tryouts, she also beat them while playing rotating partners matches. She even played against them with her exhibition partners (2 players that were on varsity last year, but are worse than her) during practice all season and usually won the practice matches. The second doubles team had a losing record and even lost 0,1 once.

My daughter believe that the reason the coach didn't put her in the doubles lineup was because she is less consistent hitting from behind the baseline. In watching all of the home matches this year, I saw that the doubles teams all play the same style - one up / one back for the entire point. Basically singles baseliner with a net player. When the players are at net, they don't move unless the ball is popped up, and otherwise they only volley when the ball is hit near or at them. The winning team is the team that has the most consistent baseliners.

My daughter is a better player because she moves in the triangle at net (alternating between challenging the back player, poaching, and covering middle), and serve/volleys chip/charges on returns. However, she plays poorly when she stays back after the serve or return of serve. She wins points on her serve, return of serve, volleys and overheads. She loses points from the baseline.

So looking back on this season, I regret the choice of focusing on serve and volley, even though I believe this made her a better player and a winning player. She is the dominant player on the court whenever she is at net. But she never got the opportunity to show that she could win in a 'real' match. Her coach and teammates are always telling her to stay back after serving and returning during practice because that seems to be what is expected at this level. In the coming year, we are planning to focus almost exclusively on playing from the baseline like everyone else.

I've been coaching high school tennis for twenty years and I can tell you that you've done your daughter a huge favor by developing her attacking game now. She will need it for either the singles or doubles matches she plays in her near future. If all she can do out there is hit her spots from the baseline, she's going to be doomed against anybody who can out-slug her and she'll only have about a 50/50 chance against opponents who are as steady as she is from the back court. Learning the skills to attack the net gives her a Plan B that will let her be more effective from more areas of the court.

The #1 girl on my team started tennis only a few years ago - she's a decent athlete and super-scrappy out there, but she didn't develop much of any skill set for rushing the net or volleying before I started coaching her last year. She just lost a match last week to a girl with about the same baseline strength, but after that opponent lost the first set, she started attacking the net and beat my girl in three sets. She won at the net.

Several years ago, a freshman girl from our rivals in the town next door showed up with a really good all-court game and shredded it - one individual match loss in four years in our high school league. She also won at the net... a lot!! While I'm at it, I guess I'll point out that Ash Barty dominated the WTA with her all-court game. She probably hung it up because she was bored with schooling all those baseline robots.

No idea how your daughter's coach operates in terms of determining a ladder, but it could be one of several reasons that she didn't compete among the top seven. Sometimes private schools can be tough - some folks who are paying for their kids to attend there can make demands on the coaches. I've been lucky to have never had to deal with any of that political crap, perhaps in part because I coach at a bigger public school where our Athletic Director is very out front about parents not interfering with coaches.

It could easily be the case that unless an underclassman is clearly playing at a level above veteran players on the ladder, they more or less wait there turn. Who knows? It's good news that your girl was brought into the varsity circle this season - sounds to me like she's going to have a spot playing singles or maybe doubles next year. If her strokes need to be more strong and steady, definitely address that so that she can play a more solid game and also more easily pass the "eyeball test" when her coach is watching her. If she doesn't have a slice backhand, that would be another great addition for her toolbox going forward.

Aside from the nuts 'n bolts work your daughter does through the off season developing one shot or another, she's got to play matches. That will get her more familiar with managing herself in competitive settings against unfamiliar opponents - a skill that needs to be practiced like anything else. Carve out a little time for her to go and play in a couple of tournaments. Even if she's a little over her head, she can learn a lot from those outings as long as she goes in with the right outlook. And she might just beat one or two baseline robots if she jumps on the net.