Official medical time-out no longer allowed

C

christos_liaskos

Professional
Dont know if this new rule is for the WTA as well as the ATP but they have been talking about it on the coverage for Doha. It basically sounds like that if you want any medical treatment then it has to be taken in the time during the change over yet the old 3 minute medical time out can no longer be taken. The reasoning behind it is of course to speed up the game and also to stop players using to break up their opponent rhythm.

While they might sound like good reasons I dont really see them as being a problem, especially not on the ATP tour. I'm sure some fingers will pointed at certain players who have used this rule more for sportsmanship rather than actually needing medical attention but I would say 90% of the time it's genuine. The WTA however may be another matter. Especially on the WTA tour it seems to me that something has to be done about the toilet break rule, that is constantly abused!

Also, I thought the reason the medical time out rule was brought in in the first place was after the Japanese player, Shuzo Matsuoka seized up with full body cramps at the USO in the 90's and no one could do anything to help him, he just layed there. So by getting rid of the rule are we not going back to where this situation is allowed to happen again? Or have I not heard all the exact changes that have been made?

So do you guys think it's a good or bad thing that they have changed the rule?
 
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it is bad i like the old ways , if a player is really injured he should get a small period of time to heal up , that is just my own peronal thought
 
I think this is in general a change for the better. Hopefully it will rid us from a lot of gamesmanship/comedia del'arte.
Of course this new rule should be applied with sensibility - if a player is indeed seriously injured, that player should be offered medical attendance, but after retiring from the match immediately.
And just for the record - cramping is NOT an injury, it is the result of bad preparation. If you can't move anymore due to cramping, you should retire from the match, it's as easy as that.
 
christos_liaskos said:
Dont know if this new rule is for the WTA as well as the ATP but they have been talking about it on the coverage for Doha. It basically sounds like that if you want any medical treatment then it has to be taken in the time during the change over yet the old 3 minute medical time out can no longer be taken. The reasoning behind it is of course to speed up the game and also to stop players using to break up their opponent rhythm.
Click to expand...
so now nadal won't be allowed to do his "banana trick" (in the middle of a game) anymore ?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLVy77i7hxw

if so... that's great. :)
 
Telepatic said:
Yeah but how about if hes in situation to serve for the match? He should be given short time to regroup in that case imo.
Click to expand...

no he shouldn't be allowed extra time. if you aren't fit to play, retire.

if the "injury" isn't serious, then he should be able to serve out.
if the "injury" is serious enough, that he can't serve out, the chances of him withdrawing after the win is high (in that case, i think it's better that the player just lose)
 
As far as medical timeouts being only on changeovers, that is the case unless it is an acute medical condition requiring immediate care. If the player rolls his ankle and is down on the court, he can still take a medical time out right there. If it is something like a blister, then the umpire will ask him to wait until the changeover. If the player insists on seeing the trainer, the chair umpire will call the trainer. When the trainer comes to court, if he decides it is an acute medical condition, he will treat then. If he decides that it is not acute, then he will instruct the player to play until the changeover where he can get the medical timeout. The medical timeout is still three minutes of treatment after reasonable time for evaluation.
 
Richie Rich said:
if they want to speed up the game just enforce the time allowed between points.
Click to expand...

Yep. Just put a clock up that counts down from 25 seconds after every point. If you don't get the serve off in time, you lose one point. Players would get the hang of it quickly after losing a point or two.
 
christos_liaskos said:
Dont know if this new rule is for the WTA as well as the ATP but they have been talking about it on the coverage for Doha. It basically sounds like that if you want any medical treatment then it has to be taken in the time during the change over yet the old 3 minute medical time out can no longer be taken. The reasoning behind it is of course to speed up the game and also to stop players using to break up their opponent rhythm.

While they might sound like good reasons I dont really see them as being a problem, especially not on the ATP tour. I'm sure some fingers will pointed at certain players who have used this rule more for sportsmanship rather than actually needing medical attention but I would say 90% of the time it's genuine. The WTA however may be another matter. Especially on the WTA tour it seems to me that something has to be done about the toilet break rule, that is constantly abused!

Also, I thought the reason the medical time out rule was brought in in the first place was after the Japanese player, Shuzo Matsuoka seized up with full body cramps at the USO in the 90's and no one could do anything to help him, he just layed there. So by getting rid of the rule are we not going back to where this situation is allowed to happen again? Or have I not heard all the exact changes that have been made?

So do you guys think it's a good or bad thing that they have changed the rule?
Click to expand...

Please show the link ot the new rule before there is any further discussion.

The rule as I heard the umpire tell the players about related to cramps.
 
pound cat said:
Please show the link ot the new rule before there is any further discussion.

The rule as I heard the umpire tell the players about related to cramps.
Click to expand...

As I said above, and in the other thread that I started and referenced above, you are correct that it is regarding cramping and not other medical timeouts. I will cut and paste it tomorrow as it is worded.
 
woodrow1029 said:
As I said above, and in the other thread that I started and referenced above, you are correct that it is regarding cramping and not other medical timeouts. I will cut and paste it tomorrow as it is worded.
Click to expand...

Yeah but will they actually enforce it or will it be another rule that Nadal and Djokovic get special privileges on? I mean the umpires are too chicken to give Nadal a point penalty for time violations, I think they'd be far too chicken to deny Nadal a medical time out.
 
ninman said:
Yeah but will they actually enforce it or will it be another rule that Nadal and Djokovic get special privileges on? I mean the umpires are too chicken to give Nadal a point penalty for time violations, I think they'd be far too chicken to deny Nadal a medical time out.
Click to expand...

You're blowing it out of proportion. I timed Nadal during his match against Bolelli and he'd often go to 20 seconds... but rarely exceeded it.

It just seems worse when he's playing someone who takes 6-10 seconds.
 
Bud said:
You're blowing it out of proportion. I timed Nadal during his match against Bolelli and he'd often go to 20 seconds... but rarely exceeded it.

It just seems worse when he's playing someone who takes 6-10 seconds.
Click to expand...

Yes but in the past he's gone consistently over the time limit and the umpires never once gave him a point penalty even though he should have racked up dozens and dozens by now. Same for Djokovic.
 
I'm slightly confused. The way it came across to me when the commentators were talking about it (i dont have a link pound cat because it was just on the commentary that i heard it)was that 3 minute medical time outs no longer exist, no matter what the problem is.

Woodrow, are you saying that i should have titled this thread 'official medical time-out no longer allowed for cramping'? Like i said, that really wasn't the impression i got at all
 
christos_liaskos said:
I'm slightly confused. The way it came across to me when the commentators were talking about it (i dont have a link pound cat because it was just on the commentary that i heard it)was that 3 minute medical time outs no longer exist, no matter what the problem is.
Click to expand...

That would be, imho, a typical case of commentators over-dramatizing things, if they have any knowledge at all that is. They spout nonsense all the time, this doesn't really surprise me.
 
Here's the rule. I think I am going to have to spread it over a few posts because it's a bit long:


a Medical Condition

A medical condition is a medical illness or a musculoskeletal injury that

warrants medical evaluation and/or medical treatment by the
Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer (also known as the Primary Health Care​
​
​

Provider) during the warm-up or the match.​


•
Treatable Medical Conditions​



o Acute medical condition: the sudden development of a medical illness​

or musculoskeletal injury during the warm-up or the match that

requires immediate medical attention.​



o Non-acute medical condition: a medical illness or musculoskeletal
injury that develops or is aggravated during the warm-up or the match
and requires medical attention at the changeover or set break.• ​



Non-Treatable Medical Conditions​

o Any medical condition that cannot be treated appropriately, or that will​

not be improved by available medical treatment within the time

allowed.​



o Any medical condition (inclusive of symptoms) that has not developed
or has not been aggravated during the warm-up or the match.

o General player fatigue.​

o Any medical condition requiring injections, intravenous infusions or
oxygen, except for diabetes, for which prior medical certification has

been obtained, and for which subcutaneous injections of insulin may
be administered.​



b. Medical Evaluation


During the warm-up or the match, the player may request through the Chair Umpire for the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer to evaluate him/her during the next change over or set break. Only in the case that a player develops an acute medical condition that necessitates an immediate stop in play may the player request through the Chair Umpire for the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer to evaluate him/her immediately.​

The purpose of the medical evaluation is to determine if the player has
developed a treatable medical condition and, if so, to determine when medical treatment is warranted. Such evaluation should be performed within a reasonable length of time, balancing player safety on the one hand, and continuous play on the other. At the discretion of the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer, such evaluation may be performed in conjunction with the Tournament Doctor, and may be performed off-court. * If the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer determines that the player has a nontreatable medical condition, then the player will be advised that no medical treatment will be allowed.​

​
​
​
​
​
​
​
​
​
​

​
 
c. Medical Time-Out

A Medical Time-Out is allowed by the ITF Supervisor/Referee or Chair
Umpire when the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer has evaluated the player and has determined that additional time for medical treatment is required.​
​
​



The Medical Time-Out takes place during a change over or set break, unless the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer determines that the player has developed an acute medical condition that requires immediate medical treatment. The Medical Time-Out begins when the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer is ready to start treatment. At the discretion of the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer, treatment during a Medical Time-Out may take place off-court, and may proceed in conjunction with the Tournament Doctor. * The Medical Time-Out is limited to three (3) minutes of treatment. However, at professional events with prize money of $25,000 or less, the ITF Supervisor/Referee may extend the time allowed for treatment if necessary. A player is allowed one (1) Medical Time-Out for each distinct treatable medical condition. All clinical manifestations of heat illness shall be considered as one (1) treatable medical condition. All treatable musculoskeletal injuries that manifest as part of a kinetic chain continuum shall be considered as one (1) treatable medical condition.​



Muscle Cramping: ​


​
​
A player may receive treatment for muscle cramping only during the time allotted for change of ends and/or set breaks. Players may not receive a Medical Time-Out for muscle cramping.​

In cases where there is doubt about whether the player suffers from an acute medical condition, non-acute medical condition inclusive of muscle cramping, or non-treatable medical condition, the decision of the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer, in conjunction with the Tournament Doctor, if appropriate, is final. If the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer believes that the player has heat illness, and if muscle cramping is one of the manifestations of heat illness, then the muscle cramping may only be treated as part of the recommended treatment by the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer for the heat illness condition.

Note:​
A player who has stopped play by claiming an acute medical condition, but is
determined by the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer and/or Tournament Doctor
to have muscle cramping, shall be ordered by the Chair Umpire to resume
play immediately. If the player cannot continue playing due to severe muscle cramping, as
determined by the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer and/or Tournament Doctor,
he/she may forfeit the point(s)/game(s) needed to get to a change of end or
set-break in order to receive immediate evaluation, and treatment if time
allows. There may be a total of two (2) additional change of ends treatments
for muscle cramping in a match, not necessarily consecutive.
If it is determined by the Chair Umpire or ITF Supervisor/Referee that
gamesmanship was involved, then a Code Violation for Unsportsmanlike​
Conduct could be issued.
​
​
​


 
d.
Medical Treatment

A player may receive on-court medical treatment and/or supplies from the
Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer and/or Tournament Doctor during any
changeover or set break. As a guideline, such medical treatment should be
limited to two (2) changeovers/set breaks for each treatable medical
condition, before or after a Medical Time-Out, and need not be consecutive. Players may not receive medical treatment for non-treatable medical conditions.​

e. ​

​

Penalty
After completion of a Medical Time-Out or medical treatment, any delay in
resumption of play shall be penalized by Code Violations for Delay of Game.
Any player abuse of this Medical Rule will be subject to penalty in accordance with the Unsportsmanlike Conduct section of the Code of Conduct. ​

​
​
f. Bleeding
If a player is bleeding, the Chair Umpire must stop play as soon as possible, and the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer must be called to the court by the Chair Umpire for evaluation and treatment. The Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer, in conjunction with the Tournament Doctor if appropriate, will evaluate the source of the bleeding, and will request a Medical Time-Out for treatment if necessary.
If requested by the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer and/or Tournament
Doctor, the ITF Supervisor/Referee or Chair Umpire may allow up to a total
of five (5) minutes to assure control of the bleeding.
If blood has spilled onto the court or its immediate vicinity, play must not​

resume until the blood spill has been cleaned appropriately.

g​

​

. Vomiting
If a player is vomiting, the Chair Umpire must stop play if vomiting has spilled onto the court, or if the player requests medical evaluation. If the player requests medical evaluation, then the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer must determine if the player has a treatable medical condition, and if so, whether the medical condition is acute or non-acute.
If vomiting has spilled onto the court, play must not resume until the vomit spill has been cleaned appropriately.​
​
​
​
​

​
 
h.
​
​
Physical Incapacity​

During a match, if there is an emergency medical condition and the player involved is unable to make a request for a Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer, the Chair Umpire shall immediately call for the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer and Tournament Doctor to assist the player. Either before or during a match, if a player is considered unable physically to compete, the Physiotherapist/Athletic Trainer and/or Tournament Doctor should inform the ITF Supervisor/Referee and recommend that the player is ruled unable to compete in the match to be played, or retired from the match in progress.

The ITF Supervisor/Referee shall use great discretion before taking this​
​
​

action and should base the decision on the best interests of professional

tennis, as well as taking all medical advice and any other information into
consideration.​

The player may subsequently compete in another event at the same
tournament if the Tournament Doctor determines that the player’s condition has improved to the extent that the player may safely physically perform at an appropriate level of play, whether the same day or on a later day.​

* It is recognized that national laws or governmental or other binding
regulations imposed upon the event by authorities outside its control may
require more compulsory participation by the Tournament Doctor in all​
​
​
​
​

decisions regarding diagnosis and treatment.​
 
If a player is truly injured and needs the time out, I have no problem with it, but he should be forced to suffer a penalty for disrupting the flow of play. Let's say... automatically losing your next service game, so that you are down a break. The opponent should not be punished by having to wait for you if you are injured. Also, 95% of the time the "injured" player is already losing the match, so he shouldn't be able to disrupt the flow of the game to "hope" that the opponent will lose his timing.
 
coloskier said:
If a player is truly injured and needs the time out, I have no problem with it, but he should be forced to suffer a penalty for disrupting the flow of play. Let's say... automatically losing your next service game, so that you are down a break. The opponent should not be punished by having to wait for you if you are injured. Also, 95% of the time the "injured" player is already losing the match, so he shouldn't be able to disrupt the flow of the game to "hope" that the opponent will lose his timing.
Click to expand...

So a player cannot take a time out to "sort out" the situation he/she is in and what kind of strategies will be needed to help him/her get back into the game? (I hope this makes sense)
 
Just a note on this: Wayne Odesnik took a medical timeout today against Radek Stepanek. It appeared to be a back muscle that was causing his hamstring to seize.

Umpire was Lars Graf, it happened at 0-3 in the second set.
 
crazylevity said:
Just a note on this: Wayne Odesnik took a medical timeout today against Radek Stepanek. It appeared to be a back muscle that was causing his hamstring to seize.

Umpire was Lars Graf, it happened at 0-3 in the second set.
Click to expand...
Which would be a treatable medical condition, thus the MTO was allowed.
 
Might as well add preexisting injury to the rule change. Look at cry baby hewy with physio jumping on his back..he had that soreness prior to the match.
 
equinox said:
Might as well add preexisting injury to the rule change. Look at cry baby hewy with physio jumping on his back..he had that soreness prior to the match.
Click to expand...

It's in there..

Any medical condition (inclusive of symptoms) that has not developed
or has not been aggravated during the warm-up or the match.

But, if it's aggravated or re-injured during the match, it then becomes treatable.
 
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