Optimal Training Schedule for Recreational Player

[CT-Topspin]

Hey everyone, I've been playing tennis seriously for the last year and half (average 3-4 days/week, 2 to 3 hours a pop) and right now the way I have been "improving" has been to force as much tennis into my schedule (balance against full time career, family, social life) which amounts to about 8-10 hours of play a week in the winter, 10-15 hours a week in the summer. I take an hour private lesson a week to set the framework for what I want to work on in the remaining hours and spend the rest of that time in match play and clinics (winter).

I tend to go overboard with this schedule in the summer and will suffer from burnout every couple of weeks (legs dead, lethargy, mild depression, etc.) And am concerned because I have also been thinking about incorporating a lifting routine into this schedule to develop appropriate functional strength and am lost on how to organize everything.

Has anyone trying to improve seriously at the recreational level cracked the code and figured out a system that works for them?

Sorry if this is a commonly asked question

 

[Knox]

Practice less frequently but more deliberately.

60mins of deliberate practice>3hrs mindless practice.

 

[FiReFTW]

U play too much, 3 hours per session is way too much.
Based on studies and evidence, humans rapidly start going downhill when it comes to learning and practicing new skills after about 1 hour of practicing a specific thing

So 1 hour is good enough, but you can do 1.5 hours aswell, but quality practice and deliberate focused practice.

I dont know what ur current technique is amd if you need alot of improvements.

I would suggest:

3h practice per week spread along 3 days.
2-4h hitting sessions with hitting partner to grove strokes and also practice all shota like overheads etc also some point play
1 match per week

 

[CT-Topspin]

Okay these are helpful starting points. I think I satisfy the criteria of deliberate practice sessions by my weekly hour lesson, but my ratio of match play to practice might be off. In those weekly hour counts it's about 1 hour of lessons to 9-10 hours of match play, and those are spread across 3 or 4 sessions during the week.

You are saying I should reduce matches to once a week? I play on a couple of teams and do a club singles league so at the very least I'm committed to two or three matches a week. Is there any way to use these as developmental tools? I have intent to apply what I've been learning in my lessons to match play (right now it's things like keep the feet moving, hit loose on my strokes and follow through, hit with depth, attack short balls, eye on the ball, line up the feet for proper overhead smash, etc.)

Also keep in mind I'm in pretty good shape, am eating healthy and young so I am willing to push myself in terms of training. I just tend to spill over as I've mentioned before.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Practice less frequently but more deliberately.

60mins of deliberate practice>3hrs mindless practice.

amen.
i pay $100 for a weekly 2h clinic, specifically because they force you to hit shots i almost never practice, even with my most cooperative hitting partners.
i can definitely hit more balls per hour, just hitting with a like minded coop partner (say 600/hr)
but let's say i only hit 400 balls in the clinic... 2/3 of those balls will be shots i never practice deliberately.

 

[CT-Topspin]

amen.
i pay $100 for a weekly 2h clinic, specifically because they force you to hit shots i almost never practice, even with my most cooperative hitting partners.
i can definitely hit more balls per hour, just hitting with a like minded coop partner (say 600/hr)
but let's say i only hit 400 balls in the clinic... 2/3 of those balls will be shots i never practice deliberately.

That's a steep price for tennis. It isn't cheap around here but NY prices seem to hit the higher end.

I like where this is going, though because I have eschewed clinics this summer (usually hit in the winter) in favor of match play. Should I start adding those back into my regimen?

 

[Deleted member 23235]

That's a steep price for tennis. It isn't cheap around here but NY prices seem to hit the higher end.

I like where this is going, though because I have eschewed clinics this summer (usually hit in the winter) in favor of match play. Should I start adding those back into my regimen?

yeah, you're right it is steep.. but it's hella convenient for me.
basically have to pay for "prime" court hours + big club name + pros need to make a profit...
there's a similar clinic for only $35 for 90m, in trumbull... far better bargain... but that's only on fridays at noon which is doable for me, but obviously very inconvenient (i'm guessing the pro worked out a deal with the club for cheap/free court time, where the pro maximizes profit)

 

[FiReFTW]

Okay these are helpful starting points. I think I satisfy the criteria of deliberate practice sessions by my weekly hour lesson, but my ratio of match play to practice might be off. In those weekly hour counts it's about 1 hour of lessons to 9-10 hours of match play, and those are spread across 3 or 4 sessions during the week.

You are saying I should reduce matches to once a week? I play on a couple of teams and do a club singles league so at the very least I'm committed to two or three matches a week. Is there any way to use these as developmental tools? I have intent to apply what I've been learning in my lessons to match play (right now it's things like keep the feet moving, hit loose on my strokes and follow through, hit with depth, attack short balls, eye on the ball, line up the feet for proper overhead smash, etc.)

Also keep in mind I'm in pretty good shape, am eating healthy and young so I am willing to push myself in terms of training. I just tend to spill over as I've mentioned before.

Thats why I said it depends on your technique, without seeing you play its hard to say, also without knowing what your goal is.

If you need alot of technical improvements in most of your shots in alot of situations, then you should limit match play and focus alot on practice, drilling, coaching.. because if you play 90% matches you will never fix your strokes, because you will revert to what you are used to in matches, no matter if you practice the right way in those 10%.

 

[CT-Topspin]

Thats why I said it depends on your technique, without seeing you play its hard to say, also without knowing what your goal is.

If you need alot of technical improvements in most of your shots in alot of situations, then you should limit match play and focus alot on practice, drilling, coaching.. because if you play 90% matches you will never fix your strokes, because you will revert to what you are used to in matches, no matter if you practice the right way in those 10%.

Gauging by the feedback of the coaches I've worked with my strokes are fine, the issue has been the consistent application of that good form via active footwork and remaining loose.

At some point I'll invest in a camera to start posting practice videos so I can show everyone where I'm at now.

 

[ChaelAZ]

Has anyone trying to improve seriously at the recreational level cracked the code and figured out a system that works for them?

For me I started very similar to to you and found I needed to tweak things based on needs. So for me, I found I was playing too many matches, and even my "practice" was matches, with very little focus on improving strokes, learning to setup plays and situational options, etc. I ended up cutting to a 2 actually matches a week, and went to finding people who wanted to run drills and do actual practice. I also added a single day on the ball machine to work on mechanics and make technical tweaks or try stuff. I went to incorporating HIT and HIIT strength and conditioning workouts per week in as well.

That worked to get me to playing 4.0 and being a 50/50'ish lower to mid level player. I had goals to improve, but injuries and changes in the above schedule have kept me about the same the last few years.

 

[CT-Topspin]

My ultimate goal is to reach whatever my ceiling is. I've had someone say that I could hit 4.5 when it's all said and done given what they have witnessed over the past year and a half.

Personally, I'd like to stretch that goal and say when it's all said and done I'd be happy as a 5.0 or 5.5 and to contest the #1 open ranking in New England. I don't know if that's realistic or achievable but given this framework how does the conversation change?

 

[FiReFTW]

Gauging by the feedback of the coaches I've worked with my strokes are fine, the issue has been the consistent application of that good form via active footwork and remaining loose.

At some point I'll invest in a camera to start posting practice videos so I can show everyone where I'm at now.

If they said strokes are fine then they are probably good enough, but did you tell them your goal aswell? They might think its good enough for x level but maybe not good enough for the level you want to reach. What is your goal?

In any case if your strokes are fine then good, but considering you say you need alot of work on application via active footwork and remaining loose you still need quite alot of practice, but considering how long uve been playing thats normal.

But this is all normal, ive been really going at it lately aswell and practicing with alot of focus, and I notice the same two things which are the biggest contributors to my strokes breaking down.

When my footwork is good and im moving lightly, split stepping, positioning well its great, but when I start getting lazy for many reasons and my footwork becomes lazy then my stroke level falls significantly.

Same with staying loose, if I manage to stay loose I have a ton of control, and I can effortlestly hit shots that have alot of spin and pace, but sometimes I want too much and that fluid loose stroke breaks down and becomes more jerky and tight and then the stroke level again falls significanly.

I would still advise you to focus alot of your time on practice and drilling aswell as sparing with friends.

Bare in mind when you spar you also play some points, and also practice some points with serve, so you still play points quite a bit in your practice, and then have a real match once per week and analyze it after and think where you failed and what you need to work on this next week.

 

[FiReFTW]

My ultimate goal is to reach whatever my ceiling is. I've had someone say that I could hit 4.5 when it's all said and done given what they have witnessed over the past year and a half.

Personally, I'd like to stretch that goal and say when it's all said and done I'd be happy as a 5.0 or 5.5 and to contest the #1 open ranking in New England. I don't know if that's realistic or achievable but given this framework how does the conversation change?

Thats a big goal, but certainy achievable if you have desire, passion and love for tennis and are willing to put in hard work and focused training to reach this goal, not only on the tennis court but also outside of it and also your diet etc..

In before someone comes and says its impossible to reach 5.0 as an adult and its not even possible to reach 4.5 unless starting as a 3 years old.

 

[CT-Topspin]

Thats a big goal, but certainy achievable if you have desire, passion and love for tennis and are willing to put in hard work and focused training to reach this goal, not only on the tennis court but also outside of it and also your diet etc..

In before someone comes and says its impossible to reach 5.0 as an adult and its not even possible to reach 4.5 unless starting as a 3 years old.

I absolutely am willing to do what it takes and realize that I am playing catch up to the people who have been playing since they were 3. I don't know if anybody on this board has been working to that or even achieved that in my shoes (started at 23, made it o 5.0)

One of the pros I hit with achieved this and had a very similar background to me, but this was 30 years ago so I'm sure the competition is much stiffer now.

I am confident I have the physical attributes and athleticism to achieve this. I don't know how to explain this other than I FEEL that I have it within me to compete at a very high level. I absolutely have the quickness to achieve good footwork and coverage skills, and have pretty powerful legs that I can generate a lot of force from in my groundstrokes and serve. I have also been developing the technical aspects of the game very rapidly and if the trend continues well. . . I think my goal is achievable. It's not guaranteed, but achievable.

The question then again becomes, what is the optimal regimen just short of training full time?

 

[FiReFTW]

I absolutely am willing to do what it takes and realize that I am playing catch up to the people who have been playing since they were 3. I don't know if anybody on this board has been working to that or even achieved that in my shoes (started at 23, made it o 5.0)

One of the pros I hit with achieved this and had a very similar background to me, but this was 30 years ago so I'm sure the competition is much stiffer now.

I am confident I have the physical attributes and athleticism to achieve this. I don't know how to explain this other than I FEEL that I have it within me to compete at a very high level. I absolutely have the quickness to achieve good footwork and coverage skills, and have pretty powerful legs that I can generate a lot of force from in my groundstrokes and serve. I have also been developing the technical aspects of the game very rapidly and if the trend continues well. . . I think my goal is achievable. It's not guaranteed, but achievable.

The question then again becomes, what is the optimal regimen just short of training full time?

Im in my 20s aswell, started playing tennis more seriously 1.5 years ago like you, before I played maybe 5 or 6 times with friends just for fun, with no clue about technique or anything.

Then I had a few lessons and also started watching a ton of youtube videos and practicing with a buddy and developing my game.

Only few months ago now have I really seriously started to work hard on fitness and also practice and everything.

I have a pretty ok schedule now, but its not optimal.

My schedule:

3x per week 1 hour practice with a good coach
1x per week 1 hour point play with some young players at the club
2x per week 1 hour of practice alone, serving and some other aspects, drop feeds etc working on specific things, short ball putaways, overheads..
1x per 2 weeks some match with friend (on average, unreliable ppl u know..)

Its a fine schedule and has been working well, alot of improvements, however I wished I had a serious person or two serious persons for some sparing where you just go out for 1.5 hours or so and hit the ball and then practice some volleys, overheads warm up a bit and then some point play

Ideally 2x per week of 1.5 hours of that would then be the perfect schedule for me... but its hard to find someone who is serious about this, so this is the issue im having currently alot, and trying to somehow find a solution

But if I would find a solution then it would be

3h per week of coaching and focused practice
1h point play with club players
2h alone practice, serve etc...
3h sparring, hitting ball, warming up volleys, overheads, some point play
A match per week or per 2 weeks

Its a great schedule, just need to find some sparring ppl, its harder than I thought

 

[CT-Topspin]

Im in my 20s aswell, started playing tennis more seriously 1.5 years ago like you, before I played maybe 5 or 6 times with friends just for fun, with no clue about technique or anything.

Then I had a few lessons and also started watching a ton of youtube videos and practicing with a buddy and developing my game.

Only few months ago now have I really seriously started to work hard on fitness and also practice and everything.

I have a pretty ok schedule now, but its not optimal.

My schedule:

3x per week 1 hour practice with a good coach
1x per week 1 hour point play with some young players at the club
2x per week 1 hour of practice alone, serving and some other aspects, drop feeds etc working on specific things, short ball putaways, overheads..
1x per 2 weeks some match with friend (on average, unreliable ppl u know..)

Its a fine schedule and has been working well, alot of improvements, however I wished I had a serious person or two serious persons for some sparing where you just go out for 1.5 hours or so and hit the ball and then practice some volleys, overheads warm up a bit and then some point play

Ideally 2x per week of 1.5 hours of that would then be the perfect schedule for me... but its hard to find someone who is serious about this, so this is the issue im having currently alot, and trying to somehow find a solution

But if I would find a solution then it would be

3h per week of coaching and focused practice
1h point play with club players
2h alone practice, serve etc...
3h sparring, hitting ball, warming up volleys, overheads, some point play
A match per week or per 2 weeks

Its a great schedule, just need to find some sparring ppl, its harder than I thought

Have you asked the club you play at if there are any players with that same interest? I've found they're pretty amenable to putting you into contact with people that have the same goals as you.

 

[FiReFTW]

Have you asked the club you play at if there are any players with that same interest? I've found they're pretty amenable to putting you into contact with people that have the same goals as you.

There are alot of beginners and low level players and then there are real competitors who play official tournaments and potential future tour players, seems like im in a place at the moment where theres not much similar level around me, at least not here at this club it seems, need to figure something else out hopefully haha.

 

[J011yroger]

In the summer I play 2-3 practice matches per week and 2-4 real matches per week. Call it 10-12 hours of match play per week. Two years ago I played 29 matches in June in addition to my training. Was totally burnt out mentally and physically, scaled it back last year and more again this year, 4-5 matches per week is about perfect 6-7+ is too much if I do it more than two weeks in a row.

I hit with an equal level partner 2-3 times per week for an hour to an hour and a half, we warm up then play groundstroke games, sometimes the last 15 minutes or so we serve and play out the points. Call that 3-5 hours of hitting per week.

I practice on my own with a cart, serving, drop feeds, ball machine etc. 2-6 hours per week. So call that 3 hours of practice.

I train 1 hour per week with an ATP player hitting, working on patterns, and playing points.

And finally a 1 hour coaching session with an ATP coach once per week.

I don't do much off court work in summer because I want to maximize my court time when it's free, maybe some footwork drills, jumping rope, or shadow swings with the weight.

So 15-25 hours on court per week.

If I need to rest, I take some, I know how to prepare for big matches and when I don't have anything important I know I can push myself.

My winter schedule is drastically different.

J

 

[CT-Topspin]

In the summer I play 2-3 practice matches per week and 2-4 real matches per week. Call it 10-12 hours of match play per week. Two years ago I played 29 matches in June in addition to my training. Was totally burnt out mentally and physically, scaled it back last year and more again this year, 4-5 matches per week is about perfect 6-7+ is too much if I do it more than two weeks in a row.

I hit with an equal level partner 2-3 times per week for an hour to an hour and a half, we warm up then play groundstroke games, sometimes the last 15 minutes or so we serve and play out the points. Call that 3-5 hours of hitting per week.

I practice on my own with a cart, serving, drop feeds, ball machine etc. 2-6 hours per week. So call that 3 hours of practice.

I train 1 hour per week with an ATP player hitting, working on patterns, and playing points.

And finally a 1 hour coaching session with an ATP coach once per week.

I don't do much off court work in summer because I want to maximize my court time when it's free, maybe some footwork drills, jumping rope, or shadow swings with the weight.

So 15-25 hours on court per week.

If I need to rest, I take some, I know how to prepare for big matches and when I don't have anything important I know I can push myself.

My winter schedule is drastically different.

J

This is helpful! Some questions regarding this post. . .

1.) Can you remember what your routine was like when you were at the 3.5 level? I believe you mentioned you are about a 4.5 so has much changed in your routine or has the court time, lessons, and hitting remained consistent?

2.) Right now I've got a condensed match schedule because of a few team obligations I have taken on. This should peter out as the summer progresses and will open up an opportunity to involve "hitting" sessions. How critical would you say these are as opposed to just match play?

3.) Do you include any additional cardio or fitness into your summer regimen or do you acquire that on court? I was thinking about including early morning runs/track workouts into the mix.

4.) What are YOUR goals? Are you looking to achieve 5.0 or above?

Thank you again

 

[ptuanminh]

In the summer I play 2-3 practice matches per week and 2-4 real matches per week. Call it 10-12 hours of match play per week. Two years ago I played 29 matches in June in addition to my training. Was totally burnt out mentally and physically, scaled it back last year and more again this year, 4-5 matches per week is about perfect 6-7+ is too much if I do it more than two weeks in a row.

J

Your schedule is insane. If i do half of this in a week, i will be happy.

 

[FiReFTW]

In the summer I play 2-3 practice matches per week and 2-4 real matches per week. Call it 10-12 hours of match play per week. Two years ago I played 29 matches in June in addition to my training. Was totally burnt out mentally and physically, scaled it back last year and more again this year, 4-5 matches per week is about perfect 6-7+ is too much if I do it more than two weeks in a row.

I hit with an equal level partner 2-3 times per week for an hour to an hour and a half, we warm up then play groundstroke games, sometimes the last 15 minutes or so we serve and play out the points. Call that 3-5 hours of hitting per week.

I practice on my own with a cart, serving, drop feeds, ball machine etc. 2-6 hours per week. So call that 3 hours of practice.

I train 1 hour per week with an ATP player hitting, working on patterns, and playing points.

And finally a 1 hour coaching session with an ATP coach once per week.

I don't do much off court work in summer because I want to maximize my court time when it's free, maybe some footwork drills, jumping rope, or shadow swings with the weight.

So 15-25 hours on court per week.

If I need to rest, I take some, I know how to prepare for big matches and when I don't have anything important I know I can push myself.

My winter schedule is drastically different.

J

So assuming you have 1 rest day per week you play almost 5 hours per day on average?
Dont you have work or school, how do you find the time?

Anyway playing 5-6 days per week for 1 hour each is more than enough for great improvements, more than that offers someore benefit but not big benefits, and I would say once u get past 2 hours none at all.

 

[J011yroger]

This is helpful! Some questions regarding this post. . .

1.) Can you remember what your routine was like when you were at the 3.5 level? I believe you mentioned you are about a 4.5 so has much changed in your routine or has the court time, lessons, and hitting remained consistent?

2.) Right now I've got a condensed match schedule because of a few team obligations I have taken on. This should peter out as the summer progresses and will open up an opportunity to involve "hitting" sessions. How critical would you say these are as opposed to just match play?

3.) Do you include any additional cardio or fitness into your summer regimen or do you acquire that on court? I was thinking about including early morning runs/track workouts into the mix.

4.) What are YOUR goals? Are you looking to achieve 5.0 or above?

Thank you again

1. I'm about a 5.0 now, I don't think I was ever a 3.5, my situation is a little odd as I played a good amount as a kid starting around 4 and in high school but didn't have any parental support so I didn't play juniors. I blew out my shoulder at 17 and didn't play for 6 years, after college I started running distance again and working out and rehabbed my shoulder so that I could kind of play again. In the beginning of my comeback I just focused on getting my strokes back. If I could go back in time I would have added more discipline and structure to my practices and I would have competed more so that my ability to hit the ball didn't get so far ahead of my ability to win matches. I get more coaching now from higher level coaches but I always sought out the best coaches I could find.

2. It depends on you and your needs. If I don't play enough matches I lose my match toughness but if I play too many matches I lose my strokes. It's taken me a long time to find the balance and to listen to my body and accurately analyze my game. If you just practice you will suck at playing matches, if you just play matches you will get better at winning at your level but struggle to improve.

3. I'm pretty strong and fit, I do most of my off court training in the winter. I'll run some races for fun in the summer if I get conned into it. I don't run much outside of tennis to save my body but I have built up a base over the years running, skating, biking, doing intervals, distance etc. Now I build stamina by doing live and dead ball drills. 2-1s side to sides, X drills, volley lob drills, deep and short drills, etc. Basically my MO is to push myself until I break in the summer then figure out how to make whatever my weakest link was that year stronger over the winter. I've worked with ATP trainers and I've made up my own routines.

4. My goals are to compete in USTA National and ITF seniors, and win a gold ball. I've been to Nationals for 4.5 and 9.0 so I would like to go back for 5.0 and 10.0.

J

 

[J011yroger]

So assuming you have 1 rest day per week you play almost 5 hours per day on average?
Dont you have work or school, how do you find the time?

Anyway playing 5-6 days per week for 1 hour each is more than enough for great improvements, more than that offers someore benefit but not big benefits, and I would say once u get past 2 hours none at all.

I'll take a day off if I need it, usually a rest day for me is just hitting for an hour or playing a doubles match.

Figure 2.5 hours per day average Monday-Friday and 4-6 hours per day Saturday & Sunday?

J

 

[Dan R]

This is a good question and I'm kind of in the same boat. Having limited time on court I think it's important to emphasize quality of practice over quantity. Of course, that raises the question of what does that actually mean? I was listening to a high level coach saying that research supports the notion that you learn the most when you are doing something with a pretty high failure rate. You don't get much benefit out of doing something over and over that you are already good at. While that might be highly satisfying, it's not productive.

He said that you should push yourself to the point where you are failing 30-50% of the time to hit the most productive point on the spectrum. That's a very high failure rate and most people get frustrated at that point. You just have to push through the frustration. I've tried to keep this in mind and when I"m practicing to push to the point where I'm failing a lot more than I would like. If I'm playing a match then no I don't want to do this, but in a drill I'm going to push it past the point of what i'm happy with in terms of success. I think it helps in terms of maximizing improvement.

 

[CT-Topspin]

1. I'm about a 5.0 now, I don't think I was ever a 3.5, my situation is a little odd as I played a good amount as a kid starting around 4 and in high school but didn't have any parental support so I didn't play juniors. I blew out my shoulder at 17 and didn't play for 6 years, after college I started running distance again and working out and rehabbed my shoulder so that I could kind of play again. In the beginning of my comeback I just focused on getting my strokes back. If I could go back in time I would have added more discipline and structure to my practices and I would have competed more so that my ability to hit the ball didn't get so far ahead of my ability to win matches. I get more coaching now from higher level coaches but I always sought out the best coaches I could find.

2. It depends on you and your needs. If I don't play enough matches I lose my match toughness but if I play too many matches I lose my strokes. It's taken me a long time to find the balance and to listen to my body and accurately analyze my game. If you just practice you will suck at playing matches, if you just play matches you will get better at winning at your level but struggle to improve.

3. I'm pretty strong and fit, I do most of my off court training in the winter. I'll run some races for fun in the summer if I get conned into it. I don't run much outside of tennis to save my body but I have built up a base over the years running, skating, biking, doing intervals, distance etc. Now I build stamina by doing live and dead ball drills. 2-1s side to sides, X drills, volley lob drills, deep and short drills, etc. Basically my MO is to push myself until I break in the summer then figure out how to make whatever my weakest link was that year stronger over the winter. I've worked with ATP trainers and I've made up my own routines.

4. My goals are to compete in USTA National and ITF seniors, and win a gold ball. I've been to Nationals for 4.5 and 9.0 so I would like to go back for 5.0 and 10.0.

J

This is awesome insight, I really appreciate you taking the time to answer. I figured a lot of these decisions would be trial and error until I find what works. I will be sure to post regularly to document my progress and seek feedback as necessary.

Good luck in achieving your goals!

 

[J011yroger]

This is awesome insight, I really appreciate you taking the time to answer. I figured a lot of these decisions would be trial and error until I find what works. I will be sure to post regularly to document my progress and seek feedback as necessary.

Good luck in achieving your goals!

Tag me in a post if you ever want my opinion and you can always email me if something is too personal to post.

Remember everyone is different. We all have our different gifts and shortcomings so you have to find out what works for you.

J

 

[CT-Topspin]

This is a good question and I'm kind of in the same boat. Having limited time on court I think it's important to emphasize quality of practice over quantity. Of course, that raises the question of what does that actually mean? I was listening to a high level coach saying that research supports the notion that you learn the most when you are doing something with a pretty high failure rate. You don't get much benefit out of doing something over and over that you are already good at. While that might be highly satisfying, it's not productive.

He said that you should push yourself to the point where you are failing 30-50% of the time to hit the most productive point on the spectrum. That's a very high failure rate and most people get frustrated at that point. You just have to push through the frustration. I've tried to keep this in mind and when I"m practicing to push to the point where I'm failing a lot more than I would like. If I'm playing a match then no I don't want to do this, but in a drill I'm going to push it past the point of what i'm happy with in terms of success. I think it helps in terms of maximizing improvement.

This makes sense. You definitely don't want to do drills that are too easy, but I think that percentage should be put into some context as there are some drills that demand a consistency (i.e. 100 ball drill). Granted there can be mechanisms put in place to add challenge to even those drills (hit only CC, hit at a certain depth, pace, etc.) but I see what you're saying. You shouldn't come out of a practice thinking what you just worked on was a breeze.

 

[FiReFTW]

Where are u from @CT-Topspin

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Where are u from @CT-Topspin

anywhere near norwalk/stamford?

 

[J011yroger]

Where are u from @CT-Topspin

Guessing CT

J

 

[CT-Topspin]

Haha I'm from Waterford but have driven as far as New Haven to play. In the other direction I drive up to Providence RI on a regular basis

 

[J011yroger]

Haha I'm from Waterford but have driven as far as New Haven to play. In the other direction I drive up to Providence RI on a regular basis

That's a hike for me.

J

 

[CT-Topspin]

That's a hike for me.

J

I am always game for a road trip, especially if it involves a day of tennis.

 

[heninfan99]

amen.
i pay $100 for a weekly 2h clinic, specifically because they force you to hit shots i almost never practice, even with my most cooperative hitting partners.
i can definitely hit more balls per hour, just hitting with a like minded coop partner (say 600/hr)
but let's say i only hit 400 balls in the clinic... 2/3 of those balls will be shots i never practice deliberately.

How many players in your clinic, on court at the same time?

 

[CT-Topspin]

anywhere near norwalk/stamford?

Stamford is about an hour and half drive from where I live and about half an hour from my old college stomping grounds. I play a lot of tournaments in that general area

 

[J011yroger]

Stamford is about an hour and half drive from where I live and about half an hour from my old college stomping grounds. I play a lot of tournaments in that general area

I went to a mixer type thing at Stamford indoor to play a TW poster who said he was 5.0-5.5. I was two double faults from golden setting him.

J

 

[CT-Topspin]

I went to a mixer type thing at Stamford indoor to play a TW poster who said he was 5.0-5.5. I was two double faults from golden setting him.

J

Hope you didn't make the drive just for that match.

 

[Nostradamus]

Hey everyone, I've been playing tennis seriously for the last year and half (average 3-4 days/week, 2 to 3 hours a pop) and right now the way I have been "improving" has been to force as much tennis into my schedule (balance against full time career, family, social life) which amounts to about 8-10 hours of play a week in the winter, 10-15 hours a week in the summer. I take an hour private lesson a week to set the framework for what I want to work on in the remaining hours and spend the rest of that time in match play and clinics (winter).

I tend to go overboard with this schedule in the summer and will suffer from burnout every couple of weeks (legs dead, lethargy, mild depression, etc.) And am concerned because I have also been thinking about incorporating a lifting routine into this schedule to develop appropriate functional strength and am lost on how to organize everything.

Has anyone trying to improve seriously at the recreational level cracked the code and figured out a system that works for them?

Sorry if this is a commonly asked question

what about weight training ? how many times a week is optimal for tennis weight training ?

 

[MyFearHand]

My ultimate goal is to reach whatever my ceiling is. I've had someone say that I could hit 4.5 when it's all said and done given what they have witnessed over the past year and a half.

Personally, I'd like to stretch that goal and say when it's all said and done I'd be happy as a 5.0 or 5.5 and to contest the #1 open ranking in New England. I don't know if that's realistic or achievable but given this framework how does the conversation change?

You can absolutely contest for #1 in New England as a 4.5. You just have to play a lot of tournaments. I've been as high as 10 after only playing 4 or 5 tournaments in a year. Currently less than 100 points off of the #1 ranking.

 

[MyFearHand]

I'm friends with the current New England #2 and he's a 4.5.

 

[CT-Topspin]

I'm friends with the current New England #2 and he's a 4.5.

Edit: Not who I was thinking. I haven't run into you guys yet-- I play a lot of the Oak Lane tourneys. I'm going to probably hit Bryant in Providence these next couple of weekends for the 3.5 draw.

 

[MyFearHand]

Edit: Not who I was thinking. I haven't run into you guys yet-- I play a lot of the Oak Lane tourneys. I'm going to probably hit Bryant in Providence these next couple of weekends for the 3.5 draw.

Yeah I think he plays all over New England. I play pretty much exclusively in Maine and rarely in Mass. Good luck man! I don't think your plan for playing that much is a bad idea. Basically the way I got to my level was just playing relentlessly all the time. It's true that more disciplined practice might be able to get you there faster though. If you try to have a focus in match and let your ego go a little bit you can turn matches into good practice as well though.

 

[CT-Topspin]

what about weight training ? how many times a week is optimal for tennis weight training ?

This one I don't know. I will say absent of weight training and just tennis alone my legs have gotten significantly stronger.

It seems to be a bit more complicated incorporating weight training into a tennis regimen because you trade off time and energy that could be spent working on a court. There's also a concept of periodization training I've read about that competitive Juniors through pros utilize but even everything I've read on that suggests working with a trainer to develop.

At my current level I imagine my best returns will come from hours on the court. Any weight training I'd do would be for injury prevention but since I have never really had a problem with them it's not on the top of my to do list at the moment.

 

[J011yroger]

Why the change of opinion?

So assuming you have 1 rest day per week you play almost 5 hours per day on average?
Dont you have work or school, how do you find the time?

Anyway playing 5-6 days per week for 1 hour each is more than enough for great improvements, more than that offers someore benefit but not big benefits, and I would say once u get past 2 hours none at all.

Since im bored at work and theres alot of talk about how adults cant get great at tennis compared to young teens, I decided to make a training schedule I think would be a great one for an adult player in order to achieve very high level of tennis comparable to young competitor players.

I talked to a friend today who plays tennis since 5 and is 24 now, she started competing even but injury then stopped her, and I asked her how much tennis she played and trained.. so this schedule is made with that in mind, so its somewhat similar to the play time and all, but a bit less.., when she was telling me and calculating she was suprized herself, thinking about her weekly schedule every day 3h+ how much she actually played if u take 10 years timespan, it really is crazy.

First he should get a good coach and then talk about goals and they should start working on achieving objectives and improving specific shots or stuff.

2nd realize they need a good diet and be fit.

Schedule

Monday
Morning: 1.5h gym strengthening training
Afternoon: 1.5h session with coach

Tuesday
Morning: 1.5h footwork, agility, fitness work
Afternoon: 1.5h session with a similar level player under coach supervision

Wednesday
Morning: 1.5h hitting session with partner
Afternoon: 1.5h point and match play

Thursday
Morning: 1.5h gym strengthening training
Afternoon: 1.5h session with coach

Friday
Morning: 1.5h footwork, agility, fitness work
Afternoon: 1.5h session with a similar level player under coach supervision

Saturday
Morning: 1.5h hitting session with partner
Afternoon: 2h point and match play

Sunday
Rest day

12.5 very quality hours of tennis per week
and 6 hours working on fitness,agility,balance,strength,coordination...etc

Now this is a demanding but very good schedule, someone would improve massively in 1 year with this schedule.

Now realistically adults dont have near enough time to do close to that schedule and it would be extremely expensive.

Average coach charges around 50-60$ per hour for a private lesson in USA i believe?

So in 2 person training sessions both split the price

So thats 225-270$ per week, 900-1080$ per month, and 10.800-12.960$ per year

And thats not taking into account the cost for balls, restringing, tennis courts (somewhere in usa they are pricey while somewhere u can get free public court play), fuel cost, and other expenses.

So becoming a high level tennis player takes a TON of time every day and a TON of money, both are a problem for adults, time is impossible to find so much and money nobody will pay so much for tennis or any other sport its a huge investment for no real return just improving a ton.

Kids have a ton of time and their parents will pay usually for alot of traning, and hoping they are talented enough to make it.

Pretty interesting once you really break it down and think about it, no wonder no adult can come close to compare to competitive 15 year olds,unless someone already went through all that training as a kid.

An adult will just never come CLOSE to closing the massive gap in hours of tennis play.

J

 

[J011yroger]

This one I don't know. I will say absent of weight training and just tennis alone my legs have gotten significantly stronger.

It seems to be a bit more complicated incorporating weight training into a tennis regimen because you trade off time and energy that could be spent working on a court. There's also a concept of periodization training I've read about that competitive Juniors through pros utilize but even everything I've read on that suggests working with a trainer to develop.

At my current level I imagine my best returns will come from hours on the court. Any weight training I'd do would be for injury prevention but since I have never really had a problem with them it's not on the top of my to do list at the moment.

I'm sorry to keep saying this but it depends on the individual.

It's even harder when you have to balance it with winning matches.

I will say that off court training and weight lifting has made a huge difference in my tennis.

If you can dedicate a 4 month block of time to training off court (winter) you can see what it does for you. I have no idea of your skills and general athletic state or background.

J

 

[CT-Topspin]

I'm sorry to keep saying this but it depends on the individual.

It's even harder when you have to balance it with winning matches.

I will say that off court training and weight lifting has made a huge difference in my tennis.

If you can dedicate a 4 month block of time to training off court (winter) you can see what it does for you. I have no idea of your skills and general athletic state or background.

J

I'm more than willing to try lifting in the winter when court time is limited-- I just haven't had success developing a program yet. Is there a resource you use that's been helpful for this?

 

[J011yroger]

I'm more than willing to try lifting in the winter when court time is limited-- I just haven't had success developing a program yet. Is there a resource you use that's been helpful for this?

How old are you, what's your general fitness level, and what issues are you looking to solve?

J

 

[Deleted member 23235]

How many players in your clinic, on court at the same time?

4 courts of 4 max per court... it's basically run like a "junior camp" for adults.
some king of the hill games... so everyone's fighting to get to the "top" court.

 

[CT-Topspin]

How old are you, what's your general fitness level, and what issues are you looking to solve?

J

I'm 25 years old, 6'0 and 185 lbs. I would say I'm athletic and fit enough to sustain playing 4-5 times a week, 2-3 hours a pop in mostly singles. My legs are very strong and have always been very strong (was a sprinter in high school for track) and playing this volume of tennis has been pretty beneficial. I would say my upper body strength is above average as well.

All in all I'm a very "fast-twitch" muscle oriented athlete that responds well to explosive exercises and lifts.

I really don't believe I am wanting for power. Most of what I want to improve are muscle groups that promote good form over an extended period (core strength has never been a focus)

 

[J011yroger]

I'm 25 years old, 6'0 and 185 lbs. I would say I'm athletic and fit enough to sustain playing 4-5 times a week, 2-3 hours a pop in mostly singles. My legs are very strong and have always been very strong (was a sprinter in high school for track) and playing this volume of tennis has been pretty beneficial. I would say my upper body strength is above average as well.

All in all I'm a very "fast-twitch" muscle oriented athlete that responds well to explosive exercises and lifts.

I really don't believe I am wanting for power. Most of what I want to improve are muscle groups that promote good form over an extended period (core strength has never been a focus)

Ok, that's good news. How is your endurance/wind?

When you get tired do you run out of breath first or do your muscles give out? What muscle gives out first?

J