Osaka splits from coach

to all those making misogynistic comments (IMO) about Osaka (either being a complete B to being a naive little girl); don't you think if Sascha had a huge problem with everything, especially if it was about pay, he would be making a bigger deal about it in the media?

He's not thus far, so I'm thinking both parties know WTH was up and agreed to part ways amicably as possible.

tells me that there definitely is a backstory that doesn't look the best, not saying its particularly significant, but at least its not a good look.

if Sascha were particularly aggrieved he would be making a bigger stink out of this.
Wow, criticism of her getting rid of her coach when they had a partnership that took her from number 68 in the world to no.1 and 2 back to back grand slams must be misogynistic.

And in terms of "naive little girl", naive, actually I do believe she is in sacking her coach, but "little girl" shows your own prejudice taking hold of you.

Youve never heard of male sports stars getting criticism I assume? You must be having a laugh. This whole culture of any female getting criticism is misogynistic is getting tiresome.

Have you never heard of the saying "if it isnt broke dont fix it". Almost all the criticism she is receiving is based around this principle.

He has taken her to world number 1 in 12 months. 2 Grand slams. You dont understand why there is critique about this decision that may come back to haunt her???
 
Wow, criticism of her getting rid of her coach when they had a partnership that took her from number 68 in the world to no.1 and 2 back to back grand slams must be misogynistic.

And in terms of "naive little girl", naive, actually I do believe she is in sacking her coach, but "little girl" shows your own prejudice taking hold of you.

Youve never heard of male sports stars getting criticism I assume? You must be having a laugh. This whole culture of any female getting criticism is misogynistic is getting tiresome.

Have you never heard of the saying "if it isnt broke dont fix it". Almost all the criticism she is receiving is based around this principle.

He has taken her to world number 1 in 12 months. 2 Grand slams. You dont understand why there is critique about this decision that may come back to haunt her???
its not the critique, its how the criticism is expressed.

i suggest you look at some of the comments!

i've never seen one of the top males called a complete BEEOTCH or whatever the male equivalent would be for firing his coach. yet Osaka was!

I've also never noticed worrying about a coach's pay so much as it has been in this case and assuming that Osaka just didn't want to pay Sascha his due.

so you sir, need to be a little more observant and recognize your privilege in this context.
 
its not the critique, its how the criticism is expressed.

i suggest you look at some of the comments!

i've never seen one of the top males called a complete BEEOTCH or whatever the male equivalent would be for firing his coach. yet Osaka was!

I've also never noticed worrying about a coach's pay so much as it has been in this case and assuming that Osaka just didn't want to pay Sascha his due.

so you sir, need to be a little more observant and recognize your privilege in this context.
What privilege? Do you think guys criticise other guys in a softly softly manner all the time?
 
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Wow, criticism of her getting rid of her coach when they had a partnership that took her from number 68 in the world to no.1 and 2 back to back grand slams must be misogynistic.

And in terms of "naive little girl", naive, actually I do believe she is in sacking her coach, but "little girl" shows your own prejudice taking hold of you.

Youve never heard of male sports stars getting criticism I assume? You must be having a laugh. This whole culture of any female getting criticism is misogynistic is getting tiresome.

Have you never heard of the saying "if it isnt broke dont fix it". Almost all the criticism she is receiving is based around this principle.

He has taken her to world number 1 in 12 months. 2 Grand slams. You dont understand why there is critique about this decision that may come back to haunt her???
You do not know what was broke in their relationship.
 
Although you have a point, you failed to mention one small issue here. She won two majors working with him so why the split when the results are there ? I understand he may be a jerk but if that's the way to achieve results imo it's okay. Look at all the coaches in other sports, soccer for example - they crucify their own players every now and them and punish them for whatnot and let me remind you some of those guys can afford to purchase whole WTA top 10 apart from Serena.
I saw this post again and I have to say that you don’t know that all coaches are crucifying the players.
Soccer is also a team sport and something different. But still there, I don’t believe it’s common they get crucified verbally at all.
I know our skiers not getting crucified by their coaches.
This is maybe something we have seen in a movie or something. Like the others in here derailed the thread w 2 pages talk about Rocky.
It’s not like that in the real world.
I’ve met teams of many players and they don’t seem to me to be harsh people at all. When you are a pro player it’s the player that is the boss and coach only giving advices.
 
...don't you think if Sascha had a huge problem with everything, especially if it was about pay, he would be making a bigger deal about it in the media?

He's not thus far, so I'm thinking both parties know WTH was up and agreed to part ways amicably as possible.

tells me that there definitely is a backstory that doesn't look the best, not saying its particularly significant, but at least its not a good look.

if Sascha were particularly aggrieved he would be making a bigger stink out of this.
I agree with what you say except for Sascha's options.

His livelihood largely depends on being hired by another player, preferably a top one. Thus, the pool of his potential future employers is a tiny one and they all move in the same circle(s). Thus, badmouthing his ex-employer, even if justified (and we have no idea if this is the case), is an absolute no-no for Bajin. So, no matter what happened, he can only say what he is saying now which is very little and largely positive and respectful to Osaka.

"if it isnt broke dont fix it". Almost all the criticism she is receiving is based around this principle.
Sums it up pretty well.
 
Well she just got thrashed 6-3 6-3 in straight sets against the world number 67 in her first match after sacking Bajin.

I watched the game and she was all over the place with a massive number of unforced errors. Her opponent didnt do anything special.

The commentators before the match said when she first came onto the scene she had monstrous shots but she was very erratic. Ever since she teamed up with Sacha Bajin he brought order and stability to her game with better shot selection, so it will be interesting to see how she plays today after parting ways.

Well if that game was anything to go by she was back to playing like the old Osaka, definitely not the world no.1.

I wonder if shes "happier" after that performance.
 
Well she just got thrashed 6-3 6-3 in straight sets against the world number 67 in her first match after sacking Bajin.

I watched the game and she was all over the place with a massive number of unforced errors. Her opponent didnt do anything special.

The commentators before the match said when she first came onto the scene she had monstrous shots but she was very erratic. Ever since she teamed up with Sacha Bajin he brought order and stability to her game with better shot selection, so it will be interesting to see how she plays today after parting ways.

Well if that game was anything to go by she was back to playing like the old Osaka, definitely not the world no.1.

I wonder if shes "happier" after that performance.
Reminds me of when Rios reached world #1 and promptly dropped his coach (Stefanki) that got him there. He is quoted as saying he "wanted to go in another direction" which is exactly what he got!
 
I think some are reading too much into this result. It's not like Sacha took all of his coaching out of her head as he went out the door. Any meaningful instruction he gave her will still be there. In my opinion this result probably has more to do with it being her first match as the number 1 player in the world, and maybe feeling the pressure of it. I mean, how many times do you see the new #1 in College Basketball go out and lay an egg in their next game...
 
I think some are reading too much into this result. It's not like Sacha took all of his coaching out of her head as he went out the door. Any meaningful instruction he gave her will still be there. In my opinion this result probably has more to do with it being her first match as the number 1 player in the world, and maybe feeling the pressure of it. I mean, how many times do you see the new #1 in College Basketball go out and lay an egg in their next game...
An unfortunate statistic from the ITF is that she is the first player ever on the WTA to lose her first match after becoming world number 1 so its not exactly a common occurrence.

No way does she lose that game if she didnt make any changes.

25-9 in unforced errors.
Got her serve broken 7 times.
48% of first serve won.
21% of 2nd serves won.

She was erratic like she used to be.
 
I think you're giving her a little too much credit.
I hope that it wouldn't be an "in one ear out the other" situation, but I could be wrong! :-D
An unfortunate statistic from the ITF is that she is the first player ever on the WTA to lose her first match after becoming world number 1 so its not exactly a common occurrence.

No way does she lose that game if she didnt make any changes.

25-9 in unforced errors.
Got her serve broken 7 times.
48% of first serve won.
21% of 2nd serves won.

She was erratic like she used to be.
Well so much for that idea! Maybe she really did just go out there and try to change things around. I haven't followed her closely enough to recognize if she played a completely different game today vs. while she was under Sacha's coaching. I had just chalked it up to a bad day spraying balls and bad choices to dropshot on a couple key points...
 
In her post match interview she said she hasnt been practicing well recently and hoped to just get through it and improve during the match.

She mentioned that in practice everyone was so unsure as to what to do, the current coach (who is just stepping in) asked her what she wanted to do and she said she didnt know, because she never says what she wants to do, she just does what people tell her to do.

That last statement to me suggest Sachas role and influence was pretty big.
 
In her post match interview she said she hasnt been practicing well recently and hoped to just get through it and improve during the match.

She mentioned that in practice everyone was so unsure as to what to do, the current coach (who is just stepping in) asked her what she wanted to do and she said she didnt know, because she never says what she wants to do, she just does what people tell her to do.

That last statement to me suggest Sachas role and influence was pretty big.
maybe she needs time to find herself again and get used to new team?
 
Don’t know about that, but I bet half of these coaching relationships between players and coaches involve some sex.

Was just talking to a few of the Pro girls about this last week. Last year there was a bit of drama between a couple of the girls I know because it was supposed one was sleeping with the coach. But overall, pro coaches know that is NOT thre rep you want to get with female athletes. An a good way to kill a career. I doubt that was an issue with Osaka. My take is that Sasha is a bit of a drama queen and was a bit too comfortable with the family, forgetting the line of being a coach and not a friend. That was also part of what was rumoured with the split with Serena in the first place after all those years. But whatever the reality, a coach is contracted by a player and they can cancel at any time, and for any reason. So kinda moot really.
 
Compare these 2 videos:



So shes saying hes difficult, argumentative, gets triggered, stresses over simple things, whilst she just likes to chill.

And she kind of throws him under the bus implying he doesnt do anything, despite him getting her from 68 to No.1 in 12 months and 2 grand slams.

Yet that 2nd video pretty much demonstrates that he does way more than she gives him credit for. And im not gonna lie, in that 2nd video she sounds a bit childish.

Overall it comes across as ungrateful. Ive no doubt he probably is argumentative, critical, a stickler for details that to her seems unimportant, maybe like a perfectionist. But thats the type of person who will push you to your limit and get the best out of you. Hes doing it for your benefit.
 

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Compare these 2 videos:



So shes saying hes difficult, argumentative, gets triggered, stresses over simple things, whilst she just likes to chill.

And she kind of throws him under the bus implying he doesnt do anything, despite him getting her from 68 to No.1 in 12 months and 2 grand slams.

Yet that 2nd video pretty much demonstrates that he does way more than she gives him credit for. And im not gonna lie, in that 2nd video she sounds a bit childish.

Overall it comes across as ungrateful. Ive no doubt he probably is argumentative, critical, a stickler for details that to her seems unimportant, maybe like a perfectionist. But thats the type of person who will push you to your limit and get the best out of you. Hes doing it for your benefit.
He was asking her to avoid trying to paint the lines. This is what every teaching pro I have seen tell juniors who are making unforced errors due to aggression. He then goes on to add that if she feels aggressive, she should go down the middle. Yeah right spend all that energy on a ball which can be returned easily.

One obvious advice which any guy in the Tennis Tips section can provide, and another bad advice.

She should just crowd source her questions to the Tennis Tips section where we are ready and willing to provide free advice.
 
She is 21 and has the emotional stability of a 13 year old teenage drama queen at San Fernando Jr High. Gives her great advice and direction and all she does is whine. Some of the things that she says that the commentators say are cute really show how far in outer space she is. Come on who says I forgot to smile?

She’s a head job and no coach is going to be able to deal with that for very long
 
She is 21 and has the emotional stability of a 13 year old teenage drama queen at San Fernando Jr High. Gives her great advice and direction and all she does is whine. Some of the things that she says that the commentators say are cute really show how far in outer space she is. Come on who says I forgot to smile?

She’s a head job and no coach is going to be able to deal with that for very long
I could not agree more. Find the video from Charleston last year. Yikes!
My concern is that she’s not emotionally built for true stardom and this could bad in a real hurry.
 

TnsGuru

Professional
Do you notice there hasn't been any backlash from Sascha? Maybe he's holding his tongue to wait for her to come to her senses and ask him back when she starts declining. Djokovic came to his senses and brought back his old coach why not her? Unless there is more to the story than what we are hearing.

She says she wants her happiness but how happy is she going to be if she declines and starts to lose like in todays match? What does she want, a buddy? Whatever she had with Sascha it worked, regardless if they liked each other or not. Her loss today shows her mental frailty and she needs him back whether she likes it or not.

How many coaches do you know have taken someone from inside the top 100 and within a year lead them to two GS's and the #1 rank. Not many, if she doesn't want him someone else will, it's her loss.
 
Do you notice there hasn't been any backlash from Sascha? Maybe he's holding his tongue to wait for her to come to her senses and ask him back when she starts declining. Djokovic came to his senses and brought back his old coach why not her? Unless there is more to the story than what we are hearing.

She says she wants her happiness but how happy is she going to be if she declines and starts to lose like in todays match? What does she want, a buddy? Whatever she had with Sascha it worked, regardless if they liked each other or not. Her loss today shows her mental frailty and she needs him back whether she likes it or not.

How many coaches do you know have taken someone from inside the top 100 and within a year lead them to two GS's and the #1 rank. Not many, if she doesn't want him someone else will, it's her loss.
Or maybe he's a professional who knows how to be polite and move on to the next job.
 
Do you notice there hasn't been any backlash from Sascha? Maybe he's holding his tongue to wait for her to come to her senses and ask him back when she starts declining. Djokovic came to his senses and brought back his old coach why not her? Unless there is more to the story than what we are hearing.
As I mentioned before, Bajin has no choice but stay civilized and keep quiet... or just say bland, positive things. He is a pro coach with, I believe, a good reputation. He wants to keep it that way for sure. And it doesn't matter who and what triggered the separation.

Few will be willing to hire a coach who is known to air dirty laundry after a split. Osaka can afford it since she is the employer. But even she will have a somewhat harder time getting coaches to work with her now; that's for sure.
 
Naomi Osaka blames scrutiny over coaching split for Dubai defeat!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/tennis/47291024

Japan's Naomi Osaka blamed scrutiny following the split from her coach for defeat in her first match since becoming world number one.

The Australian and US Open champion, 21, was beaten 6-3 6-3 by France's Kristina Mladenovic in the Dubai Tennis Championships second round.

It was her first match since since splitting with Sascha Bajin last week.

Asked if she could block out reaction to the news, she said: "I couldn't. This match is the result of that."

She added: "I'm pretty sure as time goes on you guys will stop talking about it. For now, it's like the biggest tennis news, I guess.

"It's a little bit hard because I feel like people are staring at me, and not like in a good way."
 
I saw this post again and I have to say that you don’t know that all coaches are crucifying the players.
Soccer is also a team sport and something different. But still there, I don’t believe it’s common they get crucified verbally at all.
Well of course not all coaches have the same methods but many of them have very interesting methods. Not to go too much into the past for example when Sir Alex Ferguson threw a boot at David Beckham and made a cut across his face after a particularly bad game they played or for example Svetislav Pesic throwing out a player from a 2002 Basketball World Cup winning squad because the guy was eating a banana while he was talking to the team, let's look at some of the recent examples.

Here we have an example of maybe the best current soccer coach after a WIN talking to arguably his best player in that match trying to make him improve more. Believe you me, both of them are well aware that there's like 300 journalists and 100 cameras around them. What do you think happens when there's no one else around ?


So here is arguably the best ever basketball coach in Europe during the timeout. His player asks what to play, what kind of answer would you expect from a coach ? Well, take a look for yourself.


Here is the same guy, I think there's something there. Obviously he did not became the best ever by practising yoga.


This one is a bit farther, Delio Rossi subbed Ljajic and the guy said something so could not stand it and look what happened in the middle of the match.


This one is over the top of course, he got suspended but I am just showing you what happens when competition and emotions get the better of someone. Let's revisit some of my favorites - here is a coach choking his best player and then a presser latter where he protects the same player from the press. Anyways that was a part of the process which made that player - Bogdan Bogdanovic now of Sacramento Kings an NBA player but at that time this is what it took.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhHsTEsZfGc

These two are still like a father and son and I am sure you can ask Bogdan whatever you want, he'll tell you that his then coach wanted the best for him and they have a father son relationship. I am sure not all the coaches are like this but I am just pointing out to a few examples. Mourinho, arguably one of the best coaches in last couple of decades is famous for using press conferences and newspapers to openly criticize his players. Here is his explanation of why does he openly criticize his players

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlgrfG3ZIGU

So let me remind you who we're talking about here - we're talking about coaches who made champions. Coaches who made legends and became legends. Won everything. If you think everything comes by easily, I apologize but a few clicks and posts and a few smiles can not replace the good ol tough love and hours upon hours of work, dedication and commitment and the coach is there to remind you when you loose it.

Djokovic fired everyone and had a slump of slumps. Because there was no one honest enough to tell him the truth. When Marjan Vajda came back he had a few requests :

- Start eating animal protein
- Fire Pepe Imaz guy, there's no place for piece and serenity in sports. It's a competition and you want to win not to make friends.
 
Naomi Osaka blames scrutiny over coaching split for Dubai defeat!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/amp/tennis/47291024

Japan's Naomi Osaka blamed scrutiny following the split from her coach for defeat in her first match since becoming world number one.

The Australian and US Open champion, 21, was beaten 6-3 6-3 by France's Kristina Mladenovic in the Dubai Tennis Championships second round.

It was her first match since since splitting with Sascha Bajin last week.

Asked if she could block out reaction to the news, she said: "I couldn't. This match is the result of that."

She added: "I'm pretty sure as time goes on you guys will stop talking about it. For now, it's like the biggest tennis news, I guess.

"It's a little bit hard because I feel like people are staring at me, and not like in a good way."
Yes. Give her a break.
 
Yes. Give her a break.
1. She fired him & then announced it on social media in a cold way.
2. She then bad-mouthed him to the media, although didn't go into specifics as such.

So she created this issue, of course it is going to be the hot topic. If she doesn't like it then she either shouldn't have fired him or should have said the exact reasons why she fired him to stop people speculating exactly why a coach who led her to consecutive slams has been dumped. It is ridiculous of her to put this on the media & the fans when she instigated the whole thing. She is a double slam champion & world number one-the spotlight is going to be on her anyway, things like this will just make it worse. She needs to stop with the shy girl routine-it is cute for a while, but gets old quick.
 
What is your point?

That this is how women in tennis should be coached like too? Like in football?

Solskjær has proved that love and understanding can go a long way too ;)

This is just so dumb to discuss I dont know what to say.
My point is plain and simple - there are numerous ways one can coach / be coached and it relates to personality. Some people love it one way while other love it the other way and there is no right or wrong way, there is just successful and not successful way.

How does this relate to the thread topic ? Here is how :

Osaka and Bajin split ways or she sacked him if you want. Sporting reasons do not exist as she just won back to back Grand Slams so we can assume that the results rule out this as a reason for their split. So although we can only assume what happened, we can be fairly certain that it is one of the following :

- Financial reasons ( he asked for a raise and she refused )
- Personal reasons ( they got involved and it went sour )
- Coaching methods ( he was to harsh )

In my honest opinion whatever the reason is, she made a mistake and is to blame or at least partly to blame. If she does not want to pay she is simply wrong as he had a lot to do with the success. If they got involved and let's say he cheated on her or whatever, it was partly her mistake because she allowed personal matters to interfere with non personal. If he was harsh and now she feels like she deserves better treatment, again her mistake as these methods got her here ( my posts were more or less focused on this as the conversation led us there ).

We can only guess what it is but whatever it is she lost the VERY FIRST match she played after firing him so it doesn't look good. And as I said ONLY time will tell but if history teaches us something - it's that you do not change the winning formula while it's working.
 
My point is plain and simple - there are numerous ways one can coach / be coached and it relates to personality. Some people love it one way while other love it the other way and there is no right or wrong way, there is just successful and not successful way.

How does this relate to the thread topic ? Here is how :

Osaka and Bajin split ways or she sacked him if you want. Sporting reasons do not exist as she just won back to back Grand Slams so we can assume that the results rule out this as a reason for their split. So although we can only assume what happened, we can be fairly certain that it is one of the following :

- Financial reasons ( he asked for a raise and she refused )
- Personal reasons ( they got involved and it went sour )
- Coaching methods ( he was to harsh )

In my honest opinion whatever the reason is, she made a mistake and is to blame or at least partly to blame. If she does not want to pay she is simply wrong as he had a lot to do with the success. If they got involved and let's say he cheated on her or whatever, it was partly her mistake because she allowed personal matters to interfere with non personal. If he was harsh and now she feels like she deserves better treatment, again her mistake as these methods got her here ( my posts were more or less focused on this as the conversation led us there ).

We can only guess what it is but whatever it is she lost the VERY FIRST match she played after firing him so it doesn't look good. And as I said ONLY time will tell but if history teaches us something - it's that you do not change the winning formula while it's working.
I will wait and see what happens.
As she said, she wants to be happy and I respect that. It’s her life, her career.

That you get that engaged in this, I don’t know.
 
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