Pilot of NCAA singles championships in fall for '24 and '25-what do you think?

jcgatennismom

Hall of Fame

I think the draws will be weaker due to top players who play Futures and Challengers in the fall. I wonder what the top US collegians will do since they have a chance at US Open WC. Will they take online courses and play a couple of tourneys in the fall, e.g. AA and fall Nats? I wonder it ITA will change ranking algorithm which was based on a certain number of countable wins and all losses so collegians with ATP points will still earn a fall ranking by playing 1-2 top ITA tourneys that they could get in via WC. It doesnt look like spring '24 ITA results could count in deciding fall '24 individual selection due to this NCAA bylaw: "The ITA rankings serve as an integral part of the NCAA Championships (team and individual) selection process each year. NCAA Bylaw 31.3.3.2 “Qualifying Standards” states “Individuals and teams required to meet performance standards to qualify for NCAA championships competition shall achieve such standards in meets held during the same academic year as the particular championship.” As a result of this bylaw, the ITA Rankings cannot consider or take into account any results or achievements from prior academic seasons or from non-collegiate competitions (ATP, WTA, ITF, USTA, UTR, etc.). More plainly, the ITA Rankings are very much a “start from scratch” ranking system each season. " This is from ITA page explaining rankings algorithm https://www.wearecollegetennis.com/ita-rankings/rankings-explained/

Some points if NCAA singles champ selections are based only on fall ITA results: 1) All fall matches are finished vs unfinished lines in spring duals 2) Most if not all fall matches are on neutral ground. However, most of us look at the 1st singles rankings of the year and think they are highly inaccurate due to the missed players. There could be an unlikely winner one year from a school outside the top 20 or more selections outside the top 20 schools as there could be players who are definitely in the top 64 in the nation but dont have the ranking in May of each year due to limited opportunities in spring duals. That's unlikely tho-there have been players who made the cut for NCAAs in spring after only playing fall and being injured in spring-maybe playing 1-2 matches in late spring after recovery. At least this is just a pilot for 2 years, so if the changes results in champions who are not ready for US Open, then ITA can revert to spring singles/dubs champs. There is also the risk that the champion who wins fall champs, turns pro in spring and leaves college team to get more pro experience before Open. Maybe there will be a clause added that winner has to play spring to end Open WC.

Supposedly 68% of D1 coaches approve this change. That makes sense as players from colleges outside the top 20 probably have a higher ITA ranking in fall than spring. I would think the coaches of the top 20 teams would be against unless they think their top players need a rest after teams before playing singles.

Will these change take away the advantage of players from universities used to playing in warm and humid conditions? Playing in Nov is a lot different than playing in mid May.
 
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andfor

Legend
I'm okay with it. At least playing in the team competition won't potentially impact the singles and doubles players individuals tournaments. Also gives more watching opportunities, maybe even better for television so they can focus on 1 match, not 6. On the other hand, how many players will win the singles tournament, then turn pro and skip coming back in the spring? We'll find out.
 

Sureshot

Hall of Fame
Do one of All Americans or Fall Nats get cut or moved to the Spring or Sunner? Otherwise it would lead to an overkill of individual tournaments
 

jcgatennismom

Hall of Fame
Do one of All Americans or Fall Nats get cut or moved to the Spring or Sunner? Otherwise it would lead to an overkill of individual tournaments
All individual events will be fall. ITA could possibly change schedule of individual events. You are right-there are AA, Regionals, Fall Nats, and now NCAAs to squeeze in 2 months from about the 3rd week of Sept (earliest Regionals) to finishing NCAAs I assume before Thanksgiving. November traditionally has been a big month for US Futures-there are at least 2 Futures a week (most hosted on campuses) before Thanksgiving-one week there has been 3. Players that dont think they can win Open card or international players may boycott NCAAs to play those Futures instead. If USTA and ITA are working together, they will have to rethink fall Futures calendar too. Probably NCAAs would replace Fall Nats and then players would play Futures afterwards.
 

JLyon

Hall of Fame
All individual events will be fall. ITA could possibly change schedule of individual events. You are right-there are AA, Regionals, Fall Nats, and now NCAAs to squeeze in 2 months from about the 3rd week of Sept (earliest Regionals) to finishing NCAAs I assume before Thanksgiving. November traditionally has been a big month for US Futures-there are at least 2 Futures a week (most hosted on campuses) before Thanksgiving-one week there has been 3. Players that dont think they can win Open card or international players may boycott NCAAs to play those Futures instead. If USTA and ITA are working together, they will have to rethink fall Futures calendar too. Probably NCAAs would replace Fall Nats and then players would play Futures afterwards.
I wonder if they would exchange the AA for the Fall National Champs? That is just too much tennis in such a short amount of time. Will be curious to follow.
 
In my opinion, the main thing is: will the USTA change any of the junior schedule to accommodate? The time difference between Clays and Hardcourt Nationals should be spread out more. Could Clays be moved to early-middle June while moving Hardcourts to late July? If this happens, then the fall tennis season could start practice early August, much like football/soccer/volleyball with the first allowed date for competition be a week later. If the junior schedule does not move, then fall tennis season would start around mid-August. Regardless, the season would be stretched to finish the weekend before Thanksgiving or possibly right after Thanksgiving.

To me, both AA and Fall Nationals stay. If anything, eliminate the invitational or whatever it was that happened at the beginning of fall. Ideally, change Fall Nationals back to being indoors. With a real fall individual season, could put AA around middle of September (two weeks earlier), Fall Nationals to late October/early November (week earlier), and have NCAAs around that late November time slot.
 
Will the NCAA refund money to the cities hosting the spring NCAA's. Stillwater and Waco....bid on the NCAA's...expecting to have 10 days.....of visitors and revenues....Now, they will only have 4 days of events and revenues.

Have they announced where the fall singles and doubles will be played?
 

bobleenov1963

Hall of Fame
I'm okay with it. At least playing in the team competition won't potentially impact the singles and doubles players individuals tournaments. Also gives more watching opportunities, maybe even better for television so they can focus on 1 match, not 6. On the other hand, how many players will win the singles tournament, then turn pro and skip coming back in the spring? We'll find out.

This is wishful thinking and it is not going to happen. The Fall season is mainly NFL and college football 24x7. No other sports can compete with the NFL and/or college football. You have college football on Thursday, Friday and Saturday, while the NFL on Sunday, Monday and Thursday. You also have baseball in the fall as well. There is no room for college tennis on TV in the fall, it is not going to happen. You will see PB and Spike ball on TV before you see college tennis matches.
 

JLyon

Hall of Fame
Will the NCAA refund money to the cities hosting the spring NCAA's. Stillwater and Waco....bid on the NCAA's...expecting to have 10 days.....of visitors and revenues....Now, they will only have 4 days of events and revenues.

Have they announced where the fall singles and doubles will be played?
would imagine it will be Orlando, since USTA and ITA are quickly becoming quite the happy couple again.
 

silentkman

Hall of Fame

I think the draws will be weaker due to top players who play Futures and Challengers in the fall. I wonder what the top US collegians will do since they have a chance at US Open WC. Will they take online courses and play a couple of tourneys in the fall, e.g. AA and fall Nats? I wonder it ITA will change ranking algorithm which was based on a certain number of countable wins and all losses so collegians with ATP points will still earn a fall ranking by playing 1-2 top ITA tourneys that they could get in via WC. It doesnt look like spring '24 ITA results could count in deciding fall '24 individual selection due to this NCAA bylaw: "The ITA rankings serve as an integral part of the NCAA Championships (team and individual) selection process each year. NCAA Bylaw 31.3.3.2 “Qualifying Standards” states “Individuals and teams required to meet performance standards to qualify for NCAA championships competition shall achieve such standards in meets held during the same academic year as the particular championship.” As a result of this bylaw, the ITA Rankings cannot consider or take into account any results or achievements from prior academic seasons or from non-collegiate competitions (ATP, WTA, ITF, USTA, UTR, etc.). More plainly, the ITA Rankings are very much a “start from scratch” ranking system each season. " This is from ITA page explaining rankings algorithm https://www.wearecollegetennis.com/ita-rankings/rankings-explained/

Some points if NCAA singles champ selections are based only on fall ITA results: 1) All fall matches are finished vs unfinished lines in spring duals 2) Most if not all fall matches are on neutral ground. However, most of us look at the 1st singles rankings of the year and think they are highly inaccurate due to the missed players. There could be an unlikely winner one year from a school outside the top 20 or more selections outside the top 20 schools as there could be players who are definitely in the top 64 in the nation but dont have the ranking in May of each year due to limited opportunities in spring duals. That's unlikely tho-there have been players who made the cut for NCAAs in spring after only playing fall and being injured in spring-maybe playing 1-2 matches in late spring after recovery. At least this is just a pilot for 2 years, so if the changes results in champions who are not ready for US Open, then ITA can revert to spring singles/dubs champs. There is also the risk that the champion who wins fall champs, turns pro in spring and leaves college team to get more pro experience before Open. Maybe there will be a clause added that winner has to play spring to end Open WC.

Supposedly 68% of D1 coaches approve this change. That makes sense as players from colleges outside the top 20 probably have a higher ITA ranking in fall than spring. I would think the coaches of the top 20 teams would be against unless they think their top players need a rest after teams before playing singles.

Will these change take away the advantage of players from universities used to playing in warm and humid conditions? Playing in Nov is a lot different than playing in mid May.

I hate to say it, but what are the financial reasons for doing this?
 

andfor

Legend
This is wishful thinking and it is not going to happen. The Fall season is mainly NFL and college football 24x7. No other sports can compete with the NFL and/or college football. You have college football on Thursday, Friday and Saturday, while the NFL on Sunday, Monday and Thursday. You also have baseball in the fall as well. There is no room for college tennis on TV in the fall, it is not going to happen. You will see PB and Spike ball on TV before you see college tennis matches.
My team is on ESPN+ live 3 times this weekend, posted that in another thread. The only wishful thinking here is thinking college tennis leadership is worrying about TV ratings and competing against the NFL.
 

dannythomas

Professional
I may have missed this somewhere but does it not mean that in the first year of implementation seniors graduating in 2024 will not be able to play individuals even if their ranking in May that year would get them in ? Or are they allowed to come back and play individuals in the fall ? Doesn’t seem fair otherwise.
 
I may have missed this somewhere but does it not mean that in the first year of implementation seniors graduating in 2024 will not be able to play individuals even if their ranking in May that year would get them in ? Or are they allowed to come back and play individuals in the fall ? Doesn’t seem fair otherwise.

I think they’re going to have two singles championships in 24.
 
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