Played with a college coach

#1
Wore my self out on the ball machine and was called over to hit with the two guys on the next court. The other guy we let play in when we were short a 4th so maybe he was returning the favor

Anyhow they were both really great plays. Annoyingly good like how do they get soooo much spin and pace? I didnt embarass myself but it was clear they were better.

Though the college coach had two nice things to say about my game.

I was on the add and he was on the duece and we were hitting against the other guy. Couple of shots came to my forehand and the guy told me he was a college coach and that my FH form was like what the college players and pros hit. Thanks @JohnYandell

Also when he was serving he had the nastiest kick I have seen in a while. Like @nytennisaddict serve but with more pace. We were playing points and he was serving to me in the ad. 1st few kickers got me really good. But then I remembered that I have to take those in no mans land or closer. Ripped off a few return winners and one that drew an error. Guy told his buddy that I had the kind of return that could make for a long day.

I got to serve some and did ok. Classic kick to the bh and volley to the open court was working but it was clear those guys were putting a ton more spin on the ball and we were all hitting similar pace at least on groundies. Serves they were sooo much faster

What is the secret to the extra spin in general and added pace on serves??
 
#3
...1st few kickers got me really good. But then I remembered that I have to take those in no mans land or closer....
sometimes i'll even move up as close as 2ft to the service line... to eliminate (a) the squirt (b) the high bounce... easier said than done... but for me it's higher percentage than moving back
...What is the secret to the extra spin in general and added pace on serves??
practice :)

honestly at the higher levels, it's about being more physically able to... i might have the same technique (ie. grip, coil, racquet path, etc...), but college players (and up) just do it with more physical authority.

it's kinda like going to the gym, and let's say i'm just starting out and have perfected the bench press "technique", and can bench 135lbs... but there's a guy next to me doing 315... it's the same "technique", but clearly he's able to apply it more physically :p
 
#4
Technique, technique, technique
true, good technique will let you accomplish your own personal "max" level, but after that it's all physical...
it's kinda like a 13y "black belt" might have the same technique as an adult (or even better - think splits, and kick above their head)... but an adult 100lbs heavier is gonna hit a little bit harder :p
 
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#5
true, good technique will let you accomplish your own personal "max" level, but after that it's all physical...
it's kinda like a 13y "black belt" might have the same technique as an adult... but an adult 100lbs heavier is gonna hit a little bit harder :p
Allow me to ask you a question? How many adult rec players do you know who are willing to go to the gym to improve their tennis? Please do not mention banned members either. ;) :p
 
#8
Allow me to ask you a question? How many adult rec players do you know who are willing to go to the gym to improve their tennis? Please do not mention banned members either. ;):p
haha, fair enough.
most folks at the 3.5-4.0 level do NOT go to the gym to really improve fitness... (or if they do, it's a weak-@ss zumba class or curling 10lb weights, or something like it...)
that said, most the folks i drill with do something significant to improve their fitness (resistance, run, etc....)
one 4.0 played with friday for example, finished a marathon a month ago in ~3h... so you can imagine why i like playing with him.

[edit] to be fair most folks (3.0-4.0) play tennis as their sole form of excerise... which is great if you're a couch potato... but beyond that most folks do not know the tennis law of, "you must get in shape to play tennis"... it was a revelation to me, as a low 4.0, getting that advice from a former atp coach (ie. i was playing tennis to get in shape, and he recommended playing less tennis, and do more "real work": resistance, running/sprints, etc...)
 
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#9
You don’t count! fitness is a requirement at 5.0. I don’t know any 3.5-4.0s who go to the gym to improve their tennis.
Ive been in gym since 2013.
This summer I stayed away from gym, didn't suffer any injuries and liked the "loose" feeling of upper torso. But i'm going to start back soon, it should be interesting once I get that 'strong' feeling back and with my improved technique. If I can stay loose and controlled should be good winter. I'm a low 4.0, @lmost 55 , i'm a real tennis addict/fanatic though , prob not the norm
 
#10
Ive been in gym since 2013.
This summer I stayed away from gym, didn't suffer any injuries and liked the "loose" feeling of upper torso. But i'm going to start back soon, it should be interesting once I get that 'strong' feeling back and with my improved technique. If I can stay loose and controlled should be good winter. I'm a low 4.0, @lmost 55 , i'm a real tennis addict/fanatic though , prob not the norm
There will always be the few exceptions, but it’s not the norm.
 
#11
haha, fair enough.
most folks at the 3.5-4.0 level do NOT go to the gym to really improve fitness... (or if they do, it's a weak-@ss zumba class or curling 10lb weights, or something like it...)
that said, most the folks i drill with do something significant to improve their fitness (resistance, run, etc....)
one 4.0 played with friday for example, finished a marathon a month ago in ~3h... so you can imagine why i like playing with him.

[edit] to be fair most folks (3.0-4.0) play tennis as their sole form of excerise... which is great if you're a couch potato... but beyond that most folks do not know the tennis law of, "you must get in shape to play tennis"... it was a revelation to me, as a low 4.0, getting that advice from a former atp coach (ie. i was playing tennis to get in shape, and he recommended playing less tennis, and do more "real work": resistance, running/sprints, etc...)
Exactly. Most people play tennis as their only form of exercise. In fact, a lot of people think the more tennis they play, the better shape they will be in.
 

Dragy

Professional
#12
Well, in fact the basic “in shape” is most healthily achieved through daily cardio routine (300 min per week with at least 80% of that time in the “basic/recovery” zone, really low H.R.) accompanied with good stretching routine and quality nutrition (not any kind of crazy diet). Maintaining such regiment constantly gives all you need to get rid of extra weight, builds up basic muscle stamina, strengthens the heart for long years of health.
Do you really need Gym to get in shape?

Now some tennis-specific traits may be developed by dedicated training, including some weight lifting, some HIIT, some footwork drills, resistance dashing, etc. But that’s actually an extra level, and I’d warn anyone from doing all that stuff without basic fitness level and routine.
 

FiReFTW

Hall of Fame
#13
Wore my self out on the ball machine and was called over to hit with the two guys on the next court. The other guy we let play in when we were short a 4th so maybe he was returning the favor

Anyhow they were both really great plays. Annoyingly good like how do they get soooo much spin and pace? I didnt embarass myself but it was clear they were better.

Though the college coach had two nice things to say about my game.

I was on the add and he was on the duece and we were hitting against the other guy. Couple of shots came to my forehand and the guy told me he was a college coach and that my FH form was like what the college players and pros hit. Thanks @JohnYandell

Also when he was serving he had the nastiest kick I have seen in a while. Like @nytennisaddict serve but with more pace. We were playing points and he was serving to me in the ad. 1st few kickers got me really good. But then I remembered that I have to take those in no mans land or closer. Ripped off a few return winners and one that drew an error. Guy told his buddy that I had the kind of return that could make for a long day.

I got to serve some and did ok. Classic kick to the bh and volley to the open court was working but it was clear those guys were putting a ton more spin on the ball and we were all hitting similar pace at least on groundies. Serves they were sooo much faster

What is the secret to the extra spin in general and added pace on serves??
Cool, how would you compare their groundstrokes to @nytennisaddict or some other posters you have played on here? Any difference in pace? spin?
 
#16
Cool, how would you compare their groundstrokes to @nytennisaddict or some other posters you have played on here? Any difference in pace? spin?
The better guy and to an extent the other guy was like a combo of Maximagq and ReopeningTuesday. Maximas pace and tuesdays spin combined.

I have forgotten my experiemce with NYTennis purposefully. This guy was alot like him though like a stockier version but hitting a proper bh.

I think the pace is what I am used to and some players on ocassion hit that way but it really the spin that I am not used to.

Besides reopening wed the most spin I have seen was from chicago jack. His was worse because he is a lefty with a leaded up spin racquet and a spinny string combo
 

FiReFTW

Hall of Fame
#18
The better guy and to an extent the other guy was like a combo of Maximagq and ReopeningTuesday. Maximas pace and tuesdays spin combined.

I have forgotten my experiemce with NYTennis purposefully. This guy was alot like him though like a stockier version but hitting a proper bh.

I think the pace is what I am used to and some players on ocassion hit that way but it really the spin that I am not used to.

Besides reopening wed the most spin I have seen was from chicago jack. His was worse because he is a lefty with a leaded up spin racquet and a spinny string combo
Cool.

I think spin is the hardest thing to get used to when its above what you usually hit against, from my short 2 year experience playing tennis.

Pace not THAT much, its just faster so you prepare earlier, and get used to fairly quickly, but spin takes a bit longer to get used to since the timing is so much different and the ball explodes at a different speed so its harder to get the timing for it specially if you hit on the rise, unless you stand very far back and give urself time.
 
#20
haha, fair enough.
most folks at the 3.5-4.0 level do NOT go to the gym to really improve fitness... (or if they do, it's a weak-@ss zumba class or curling 10lb weights, or something like it...)
that said, most the folks i drill with do something significant to improve their fitness (resistance, run, etc....)
one 4.0 played with friday for example, finished a marathon a month ago in ~3h... so you can imagine why i like playing with him.

[edit] to be fair most folks (3.0-4.0) play tennis as their sole form of excerise... which is great if you're a couch potato... but beyond that most folks do not know the tennis law of, "you must get in shape to play tennis"... it was a revelation to me, as a low 4.0, getting that advice from a former atp coach (ie. i was playing tennis to get in shape, and he recommended playing less tennis, and do more "real work": resistance, running/sprints, etc...)
I don't even think 4.5/5.0+ players go to the gym at least none of my friends. We just play a lot of tennis hahaha
 
#22
haha, fair enough.
most folks at the 3.5-4.0 level do NOT go to the gym to really improve fitness... (or if they do, it's a weak-@ss zumba class or curling 10lb weights, or something like it...)
that said, most the folks i drill with do something significant to improve their fitness (resistance, run, etc....)
one 4.0 played with friday for example, finished a marathon a month ago in ~3h... so you can imagine why i like playing with him.

[edit] to be fair most folks (3.0-4.0) play tennis as their sole form of excerise... which is great if you're a couch potato... but beyond that most folks do not know the tennis law of, "you must get in shape to play tennis"... it was a revelation to me, as a low 4.0, getting that advice from a former atp coach (ie. i was playing tennis to get in shape, and he recommended playing less tennis, and do more "real work": resistance, running/sprints, etc...)
Get fit to play tennis, but eat well to get fit
 
#24
Its not fun to eat well tho, WHERES MY ICE CREAM!!?
I make a smoothie morning and night thats similar to eating icecream but with way more nutrients..

2 banans, 1.5tblspn cacao powder, 3 tblspon almonds, 3 tblspn walnuts, 1 cup yoghurt + add protein powder or eggs or whatever else you want. Only add a tiny bit of water and its thick you eat it with a spoon like icecream
 
#25
haha, fair enough.
most folks at the 3.5-4.0 level do NOT go to the gym to really improve fitness... (or if they do, it's a weak-@ss zumba class or curling 10lb weights, or something like it...)
that said, most the folks i drill with do something significant to improve their fitness (resistance, run, etc....)
one 4.0 played with friday for example, finished a marathon a month ago in ~3h... so you can imagine why i like playing with him.

[edit] to be fair most folks (3.0-4.0) play tennis as their sole form of excerise... which is great if you're a couch potato... but beyond that most folks do not know the tennis law of, "you must get in shape to play tennis"... it was a revelation to me, as a low 4.0, getting that advice from a former atp coach (ie. i was playing tennis to get in shape, and he recommended playing less tennis, and do more "real work": resistance, running/sprints, etc...)
I'm not sure Gasquet goes to the gym on the regular either or



Marcus Willis def. didn't for a while & was def. over 5.0 :)
 
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#29
Got an urgent text needing a 4th. It would be the 3rd day in a row to play. Most of you fellas cant understand but I was not in any kind of shape to play. But I did. 3:30 hours and 3 sets later i left the courts.

On the spin. So midway in the 2nd set I switch from my experimental racquet setup back to the normal. Damn. The spin was back and on par with the others. A few shots jumped enough to draw some wiffs. The experimental racquet had a locked stringbed and the normal had an unlocked (mains could snap back) and boy it showed.

Still was serving with a lot less pace than most of the players. :confused:

No more tennis this week. Rain and muscles seeing to that.
 

tlm

G.O.A.T.
#31
Allow me to ask you a question? How many adult rec players do you know who are willing to go to the gym to improve their tennis? Please do not mention banned members either. ;):p
I go to the gym everyday, I’m lucky to have my own home gym. I learned years ago that strength training is one of the keys to staying healthy and avoiding injuries. I lift weights one day and do CrossFit the next plus I run a mile everyday.

All these guys at my club ask me how I can play so much but rarely ever am I injured. Strength training is the key to staying on the court especially as you age. Also stretching is very important and balance work. A couple years ago I noticed that I was getting more winded when playing long points so I’ve added CrossFit training and that has made a big difference in my endurance.

Most club players are pretty much done with singles by their mid 40’s. They aren’t in good enough shape to play 3 sets or they get injured all the time so most of them play doubles, but they still have a lot of injury problems. Most have sedentary jobs and do no off court training and they can’t figure out why they are injured all the time.
 
#34
IF you have the techniques and a great serve like in Marcus' case. Gives fat guys hopes of greatness.
I stood next to Willis this summer when he was playing WTT. It was humbling to be in the presence of such a fit professional athlete.

Marcus worked Tiafoe this summer in WTT. Of course, if the match length were increased to best of 3 sets while playing deuce points, I'd immediately give the advantage to big foe.
 
#36
.....................................

What is the secret to the extra spin in general and added pace on serves??
There is no extra spin on serves.

"extra spin" Kick serve with racket still rising at impact gives additional topspin component. Slice serve is impacted near highest racket position for more side spin component.




"added pace" Same serve. Internal shoulder rotation - see twitch-like ISR motion by looking at elbow shadows.
To do single fame on Vimeo, click Vimeo, full screen, hold down the SHIFT KEY and use the ARROW KEYS. My Vimeo video is skipping frames, see the millisecond time scale. One frame at 240 fps is 4.2 milliseconds. If it advances more than 4 or 5 milliseconds per key press it is skipping frames.

To see difference view high speed video of your kick serve in bright sunlight without hoodie.

In addition, the racket should be closed, say 15 d, just before it impacts the ball. This only shows on a well positioned camera view (mostly from the side).
 
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#37
Got an urgent text needing a 4th. It would be the 3rd day in a row to play. Most of you fellas cant understand but I was not in any kind of shape to play. But I did. 3:30 hours and 3 sets later i left the courts.

On the spin. So midway in the 2nd set I switch from my experimental racquet setup back to the normal. Damn. The spin was back and on par with the others. A few shots jumped enough to draw some wiffs. The experimental racquet had a locked stringbed and the normal had an unlocked (mains could snap back) and boy it showed.

Still was serving with a lot less pace than most of the players. :confused:

No more tennis this week. Rain and muscles seeing to that.
I've seen video of your serve. Its just not that good compared to D1 players. You are all floppy and the energy you generate goes everywhere but into the ball. It's good for old guy tennis.
 
#40
@Shroud 100% truth in this post. For more pop, you have to direct your flailing energy into the ball. I recommend you strengthen your abs.
I've seen video of your serve. Its just not that good compared to D1 players. You are all floppy and the energy you generate goes everywhere but into the ball. It's good for old guy tennis.
Fair enough. Sadly i AM an old guy. Though I have changed my serve since moving. Yandell helped me and there are some next level things I just cant seem to do. But during the lesson was able to kill the ball. Its better for sure and i am getting more pace but not where it could be. One guy was just killing the ball. Faster than Maxima.

Ironically after the 3rd set one guy left and we played that game where the singles guy serves to the doubles guy and I won 5 to 2.5 to 1.5. Powder puff kickers got me through and got some aces. @J011yroger had a tip about hitting a slice serve off of a kick toss that paid dividends. So having the biggest serve doesnt always mean winning.

What kind if ab workout.
 
#41
There is no extra spin on serves.

"extra spin" Kick serve with racket still rising at impact gives additional topspin component. Slice serve is impacted near highest racket position for more side spin component.




"added pace" Same serve. Internal shoulder rotation - see twitch-like ISR motion by looking at elbow shadows.
To do single fame on Vimeo, click Vimeo, full screen, hold down the SHIFT KEY and use the ARROW KEYS. My Vimeo video is skipping frames, see the millisecond time scale. One frame at 240 fps is 4.2 milliseconds. If it advances more than 4 or 5 milliseconds per key press it is skipping frames.

To see difference view high speed video of your kick serve in bright sunlight without hoodie.

In addition, the racket should be closed, say 15 d, just before it impacts the ball. This only shows on a well positioned camera view (mostly from the side).
As isual no clue what you are saying

Toss lower for more spin?

Isr for more power? Vimeo is useless on an iphone

Thanks though
 
#43
Fair enough. Sadly i AM an old guy. Though I have changed my serve since moving. Yandell helped me and there are some next level things I just cant seem to do. But during the lesson was able to kill the ball. Its better for sure and i am getting more pace but not where it could be. One guy was just killing the ball. Faster than Maxima.

Ironically after the 3rd set one guy left and we played that game where the singles guy serves to the doubles guy and I won 5 to 2.5 to 1.5. Powder puff kickers got me through and got some aces. @J011yroger had a tip about hitting a slice serve off of a kick toss that paid dividends. So having the biggest serve doesnt always mean winning.

What kind if ab workout.
Not being able to replicate what you were able to do during a lesson is a common thing. I’ve experienced it quite often. Usually for me, it’s a small technical detail that has changed slightly vs during the lesson. Hard to say what might be going on without a video though. Sometimes, it’s as simple as you are dropping the tossing arm too early.

My last post wasn’t meant to be offensive. Your serve is good for <4.0 level but in order to get more out of it, you have to tighten up the motion.

For abs, there are a number of exercises you can do. The simplest one is the seated ab crunch machine at the gym. Pick your resistance and do 5 sets of 20-25 to start.
 
#45
Not being able to replicate what you were able to do during a lesson is a common thing. I’ve experienced it quite often. Usually for me, it’s a small technical detail that has changed slightly vs during the lesson. Hard to say what might be going on without a video though. Sometimes, it’s as simple as you are dropping the tossing arm too early.

My last post wasn’t meant to be offensive. Your serve is good for <4.0 level but in order to get more out of it, you have to tighten up the motion.

For abs, there are a number of exercises you can do. The simplest one is the seated ab crunch machine at the gym. Pick your resistance and do 5 sets of 20-25 to start.
<4.0 is offensive :) though half my vids have me serving with a different and wildly lighter racquet or show me hitting platform. Platform was like that beautiful chick that turns ugly when the beer goggles wear off..

It has to do with isr or pronation. He wanted more and I can't time it right. Ball slides off the wrong side of the racquet since I pronate too early when I try to increase the isr/pronation
 

FiReFTW

Hall of Fame
#46
Not being able to replicate what you were able to do during a lesson is a common thing. I’ve experienced it quite often.
Week ago i finally cracked the kick serve code, somehow I got everything to click, biggest difference was letting the toss drop much lower than I even imagined at first, but a few other things aswell.

For the 1st time ever I was able to swing absolutely 100% brutal speed full effort and the ball had decent pace but such crazy spin that it went fast over the net and then DIP like it was sucked into the court and exploded up violently and to the right.

If I was on the other side I would struggle to return it looked really brutal.

Yesterday I did some practice and then also some point play, decided to just hit kicks to practice it, and it was gone, i simply lost the feeling, timing..whatever from last time, it was just not even close to what I experienced a week ago, it had decent spin but not even close to really being that violent kick.

So sad... o well, time to go and keep practicing.
 
#47
<4.0 is offensive :) though half my vids have me serving with a different and wildly lighter racquet or show me hitting platform. Platform was like that beautiful chick that turns ugly when the beer goggles wear off..

It has to do with isr or pronation. He wanted more and I can't time it right. Ball slides off the wrong side of the racquet since I pronate too early when I try to increase the isr/pronation
I meant 4.0 level and lower. It’s ok for 4.0 but won’t trouble 4.5 and higher.

Your racquet sliding off could be due to off balance issues/falling over the wrong way which pull your arm away too early.
 
#48
Week ago i finally cracked the kick serve code, somehow I got everything to click, biggest difference was letting the toss drop much lower than I even imagined at first, but a few other things aswell.

For the 1st time ever I was able to swing absolutely 100% brutal speed full effort and the ball had decent pace but such crazy spin that it went fast over the net and then DIP like it was sucked into the court and exploded up violently and to the right.

If I was on the other side I would struggle to return it looked really brutal.

Yesterday I did some practice and then also some point play, decided to just hit kicks to practice it, and it was gone, i simply lost the feeling, timing..whatever from last time, it was just not even close to what I experienced a week ago, it had decent spin but not even close to really being that violent kick.

So sad... o well, time to go and keep practicing.
Cool. Keep working at it!
 
#49
Week ago i finally cracked the kick serve code, somehow I got everything to click, biggest difference was letting the toss drop much lower than I even imagined at first, but a few other things aswell.

For the 1st time ever I was able to swing absolutely 100% brutal speed full effort and the ball had decent pace but such crazy spin that it went fast over the net and then DIP like it was sucked into the court and exploded up violently and to the right.

If I was on the other side I would struggle to return it looked really brutal.

Yesterday I did some practice and then also some point play, decided to just hit kicks to practice it, and it was gone, i simply lost the feeling, timing..whatever from last time, it was just not even close to what I experienced a week ago, it had decent spin but not even close to really being that violent kick.

So sad... o well, time to go and keep practicing.
Mmmmm tennis erotica
 
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