Practice vs Match

[Traffic]

What's your practice (drills, grooving strokes or serves) vs formal match or even practice match play frequency?

I've been finding myself playing matches, but not getting in practice time to groove my strokes. And it feels like my strokes are disappearing. This weekend, I worked on grooving strokes with my son as well as with a club mate. And I feel like I really needed that to get my strokes back.

 

[Hmgraphite1]

What's your practice (drills, grooving strokes or serves) vs formal match or even practice match play frequency?

I've been finding myself playing matches, but not getting in practice time to groove my strokes. And it feels like my strokes are disappearing. This weekend, I worked on grooving strokes with my son as well as with a club mate. And I feel like I really needed that to get my strokes back.

Same, need to hit ball machine at club during cold season, especially since still unlearning bad technique. Noticed i'm arming ball more and more, although better arming than before not what I want. Went to a clinic and hit 525 shots in 30 minutes. Match hit 285 in 90 minutes. So 5 times more shots.

 

[J011yroger]

About 1-1 in the winter and 2-1 in the outdoor season when there is more time to practice. If I play too many matches I lose my strokes and if I play too few, I get nervous in matches.

Mostly practice matches, real matches are only every couple weeks at best in winter.

J

 

[user92626]

I realize it's very hard and a lot of work to separate and manage "practice" and "match" sessions. So, basically I changed my mind to seeing both the same!

So you can say I constantly play matches and practice. And, it's freaking recreational. There's no need to formalize anything!

 

[ptuanminh]

probably 3 to 1, for one hour of match play i do 3 hours of practice

 

[grhcan99]

The transition from practice to matches is quite tricky. The sweet spot on frequency, quality and intensity for us rec players is quite elusive. The simplest answer to me is more of each but we're rec players and don't have the leisure of time and money for proper coaching, training, and physical conditioning. So it's always an uphill battle to "stay in the game".

 

[Traffic]

I realize it's very hard and a lot of work to separate and manage "practice" and "match" sessions. So, basically I changed my mind to seeing both the same!

So you can say I constantly play matches and practice. And, it's freaking recreational. There's no need to formalize anything!

I agree we are just recreational players. But there must be some competitive spirit within us to keep us playing. Otherwise, why keep score?

When I play matches, I try to figure out ways to win the point and win the match. And sometimes it's putting band-aids on stroke selection if something isn't working. And I don't see the same ball as often, so I lose the timing or whatever. I find I need just a hitting session to get my muscle memory back.

 

[ChaelAZ]

Way too much practice to not enough play, but working on that. My biggest issue lately has been hitting with a lot of kids and lower ranked players, which tones down the intensity overall. I find that kinda dulled me in match play, so working to get back with some of the league guys and others to make practices more usefull.

 

[Traffic]

Way too much practice to not enough play, but working on that. My biggest issue lately has been hitting with a lot of kids and lower ranked players, which tones down the intensity overall. I find that kinda dulled me in match play, so working to get back with some of the league guys and others to make practices more usefull.

Reminds me of when my sister complained about having to face one of the tennis pros from our club at MXD. She was complaining that he was rated too low. But I had to remind her that our pro spends all day feeding balls and hitting with kids and 3.0 moms.

 

[grhcan99]

I realize it's very hard and a lot of work to separate and manage "practice" and "match" sessions. So, basically I changed my mind to seeing both the same!

So you can say I constantly play matches and practice. And, it's freaking recreational. There's no need to formalize anything!

There are people who are by nature competitive. It's nothing put on. It's who they are. I was like that when I was younger. I still am (can't help it) but with age it's tempered I can laugh at myself a bit more now despite the fact that it hurts when I miss shots or lose. The change is subtle but age and injuries help you on your way down

 

[user92626]

There are people who are by nature competitive. It's nothing put on. It's who they are. I was like that when I was younger. I still am (can't help it) but with age it's tempered I can laugh at myself a bit more now despite the fact that it hurts when I miss shots or lose. The change is subtle but age and injuries help you on your way down

People don't or cannot change, at least in substantial ways. If you're the type that feels "hurt" from missing a shot or lose, you'll likely be that type forever. I also see a lot of players who do not feel "urgent" about their bad shots or loses, and they won't change a single thing.

The age or injury effects are all natural and separate and people usually understand them. I slow down a lot now, but my intensity and competitiveness is the same and people still see that.

Anyway, the topic is how would you manage practice vs match. I commend those who are that serious about this recreation as to put that much care into it. I feel my time for tennis is always not enough and when I have it I cannot 100% control how it plays out. Eg, how do you ensure you have a good practice partner or a coach? Or, the next match to implement your learning or someone to take notes of your mistakes, improvements? Without these, imo, most practice would be meaningless. You're driving blind.

 

[NuBas]

What's your practice (drills, grooving strokes or serves) vs formal match or even practice match play frequency?

I've been finding myself playing matches, but not getting in practice time to groove my strokes. And it feels like my strokes are disappearing. This weekend, I worked on grooving strokes with my son as well as with a club mate. And I feel like I really needed that to get my strokes back.

You need to reach a point where your strokes don't disappear even if you haven't rallied in a while, you should get the feel for it during warm up before a game. That being said, I do revisit rallying when I perform poorly against someone but I also make sure to treat rallying as if I'm playing a game but obviously with less pressure so I can focus on what I wanted to work on.

 

[user92626]

You need to reach a point where your strokes don't disappear even if you haven't rallied in a while, you should get the feel for it during warm up before a game. That being said, I do revisit rallying when I perform poorly against someone but I also make sure to treat rallying as if I'm playing a game but obviously with less pressure so I can focus on what I wanted to work on.

Whether you have or haven't rallied, played a match, it's always hit or miss for anyone to reach their ideal point or the point that they wanna be. It's the same for pro's. In one match or a particular time, even year long, they play brilliantly, then in the next one they play like third rate players.

 

[NuBas]

Whether you have or haven't rallied, played a match, it's always hit or miss for anyone to reach their ideal point or the point that they wanna be. It's the same for pro's. In one match or a particular time, even year long, they play brilliantly, then in the next one they play like third rate players.

Well that's the goal is to develop consistency.

 

[jbot]

i've been using matchplay/sets against weaker players for "grooving strokes" (sounds a little sexy), matches against more or less "even" players for pure competitive play practice, and sets against stronger players to work on defense and strategy. Sometimes, though, there is just nothing like hitting against the ball machine to hit a bunch of forehands/backhands/slices/volleys that nobody else has the patience to feed you.

 

[grhcan99]

i've been using matchplay/sets against weaker players for "grooving strokes" (sounds a little sexy), matches against more or less "even" players for pure competitive play practice, and sets against stronger players to work on defense and strategy. Sometimes, though, there is just nothing like hitting against the ball machine to hit a bunch of forehands/backhands/slices/volleys that nobody else has the patience to feed you.

True that.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

in general i shoot for at least 2h of practice for every hour of practice/"real" match play i do...
winter time, i mostly practice... main goal is max # of balls hit per hour, just to stay grooved until spring...
then in spring, i'm mostly playing practice matches to get ready for usta season

 

[ByeByePoly]

I agree we are just recreational players. But there must be some competitive spirit within us to keep us playing. Otherwise, why keep score?

When I play matches, I try to figure out ways to win the point and win the match. And sometimes it's putting band-aids on stroke selection if something isn't working. And I don't see the same ball as often, so I lose the timing or whatever. I find I need just a hitting session to get my muscle memory back.

So you know when it's time to drink beer. Duh.

Are you practicing for singles or doubles? If doubles, just keep playing a lot ... you don't need strokes for doubles.

 

[Traffic]

So you know when it's time to drink beer. Duh.

Are you practicing for singles or doubles? If doubles, just keep playing a lot ... you don't need strokes for doubles.

True.
But I can't play like that. Or I used to be able to play like that. But now I want to play with strokes.

I've been really sucking playing doubles lately. Can't ROS. Can't maintain a cc rally. Missing easy volleys.
Gonna practice singles today. Maybe that'll make me feel better.

 

[ByeByePoly]

True.
But I can't play like that. Or I used to be able to play like that. But now I want to play with strokes.

I've been really sucking playing doubles lately. Can't ROS. Can't maintain a cc rally. Missing easy volleys.
Gonna practice singles today. Maybe that'll make me feel better.

I hear you on the strokes ... it gives me something to distract myself with as I get slower, and slower ...

In my 20s and singles tournaments ... it was almost all singles, not a member of a club yet. I really can't remember any "just hitting", or drills. When you were not a club member, you looked forward to your matches that you could arrange. I was lucky all the way with enough players/friends to play singles with ... high school team, college friends at college that carried into early 20s after college. Then singles tournaments 24-25ish and new set of players/friends ... but still mainly played matches.

Club membership by early 30s, mainly doubles (2-3 permanent indoor court time/doubles a week), one drill group a week with mostly USTA teammates. The drill groups were not about technique, strokes, grips ... they were doubles play points drills. I don't remember a lot of serving and ros ... so mainly cc drills, approach and net play, back pedal for overheads, etc.

In hindsight after ttw:

I would divide "tennis improvement" into two big buckets 1) winning matches 2) the rest ... technique, strokes, grip, footwork, cardio, etc.

IMO ... if you have limited time (say once or twice a week), and your number one goal is winning matches, nothing will be better time spent than playing "quality" matches. If your goal is to win 4.0 singles tournaments, and you have limited time per week ... play practice singles matches against players that force you to hit a lot of balls, and enter every 4.0 singles tournament you can.

If you have more time, no doubt add drills (either cooperative drills with another player, or group drill). To me, cc drills are priceless ... for singles or doubles. Same with overhead and volley drills.

I have mixed feelings about rec players serving too many baskets of serves, but none at all with ros drills. For me, anyway ... particularly doubles ... I would have benefited more from regular ros drills than serving practice. That said ... you ros against a lot of different players, hard to replicate that in a drill. BTW ... that is why playing tournaments or USTA is actually practice ... mutiple styles and techniques. You don't play your buddy or coach over and over.

So for me, to answer your ratio question, I would first ask how many times a week do you play, and do you have the ability to play quality/useful matches.

If you can only play once a week, play matches. Twice a week ... maybe one match, one practice ... but I would lean towards two matches. Three times a week ... for sure one drill group/practice a week. @nytennisaddict pointed out another consideration ... seasons, winter indoor limits, time of year you play tournaments or USTA.

Strokes, technique, footwork ... separate ... coach, instructor, ball machine, drills and reps for new/changes. If you can only bet on one 1) changing strokes ... OR 2) playing a lot USTA/tournament matches ... to move up a level, play a lot of matches. I do think stroke improvement has more upside in singles than doubles. If we call a serve a stroke ... that stroke improvement obviously has big upside to both.

 

[WestboroChe]

About 1-1 in the winter and 2-1 in the outdoor season when there is more time to practice. If I play too many matches I lose my strokes and if I play too few, I get nervous in matches.

Mostly practice matches, real matches are only every couple weeks at best in winter.

J

For most people the challenge is just getting time to play whether it’s practice or matches.

I’d love to play thrice a week. But right now I’m pretty much stuck at about 1.5 times a week.

 

[user92626]

I agree we are just recreational players. But there must be some competitive spirit within us to keep us playing. Otherwise, why keep score?

When I play matches, I try to figure out ways to win the point and win the match. And sometimes it's putting band-aids on stroke selection if something isn't working. And I don't see the same ball as often, so I lose the timing or whatever. I find I need just a hitting session to get my muscle memory back.

We're in the same camp if you prefer competitive attitude and spirit which usually means keeping score or some sort of structure in the session. This is something that a lot of people don't understand or if they do but are afraid to step up and face it (competition).

Today (a nonregular day) I came out when almost everyone has left. I and a couple of the regular guys still stayed around and arranged a "lunch" game, a 1 vs 2, best of 3. It had to be a competitive game where everyone has to feel they need to try. Hence, the lunch expense. Otherwise it'd be very boring and miserable given the cold weather and lack of players.




Anyway, the topic is practice vs real match. Well, how "real" does a recreational match have to be? How am I gonna find a specific scenario like today's game for me to practice?

As recreational players, I don't think we have enough time (and resources) to develop our skills evenly.

 

[ByeByePoly]

We're in the same camp if you prefer competitive attitude and spirit which usually means keeping score or some sort of structure in the session. This is something that a lot of people don't understand or if they do but are afraid to step up and face it (competition).

Today (a nonregular day) I came out when almost everyone has left. I and a couple of the regular guys still stayed around and arranged a "lunch" game, a 1 vs 2, best of 3. It had to be a competitive game where everyone has to feel they need to try. Hence, the lunch expense. Otherwise it'd be very boring and miserable given the cold weather and lack of players.

Anyway, the topic is practice vs real match. Well, how "real" does a recreational match have to be? How am I gonna find a specific scenario like today's game for me to practice?

As recreational players, I don't think we have enough time (and resources) to develop our skills evenly.

If I had to win to get to eat lunch I would be hard to beat. I am a big fan of lunch.

 

[user92626]

If I had to win to get to eat lunch I would be hard to beat. I am a big fan of lunch.

That's good spirit but there's still work for you to do. First, your opponents are also likely big fans as well, if not bigger. Nobody likes to lose or treat others to lunch if they don't have to.

Secondly, you might get ahead of yourself and trip by trying too hard. Unless you're way above your opponents -- who would agree to such competition? -- you can't really impose your will on them. Tennis is a game of the right tempo in term of finding your niche. You can't be too late or too early to the moment!

This is why you see pro's, once they find their tempo, they just roll. Losers tend to think they have missed opportunities (see, it's not all about skills).

This is why I love matches with small stakes. It makes me think.

 

[ByeByePoly]

That's good spirit but there's still work for you to do. First, your opponents are also likely big fans as well, if not bigger. Nobody likes to lose or treat others to lunch if they don't have to.

Secondly, you might get ahead of yourself and trip by trying too hard. Unless you're way above your opponents -- who would agree to such competition? -- you can't really impose your will on them. Tennis is a game of the right tempo in term of finding your niche. You can't be too late or too early to the moment!

This is why you see pro's, once they find their tempo, they just roll. Losers tend to think they have missed opportunities (see, it's not all about skills).

This is why I love matches with small stakes. It makes me think.

Golf is for betting.

 

[user92626]

Golf is for betting.

I save golf for when I turn 80.

 

[fuzz nation]

Reminds me of when my sister complained about having to face one of the tennis pros from our club at MXD. She was complaining that he was rated too low. But I had to remind her that our pro spends all day feeding balls and hitting with kids and 3.0 moms.

SOOOO true!! After a season of coaching or teaching, I can get crazy-rusty in terms of actually managing points in competition. More than a little ironic when being around tennis all the time (teaching) can put my game into a crummy place.

 

[user92626]

Golf is for betting.

Speaking of betting. There are a handful of over 65 men at my courts. Naturally they don't play very well with the 40s guys. They are 2nd or 3rd choice for dubs partners after the young and capable players are gone. Usually they don't get to play!

I do sympathize them. I came up with the idea that they should be open to betting games, to entice and troll the capable guys. Challenge them with handicaps and the worst case is the old guys lose a few cans of balls. That's hella cheaper than a bingo night.

But only one man took my advice. He's been playing for a couple years now and is quite fit and play singles with the best of us!

Tennis is one of the cheapest hobbies around.

 

[ByeByePoly]

Speaking of betting. There are a handful of over 65 men at my courts. Naturally they don't play very well with the 40s guys. They are 2nd or 3rd choice for dubs partners after the young and capable players are gone. Usually they don't get to play!

I do sympathize them. I came up with the idea that they should be open to betting games, to entice and troll the capable guys. Challenge them with handicaps and the worst case is the old guys lose a few cans of balls. That's hella cheaper than a bingo night.

But only one man took my advice. He's been playing for a couple years now and is quite fit and play singles with the best of us!

Tennis is one of the cheapest hobbies around.

Where do you live ... country. I have been whooping at 34 year old in singles for several months ... and turn 61 in Feb. Doubles ... heck ... 20 year olds.

It kind of depends on the 60 year old and the 40 year old.

 

[user92626]

Where do you live ... country. I have been whooping at 34 year old in singles for several months ... and turn 61 in Feb. Doubles ... heck ... 20 year olds.

It kind of depends on the 60 year old and the 40 year old.

Amerika.

Maybe that's because you're only 61

20 yr gap is huge but I suppose you're right. There are crappy players at all ages.

 

[ubercat]

Heck I m in my 50s and play with 20s and 30s guys. I just beat my 22 year old coach in Point play this morning. Admittedly it doesn't happen often. He's a pretty competitive guy so hopefully he didn't shout me a gimme.

If I keep fit by my 60s playing with guys in their forties is not an impossible dream.